Bullets Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Was just trying to find out which versions we have to I can find out some performance stats online about the aircraft we fly and I couldn't find out if we had the Yak 1 (Initial production variant) or the Yak 1b... (If we don't have the 1b surely we should do as it was the main production of the Yak 1? )
Feathered_IV Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 The 1b had the cut down rear fuselage. It's safe to assume the version we currently have is the Yak-1.
II./JG77_Manu* Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 We have the Yak1 Body with the 1B engine ingame. Strange combination (but there were a few IRL)
=LD=Penshoon Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 It's the Yak-1 Series 69 Found this list on another forums: 1 series M-105P36 series - default Yak-1 with M-105PA (according to other data with 22 on 27 series, all from 28 series, ~ 430 planes with M-105P)49 series52 series 2xUBS+1xShVSK for antiaircraft defense of Rostov60 series light -160 kg 1xShVAK for antiaircraft defense of Moskow69 series M-105PF96 series light -160 kg 1xShVAK, M-105PF for antiaircraft defense of Stalingrad 512 and 520 IAP 220IAD 16A99 series (Yak-1B Early, autumn 1942)136 series default Yak-1B (approximately corresponds to the serial plane SNo. 08136 tested in Scientific Research Institute Air Force in April, 1943)
BlitzPig_EL Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Probably from the same folks that had the Yak 3 come after the Yak 9. 2
Dakpilot Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Indeed Soviet nomenclature can indeed be confusing Cheers Dakpilot
fjacobsen Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Indeed Soviet nomenclature can indeed be confusing Cheers Dakpilot Hmm.. Didn´t the F-16 come after the F-100 or even F-84 ? And now F-35 comes after F-51 (P-51). The Yak-1 was als developed into the Yak-7 The Yak-3 was an alternative developement to the Yak-1 and based on the Yak-1M, while the Yak-9 was a lighter version of the Yak-7 So basicly the Yak-1 was developed into the Yak-7, which again was developed into the Yak-9. This means we have the Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch and then the Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. Offcourse the developement phases where more complex. FinnJ 1
Pupo Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Hmm.. Didn´t the F-16 come after the F-100 or even F-84 ? And now F-35 comes after F-51 (P-51). The Yak-1 was als developed into the Yak-7 The Yak-3 was an alternative developement to the Yak-1 and based on the Yak-1M, while the Yak-9 was a lighter version of the Yak-7 So basicly the Yak-1 was developed into the Yak-7, which again was developed into the Yak-9. This means we have the Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch and then the Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. Offcourse the developement phases where more complex. FinnJ waht about the series thing? were they random numbers, or is there a logic behind them?
ShamrockOneFive Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 waht about the series thing? were they random numbers, or is there a logic behind them? I'd love to do a more detailed study on this but from what I understand of the Yak series history and Soviet factory production the reasoning behind all of the series changes was to try and keep some semblance of organization around all of the sub model modifications being made on the production line. I hesitate to use the haphazard but Soviet production techniques varied between factory and some modifications would be made at one factory and not at another. Or a special series modification like the Yak-1 light with reduced weight would be made but those modifications were not necessarily part of a major production change. They are chronological but one cannot assume that modifications made on one type would have carried over the entire production line. Each needs to be looked at separately. It's really not that different than say the production blocks for American aircraft (P-47D-10, D-22, D-25, D-30 for example) but the number of changes going on - on the fly - ended up with huge numbers of series changes. BTW: I'd love to see a Yak-1B version that fought at Stalingrad but as I understand it, the Yak-1 Series 69 with the VK105PF is quite a hot fighter and we'd really be gaining only in rear view visibility (thanks to the bubble canopy) and the added weight of fire with the removal of the ShKAS machine guns and the addition of the single UBS 12.7mm.
Brano Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 We have the Yak1 Body with the 1B engine ingame. Strange combination (but there were a few IRL) Wrong. Yak1b as you think of it = with lowered rear fuselage,retractable tailwheel and changed armament (1xShvak+1xUBS) was produced from 111th series (jan 1943).All of this modifications were continuously introduced from 89th series. M105PF engine serial production started 1.5.1942 in No26 factory.Untill peak production volumes could be reached form 79th series,there was mix of previous M105PA engines used in previous series. Nothing weird,simply running change. The Yak-1 was als developed into the Yak-7 The Yak-3 was an alternative developement to the Yak-1 and based on the Yak-1M, while the Yak-9 was a lighter version of the Yak-7 So basicly the Yak-1 was developed into the Yak-7, which again was developed into the Yak-9. This means we have the Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch and then the Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. No. Yak 3 was developed from Yak1 design line,in popular literature called ''light Yaks'' Yak 9 was developed from Yak 7 design line,in popular literature called ''heavy Yaks'' If we speak about introduction to field units,then Yak 9 was late 1942 and Yak3 summer 1944.
fjacobsen Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) I really don´t know the exact history behind aircraft manufacturing in Soviet during WW2. But it´s probably important to note that LAGG, LA, MIG, IL, YAK, PE where all design bureau's and not manufacturers. Each design bureau where allocated factories to produce their designs. Depending on how good their designs where, or how they where regarded by Stalin and Stavka, they got factories allocated of higher or lower quality. Remember how, when Soviet was attacked by Germany, moved their factories from western Soviet to the Urals and other easterly places. I think that logistics where very hard to control and that any kind of Norms where trashed. It really cme down to produce as much eqipment as possible to conter the very high treat of being overrun. So many subvariants has definitly been build in the various factories and a way to control it, they started to add version numbers. Considering the overall confusion, I guess that it will be hard to find any set aircraft configuartions that could be regarded as a norm, but the version numkbers would indicate a rough configuration of the aircraft. Factory XX might build the version 69 with the not cutdown rear fuselage, but with the PF engine, while factory XY would build the same but with some other alterations and then call it version 67, cause the plans started before the plans for 69. It´s just a guess, but I think that even for the Soviets it was confusing, but at leaswt provided some control of developement / equipment. Wrong. Yak1b as you think of it = with lowered rear fuselage,retractable tailwheel and changed armament (1xShvak+1xUBS) was produced from 111th series (jan 1943).All of this modifications were continuously introduced from 89th series. M105PF engine serial production started 1.5.1942 in No26 factory.Untill peak production volumes could be reached form 79th series,there was mix of previous M105PA engines used in previous series. Nothing weird,simply running change. No. Yak 3 was developed from Yak1 design line,in popular literature called ''light Yaks'' Yak 9 was developed from Yak 7 design line,in popular literature called ''heavy Yaks'' If we speak about introduction to field units,then Yak 9 was late 1942 and Yak3 summer 1944. Is nat not what I wrote ? This means we have the.. Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch ...and then the .. Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. FinnJ Edited January 2, 2015 by fjacobsen
Brano Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Yak 7 is separate design line starting with UTI-26 trainer. All technical changes had to be approved by GKO (State Commetee for Defense) and only then introduced in serial production.It was not important in which No.X factory the plane was built.All series has been planned in advance and production planes and targets distributed to all by NKAP (Peoples Commisariat for Aircraft Industry).
fjacobsen Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Yak 7 is separate design line starting with UTI-26 trainer. All technical changes had to be approved by GKO (State Commetee for Defense) and only then introduced in serial production.It was not important in which No.X factory the plane was built.All series has been planned in advance and production planes and targets distributed to all by NKAP (Peoples Commisariat for Aircraft Industry). True, but still based on the Yak-1. FinnJ
Brano Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 If we go to roots,everything started with 1939 state competition for new VVS fighter with I-26 prototype built by No.115 factory. Out of this prototype there was serial production fighter version designated as Yak1 and redesigned 2 seat trainer version UTI-26.Later redesigned as single seat fighter Yak7 for serial production.There were many differencies in construction between Yak1 and Yak7 and we cant say that Yak 7 comes from Yak1.
Lusekofte Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Hmm.. Didn´t the F-16 come after the F-100 or even F-84 ? And now F-35 comes after F-51 (P-51). The Yak-1 was als developed into the Yak-7 The Yak-3 was an alternative developement to the Yak-1 and based on the Yak-1M, while the Yak-9 was a lighter version of the Yak-7 So basicly the Yak-1 was developed into the Yak-7, which again was developed into the Yak-9. This means we have the Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch and then the Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. Offcourse the developement phases where more complex. FinnJ US change the letters after WW2. P-51 as for Pursuit changed to A-51 for attack in Korea war and Fighters got the F- in front. What they talk about is versions of Yak, witch was I think united among those flying Yak, The best fighter was the Yak 3 other versions was for Ground attack capabilities and how much fuel they could carry. and letters behind the numbers often , but not always referred to cannon or armament. Germany gave a number combination to the different factories. FW-189 , 190, 200 etc. and BF- 109, 110, ME-210,410,262 , Arado 232 , 196 also very confusing Arado 232 , Heiskel 123, 129 Edited January 2, 2015 by LG1.Jaeger
fjacobsen Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 US change the letters after WW1. P-51 as for Pursuit changed to A-51 for attack in Korea war and Fighters got the F- in front. What they talk about is versions of Yak, witch was I think united among those flying Yak, The best fighter was the Yak 3 other versions was for Ground attack capabilities and how much fuel they could carry. and letters behind the numbers often , but not always referred to cannon or armament. I know about the US change from P to F. The question was how Yak-9 came before the Yak-3, and I answered that even in US F-16 came later than F-84 etc... FinnJ
BSS_Mudcat Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 Was just trying to find out which versions we have to I can find out some performance stats online about the aircraft we fly and I couldn't find out if we had the Yak 1 (Initial production variant) or the Yak 1b... (If we don't have the 1b surely we should do as it was the main production of the Yak 1? ) As already said, it's the Yak 1 (series 69) but for future reference of what we actually should have it's here http://il2sturmovik.com/about/#5
JG4_Nemesis Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 The Yak-1 here in game seems much too fast at sea level....should be 471kph top speed for Yak-1, but it can almost keep up with 109 on the deck.
Dr_Molenbeek Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 The Yak-1 here in game seems much too fast at sea level....should be 471kph top speed for Yak-1, but it can almost keep up with 109 on the deck. The Yak-1 series 69 has a M-105PF, it should hit 535km/h at sea level in normal condition. Ingame it hits 560km/h due to "cold boost", which is ~30km/h less than the Bf 109F-4 at 1.42 ata.
ShamrockOneFive Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 This is the "problem" we have. There's a big difference between the earlier Yak-1 series and the later series with the upgraded engine. The M-105PF upgrade provided a decent performance boost for both the Yak-1 and the Yak-7B.
Willy__ Posted January 2, 2015 Posted January 2, 2015 The Yak-1 here in game seems much too fast at sea level....should be 471kph top speed for Yak-1, but it can almost keep up with 109 on the deck. Once I had a LaGG keep up with my 190 on the deck, lmao . But he had the energy advantage, so no problems there, as I indeed started to lose him after quite while. 1
ACG_Smokejumper Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Hmm.. Didn´t the F-16 come after the F-100 or even F-84 ? And now F-35 comes after F-51 (P-51). The Yak-1 was als developed into the Yak-7 The Yak-3 was an alternative developement to the Yak-1 and based on the Yak-1M, while the Yak-9 was a lighter version of the Yak-7 So basicly the Yak-1 was developed into the Yak-7, which again was developed into the Yak-9. This means we have the Yak-1 -> Yak-7 -> Yak-9 branch and then the Yak-1 -> Yak-1M -> Yak-3 branch. Offcourse the developement phases where more complex. FinnJ Western fighter designs are broken into generations I think? I think the numbers seemed to have started over in the late 70's? I'm just guessing thinking of numbers and major evolutionary changes over the history of American military aviation. If someone knows please let us know.
Dave Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Western fighter designs are broken into generations I think? I think the numbers seemed to have started over in the late 70's? I'm just guessing thinking of numbers and major evolutionary changes over the history of American military aviation. If someone knows please let us know. 60s actually.
III/JG53Frankyboy Posted January 4, 2015 Posted January 4, 2015 (edited) when the USAF F-110 / USN F4H Phantom II was renamed F-4 for all services :D for further infos, this is always a nice read http://www.joebaugher.com/usfighters.html Edited January 4, 2015 by III/JG53Frankyboy
bivalov Posted January 4, 2015 Posted January 4, 2015 Was just trying to find out which versions we have to I can find out some performance stats online about the aircraft we fly and I couldn't find out if we had the Yak 1 (Initial production variant) or the Yak 1b... (If we don't have the 1b surely we should do as it was the main production of the Yak 1? ) in game Yak-1 series 69. in RL in late spring-early summer of 1942, plane exactly of this series, first got M-105PF (1180-1210 hp at sl) instead of M-105PA (1020/1100 hp at sl). and this is typical Yak-1'42, before around s87, plus a bit later. Yak-1b is basically same, and these planes also were used during winter period of BoS, but, anyway, this is another story. waht about the series thing? were they random numbers, or is there a logic behind them? series, ie batches etc., this is just specifics of production, and there means concrete batches of planes. each contains X planes (different number for planes of each type (Yak/LaGG/La), or some series (first, and later series, for example), but all times this is will be about 50-100-150 planes). and during this serial production were introduced all changes, so, for simplicity, and for example, as "Yak-1 s69" mean Yak-1 of s69 with M-105PF. and only if this is really massive serious changes, type of plane also was changed (Yak-1b, for example, or La-5 type 37 > type 39 > type 41/43 > La-7). but this is just my very simple explanations, by my memory, and be better if you find books of E. Gordon, for example, or any other autor who writes on english. 52 series 2xUBS+1xShVSK for antiaircraft defense of Rostov that is not really correct - these 4 Yaks (in total were produced 5 Yaks with 2xUBS, except of first in 1941) - just were TESTED in PVO of Rostov. and that i can said here - instead of Yak-7b with high gargrot (PA or PF), and even instead of Yak-1b - personally i interested in Yak-1 s96 and in this Yak with UBS. M-105PF almost identical with M-105PA, and i THINK that last engine can have "1050 mm hg boost" as "hypotetical fieldmode" (acc. to description of all this story). so, this is will be something like Yak-7b with PF, but in performance will be a bit better. meanwhile, Yak-1b need for all battles starting from winter BoS, Yak-7b even with PA fought in 1943, but s96 is ONLY BoS bird, like and personally i not sure that in near future, will be chances for early Yaks-1 with UBS. and, at least, summer BoS is very close to spring-42 and area of Rostov. The Yak-1 here in game seems much too fast at sea level....should be 471kph top speed for Yak-1, but it can almost keep up with 109 on the deck. new Yak-1'42 (M-105PA) in good condition, had around 490-495 kph at sl, BUT with cooling flaps "по потоку" (BMO this is - 10-15 kph (or around 30-35, when fully open). so, + M-105PF (20-25 kph) + cold air (25-30 for difference 30 degrees), or 490-495 + 10-15 + 23 + 30 = around 553-563 kph with FULLY closed cooling flaps, like in game. TREATED Yak-1 SN 1569 (ie prototype of Yaks-1 with high gargrot and PF, before s87), showed 510 kph at sl + 15 + 30 = ALMOST in-game speed 555 kph. etc. best real speed of Bf 109 F-4 (1.3 ata) - 520-526 kph at sl + 30 = 555 kph. so, looks like that results in game are correctly, in total, and hot summer will show other results (well, on russian forum some guys already CHANGED temperatures in mission files, and with +25 degrees they got exactly around 495 kph, with fully OPEN cooling flaps). 1
Jackfraser24 Posted September 2, 2022 Posted September 2, 2022 On 1/2/2015 at 11:55 PM, =LD=Penshoon said: It's the Yak-1 Series 69 Found this list on another forums: 1 series M-105P36 series - default Yak-1 with M-105PA (according to other data with 22 on 27 series, all from 28 series, ~ 430 planes with M-105P)49 series52 series 2xUBS+1xShVSK for antiaircraft defense of Rostov60 series light -160 kg 1xShVAK for antiaircraft defense of Moskow69 series M-105PF96 series light -160 kg 1xShVAK, M-105PF for antiaircraft defense of Stalingrad 512 and 520 IAP 220IAD 16A99 series (Yak-1B Early, autumn 1942)136 series default Yak-1B (approximately corresponds to the serial plane SNo. 08136 tested in Scientific Research Institute Air Force in April, 1943) Good research. Could you tell me which forums you got that info from, please?
1CGS LukeFF Posted September 2, 2022 1CGS Posted September 2, 2022 58 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said: Good research. Could you tell me which forums you got that info from, please? Dude, the guy last visited here in 2016. 6
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