what I want to know is why no AA in LD server?

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

I mean PU drinkens just vulched in there none stop and there is no AA in the airbases.

Edited December 10, 2014 by 71st_Mastiff

[vonLazan]

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/11977-loose-deuce-heavy-metal-server/ I think this is the place you were looking for.

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Starting to see more name-and-shame as time goes by here.

[Feathered_IV]

Starting to see more name-and-shame as time goes by here.

Good!

[vonLazan]

Good!

 

I personally don't subscribe to vulching, but I fail to see how naming and shaming is a good thing...

[Y-29.Silky]

AAA/AA doesn't respawn when it gets blown up.

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

I personally don't subscribe to vulching, but I fail to see how naming and shaming is a good thing...

Speaks pretty highly of this community, eh?

 

*sigh*

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

this isn't BF4!

[Yakdriver]

IT IS.
and dogfight servers are Airquake.

Yes, we have had these discussions before and will have them... again.
People DO vulch - so what.
you do not like what kind of Missions are on that server. So what.

you will soon do our own server and your own missions and your own scripting.

 

Then you can do as much AAA protection as you want.
happy?

[Mikey]

Its a witch hunt, you vulchers better watch out

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Vulchers = spawn campers and they suck

 

But......

 

Spawn somewhere else, fly CAP/intercept over your forward bases and drive them off. AAA is an answer, and I'm for it, but it's not the only answer.

[Yakdriver]

I take pride in Vulching. Takes me half an hour to make a biiiiig detour in order to not get caught on my way to the rearmost bases.

 

I then safely drop my Rockets on that Poor buttplug that dares to sit down there and does not despawn asap.

 

Probably thinks he can kick me off the map in his 109. bah. Thinks his gunners protect his Heinkel. hahah. many pilots even forget to "activate" their gunners till its too late.

 

one fast pass, Guns, rockets, and then low beneath the trees away out of the 10 mile radar radius. Once i am out of Radar Range. i am safe.

 

Getting home in one piece is the icing on the cake.

 

Chuikov talks about my mad exploits in his memoirs.

 

remember my name.

 

Vulching done right has nothing to do with "spawn camping" - since there is no where to hide, since radar indicates your position. The vulcher is indeed the screwed one if he stays around...

but then he is not a Vulcher. he is dead meat sooner or later.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Yakdriver

[No601_Swallow]

Meh. If you're the kind of person who finds shooting fish in a barrel "fun", then good for you. Just don't expect to be on the Christmas card list of people who, you know, enjoy life. Wha'eva.

[Yakdriver]

I don't expect anything positive at all.
Vulching is the ultimate thrill because it's a kick in the enemy's nads.

 

Been vulched enough times, been on the receiving end.

WWI is over, chivalry is dead, i finally got that message.

 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

What you described is not vulching. It's strafing. I have no problem with a single pass with either guns or rockets/bombs. I do a lot of Jabo work now in my Fw. I usually drop a bomb on the airstrip and take a AAA on the outward pass as well. If there is no CAP I will take a AAA on the return trip before fleeing, do a little aerial combat, land and repeat.

 

Vulching is multiple passes and/or just sitting in the rafters until someone spawns before taking runs down the airstrip over and over. That is no fun for anybody, is not realistic, and if we are honest, cowardly. It's a grand way to turn off prospective pilots as well. I have no problem with a realistic ground attack/strafe.

 

Vulching is, ultimately, disrepectful and childish. Chivalry dies when you allow it to. Police yourself first and have a little honor. This isn't unrestricted warfare, it's a game, and there should still be respect for your opponent.

Edited December 12, 2014 by HerrMurf

[Yakdriver]

well from the reaction i got it was very, VERY MUCH vulching. :-)

What do i care about prospective pilots? That's not my Job, is it. Balkenkreuze? Finnish cross? Vichy markings? All good, all good.

The last bit of Chivalry died when they gunned us down on the ground destroying our forces within hours.

Balkenkreuze-Backstages, all of them.

 

 

or ingame lingo:
The last bit of "fair play feeling" died when i saw a radar full of red spots converging on me upon spawning. Superior 109's and bored pilots looking for the cheap kill... all right, if that's the rules to play by, i will gladly play by them.

Briefing doesnt interdict it... Vulching. no restrictions, no need to feel bad - at least not for me. Just a game! Respawn, try again. I can do that, no problem.

 

the OP got vulched.

and went to the forum.

and nagged about the server mission

and named names.

 

 

say honor, childish, self-policing, and respect again.
It's a game - if a victim takes it so serious it needs to whine in the forum and complain about everything and everyone BUT HIMSELF... huh? what am i to think of that!

he had Dozens of options - write a PM to the LD guys, seek dialogue with the Vulcher, go away, keep the vulcher anonymous, tons of things to do.

 

But no, he did THIS.

Nono. Not a marine that one. No adaptation, no overcoming.
complaining is the easiest thing in the world.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Yakdriver

[vonLazan]

Vulching is, ultimately, disrepectful and childish. Chivalry dies when you allow it to. Police yourself first and have a little honor. This isn't unrestricted warfare, it's a game, and there should still be respect for your opponent.

 

 

As much as I agree, I think this is going to be a very 'live and let live' type situation mate. Like I said above, I don't personally subscribe to vulching, and you do bring up a very valid point about chivalry dying when you allow it.

Edited December 12, 2014 by 2./JG54_vonLazan

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

That was probably the most important line Von Lazan but it was lost on the target audience.

 

RTB

[1./KG4_Blackwolf]

As much as I agree, I think this is going to be a very 'live and let live' type situation mate. Like I said above, I don't personally subscribe to vulching, and you do bring up a very valid point about chivalry dying when you allow it.

I don't subscribe to it either. One time I did call the gang of vulchers out on it and was told to leave. I did, never have been back and wont. Its not my type of server. Yakdriver is saying if that's how they play, then play their game, a "how do you like it" thing. Then no missions are run, no more squads on a side working together in a server for a common goal of the mission.. just lone wolves playing air quake for the easy kill. That maybe fine for some but I would fly more in a mission based server any day. 

[johncage]

people who vulch therefore have no moral leg to stand on when people teamkill them. it's philosophically the same thing. you're doing what is enjoyable to you at the expense of others. same mentality as teamkillers and people whoo jump into a turret position and shoot tails off.

 

name and shame is exactly what needs to happen to these people. end of discussion.

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

or like the OP he like to sit at an airbase no cap and wait until some one fly's by, take off then vulch rinse repeat.

 

but me and Drinkens go way back, so he know he's an smart ass at hiding and vulching. lol

Edited December 12, 2014 by 71st_Mastiff

[Yakdriver]

I don't subscribe to it either. One time I did call the gang of vulchers out on it and was told to leave. I did, never have been back and wont. Its not my type of server. Yakdriver is saying if that's how they play, then play their game, a "how do you like it" thing. Then no missions are run, no more squads on a side working together in a server for a common goal of the mission.. just lone wolves playing air quake for the easy kill. That maybe fine for some but I would fly more in a mission based server any day. 

You always have these lone Wolves in any DF kind of server. always had... and likely always will. Maybe two or three even, and when they are overhead and dominate an airbase sort of kind of... a smart player has the means to deal with it.

Bring your qualities into play - imagination, improvisation, communicate with your team mates...

 

Imagination/Improvisation:

Sometimes, the more vulchers there are on the front, the easier you have it to sneak around them - you know where these cheapskates are.

Set up a Bombing mission from a different airbase. Away from these points with no need to worry. while they are vulturing , you kncok out the target

and suddenly a Message appears: Red army has won the day! changing missions in 30secs! next Mission: Berlin!

 

Communication:

Is necessary for teamwork - but currently, Communication is utterly lacking. there are Free, 24/7, quality TS servers all over the place and nobody uses them.

The communications that ARE used are the private, squad-internal ones.

That is a thing the Pilots by themselves need to learn... go into the game, and get on "the TS channel" at the same time.

It must become a reflex like launching TrackIR.

 

there are things to do about Vulchers, spawn campers, whatever you call them.

Others, like coop style missions with no respawn, are yet to come. The waiting game.

 

But coming on the forum, nagging about your experience... AFTER it's all over...

 

 

I seem to not understand what connects the Vulching and the Teamkilling.

 

the Teamkiller wants to shoot anything, or specifically wants to shoot his own team, and the fastest to get to that goal is to take out an unsuspecting or even completely helpless team member.

 

Example:

The dude who flies the Il-2 can not do a damn thing about the gunner shooting the rudder off and taking potshots at other planes in the formation.

Besides bail maybe, or fly inverted so the gunner faces downwards... or leave the formation.

But if the Pilot bails, he gives the teamkiller a chance to respawn in another IL-2 gunner position.

Therefor if The Pilot bails, the teamkiller wins AND makes progress in taking out the flight.

Or ask another gunner to take the teamkiller Out... not so easy...

the Pilot has no positive course of action available...

 

In that sense a teamkiller can leave his team helpless with no means of action.

A vulcher who loiters and takes potshots - does not have the means to make the targets helpless - the targets have options, choices as described above.

 

the TK'ing is for that reason far more destructive to the MP experience than Vulching.

Vulching is, in one pass... just a part of war. Vulching by loitering is a perverted. distorted part of war, partially gaming the game if no AAA is present.

 

 

 

But does that warrant a thread like this?

I thought we all had gotten over Vulching, accepted it, and have found the means to deal with it.

We have all been there, and certainly mastiff, who i recognize from way back.

 

so what's new to make the discussion come up again?

Edited December 12, 2014 by Yakdriver

[1./KG4_Blackwolf]

As for the TK's how about any damage done is done to the one shooting friendlies and not the other planes. Tail gunner shoots your tail and it counts as him getting shot, wounded then dead. Of course this would also mean the guy who misidentified a "bad guy" would get it too.

 

 

Vulching is, in one pass... just a part of war. Vulching by loitering is a perverted. distorted part of war, partially gaming the game if no AAA is present.

Agree. Its been in every game I've seen or played. Only thing to do is go to another base to spawn if there is one.

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

Hi,

 

Please could you advise if what I did recently was improper behaviour, I'm not that experienced on MP at all, and don't want to spoil other's enjoyment.

 

I was in an IL2, I headed to one of the targets on the briefing, a train, as I was flying solo I considered this a kind of stealth flight/mission, low and fast to try and take out a specific target. When I got to the train, I found it destroyed, so I turned to the nearby bridge which I believe was also listed as a target, this too was already destroyed. As I turned to head back to base/the front, I saw an airfield, so thought I would take it as a target of opportunity and use up the bombs/rockets I had (all unused). As I approached I saw a plane taking off, I attempted to hit this along with ground targets in my pass.

 

I failed to destroy much, including the taking off 109, that one and a buddy then promptly shot me up. I found this really fun, but then realised that I had perhaps been guilty of vulching?

 

Please could you advise, should I not do this in future? Or is this 'target of opportunity' scenario acceptable? I would never look to hang about to specifically get people taking off.

 

Thanks,

 

ChiefWH

that kind of vulching is acceptable.

[Dakpilot]

Attacking a ground target with a ground attack aircraft....seems pretty reasonable to me

 

It is spawn camping that is the thing that needs to be discouraged

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[Yakdriver]

you are in an IL-2 and you happen to come across a 109.

if you do not try your very very best to knock it out, YOU will be the one knocked out.

you... or him.

does that answer the question?

[coconut]

What I want to know is why aren't more people playing on the LD expert server? The gameplay in the map is pretty simple, if I got it right: Russians are expected to bust tanks (easiest done with IL-2), Germans have to stop them (using BF109 F4/G2, I suppose), the rest of the Russians can take Yaks to cover the IL-2.

 

That should produce nice fights, with a good mix of ground attack and dogfights.

 

Sadly, the low player density there (at least when I'm playing) makes it bit boring. Personally, I use the server as training grounds for tank-busting, and enjoy the company of other pilots, which is fine. It could be a lot more fun, though.

 

For me, vulching has never been a problem there. The lack of players makes it easy to spawn at a vulch-free airfield.

[Yakdriver]

comes down to:
tankbusting is a hard and difficult, very very risky business.
I am not good enuff for that, and if i were to try it it would be in a coop mode flight, where i would fly "together" to my certain death-by-tree or death-by ground or death-by whatever

the part of flying"together" would at least give the time invested some sense.

 

but flying alone and sucking at tankbusting... nope :-(

[Yakdriver]

addentum:

same mission been there for as long as i know LD.

targets gone or already Busted

dropping bombs and rockets on a row of heinkels, no effect. 23mm--- no effect.

nope.

[coconut]

comes down to:

tankbusting is a hard and difficult, very very risky business.

I am not good enuff for that, and if i were to try it it would be in a coop mode flight, where i would fly "together" to my certain death-by-tree or death-by ground or death-by whatever

the part of flying"together" would at least give the time invested some sense.

 

but flying alone and sucking at tankbusting... nope :-(

 

That it is hard is precisely why it's fun, IMO. It gets easier when one gets one's priorities right: 1. Avoid the ground and the trees, 2. Shoot stuff. Managing to hit targets is also a matter of patience. The circling pattern has to be wide enough that you have plenty of time to adjust your target and stabilize your aircraft. I understand that ultimately it's a matter of personal preferences. Personally, ground pounding makes the evil part in me very happy. From the sky, tanks look like cute toys, and seeing them explode and burn gives me much joy 

 

addentum:

 

same mission been there for as long as i know LD.

targets gone or already Busted

dropping bombs and rockets on a row of heinkels, no effect. 23mm--- no effect.

 

nope.

 

It's true that the mission state tends to get stale after a while. Tanks stop moving, the mission looks like it played to the end, yet there is one hour left on the timer. This may be a consequence of too few players for the mission. It's designed for large populations (or at least larger than 2 people).

[Yakdriver]

True.
I might need to be more patient and learn to fly a wide circle, even under the influence of the adrenaline and tension.

I feel similar...
but i also admit that i ground pound because the air to air war is too fast for me, always has been. Especially versus humans, where things get personal.

Ground pounding is my way of contributing to the air war, but also keeps me aware of why an air war exists in the first place. And Tanks are just evil Monsters. Armored, evil monsters.