Cockpit views?

[mjfur]

Hi,

 

New to BoS, but lots of time in IL-2. Is there a way to change the cockpit view like in IL-2 (Ctrl + F1) or must the cockpit view be up all of the time? If these keystrokes already exist, I keep missing them.

 

Thx,

[Steambat]

Nothing like that, cockpit is always.

[taffy2jeffmorgan]

I know that the "No Cockpit" feature especially for new pilots was a help in judging distance and hits on aerial  targets [ IL-2 1946 ] and as was said, that aid is not found in BoS ! , this combat flight simulation is about as real as it gets.

 

So keep practicing and it will all come good, I can say that from experience, also the use of a good head movement sensor is a must [TrackIR] will help you.

 

Happy Hunting.

[sgt_fresh]

I find the removal of views featured in previous versions of iL2 beyond dissapointing.

 

Recently I purchased the FW190 only to find out weapons and skins are locked.

 

I gave up on BOS, and re installed iL21946, still a good sim and all weapons views and skins are available ..... Don't get me started on the mission editor!

[SharpeXB]

I don't believe this is a feature you will see anymore in flight sims. It's a legacy view system from the past where games were played on an 11" 4:3 monitor without head tracking. Today's developer spends so much time and money creating the 3D animated cockpits, that's the way they want players to experience the game.

[CorsairHundo]

I was surprised with the 3rd person view in DCS

 

 

 

I don't believe this is a feature you will see anymore in flight sims. It's a legacy view system from the past where games were played on an 11" 4:3 monitor without head tracking. Today's developer spends so much time and money creating the 3D animated cockpits, that's the way they want players to experience the game.

[SKG51_robtek]

I don't believe this is a feature you will see anymore in flight sims. It's a legacy view system from the past where games were played on an 11" 4:3 monitor without head tracking. Today's developer spends so much time and money creating the 3D animated cockpits, that's the way they want players to experience the game.

That is mighty arrogant, imo, to force the customer to enjoy something in a very limited way.

It is just another option that is not available, limiting the possible buyer base, as if there was a too big base with the need to limit it.

[FuriousMeow]

Even War Thunder doesn't have a no-cockpit view. Shoot, even Elite: Dangerous and Star Citizen don't have a no cockpit view.

 

"But I built my own cockpit" but it doesn't work the same way as a virtual cockpit as you look around. There are no realistic view obstructions with a home cockpit vs the virtual cockpit.

 

It would be disabled online in most servers, so you don't have an option to play no cockpit online except in servers that would allow it - and at that point, why play a sim at all.

 

And not to mention the additional work involved to get a no cockpit view. All of the gauges, and where do they go? They're going to go right in your view anyway.

 

Plus, it hasn't been announced that there won't ever be a no cockpit view - it just hasn't been decided to add no (remove?) cockpit.

 

And there is no forcing the customer, there was never a "no cockpit" view to begin with so you aren't forced - it never existed, the option was never there. That's like forcing you use the 109 but you wanted to use a He-123. The first exists and was announced, the latter doesn't and never was even rumored.

 

But why the no cockpit? That just makes no sense. The wings are still there, the tail section is still there - the only thing removed is the cockpit and the bars that are just as much a realistic visible hindrance as the wings and tail section. And there is no argument in the world to be able to see the area obstructed by the engine/instrument panel/floorboard other than you want to play an arcade game. And at that point, there already is one.

Edited December 9, 2014 by FuriousMeow

[SharpeXB]

I was surprised with the 3rd person view in DCS

There is a "HUD Only" view in DCS. But it's really a HUD only, in the WWII planes all you see is the gunsight crosshairs. There's no game-like set of instruments and such on your screen. So it's intended for cockpit builders and you would in fact need your own cockpit in order to see any instruments or for the planes like the A-10C you'd need working panels.

That is mighty arrogant, imo, to force the customer to enjoy something in a very limited way.

It is just another option that is not available, limiting the possible buyer base, as if there was a too big base with the need to limit it.

I don't mean to be "arrogant"

That's just trying to make an assumption about why this feature was included in past sims but not today.

[Wuerger]

Today's developer spends so much time and money creating the 3D animated cockpits, that's the way they want players to experience the game.

 

Unfortunately they don't spend time and money in giving us a detailed manual explaining all the camera views and other settings he programmed in thousands of hours. This is really disappointing as it was already in Cliffs of Dover. 

 

It's like selling a perfectly expensive capable Video Recorder and not having time and money to deliver a manual. In a detailed sim which claims to be near realism, I find it rather annoying.  

 

Same disappointment here with BoS as sgt_fresh. Those who enjoyed IL-2, especially the modded Version, don't find a step forward except little better graphic details on the ground.    

Edited December 10, 2014 by Wuerger

[SharpeXB]

Unfortunately they don't spend time and money in giving us a detailed manual explaining all the camera views and other settings he programmed in thousands of hours. This is really disappointing as it was already in Cliffs of Dover.

 

It's like selling a perfectly expensive capable Video Recorder and not having time and money to deliver a manual. In a detailed sim which claims to be near realism, I find it rather annoying.

 

Same disappointment here with BoS as sgt_fresh. Those who enjoyed IL-2, especially the modded Version, don't find a step forward except little better graphic details on the ground.

I'm sure there will eventually be a manual. There is a very nice one for RoF. In the meantime there's a wealth of info available on the forum here. Really that's a spot than can be filled more easily by the community than the developer. They can keep busy creating content.

[LizLemon]

Even War Thunder doesn't have a no-cockpit view.

But it does have a no cockpit view.

 

Have you even played war thunder?

[Sokol1]

Semantics, they call then "HUD":

 

http://yoyosims.pl/sites/default/files/Obrazki/WarThunder/Bombery/War_Thunder_168.jpg

 

[FuriousMeow]

But it does have a no cockpit view.

 

Have you even played war thunder?

 

Yes. I have. I clearly haven't searched out that view EvilFlower. I also only played it for a few weeks because it is terrible. FRB didn't offer that view, and if it did - I never tried to use it but it was not one of the items I ever saw in the control list. I did google it though, and no "no cockpit" showed up.

 

Except for the bombers that had no cockpit because it wasn't developed for those planes at the time.

Edited December 11, 2014 by FuriousMeow

[voncrapenhauser]

I think the option should be there then you can please yourself.

Anything that encourages sim pilots has to be a plus.

I just got used to the view on ROF seems second nature now to me.

With that said I would like to see the choice though.

[N1SB.Jefu]

No reason it couldn't or shouldn't be added for single player. Has always been there in the past as far as I can remember. Definite no-no for multiplayer though.

[SharpeXB]

Except for the bombers that had no cockpit because it wasn't developed for those planes at the time.

That's the other reason arcade games like Wings of Prey and War Thunder have the "Virtual Cockpit". Because they don't model many of the cockpits. BoS or real flight sim games don't have that problem.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

It is unnecessary and would take away design work of higher priority. It continues to amaze me the ragers who yell, "it's too gamey, I quit," and increasingly those who yell, "it doesn't have some legacy game element, I quit!"

[Steambat]

I tried it in IL2 original all those years ago and it just made me feel air sick! Just never seemed to know which way was up in a dogfight!!

[sgt_fresh]

It is unnecessary and would take away design work of higher priority. It continues to amaze me the ragers who yell, "it's too gamey, I quit," and increasingly those who yell, "it doesn't have some legacy game element, I quit!"

[sgt_fresh]

Yup it's easy to set a game down, especially when the end user is ignored or discounted by dog pile banter.

 

Just consider what previous iL2 game enthusiasts would like made available in game play options.

[Felix58]

One of the big steps forward from 1946 in CLoD, BOS and DCS is the ability to fly by the instruments.

While 46 is a (the) classic of the WW2 flight sim genre it really has had its day in the sun.

Not dissing the 46 mod community or even those who stick to old faithful but new entrants to the genre would be expecting more in the visual department.  

And, yes, BOS does need and will get an editor.

Just as DCS will get a decent planeset and map.

[voncrapenhauser]

No reason it couldn't or shouldn't be added for single player. Has always been there in the past as far as I can remember. Definite no-no for multiplayer though.

Absolutely....In multi is a no no.

But for casual players, in single play the no cockpit view will encourage new players I MO.

[voncrapenhauser]

It is unnecessary and would take away design work of higher priority. It continues to amaze me the ragers who yell, "it's too gamey, I quit," and increasingly those who yell, "it doesn't have some legacy game element, I quit!"

Just have the view option would be fine by me. I would play both ways and still probably prefer the cockpit view....for the emersion factor.

The I quit's can quit and miss this wonderful sim.....Their prerogative ....Their loss.

[N1SB.Jefu]

It is unnecessary and would take away design work of higher priority. It continues to amaze me the ragers who yell, "it's too gamey, I quit," and increasingly those who yell, "it doesn't have some legacy game element, I quit!"

 

Removing the cockpit and adding a standard UI element for instrument readings isn't what I would call work -  reverting back to a prior time in earlier development isn't something developers would normally associate with increasing revenues.

 

Sure sims have moved on, tracking & joysticks are relatively inexpensive, but why isolate those who dabble in these games who like to make do with singleplayer and zero investment in specific equipment? I myself have a friend whom dabbles with IL-2 1946 who won't come over to BoS, primarily due to the fact that he must pay £39.99 (game) + £20 (cheapest joystick) + £20 (cheapest DIY tracking setup), that's £80 for barebones. Even if one could be convinced to play BoS with zero peripherals and try make do with mouse/keyboard, your all actively campaigning to make this even more impossible for them than it already is.

 

Get off your ridiculous high horses and let the casuals enjoy the game too. I'd personally allow every plane in singleplayer a space hopper on the underbelly to shoot them back into the sky following a crash if it meant more players getting into WW2 flight sims.

Edited December 15, 2014 by N1SB.Jefu

[Streiff]

Removing the cockpit and adding a standard UI element for instrument readings isn't what I would call work -  reverting back to a prior time in earlier development isn't something developers would normally associate with increasing revenues.

 

Sure sims have moved on, tracking & joysticks are relatively inexpensive, but why isolate those who dabble in these games who like to make do with singleplayer and zero investment in specific equipment? I myself have a friend whom dabbles with IL-2 1946 who won't come over to BoS, primarily due to the fact that he must pay £39.99 (game) + £20 (cheapest joystick) + £20 (cheapest DIY tracking setup), that's £80 for barebones. Even if one could be convinced to play BoS with zero peripherals and try make do with mouse/keyboard, your all actively campaigning to make this even more impossible for them than it already is.

 

Get off your ridiculous high horses and let the casuals enjoy the game too. I'd personally allow every plane in singleplayer a space hopper on the underbelly to shoot them back into the sky following a crash if it meant more players getting into WW2 flight sims.

 

+1

 

But tell that to the devs, that we need options to attract new players, not a fundamental game play change or a few persons narrow view on how a flight sim should be played. (Not that they will listen)

Edited December 15, 2014 by Baron

[-TBC-AeroAce]

It always amazes me that people don't know what sim actually means. It's a platform that can change the inviroment and realism to suit training or other need. Sim has nothing to do with realism but is a tool that can be changed to suit user requirements. Too many hardcore player are to quick to judge that optional simplifications make it less of a sim when the opposite is true, as it's adding to the utility of the platform

[SharpeXB]

Removing the cockpit and adding a standard UI element for instrument readings isn't what I would call work - reverting back to a prior time in earlier development isn't something developers would normally associate with increasing revenues.

 

Sure sims have moved on, tracking & joysticks are relatively inexpensive, but why isolate those who dabble in these games who like to make do with singleplayer and zero investment in specific equipment? I myself have a friend whom dabbles with IL-2 1946 who won't come over to BoS, primarily due to the fact that he must pay £39.99 (game) + £20 (cheapest joystick) + £20 (cheapest DIY tracking setup), that's £80 for barebones. Even if one could be convinced to play BoS with zero peripherals and try make do with mouse/keyboard, your all actively campaigning to make this even more impossible for them than it already is.

 

Get off your ridiculous high horses and let the casuals enjoy the game too. I'd personally allow every plane in singleplayer a space hopper on the underbelly to shoot them back into the sky following a crash if it meant more players getting into WW2 flight sims.

Hey Rise of Flight is adding mouse control so who knows? Maybe it will come to BoS too.

Absolutely....In multi is a no no.

But for casual players, in single play the no cockpit view will encourage new players I MO.

I just gave the zero cockpit view a try in CoD & DCS. I don't think its something for beginners. Cockpit builders? Yes. But it's very difficult and disorienting. There's no "HUD" like a pitch ladder you'd see on a modern plane. If I was a beginner I'd stick to the cockpit view.

[Yakdriver]

No.

nonono... i have to disagree with you.
simulator - simulates.

 

I would like to invite you on a wiki trip around the simulation and combat flight simulation theme, in no place will you find the definition of a simulator to be riddled with options, accessability, utility embracing new players...

You DO however find the general attempt (poor attempt?) to replicate the real deal. The aim to be as close to the real thing as possible.

 

Does BoS try to be a simulator?

 

IL-2 Sturmovik: Battle of Stalingrad is a historically based game. It is the next generation of the legendary Sturmovik series of WWII flight-sim games.

 

Yes.

 

Therefor its Players are, by default trying to simulate - not to accomodate a maximum amount of players.

A maximum amount of players, by sheer numbers, you will find in War Thunder, because it is specifically designed to do that.

 

---------------------------

I accept that Options should be available as a stepping stone towards the simulation level. To get new players aboard and let them learn the ropes. No disagreement there.

 

--------------------------

A lot of the "hell no!" responses might potentially have the roots in the fear that the MP Scene starts offering pure arcade servers, and that those servers get more traffic than the full real stuff.

Nobody cares what people do alone at home - but people care about the Server difficulty settings, do they not? I admit i do.

 

I don't want to fly with noobs who use the mouse to aim, auto rudder, auto throttle in order to control the plane, who use arcade options online. That is, after all, specifically *not* why this program was written.

If i wanted that i would go elsewhere, where these freedoms are...  for Free.

 

I can say i am one of those, Plane fans , whose aim it is to fly, to get close to the experience they had back then.
i would go as far as remove the plane icon from the map, and remove the observers/radar too. (look out the window! look for landmarks!)

Even the technochat  (know what you did! look at your gauges!

Even the chat. (use teamspeak! Hint: even the devteam has a TS3 Server running, so the message is very clear.)

 

Summa Summum:
No cockpit / God's eye View is fine to get into the platform... for the first dozen flights.

But i would seriously hope for no server to offer that option - ever.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Yakdriver

[Bearcat]

Hi,

 

New to BoS, but lots of time in IL-2. Is there a way to change the cockpit view like in IL-2 (Ctrl + F1) or must the cockpit view be up all of the time? If these keystrokes already exist, I keep missing them.

 

Thx,

 

Yeah there is no no pit view.. I think it is  a shame too because there is a place for it in any sim IMO.. but it is what it is...

 

 

I find the removal of views featured in previous versions of iL2 beyond dissapointing.

 

Recently I purchased the FW190 only to find out weapons and skins are locked.

 

I gave up on BOS, and re installed iL21946, still a good sim and all weapons views and skins are available ..... Don't get me started on the mission editor!

 

Me too..

 

I don't believe this is a feature you will see anymore in flight sims. It's a legacy view system from the past where games were played on an 11" 4:3 monitor without head tracking. Today's developer spends so much time and money creating the 3D animated cockpits, that's the way they want players to experience the game.

 

I disagree...  Look what about the guy who wants to build his own pit.. using a no pit view either projectyed or on a 32"+ monitor in front of his pit? It has been done. I fail to see why options are a problem and unless I am missing something i would think it would be a relatively simple task to turn off the cockpit. Plus a no pit view is great for total noobs..

 

 

I think the option should be there then you can please yourself.

Anything that encourages sim pilots has to be a plus.

I just got used to the view on ROF seems second nature now to me.

With that said I would like to see the choice though.

 

+1

 

No reason it couldn't or shouldn't be added for single player. Has always been there in the past as far as I can remember. Definite no-no for multiplayer though.

 

It should be in single or MP.. just server side settable.. end of issue. IL2 has all of this .. and if you want to you can find an open pit server.. if it is not your cup of tea there are locked pit options as well..

 

It is unnecessary and would take away design work of higher priority. It continues to amaze me the ragers who yell, "it's too gamey, I quit," and increasingly those who yell, "it doesn't have some legacy game element, I quit!"

 

It amazes me how many folks can drop $60+ on a product and drop the product before it is even finished...

[voncrapenhauser]

^{Cockpit on or off easy choice .......If you have it}

 

^{I think Bearcat has covered all bases there}  

 

 

Edited December 17, 2014 by voncrapenhauser

[Sokol1]

 

 

 I fail to see why options are a problem

 

 

Well, this option - No Cockpit View (Wonder Woman)... - will need a button more in controls, so...   

[NoNameHitman11]

Hi,

 

New to BoS, but lots of time in IL-2. Is there a way to change the cockpit view like in IL-2 (Ctrl + F1) or must the cockpit view be up all of the time? If these keystrokes already exist, I keep missing them.

 

Thx,

Press f4

[Solmyr]

Press f4

Since 2014 his F4 key could be broken. 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Guldurnit, I haven't been in this thread since 2014 and I got flamed pretty hard there. I missed an excellent argument and lord knows I love them - as well as a good mouth fight too.

[Thad]

I find the removal of views featured in previous versions of iL2 beyond dissapointing.

 

Recently I purchased the FW190 only to find out weapons and skins are locked.

 

I gave up on BOS, and re installed iL21946, still a good sim and all weapons views and skins are available ..... Don't get me started on the mission editor!

Salutations,

 

I purchased both premium version of BOS and BOM and the early access BOK as a WWII flight simulation and at full price. I have all weapons and skins.

 

Have fun in IL2 1946.

[Riderocket]

I find the removal of views featured in previous versions of iL2 beyond dissapointing.

 

Recently I purchased the FW190 only to find out weapons and skins are locked.

 

I gave up on BOS, and re installed iL21946, still a good sim and all weapons views and skins are available ..... Don't get me started on the mission editor!

 

I believe they've removed "unlocks" unless you get the starter edition on G2A.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I believe they've removed "unlocks" unless you get the starter edition on G2A.

 

December 2014.... its a necrothread

[Feathered_IV]

You can go to externals and manoeuvre the PoV so that your view is just a fraction ahead of the spinner.  It's not my sort of thing, but it works the same way as Oleg's wonder-woman view.