Reasons why i almost exclusively play BoS - unbiased WW2-sim ranking

[JG1_Pragr]

I could sign the first post of this thread in an instant. Still I'd add another one big pro of BoS and that's 6DOF. No other sim has such a great representation of the pilots head moves like BoS has. The things I hate most on CloD is the idiotic "lean on gunsight" when you want to aim in 109 and 6DOF impossible to set for keys.

 

Just one notice about Marseille. I wouldn't take his shooting efficiency as a measure. He is famous by claiming multiple victories during one fight, while whole Allied air forces didn't lost a single plane on the same whole day. 

[Stig]

 

Just one notice about Marseille. I wouldn't take his shooting efficiency as a measure. He is famous by claiming multiple victories during one fight, while whole Allied air forces didn't lost a single plane on the same whole day. 

 

Yes, Marseille overclaimed, but not necessarily more than most other aces of any airforce in WWII. It doesn't really say anything about his marksmanship. He was likely very good.

[avlSteve]

Just got back from a successful night bombing run on a supply depot in a Pe-2.  When I got back to the base and start my approach, the search lights come on, and I figure we must have company.  After I land, I turn onto the taxiway and look down the runway just in time to see the bombs hit where I had just been. 

 

The whole flight was rather... spectacular and unique.  That's the kind of thing that has me hooked.

[II./JG77_Manu*]

If i would write this topic again, today, i would rewrite the title a little bit. It would sound "Reasons why i mostly play BoS (and also a little bit CloD)"

Thanks to the positive reviews of some users in this topic, i gave it another try, fired it up 3 days ago, and flew around in the Atag server. To be honest it was quite fun. Beside one sortie i took only the Spitfire and the Bf110, just because they are "something else" compared to the stuff we have in BoS. The map is also "something else" then the winter map in BoS. I couldn't overlook, how important diversity is, at least for me. It's not as "polished" as BoS in terms of performance and overall UI, but it's acceptable. But on the other side it definitely shows, what BoS still can make better. The hitsounds are awesome (amazingly scary and loud when you get hit by multiple bullets, way more immersive), gun sounds, especially the cannons have more "punch" (the .3  Browning mg is also spot on, it's similar to the youtube guntests, couldn't be more accurate), and the recoil effect seems way more plausible then in BoS (where there is not really one). So still a lot of things, BoS can learn from this also very good Sim. 

As long as another (non-winter) theatre with new planes is coming out in the BoS franchise, i will definitely have my fun also with CloD.

Edited November 5, 2014 by Celestiale

[FlatSpinMan]

Too much petty bickering going on that has been cleaned up. We could keep it in to show how stupid it all is, but that would just contribute to the general irritation here as people new to the thread would see it and feel like piling in on one side or the other.

Just knock the niggling and one-up-manship on the head. Ignore someone if they bother you.

[II./JG77_Manu*]

Too much petty bickering going on that has been cleaned up. We could keep it in to show how stupid it all is, but that would just contribute to the general irritation here as people new to the thread would see it and feel like piling in on one side or the other.

Just knock the niggling and one-up-manship on the head. Ignore someone if they bother you.

thanks a lot for cleaning this mess

[Scarecrow]

I'm also enjoying BOS very much, it isn't perfect but then there is no perfect flight sim is there?

 

BOS seems to be very well placed for commercial success and I'm excited about seeing further expansions and new products.

 

Team Fusion have done great things with CLOD but new maps and planes aint gonna come anytime soon.

 

Some things about DCS WWII though,

 

1) "Planes fly on rails" probably because nobody puts any weather in their missions at all whatsoever.

2) "Dora's DM seems incomplete" it is a beta product so that is to be expected.

3) "No historical map" Yeah I backed the thing and I ain't even bothering till there is a historical map.

4) "Ground handling is to easy" This was answered by YoYo in relation to the P51, basically ED's focus is on realistic aircraft systems simulation and ground handling is not a priority.

 

I look forward to DCS WWII but I feel bad for ED as the original plan was to have the product ready for retail about now.

 

I think the Devs here have hit the sweet spot for "realism v it's an actual complete software product"

Edited November 5, 2014 by Scarecrow

[II./JG27_Rich]

Too much petty bickering going on that has been cleaned up. We could keep it in to show how stupid it all is, but that would just contribute to the general irritation here as people new to the thread would see it and feel like piling in on one side or the other.

Just knock the niggling and one-up-manship on the head. Ignore someone if they bother you.

I can't speak for DCS because I have not flown it but I think both Cliffs of Dover and Battle of Stalingrad are very very good. One of the rare things I don't care for in Cliffs of Dover are the run-through trees. I love the trees in Battle of Stalingrad, you hit one you're toast...I love that  Plus the trees are beautiful. So is the whole world of it..I don't mind snow I'm in Canada.

Edited November 5, 2014 by II./JG27_Rich

[Pringliano]

 

4) "Ground handling is to easy" This was answered by YoYo in relation to the P51, basically ED's focus is on realistic aircraft systems simulation and ground handling is not a priority.

 

Good post Scarecrow...

 

curiously I find DCS's ground handling very credible, and wished for a similar modeling in BoS. I still find the prop effects during ground operations in BoS way overdone and not plausible. The "Dora" in DCS, to give just one example, models pretty much what I would expect from such an aircraft while taxiing, during takeoff and even landing...

[=LD=Hethwill]

Yes. CloD is as fun as BoS as fun as WW2OL as fun as AH, the squad social aspect I mean, mileage and preferences may vary. Game wise yes, BoS and CloD are fun. Thanks for the vids.

 

Eagerly waiting for the Dserver and check if some co-op can be played with it, i'm sure FMB will give us the ability to make some proper all squads scenarios

[II./JG77_Manu*]

I'm also enjoying BOS very much, it isn't perfect but then there is no perfect flight sim is there?

 

BOS seems to be very well placed for commercial success and I'm excited about seeing further expansions and new products.

 

Team Fusion have done great things with CLOD but new maps and planes aint gonna come anytime soon.

 

Some things about DCS WWII though,

 

1) "Planes fly on rails" probably because nobody puts any weather in their missions at all whatsoever.

2) "Dora's DM seems incomplete" it is a beta product so that is to be expected.

3) "No historical map" Yeah I backed the thing and I ain't even bothering till there is a historical map.

4) "Ground handling is to easy" This was answered by YoYo in relation to the P51, basically ED's focus is on realistic aircraft systems simulation and ground handling is not a priority.

 

I look forward to DCS WWII but I feel bad for ED as the original plan was to have the product ready for retail about now.

 

I think the Devs here have hit the sweet spot for "realism v it's an actual complete software product"

I completely agree with 1, 3 and 4, but i disagree with 2. It's not only the Dora's DM, it's the DCS DMs overall. They are very broken right now, they don't even have specific hitboxes. Right now it feels like Battlefield, where the vehicles have a health bar. I have already written a few posts about it, so i won't go into details again. One little example, which i didn't mention yet:

Last time i landed with the Mustang (wasn't hit by any bullet), after landing when i became slower, i accidently ditched one wing onto the ground. You know what the result was? I got bulletholes all over this wing  .

I think, and i really hope that sometime in the future they will implement a propper DM in this game. I think it could become great. But till then i won't be able to really enjoy it 

[Tektolnes]

1) is then a player issue as weather is in the sim and can even be made dynamic to move over the map. The only thing maybe missing is the turbulence you get bumping the plane in BOS which is a nice touch. The FM in DCS is hardly on rails though. When 9 RL Mustang pilots say the FM is pretty much spot on then it's right.

 

4) ground handling is too easy compared to what? I find DCS and BOS ground handling fairly similar except for the BOS FW190 which seems a bit overdone.

 

I enjoy playing both BOS and DCS but unless BOS changes its bizarre approach to things like unlocks, graphic options, etc. then the future will be mainly DCS for me I think. It'll take longer to come together but ultimately it's going to be a glorious high fidelity piece of work.  

[=LD=Hethwill]

A mission-generated campaign ( with horrible unlocks ) or no campaign at all... decisions decisions... 

 

After all MP is MP anywhere.

 

I keep DCS for jet era and a more interested in jet-era mission builders.

[snowsnipersnow_sniper]

, they don't even have specific hitboxes. 

 

they have.  it's only a graphic issue from what i've read on ED forum.

you can have a look on all the DM simulated in the  "failure page" in FMB to see what can be simulated in DCS.

 

Anyway at this time, the best realistic DM and graphical DM model still COD.

[=LD=Hethwill]

CoD or TF ? I'm lost...

 

Anyway, shouldn't this thread be moved to "other Il-2 games" already... sorry to say but damn too much TF CloD shameless pub already 

[snowsnipersnow_sniper]

Dora FMB exemple  :

 

What sort of detailled DM is possible to be simulated in DCS : here you go.  it's only a graphical issue. only an extract from a very big list.

Edited November 5, 2014 by snowsnipersnow_sniper

[II./JG77_Manu*]

Dora FMB exemple  :

 

What sort of detailled DM is possible to be simulated in DCS : here you go.  it's only a graphical issue. only an extract from a very big list.

well maybe. It's still broken as hell, when a mustang can withstand 8 20mm and 8 13mm into the engine without any harm. basically 1 20mm, and the engine should be gone

[Rama]

To All

If you want to discuss CoD or DCS features, you can do it in some specific topics in other sub-forums (Free subject for DCS, and other 1C games for CoD).

 

Here, please, stay on topic.

[Sokol1]

 No other sim has such a great representation of the pilots head moves like BoS has. 

 

Better say "boddy moves": 

 

[LizLemon]

Im amazed that the devs were very quick to patch something like 16x yet the ability to stand on your pilots seat hasnt been fixed.

[Yakdriver]

out-of mind or near death experiences included in the game.
and it's all safe - stop complaining you lot!

:D

[II./JG27_Rich]

Better say "boddy moves": 

 

I like it though  You just don't have to move out a bit if you think it's unrealistic. If your engine is on fire you can poke your head out just enough to see to land or ditch witch is very cool

Edited November 6, 2014 by II./JG27_Rich

[StarLightSong]

Thanks,  I own all of the above "sims" and pretty much agree although I do find CLoD Team Fusions single player  good when I'm here in the slow, big lag internet, Northern Canada and denied reasonable multiplayer perfomance.

[Tektolnes]

The ability of the strapped in pilot to move their head all over the place is pretty ridiculous. It's been pointed out a good few times now but the devs have never commented. I could half accept it if we were allowed that range of movement when on the ground but it should be much more restricted when in the air. The devs seem to have a bee in their bonnet about people gaming the game with graphic options but let something way more gamey like this get a free pass. 

[Marq_Tex]

++1

 

Thx Celestiale.

[150GCT_Veltro]

BOS seems to be very well placed for commercial success and I'm excited about seeing further expansions and new products.

 

 

+1, i feel the same and for my opinion it will be.

[unreasonable]

The ability of the strapped in pilot to move their head all over the place is pretty ridiculous. It's been pointed out a good few times now but the devs have never commented. I could half accept it if we were allowed that range of movement when on the ground but it should be much more restricted when in the air. The devs seem to have a bee in their bonnet about people gaming the game with graphic options but let something way more gamey like this get a free pass. 

 

Imagine the screaming from the MP community if pilot head view was realistically modelled so that checking 6 (or in many planes, even 5 or 7) actually required a turning manoeuvre rather than an Exorcist style demonic possession.  They keep saying they want realism but they really, really do not.

 

The thing is that the viewing system is the same for everybody now, whereas custom graphics could (in some absurd paranoid nightmare) give unfair advantage.

[avlSteve]

I must admit that BOS allows me to see better than any other combat sim I've tried.  In all the others, I've felt like the 6dof was unrealistically restricted. I have the canopy open, I want to lean out further and look down the side of the aircraft, which I think I'd be able to do IRL. 

 

So in that instance, BOS is more realistic to me, in a sense.  On the other hand, there is something gamey to be moving at top speed and lean WAY out and have a look around.  I need all the help I can get though, and I'd rather have too little than not enough, but I think less would be more in this instance. 

 

The sweetest would be to make the 6dof limits configurable.  If not, I wish they would consider toning it down a notch, where your head can get inches outside the cockpit rather than feet.

[DD_bongodriver]

 

 

  where your head can get inches outside the cockpit rather than feet.

 

yeah this, just like it is in CloD.

[Matt]

Imagine the screaming from the MP community if pilot head view was realistically modelled so that checking 6 (or in many planes, even 5 or 7) actually required a turning manoeuvre rather than an Exorcist style demonic possession.  They keep saying they want realism but they really, really do not.

Not sure who "they" are, but I would love to have that in a flight sim.

 

With the DK2, I kind of had that experience in DCS already and it's so much better than the 360 degree stuff that's the standard in everything today. It's actually one of the reasons why I enjoy flying the La-5 less since the update when they put the gunsight higher. With the default view point, you can basically look directly behind and over the rear fuselage now and it feels pretty ridiculous to be honest.

 

So yes, I would definitely vote for a more restricted view system in BoS.

[II./JG27_Rich]

What a shame.. Cliffs of Dover..COD CLOD. Good thing it's not ......Doghtfight Over Hastings

 

 

[Tektolnes]

I must admit that BOS allows me to see better than any other combat sim I've tried.  In all the others, I've felt like the 6dof was unrealistically restricted. I have the canopy open, I want to lean out further and look down the side of the aircraft, which I think I'd be able to do IRL.

 

You could sort of do it on the ground when you're not strapped in. Though even still not to the extent of the out of body experience that BOS allows. But when you're in the air you'd be strapped in to stop you braining yourself on something when maneuvering the plane in a fight. There's absolutely no logic to what BOS allows you to do where you can pull a 400kmh 5g turn while your head is way out somewhere over the wing looking behind you. Other flight sims nail it far better. 

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 Easy to test how "nice" to keep a head in the wind. Take a motorcycle and raise your head from behind the windscreen at speeds above 200km/h. Now imagine the same at speeds excess of 400km/h.

[BraveSirRobin]

 Easy to test how "nice" to keep a head in the wind. Take a motorcycle and raise your head from behind the windscreen at speeds above 200km/h. Now imagine the same at speeds excess of 400km/h.

 

It would probably be even easier to just have someone hit you in the face with a club.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 Tried to be less aggressive, more subtle approach this time

[Tektolnes]

It's been posted before I think but the NACA test shows it'd be pretty unpleasant:

 

[II./JG77_Manu*]

It's been posted before I think but the NACA test shows it'd be pretty unpleasant:

 

 

Yeah but it also shows that it's possible even at high speeds, without "breaking your neck" or other harm, like People were stating. Of course you should not be able to put your head out like in BoS. I also think Clod makes this most realistic

[DD_bongodriver]

The guy in the NACA tests obviously has his head on a headrest.