Unlock Modifications is a boring process to be honest...

[DD_bongodriver]

2 polls and a massive pre release row proving it's unpopularity yet it was still pushed on us, what makes you think anybody 'got it'?

Edited October 29, 2014 by DD_bongodriver

[DD_bongodriver]

 

 

The whole game marketing strategy is built around this unlock system.

 

it's baffling, the challenge should lay simply with flying and fighting and trying to survive in a combat simulation, but some genius though what we really want is unlocking stuff?

[IvanDolvich]

For me the unlocks take away a big part of the immersion. If you flew and finish a mission, in the following you get other or more weapons/bombs/.... for finishing the mission. Perhaps explained with the campaingn making progress (new things shipped to the front, better supply-lines, finally more of the new guns developed are available for your squadron, ect.).

But now you are shown how many targets you have destroyed and what that counts in XP. It just feels numb..... just too "gamey" for a sim.

On top of that... after the last patch the game tends to crash to desktop without a proper message what that was caused my..... and voila, my "XP" is gone, the mission is over..... I'm restarting the game and do another generic mission of groundattack or escort.

That is quite gamebreaking for me.

The only thing that keeps me playing is that I know I am getting better at the handling of the planes. But that would work (and would be mor fun for ME) without the immersion-breaking unlocks and XP

 

Edit: another thing comes to my mind.... for the missions not being much different from eachother. Is it really necessary being online to play SP? I think my own computer is more than capable to cast such simple mission.... no need to do that on a server

Edited October 29, 2014 by IvanDolvich

[DD_bongodriver]

 

 

I, truly, can't wait to meet these people. I want to know what colour the sky is on their planet.

 

Don't expect any lasting relationships, the second they realise that actually flying let alone the fighting is a challenge and the sky isn't always full of bad guys that explode when you squirt laser guns at them with lots of flashing messages on screen telling them how awesome they are at racking up bonus points and XP, they will vanish quicker than a 16x speed setting.

[Brano]

it's baffling, the challenge should lay simply with flying and fighting and trying to survive in a combat simulation, but some genius though what we really want is unlocking stuff?

That's exactly what I do in offline campaign.If I get some badge for it or new skin,I really don't care.But I do care that we dont't have working decal system,proper military ranks and awards.Only levels and funny boyscout badges

[Jaws2002]

Aye.

 

I just hope they stick around long enough so I can ask them what colour the sky is on their planet.

 

 

LOL. That's a good sig right there.

[Sparrer]

S!

I think route correction is needed about this disastrous unlock game design:

Disconnect the unlock stuff with MP : 60% problem solved


Provide the old il2 way skin management: 80% problem solved .

(Plus you just BUMP UP the community with plenty of material around BOS. There are thousands of people interested in this )

Provide really good missions and campaign in SP : 100% problem solved



In the future, release the : FMB and Dserver

..then a summer map.

BOOOM.... bos now will become a SERIOUS competitor sim in the market. It has a lot of POTENTIAL.

Then, just wait for the sky fall down when, further, the single planes market starts to mess up with servers planeset and online wars....i would prefer addons


Go ahead dev's. Youu already done the hard work. You just need to finish it properly. You have a very nice sim here. Don't screw this up with LOFT ideas and move on :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:

[dkoor]

Here's what I'd like to see happen, pronto. 

 

Unlock system stays in place, except the things to unlock would not affect gameplay.  Just have it be skins for now, and when you complete it you get a badge signifying you're a Ju-87 pilot or whatever.

 

That way the core system stays as is, the MP players can ignore the campaign, and SP players will still have goals.  What do you think?

 

Good idea up to a point.

 

Many (STEAM) games of other genres have unlocks.

 

I'd add to that, unlocks should be achievements only IMHO.

 

Meaning that after you down say 5 E/A you get "Ace" achiv, after you down 5 players you get "Ace Stalker" or something like that, if you direct hit player with bomb in mid air (one in thousands shot) you get "tasty iron" achiv etc.... there are tons of weird things you can do with this game and things to be unlocked, and devs should have appoint someone to create a lot of such crazy achivs.

 

And unlock away.

 

People would be laughing at that and try to accomplish as many as they can, a great and fun situation IMO... as opposed to the situation we have now (for many players).

Edited October 29, 2014 by dkoor

[DrDag]

I think a simple fix to keep the MP crowd happy is in order. This unlocking concept is not well placed there. As for the single player, I don't mind it at all. It is a good training for all the different planes.

 

Dag

[DD_bongodriver]

Good training would be.......training missions, not sure how unlocking stuff is training.

[Jaws2002]

I think a simple fix to keep the MP crowd happy is in order. This unlocking concept is not well placed there. As for the single player, I don't mind it at all. It is a good training for all the different planes.

 

Dag

 

 

Actually it's not  good training or good anything for the offline campaign. With this huge map and those entire cities modeled historically accurate, it's a shame to make the next unlock the driving force for the mission instead of immersion and history. It's such a waste.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

Good training would be.......training missions, not sure how unlocking stuff is training.

Even better training would be to have training servers where more experienced players can show newbies the ins and outs.

[Hertt]

Down with the unlock system! This is supposed to be a sim, not an arcade game. This is not running in XBox One.

 

There are some people here that have been flying in sims for decades. Why they need to fly hours offline to earn points and get different payloads and skins?

 

Not even in RoF that was necessary.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

Down with the unlock system! This is supposed to be a sim, not an arcade game. This is not running in XBox One.

 

There are some people here that have been flying in sims for decades. Why they need to fly hours offline to earn points and get different payloads and skins?

 

Not even in RoF that was necessary.

People still play that today, too. It's almost as if the core game is strong enough that people enjoy it based on that and don't need a carrot-on-a-stick to keep playing.

[Chuck_Owl]

But... don't you guys understand? Don't you see the obvious truth? It's OUR fault if we can't enjoy the game with features we do not fully appreciate to their (outstanding) value. 

 

We are ruining what is the best simulator EVER made. How childish! How dare we? What have we done?  Oh, Lord... Why? Why can't we just recognize this masterpiece and enjoy the game like these hundreds of thousands of other satisfied customers? You know... the ones that really "get it"? 

 

Thankfully, many valiant forumers showed me the errors of my way and I now take full responsibility for the failure to realize how awesome the unlock aspect is. I shall now retire to Nepal where I intend to live as a mountain goat as a sentence for my unforgivable crime.

Edited October 30, 2014 by 71st_AH_Chuck

[indiaciki]

But... don't you guys understand? Don't you see the obvious truth? It's OUR fault if we can't enjoy the game with features we do not fully appreciate to their (outstanding) value. 

 

We are ruining what is the best simulator EVER made. How childish! How dare we? What have we done?  Oh, Lord... Why? Why can't we just recognize this masterpiece and enjoy the game like these hundreds of thousands of other satisfied customers? You know... the ones that really "get it"? 

 

Thankfully, many valiant forumers showed me the errors of my way and I now take full responsibility for the failure to realize how awesome the unlock aspect is. I shall now retire to Nepal where I intend to live as a mountain goat as a sentence for my unforgivable crime.

What's your crime besides recommending touchdown speed for the 109F at 160 km/h instead of 150/h ?

[Rjel]

What a shame. There are some very valid points made in this (and a bunch of other similar) thread. Unfortunately, most of those are lost to the chickenshit comments as posted earlier in this thread. Whatever the reasons behind the unlocks, childish rhetoric isn't going to change anything. All it's accomplishing is making some people look like fools. It's a proud day for what is supposed to be a mature and intelligent "community".  

Edited October 30, 2014 by Rjel

[Chuck_Owl]

What's your crime besides recommending touchdown speed for the 109F at 160 km/h instead of 150/h ?

 

Yeaaah... I know... I should be punished for that too.

 

But hey, there are a couple of things I wanted to change in the guides, like landing speeds, radiators for 109s, auto supercharger stages for the Ju-87 and He-111 (or some other aircraft, can't remember it) and probably correct some oversights and small mistakes I did. But strangely enough, I can't find the motivation to make the final revision.

 

Too bad, I guess.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

Mountain goat? Pleeasse, what kind of scrub are you? You either live out your days as a sloth or go home!

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

S!

 

I think route correction is needed about this disastrous unlock game design:

 

Disconnect the unlock stuff with MP : 60% problem solved

 

 

Provide the old il2 way skin management: 80% problem solved .

 

(Plus you just BUMP UP the community with plenty of material around BOS. There are thousands of people interested in this )

 

Provide really good missions and campaign in SP : 100% problem solved

 

 

 

In the future, release the : FMB and Dserver

 

..then a summer map.

 

BOOOM.... bos now will become a SERIOUS competitor sim in the market. It has a lot of POTENTIAL.

 

Then, just wait for the sky fall down when, further, the single planes market starts to mess up with servers planeset and online wars....i would prefer addons

 

 

Go ahead dev's. Youu already done the hard work. You just need to finish it properly. You have a very nice sim here. Don't screw this up with LOFT ideas and move on :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:

To b frank, that wouldn't be a competitor. That'd be an out right winner.

[LBR=H-Ostermann]

What a shame. There are some very valid points made in this (and a bunch of other similar) thread. Unfortunately, most of those are lost to the chickenshit comments as posted earlier in this thread. Whatever the reasons behind the unlocks, childish rhetoric isn't going to change anything. All it's accomplishing is making some people look like fools. It's a proud day for what is supposed to be a mature and intelligent "community".  

Childish hey? Well I guess you become as you are treated. Like the actions they took after some enterprising player found a way around the locked down graphic settings. Once he was found to have his hand in the cookie jar what did they do? Same for the end run around the idiotic training flights that were our right to use since they included it in the game, I.E. 16x time compression. You can't do that, you must be punished as the wayward child you are. All gone, now do as we say.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 Unlocks are like Siberia. Everyone knows where it is, but does not want to go there Unlocks could have been historically accurate field mods or other gadgets NOT affecting MP, awards being real medals, pilot level being promotions instead etc. Add to that Feathered's idea and BAM, single player just got that more interesting for those liking it. And would not affect MP the slightest. Grinding through in Expert took over 100 missions and 40-60hrs. A torture with the current system and lackluster campaign, or shall we say random QMB.

 

 Another thing the graphics settings. Someone got around it, showed it works perfectly without any issues(solving them instead!), giving exceptional image quality and no FPS loss, more so a GAIN in FPS. What happens, plugged like in an instant. What would they lose if people had options? Nothing if they made a proper manual explaining in simple terms what each setting does. Now it is like an idiot in a shop, press a button for the level of doodah you want. 

 

 Even I like BoS for the most part I just can not stand the graphics as they are now. Ventured off planet to Periphery and Outreach, those damn Clanners are coming!

[Mac_Messer]

Some people seem to believe that the reason WT is popular is because of the unlocks.

 

The truth is, it's popular because it's FREE!

 

The unlocks in WarThunder are a method of annoying their customers so much that they would rather pay REAL MONEY to unlock instead of grind.

 

Unlocks are SUPPOSED to be annoying. They're not FUN. NOBODY enjoys them, they either pay to bypass them or they grind through gritted teeth.

 

Good point, although not real for everyone. I have some friends who play WT. They don`t pay for stuff, it is their main principle. So they go ahead and grind away to get better stuff. While doing it, they actually admitted they liked the act itself, well, most of them anyway. For them, the grinding is in fact fun, because they like the challenge of it. And when they get their top tier aircraft, they are so happy that they feel the need to post it in their forum signatures.

Needless to say, some of them quit playing once they got to the top tier. They couldn`t be bothered to do that for the 2nd, 3rd or 10th time. But the fact is they did stay around long enough to count tens of hours with WT. I guess the BoS devs wanted to recreate a bit of that, though I`m not sure if it belongs in a game that is not free to play.

[DD_bongodriver]

 

 

Unlocks are like Siberia. Everyone knows where it is, but does not want to go there

 

So true, further to this, everyone doesn't want to go there but a few think if they go they might come back one day.

[150GCT_Veltro]

I agree about this problem, i don't like it at all, but instead of waste your time here writing and writing again about this complain, play some missions to unlock the essential mod like winter skin and bombs. You can do it in a few time, really.

Edited October 30, 2014 by 150GCT_Veltro

[DD_bongodriver]

can you unlock directly the 'field mod' you want or do you have to go through a series to get the one you want?

[150GCT_Veltro]

can you unlock directly the 'field mod' you want or do you have to go through a series to get the one you want?

 

The second.....but at least it has ben coded to unlock the most important mods to fly all sort of missions (you should be able to unlock bombs very soon).

Edited October 30, 2014 by 150GCT_Veltro

[=69.GIAP=Shvak]

Let's be honest, 8 pages is enough. This plus countless closed, locked threads and the unlocks stay. I doubt whether anyone including Jason can get them removed. They can point it out to the powers that be but for whatever reason the unlock system is here to stay. I think the WT connection might be a very valid point. Long term I am sure the plan is to introduce a Free 2 Play version... As stated elsewhere then the unlock system works to entice people to pay to unlock items rather than have to grind them. If this was not the plan I am 100% sure even the most obstinate developer would have been able to read the writing on the wall and have dumped the unlock system

Edited October 30, 2014 by =69.GIAP=Shvak

[=69.GIAP=Shvak]

Found this interesting nugget on another site but it is so apt I laughted, then I began crying inside as I read the rest...
"This is the part of the game that has provoked the most angst among people who bought into the beta access. Single player in BoS, when you come from the multiplayer world of WT, is MIND NUMBINGLY I’D-RATHER-KISS-MY-GRAN-ON-THE-MOUTH BORING" I wonder if that will translate well into Russian  

Edited October 30, 2014 by =69.GIAP=Shvak

[EAF19_Marsh]

If nothing else there have been some entertaining comments, with Extreme One's

 

'I - truly - can't wait to meet these people. I want to know what colour is the sky is on their planet.'

 

current in first place and will be misappropriated by me in my next frustrating work meeting

[ZakTurbo]

Hi,

 

New player to IL2:BoS but a long term flight sim player, just dropping by to give my opinion on this issue.

 

Having to grind 300 hours to 'unlock' some content that I've paid £70 for is a massive F-U to me, is not fun and quite frankly I'm pissed off that you'd charge such a price for a game and then lock me out of half the content. I would understand if this was F2P or dirt cheap but you're charging twice as much as a standard triple-A game for the full package, so when I boot the game up to find I can't use any of the unique weapons or plane camos you can probably see why I'm pissed off.

 

The devs probably envisioned that the unlock system would add longevity to the game, which is true, for the people with the time and/or patience to sit through the grind, but for me it's a barrier, I don't have the time or patience for it. I play these types of games in short bursts, I'll set up a quick mission, mess around for half and hour, then quit. Or I'll play MP for a bit. Both of which I don't earn any experience in...

 

.. I'm ranting a bit now so I'll just say this and be gone.

 

Having to gain experience for field mods in the campaign? Good idea - For people that like playing the campaign maybe it gives them a sense of progression and keeps them involved in it.

 

Having to grind experience in the campaign to use field mods in quick missions and multiplayer? BAD IDEA - I have very little motivation to play this game because I can't play it how I usually would play a sim ( i.e. dicking around with the 'cool stuff' in the quick mission builder).

 

So why not just unlock all the content in quick missions and unranked multiplayer servers? Everyone's happy now, everyone wins.

 

[oneeyeddog]

If nothing else there have been some entertaining comments, with Extreme One's

 

'I - truly - can't wait to meet these people. I want to know what colour is the sky is on their planet.'

 

current in first place and will be misappropriated by me in my next frustrating work meeting

Cheers.

[Bearcat]

I wonder if people have misunderstood how unlocks work in that other popular (WarThunder) flying game.

 

Some people seem to believe that the reason WT is popular is because of the unlocks.

 

The truth is, it's popular because it's FREE!

 

The unlocks in WarThunder are a method of annoying their customers so much that they would rather pay REAL MONEY to unlock instead of grind.

 

Unlocks are SUPPOSED to be annoying. They're not FUN. NOBODY enjoys them, they either pay to bypass them or they grind through gritted teeth.

 

It seems a lot of people are confusing unlocks with achievements.

 

Unlocks and achievements are two totally completely different things.

 

One is a stick to beat gamers with (unlocks) the other is a carrot (achievements) to encourage gamers with.

 

It's quite apparent that the developers aren't confused.

They want (need?) players to be annoyed (enough to pay to get their locked planes) by the unlocks.

 

Simples.

 

 

.... and the unlocks in BoS are not the same as the unlocks in WT... In WT you "grind" for the basics.. like a better aircraft. In Bos you grind for certain additions to your plane.. but you can hop in any plane in Mp and defend yourself.

[HeavyCavalrySgt]

Even better training would be to have training servers where more experienced players can show newbies the ins and outs.

 

 

Bullets going in, flames, fluids and shrapnel coming out?

[Marq_Tex]

Much is said about this theme

 

 

I already have the F4 unlocked. It was not so bad. As a businessman and father I had a few hours  at night to get there.(expert mode, x2 some times, hit some bomber and landing)

 

The truth is that spending some time with this system makes me to like  more of BoS.

 

I go into MP without problems, and I see that it is not imperative to have unlocked planes, I think is more a matter of conceit ( Good pilots shoot  down any russian plane without a 20mm that i have in F4)

 

I always thought it would be the best simulator (WW2)  since the IL 2, 1946, was not wrong, it looks really good.

 

The servers, despite still being in test,already give us an immersive experience. Imagine how it will be when some details are refined.

 

Do you remember CloD?

 

I played IL2 1946 and never  joined CloD.

 

BoS has no possible comparison with that (frustrating) IL2.

 

 

I will be in the 10% of customers who think so... as someone already said that  developers are forgetting the other 90%. 

[Mac_Messer]

 

Do you remember CloD?

 

I played IL2 1946 and never  joined CloD.

 

BoS has no possible comparison with that (frustrating) IL2.

 

Have you heard about ATAG squad? They modded CloD. Got rid of some pesky bugs, made 3rd party system for it. Quite cool. I hear some squads already abandoned BoS because of the unlocks and currently playing CloD. Both games fill one another`s gaps pretty well.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Mac_Messer

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

.... and the unlocks in BoS are not the same as the unlocks in WT... In WT you "grind" for the basics.. like a better aircraft. In Bos you grind for certain additions to your plane.. but you can hop in any plane in Mp and defend yourself.

Doesn't that only apply to founders, though? If someone went and bought the game, right now, wouldn't they have to grind out the aircraft, as well?

 

And what sense does it make to have to unlock the ability to remove a headrest panel, at any rate.

[dkoor]

Have you heard about ATAG squad? They modded CloD. Got rid of some pesky bugs, made 3rd party system for it. Quite cool. I hear some squads already abandoned BoS because of the unlocks and currently playing CloD. Both games fill one another`s gaps pretty well.

[wellenbrecher]

 

Have you heard about ATAG squad? They modded CloD. Got rid of some pesky bugs, made 3rd party system for it. Quite cool. I hear some squads already abandoned BoS because of the unlocks and currently playing CloD. Both games fill one another`s gaps pretty well.

 

Ah, in all fairness though:

CloD has nothing on BoS when it comes to the actual feel of flying though. Like, CloD almost always feels clunky and counter-intuitive in so many ways that are not related to the technology in the actual planes.

BoS on the other hand is incredibly... "smooth" is the best word that comes to mind.

 

 

(mind, I said nothing about realism, clickable cockpits or graphical fidelity)

Edited October 31, 2014 by [JG2]G3_wellenbrecher

[dkoor]

I wonder why RoF wasn't copied in everything... that game is true winner in my eyes.