LaGG-3 s29 armament

[rolikiraly]

Just a quick question: do you know what armament will this plane carry in game?

I couldn't find exact info for s29, but it seems LaGG-3s in general had many different weapon combinations. There was an ingame screenshot with a 37 mm cannon but i think that's more like a relatively rare variant, maybe as an 'unlock'?

[Finkeren]

There could well be unlockable 'weapon mods' for the heavy cannons but the standard armament should be one synchronised 12.7mm UBS on the cowling and one engine mounted ShVAK 20mm cannon with fittings for up to 8 RS-82 rockets.

[LukeFF]

The 37mm cannon was a weapon mod in the alpha preview version.

[Sgt_Joch]

There were three variants of the Lagg-3 in service in late 42. Two main ones each armed with 1x20mm cannon and 1x12.7mm MG. The newer version had a slightly more powerful engine and was a bit lighter to improve performance.

 

You also had the Lagg-3-37 which was armed with 1x37mm cannon and 1x12.7mm MG. This was available in limited numbers and was used mainly to attack bombers.

Edited August 15, 2013 by 2Lt_Joch

[Finkeren]

Well it's a bit misleading to talk about specific 'variants' of Lagg-3. Western scholars like to associate specific production series with certain changes. In the case of the Lagg-3 we usually talk about the 4th, 29th, 35th and 66th series as being significant, but it's rather arbitrary, since changes were introduced all the time.

 

The VVS didn't distinguish between 'variants', except when they had a different engine or different armament.

[III/JG53Frankyboy]

IIRC these 37mm canons of these earlier LaGGs had a ammosupply of only 20 rounds. and it is not the same weapon as the later Yak9T.

 

My 'bet' for the BoS LaGG3 unlockable mods are:

23mm canon

37mm canon

RS82 Rockets

Bombs

Droptanks

(in any order j

 

and the engine will be a M105PF

 

bit, IL 2 owners, thevseries 29 is in game

[III/JG53Frankyboy]

IF wikipedia is correct, this early 37mm will have a 'bright' future in BoS - the some IL2s around Stalingrad had it too. Also a nice weapon mod

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shpitalny_Sh-37

Edited August 15, 2013 by Frankyboy

[Sgt_Joch]

Well it's a bit misleading to talk about specific 'variants' of Lagg-3. Western scholars like to associate specific production series with certain changes. In the case of the Lagg-3 we usually talk about the 4th, 29th, 35th and 66th series as being significant, but it's rather arbitrary, since changes were introduced all the time.

 

The VVS didn't distinguish between 'variants', except when they had a different engine or different armament.

 

true, but it makes it easier to understand in game terms.

 

I am not sure where the reference to different "series" comes from, whether it is a post-war convention or whether something was lost in the translation. I have also seen it translated as different factory "production batches" which probably better reflects how the Russians viewed it.

 

So for example, at one point in late 42, Lagg-3 production was switched to an improved lighter version with the more powerful Klimov M105PF engine, but both the older and newer version are just officially referred to as  Lagg-3.

[leitmotiv]

I wonder if we will see leading edge slats as unlocks for LaGGs like LaGG-3 series 35 has in old il2

[Finkeren]

true, but it makes it easier to understand in game terms.

 

I am not sure where the reference to different "series" comes from, whether it is a post-war convention or whether something was lost in the translation. I have also seen it translated as different factory "production batches" which probably better reflects how the Russians viewed it.

 

So for example, at one point in late 42, Lagg-3 production was switched to an improved lighter version with the more powerful Klimov M105PF engine, but both the older and newer version are just officially referred to as Lagg-3.

Sort of true, but it's wrong to say that "at one point" they switched to a lighter construction and an upgraded engine. There was no "one point" where that happened, there were gradual incremental changes from series (or production batch) to series, and varied standards at different factories. A "Series 4" aircraft from one factory could be similar to a "Series 7" from another.

Edited August 15, 2013 by Finkeren

[Finkeren]

I wonder if we will see leading edge slats as unlocks for LaGGs like LaGG-3 series 35 has in old il2

I hope so, but I hope they will be modeled correctly. In the old IL2 they were shown as auto-deploying slats like on the Bf 109. In reality they were fixed slats that were simply bolted to the leading edge of the wing.

[Sgt_Joch]

Sort of true, but it's wrong to say that "at one point" they switched to a lighter construction and an upgraded engine. There was no "one point" where that happened, there were gradual incremental changes from series (or production batch) to series, and varied standards at different factories. A "Series 4" aircraft from one factory could be similar to a "Series 7" from another.

 

well no, there was actually, the lightened Lagg-3 was a specific modification made to try to squeeze more performance from the Lagg-3 which always had a poor power/weight ratio.  It's discussed in Gordon/Khazanov's "Soviet combat aircraft of WW2", vol.1.

 

Now whether there was overlap or different starting time between diferent factories is another story, although I believe only a very small number of factories were producing Lagg-3's at the time since Yakovlev had almost convinced Stalin to shut down the Lagg line completely. I would have to recheck that part.

Edited August 15, 2013 by 2Lt_Joch

[BFsSmurfy]

I read a piece years ago stating that some Lagg-3 pilots used to deploy the flaps at  approx 5 degrees to give the plane a better rate of turn in a dogfight. I don`t know if that`s true or even possible merely stating what I read. Did the 37mm use HE rounds or just AP???

[Volkoff]

IIRC these 37mm canons of these earlier LaGGs had a ammosupply of only 20 rounds. and it is not the same weapon as the later Yak9T.

My 'bet' for the BoS LaGG3 unlockable mods are:

23mm canon

37mm canon

RS82 Rockets

Bombs

Droptanks

(in any order j

and the engine will be a M105PF

bit, IL 2 owners, thevseries 29 is in game

That would be an interesting set of mods for the LaGG- 3. I wonder if on the Yak 1 tree we will see a Yak 1b with the M105PF? Only time will show. I really want a bubble canopy on my Yak and one of those Klimov M- 105PF V- 12 engines, under the hood. Edited August 15, 2013 by MishaJames

[III/JG53Frankyboy]

following Gordon/Khazanov's "Soviet combat aircraft of WW2", vol.1 it was common in late 42 that the Razorback Yak-1 had the M105PF engine.

Interesting would be the lightend Yak-1 that is mentioned in that book and was in limited action over Stalingrad. To get better performance (almost the same climb as a 109, keep in mind hat the G2's DB605 of that time was not allowed to use WEP! ) they put away the two SchKas ( so only the 20mm as weapon), fueltankprotection and some minor things.

Would be an awesome 'Mod' to unlock

[Volkoff]

following Gordon/Khazanov's "Soviet combat aircraft of WW2", vol.1 it was common in late 42 that the Razorback Yak-1 had the M105PF engine.

Interesting would be the lightend Yak-1 that is mentioned in that book and was in limited action over Stalingrad. To get better performance (almost the same climb as a 109, keep in mind hat the G2's DB605 of that time was not allowed to use WEP! ) they put away the two SchKas ( so only the 20mm as weapon), fueltankprotection and some minor things.

Would be an awesome 'Mod' to unlock

 

Yeah, a lightened Yak 1 razorback, as you describe, would not be bad at all, Frankyboy. Still, I am really looking forward to Yaks with bubble canopies. The improved visability is always going to really come in handy. It is all good, though. Bubble canopy fanboi or not, I am going to really appreciate my Yak 1 razorback and my La-5 razorback, especially after spending some serious quality time covering IL2's with the LaGG-3.

 

 MJ

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 While I like field mods and stuff, just hoping it will not get out of hands so to say. Like getting mods some obscure document mentions and was it really used in quantity etc. And by this I mean both Axis and Allied ones. If it was not official then keep it out as there hardly are any proof documentation on the field mods and their effect on the planes. Just my .02€ 

[Volkoff]

S!

 

 While I like field mods and stuff, just hoping it will not get out of hands so to say. Like getting mods some obscure document mentions and was it really used in quantity etc. And by this I mean both Axis and Allied ones. If it was not official then keep it out as there hardly are any proof documentation on the field mods and their effect on the planes. Just my .02€ 

 

Yeah, that is a really good point. I hope that there is sufficient evidence of factory modified Yak 1 machines, featuring a bubble canopy and Klimov M105PF engine, actually serving in the Battle of Stalingrad. I leave verifying that to the professionals on the Unified Team,  since they have access to really super awesome unclassified State documents and I...well... don't.

 

 MJ

Edited August 15, 2013 by MishaJames

[Volkoff]

So, what do we know for sure about the LaGG-3 mods? I think that the only thing we know for sure is that there will be a 37mm cannon mod. As far as that mod goes, it should prove useful for killing bombers, particularly when the LaGG-s are covered by Yak's or La-5's. When the LaGG-3 is escorting IL2s or flying without Yak/ La-5 cover, I guess LaGG-3 players will want to go with the 20mm cannon version of the LaGG-3.

 

MJ    

Edited August 15, 2013 by MishaJames

[FTC_Karaya]

I find it weird that the 37mm is a loadout option to the LaGG-3 Series 29, it should not be. It was not possible to swap armament easily in the field and of the early 37mm armed version which was called "K-37" only around a dozen were built and used around Stalingrad. Keep in mind that it used the Shpitalnyy Sh-37 cannon with an ammo supply of just 20 rounds which was very heavy, unreliable and highly unsuccesful, so much that the designers of the weapon were rounded up and shot!

 

http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/lagg3-37/lagg3-37.htm

 

Later aircraft (not before spring 1943) featured the Nudelman Suranov NS-37 cannon of similar calibre but even these 37mm armed LaGG-3s were the exception rather than the rule.

 

Keeping in mind that currently it is only possible to either fully allow or disallow weapon mods (in RoF) I would appreciate the 37mm armed LaGG-3 to be turned into a seperate aircraft with its own FM, etc. Having hordes of them flying around in the BoS skies would just feel like warped reality really.

Edited August 15, 2013 by JG52Karaya

[Volkoff]

I find it weird that the 37mm is a loadout option to the LaGG-3 Series 29, it should not be. It was not possible to swap armament easily in the field and of the early 37mm armed version which was called "K-37" only around a dozen were built and used around Stalingrad. Keep in mind that it used the Shpitalnyy Sh-37 cannon with an ammo supply of just 20 rounds which was very heavy, unreliable and highly unsuccesful, so much that the designers of the weapon were rounded up and shot!

 

http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/lagg3-37/lagg3-37.htm

 

Later aircraft (not before spring 1943) featured the Nudelman Suranov NS-37 cannon of similar calibre but even these 37mm armed LaGG-3s were the exception rather than the rule.

 

Keeping in mind that currently it is only possible to either fully allow or disallow weapon mods (in RoF) I would appreciate the 37mm armed LaGG-3 to be turned into a seperate aircraft with its own FM, etc. Having hordes of them flying around in the BoS skies would just feel like warped reality really.

 

Well, I don't know why the team included the 37 mm LaGG-3, but the team does allow for the inclsuion of things that were not necessarily in significant numbers at Stalingrad, so long as a thing existed at the time of the battle and could have participated, such as the FW 190. If a 37mm mounted LaGG-3 did exist at the time of the battle, hovever rare, it could fit in IL2 BOS, using the same logic as was used to include the FW 190.

 

  MJ

 

.

Edited August 15, 2013 by MishaJames

[FuriousMeow]

That's pretty funny. A plane already outclassed by it's foes is up for a pre-ban because it sports a larger unreliable weapon with limited ammo that might have a chance at a single shot kill it's scary.

[Volkoff]

That's pretty funny. A plane already outclassed by it's foes is up for a pre-ban because it sports a larger unreliable weapon with limited ammo that might have a chance at a single shot kill it's scary.

I don' t think Karaya meant it like that, though. I can't imagine anyone in a Willy Messer squad worrying about the Lagg-3, though. The Virtual VVS isn' t going to get any plane that is clearly superior to the 109, at this stage of the war. This is why I would encourage persons looking to join a virtual squad to join the VVS, as we need tactics, teamwork, and numbers, to survive. When it comes to the 109, a cohesive Section, entering fights high and fast, could probably go years without getting shot down, just using one pass hit and run ambushes. Lol

 

S! MJ

Edited August 16, 2013 by MishaJames

[Volkoff]

I find it weird that the 37mm is a loadout option to the LaGG-3 Series 29, it should not be. It was not possible to swap armament easily in the field and of the early 37mm armed version which was called "K-37" only around a dozen were built and used around Stalingrad. Keep in mind that it used the Shpitalnyy Sh-37 cannon with an ammo supply of just 20 rounds which was very heavy, unreliable and highly unsuccesful, so much that the designers of the weapon were rounded up and shot!

 

http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/lagg3-37/lagg3-37.htm

 

Later aircraft (not before spring 1943) featured the Nudelman Suranov NS-37 cannon of similar calibre but even these 37mm armed LaGG-3s were the exception rather than the rule.

 

Keeping in mind that currently it is only possible to either fully allow or disallow weapon mods (in RoF) I would appreciate the 37mm armed LaGG-3 to be turned into a seperate aircraft with its own FM, etc. Having hordes of them flying around in the BoS skies would just feel like warped reality really.

 

While in ROF mods are all in or all out, I don't think that the United Team has come to a determination of whether or not they will use the same approach. Still, even if the team does go with the ROF approach, I have never really believed that mods unfairly help my opponents or hurt immersion. ROF weapon mods give and they take. For instance, I love the SPAD VII. When I go hunting for scouts, I don't use the Lewis weapon mod. Even though it would add to my lethality, I feel that the Lewis negatively impacts my SPAD's overall performance.  I only bring my Lewis if I am going after a balloon, otherwise I keep my SPAD 7 a one gun ship.

 

 MJ

Edited August 16, 2013 by MishaJames

[TheBlackPenguin]

So true about weapon Mods in ROF, as an example you can have an extra gun on the Triplane, but it does adversely and noticeably affect performance. I tend to now use it only on specific missions, such as Balloon busting

[FuriousMeow]

See if you can guess who stated this gem:

 

Will weapon mods be unlockable (lets say during SP campaign) or we would need to buy them as weapon mods if we want to be competitive in multiplayer (better or more guns, more hitting power) like it is currently in ROF?

 

It's in a thread here, quite interesting to see that stated. I've never once seen a single weapons mod in RoF be a difference in making something more competitive. If anything, they tend to make them far less competitive.

[Volkoff]

Just a quick question: do you know what armament will this plane carry in game?

I couldn't find exact info for s29, but it seems LaGG-3s in general had many different weapon combinations. There was an ingame screenshot with a 37 mm cannon but i think that's more like a relatively rare variant, maybe as an 'unlock'?

 

I don't think that the devs have released the mod tree for the planes, yet. I am pretty sure that the devs did indicate, in a post recently, that they may do so in the not too distant future. I think we are all really looking forward to going through that list.  MJ

Edited August 16, 2013 by MishaJames