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Vive Pro 2 Specs: 5K 120Hz LCD, New 120° Lenses, SteamVR Tracking ($799 headset only, $1399 full kit)


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Boomerang
1 hour ago, dburne said:

running 90 Hz with Motion Smoothing on and forced to 45 fps as I do now so I can have some pretty high graphics settings.

45 fps @ 90 Hz, your eyes will thank you! I would do the same, in regards to viewing the higher graphic settings when available.

Nice rig you have there btw. 

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dburne
3 minutes ago, Boomerang said:

45 fps @ 90 Hz, your eyes will thank you! I would do the same, in regards to viewing the higher graphic settings when available.

Nice rig you have there btw. 

 

Thanks much!

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
2 hours ago, dburne said:

I would imagine for flight sims probably be better to run them at 90 Hz  on the VP2 due to how demanding they are in VR.

Top end rigs might be able to get away with 120 Hz with Motion Smoothing forced on to run at 60 fps.

I am expecting I will end up running 90 Hz with Motion Smoothing on and forced to 45 fps as I do now so I can have some pretty high graphics settings.

Indeed.

 

Right now I'm also running 90Hz @45fps with forced MS. I'll attempt to get to 120hz @60fps in the VP2. I checked that already and it's something my GPU can manage.

 

The only issue is having to keep clouds at medium - they are very problematic to VR performance right now. I hope for a cloud update similar to DCS, and a port to Vulkan as well. These things are incredibly important to keep up tech-wise for IL-2, it's one of their main quality of life services in our eyes. We've just had talks about this yesterday in our squadron :) 

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chiliwili69
Posted (edited)

I have done some tests with my current Index at different frequencies using my usual settings (Preset High, and almost all maxed out except mirror and clouds at high).

Using the SYN_Vander bench this is what I had:

 

at 120Hz
Frames: 3687 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 61.450 - Min: 55 - Max: 94
Frames: 3737 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 62.283 - Min: 57 - Max: 90

 

at 90Hz
Frames: 4899 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 81.650 - Min: 69 - Max: 91
Frames: 4675 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 77.917 - Min: 55 - Max: 91

 

at 80Hz
Frames: 4566 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 76.100 - Min: 64 - Max: 81
Frames: 4575 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 76.250 - Min: 67 - Max: 82

 

I currently use the Index at 80Hz and no Motion Smoothing, and I am very pleased with that.

 

But I am afraid that any current CPU would be able to mantain 120fps with decent settings and moderate scenarios.

It is really a drawback that the VP2 runs at 120Hz, and without having any other option.

Why the hell HTC didn´t put other optional frequencies like in the Index.

 

For my 80fps at 80Hz with no motion smoothing is quite good. I can not see the difference when running at 90 or 120Hz in IL-2.

 

This is a big disadvantage of the VP2. Probably I will need to wait for Index 2 to have a good contender of the curent Index.

Edited by chiliwili69
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dburne
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, chiliwili69 said:

I have done some tests with my current Index at different frequencies using my usual settings (Preset High, and almost all maxed out except mirror and clouds at high).

Using the SYN_Vander bench this is what I had:

 

at 120Hz
Frames: 3687 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 61.450 - Min: 55 - Max: 94
Frames: 3737 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 62.283 - Min: 57 - Max: 90

 

at 90Hz
Frames: 4899 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 81.650 - Min: 69 - Max: 91
Frames: 4675 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 77.917 - Min: 55 - Max: 91

 

at 80Hz
Frames: 4566 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 76.100 - Min: 64 - Max: 81
Frames: 4575 - Time: 60000ms - Avg: 76.250 - Min: 67 - Max: 82

 

I currently use the Index at 80Hz and no Motion Smoothing, and I am very pleased with that.

 

But I am afraid that any current CPU would be able to mantain 120fps with decent settings and moderate scenarios.

It is really a drawback that the VP2 runs at 120Hz, and without having any other option.

Why the hell HTC didn´t put other optional frequencies like in the Index.

 

For my 80fps at 80Hz with no motion smoothing is quite good. I can not see the difference when running at 90 or 120Hz in IL-2.

 

This is a big disadvantage of the VP2. Probably I will need to wait for Index 2 to have a good contender of the curent Index.

 

Depends on how well their loss less compression works they are using, that we do not know yet.

They did not raise the min specs over the initial Vive Pro due to this.

But yeah I see no reason to need to run the sim at 120 Hz in any headset really.

 

Why do you think Vive Pro 2 is only 120 Hz?
It has a 90 Hz mode as well.

Quote

Refresh Rate

90/120 Hz (only 90Hz supported via VIVE Wireless Adapter)

 

https://www.vive.com/us/product/vive-pro2/specs/

 

It will be ok Chili - so chill.

;)

Edited by dburne
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chiliwili69
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, dburne said:
Quote

Refresh Rate

90/120 Hz (only 90Hz supported via VIVE Wireless Adapter)

 

https://www.vive.com/us/product/vive-pro2/specs/

 

It will be ok Chili - so chill.

 

Hey you are right!.

 

I was reading those specs wrongly. When I read the brackets thought that the 90Hz will be supportted only with the wireless adapter.

But the brackets are only telling that the wireless doesn´t support the 120 Hz mode.

 

So yes, Hallelujah!, it can run at 90Hz as well!!  I will chill now.  😉  

 

Edited by chiliwili69
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dburne
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

Hey you I right!.

 

I was reading those specs wrongly. When I read the brackets thought that the 90Hz will be supportted only with the wireless adapter.

But the brackets are only telling the the wireless doesn´t support the 120 Hz mode.

 

So yes, Hallelujah!, it can run at 90Hz as well!!  I will chill now.  😉  

 

 

:clapping:

 

Lol I figured that was probably what ya did!

I am really anxious to see how these new headsets do. Especially utilizing this new loss less compression they are doing.

I so love my Reverb G2 with flight sims, but I would not mind being rid of WMR for sure.

Edited by dburne
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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
Posted (edited)

I wouldn't mind getting rid of that terrible software stack either.:banned:

 

Just be bolted into SteamVR, all I need by now. Getting tired of being depended on Windows holographic driver updates I didn't ask for, tracking issues, or audio not working as it should in 4/5 cases after starting.

 

I'm also looking forward to the large FOV of the VP2. :pilot:

 

There's no headset out there but the Pimaxes that can battle the VP2 on that factor... and the Pimaxes lack stereo overlap, have strongly canted displays so you might not even hope to feel presence, and a shibuzelload of other issues with their software. As well as low brightness and contrast emitting LCDs... not going back to these crooks anytime soon. They still owe me stuff I've paid for, can you believe it.:russian_ru:

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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ICDP
Posted (edited)

I honestly have had no issues from a hardware perspective on either my Pimax 5K, or my current 8KX.  Stereo overlap is fine, colours brightness and contrast are as good or better than my Reverb, sweet spot was better than my reverb.  The software is fine as long as you just use the Pitool app and SteamVR.  The only issue is black levels but that is the same for pretty much all LCDs and I suspect the VP2 will have the same problems and if it uses the Index lenses will have poor glare and god rays.

 

Why is it very new HMD has compromises?

 

Where Pimax fall down completely is in their business ethics.  They will outright lie to their customers and have no repsect for their them.  I waited a year for a HMD to be made that we were told was already in production, same for the deluxe audio I ordered 18 months ago.

 

EDIT: Just noticed I have been charge on the credit card for the VP2.  I was under the illusion from the order it would only come out once shipped.  Either way it doesn't matter as I used a CC with full protection if it ends up like another Pimax BS.

Edited by ICDP
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dburne
3 hours ago, ICDP said:

 

 

EDIT: Just noticed I have been charge on the credit card for the VP2.  I was under the illusion from the order it would only come out once shipped.  Either way it doesn't matter as I used a CC with full protection if it ends up like another Pimax BS.

 

PayPal?

Had the same happen to me, from what I am seeing it is happening to buyers who went through PayPal.

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ICDP
4 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

PayPal?

Had the same happen to me, from what I am seeing it is happening to buyers who went through PayPal.

 

No, my credit card.  It's no big deal as it does have protection but it's not going to be like Pimax and the 1 year plus wait.  So i expect the HMD when they said it will be due.

 

I tried a CC charge back on my Pimax 8KX after 5 months but was outside the 120 day limit.

 

Totally unrelated but I stopped using Paypal for these kind of purchases when I lost out on a 5900X I bought within minutes on release day.  It seems the Paypal transactions aren't completed instantly, so the large UK seller I bought from didn't hold my CPU as the sale was not verfied.  When it eventually went through I got an email saying I was number 956 in the queue.

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
1 hour ago, ICDP said:

Totally unrelated but I stopped using Paypal for these kind of purchases when I lost out on a 5900X I bought within minutes on release day.  It seems the Paypal transactions aren't completed instantly, so the large UK seller I bought from didn't hold my CPU as the sale was not verfied.  When it eventually went through I got an email saying I was number 956 in the queue.

Wow that's a story. I also bought through PayPal (VP2) within 10mins after the link went live on Bestware as I was looking for the 50€ pre-order code, and it also charged instantly.

I have received just one E-Mail so far from Bestware. Hoping all went well.

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ICDP

The way it worked for my (non) 5900X order was an email stating "thank you for your order, you will get a dispatch email soon", then later that evening another email stating "your Paypal payment has been verified you are number 956 in the queue".  I contacted Scan UK support the next day and asked what is this about?  I was told that "Paypal orders may take a number of hours to verify and we post based on payment verification not order time".  So even though I ordered within minutes I was dropping down the queue minute by minute as the vendor waited on verfication of payment transfer.  The person then advised that in future if I wanted a very highly sought after item, I should use CC for instant payment and dispatch as well as better protection.  I was nice about it all and thanked them for the advice.

 

When I got my 3080 FE from the same site a few months later for MSRP, I knew to pay by CC and the purchase was instantly approved and veriefied.  The GPU was dispated very quickly an in my PC 2 days later.

 

I will be honest, I had been wondering why some of the expensive hardware orders I made using PP usually take until next day for dispatch.

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chiliwili69
10 hours ago, ICDP said:

I suspect the VP2 will have the same problems and if it uses the Index lenses will have poor glare and god rays.

 

Glare and god rays is the same.

Regarding this, the glare could be an issue for space sims where there is a dark sky and high white contrast, but in IL-2 it is something that it is not an issue for me.

I only see that when IL-2 is launching since background is black and letters are white, but after that I really don´t notice anything else.

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ICDP
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

Glare and god rays is the same.

Regarding this, the glare could be an issue for space sims where there is a dark sky and high white contrast, but in IL-2 it is something that it is not an issue for me.

I only see that when IL-2 is launching since background is black and letters are white, but after that I really don´t notice anything else.

 

Apologies I should have clarified that Glare and God rays are not the same thing.  One is rays that show when you have bright objects on a dark background and is something the Index is notoriously bad for.  The other is more of an everpresent glow in dark areas that happens with all LCD screens to varying degrees.  When I tried an Index for about 30 minutes it seemed more obvious than I was getting on my then Pimax 5K and it was already bad on it.

 

So the VP2 will be LCD but may main worry is it will use the horrible Index lenses.  I get that it's not an issue for you, but I play plenty of dark VR games.

Edited by ICDP
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chiliwili69
10 hours ago, ICDP said:

Apologies I should have clarified that Glare and God rays are not the same thing.  One is rays that show when you have bright objects on a dark background and is something the Index is notoriously bad for.  The other is more of an everpresent glow in dark areas that happens with all LCD screens to varying degrees.

 

I thought that in VR Glare and God rays were referring to the samething. It is explained in this video at 0:50 (in spanish):

 

 

There is an app to measure several items of VR devices and the Glare Test on it has been used in many reviews and they consider Glare and god rays as the same thing.

They Glare/godrays it seems depend on the lenses not the panels.

 

So, according to your definition when you say glare you mean glow in dark areas, and it depends on the panel.

 

Perhaps if you can refer to some examples it would help me to understand the difference.

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ICDP

When I say glare I mean what on a monitor would be called backlight, so I may just need to clarify it as haze or glow.  I have read or watched plenty of reviews that have maybe referred to this as black levels.

  • Glow or haze is not true blacks where dark areas always have a hazy glow from screen backlight.  This an issue with all LCD screens and some are better than others.
  • Godrays are bright objects on bright backgrounds giving the rays effect.  This is a problem with lenses and the Index is notorioulsy bad in this area.

So my concerns with VP2 is it is going to have the unavoidable LCD haze to some degree and if it uses the Valve Index lenses it will have the excessive godrays.

 

Time will tell and it is why I held of a week before pre-ordering because I will have time to cancel if Godrays and glare/haze/glow (pick one) are poor.

 

 

 

 

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blue_max

I am... medium excited for this headset, but I'll probably get it for the one reason that isn't mentioned here yet: IPD range! Mine is very narrow, so I had to return the G2 (it only goes down to 60) and now am playing with the quest 2 (at 58, too wide but bearable). The VP2 goes to 57, and I really hope that makes all the difference.

 

Definitely not excited about needing to buy lighthouse tracking base stations. My house just isn't set up for that. And no way my GPU can handle the resolution/frame rate (5700XT), so I'm screwed there as well. One of my friends has a 3090 and tbh I don't think that is going to be enough either... Was hoping that this was the generation we'd get foveated rendering. But I guess we'll have to wait another two years.

 

And perhaps by the time I have this baby finished there will be a next GPU gen 😄 https://authentikit.org/

 

Cheers, Blue

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ICDP
Posted (edited)

The VP2 allegedly uses advanced compression so performance could be OK.  If you only aim to VR with sims then one lighthouse is fine.  I have 2 lighthouses in my small box room mounted high up the wall in each corner.  Most often I only use 1 for Il2 and tracking is perfectly fine.

Edited by ICDP
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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
Posted (edited)

FYI DCS = compression is only to keep the bandwidth minimal on the cable to stay within DP1.2 specs, doesn't give any performance benefits or smoother picture from what I read. It's loss-less, which is a requirement of the cert for it. 

 

The variable rate shading with the wrapper for eye tracking (VRS) requires a forward shade rendering engine. So, no eye tracking according to Nvidia developer section.

 

But VRSS and DLSS 2.1 could be something for IL-2. Either one of these could dramatically improve performance for VR players.

 

P.s. especially since the new Radeon cards are running with strong handbrake in VR anyway, due to the resizable bar. Performance reported so far was atrociously down and below expectations. So they're no-go's for VR players anyway right now.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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ICDP
Posted (edited)

I read more about the compression and as Fenris said, it is not for performance.  So apologies on that, your 5700XT will struggle with most recent modern HMDs without a lot of compromises on graphics and I found the same on my older RTX 2080 GPU.

 

Nvidia tends to be better for VR but not massively so.  In this current climate if you get a chance to get a new AMD 6000 seried GPU to fit your budget then take it.  Your performance in VR will be more than fine.  Fenris tends to massively exaggerate performance differences of VR between AMD and Nvidia GPUs.  Using words like "atrocious" to describe AMD performance when actual reviews show nothing of the sort.  If you have an AMD 6800 series GPU, your performance in VR will be in the ballpark of any Nvidia equivalent for the majority of games.  Ballpark means ~10% or so.

 

Here if you only look at the graphs Nvidia comes out on top most of the time, but reading the actual comments it becomes clear that the experience on both GPUs was largely identical and no real issues on the 6800XT.

https://babeltechreviews.com/vr-wars-the-rx-6800-xt-vs-the-rtx-3080-15-vr-games-performance-benchmarked/

 

Previous testing of the 5700XT compared to NV cards showed similar levels of performance overall.

https://babeltechreviews.com/vr-wars-the-rtx-2060-super-vs-the-rx-5700-xt-vs-the-rtx-2070-super/

 

If you have a choice then go Nvidia but be wary of the limited VRAM on 3080 and below.  I find for example DCS on my 8KX and RTX 3080 is unplayable on the Normandy map.  Even though FPS is keeping at ~75Hz but because the 10GB VRAM buffer is useless and causes massive stutters.

 

The same map with my 6800 (non XT) was much, much better because it has 16GB VRAM.  This matches with this thread here on the DCS forums.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/254028-amd-rx-6800xt-vs-nvidia-rtx-3080/

 

Il2 with my 6800 non XT handled my 8KX with medium.high setting quite well.  Though if IL2 is your only interest for 2D or VR then I recommend Nvidia.

Edited by ICDP
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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

I'm not massively exaggerating... 

 

Please consider there is a reason:

VRSS working in several titles that I play (Pavlov, Boneworks, Half-Life Alyx, etc among the FPS titles) already gives a 20-30% boost and 60% SS looks like 100% SS on the G2. Then the new hotdog is DLSS2.1, Nvidia had the way quicker memory, and my 3090 being 15-20% quicker than 6900xt benches in VR as the baseline to go from.

 

So if we multiply this up to 35-40%, we get massively different performance results in my book ;)

 

And please recognise I'm have 0 brand loyalty. Zero. I go with what's well and good and verbalise that! ;)

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ICDP
Posted (edited)

I never said you had bias, I said you exaggerated the difference and here you are doing just that (Half Life Alyx).  You are also taking arbitrary numbers with no basis in facts (let's add 40% on to Nvidia just cus, why not).

 

Yet the link I provided shows that a 6800XT vs 3080 showed less than 10% extra performance in favour of the 3080 in Half Life Alyx and most other titles.  And the 5700XT showed to be right on par against the equivalent Nvidia GPUs.  So tier for tier I am correct in saying ~10% performance between AMD vs Nvidia in most games.

 

My main PC has a 5900X, RTX 3080 and 32GB of DDR 3600 CL16 RAM.

Second PC (son's) has a 5600X, 6700XT, 32GB DDR 3400 CL14 RAM.

 

Pimax 8KX, native mode with normal view, identical graphical settings on Moscow Map, 16x16 QMB, heavy cloud and mostly high/ultra settngs.  Pitool set to 1.25 quality and SS at 60%.  Identical settings between both PCs and the 2nd Tier RTX 3080 is ~30% faster than a 4th Tier 6700XT.  Right where I would expect it to be considering it is ~20% - 40% faster across a wide range of games and resolutions according to most reviews.  So why would a 6700XT be ~30% slower than an RTX3080, yet you are saying your 3090 is 40% sfaster than a 6900XT?  It just doesn't match actual testing results.

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-radeon-rx-6700-xt/29.html

Edited by ICDP
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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
Posted (edited)

Well, go ahead try VRSS, and put this into the equation. I also quoted 3090, it's roughly 10 % quicker than the 3080, which you said to be 10% quicker. So adding these things up.... Well, just go ahead and try VRSS. You'll probably be amazed, suddenly running 100% at 90Hz becomes possible. :)

 

We were talking about two different use cases. I don't talk about IL-2. If you don't mind, please re-read my post. It's clear IL-2 does not support this feature set. 

 

I wish it did, then it could benefit massively as well. VRSS works incredibly well on the G2, you can hardly tell. It's not comparable to FFR on the 8KX. There's no jaggie-overload... You know what I mean.

 

Mentioned DLSS (Deep Learning Super Sampling) as well, as the new hot alternative to VRSS. Family member used this on the 4K a lot, a 3070-rig for Cyberpunk and other games. The benefit DLSS gives is very very promising indeed. These have not been marketing slices. This tech is blazing fast without loss of visible quality.

 

P.S. added links ;)

This stuff is not just a +10% performance stuff. This is going way beyond 20% better performance on its own indeed, depending on game even higher. I can only describe the gain as radical, which is a fitting term, I stand by that. And @ICDP it would be really great if you tried it out (or again), I know you're a tech enthusiast here as well, so this'll be very interesting for you, I am absolutely certain of that. 

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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ICDP
Posted (edited)

I already know what DLSS does and it is why I chose to keep the 3080 over the 6800 I bought.  AMD needs to get a viable alternative to DLSS and it must be way better than the horrible first versions Nvidia released.  I also know VRSS has limited support and does not work in IL-2, so it is moot in this thread all things considered.

 

You claimed the following regarding AMDs current VR performance:

 

"P.s. especially since the new Radeon cards are running with strong handbrake in VR anyway, due to the resizable bar. Performance reported so far was atrociously down and below expectations. So they're no-go's for VR players anyway right now."

 

I called you out on it and proved it is a massive exaggeration that has no basis in facts.  I linked to multiple reviews of current and past VR performance on AMD that shows AMD to be on par or very close to Nvidia at similar tiers.  I posted a link to show DCS VR is performing better on AMD.  I posted my own experience of using a 3080 vs a 6800 (now sold) and a 6700XT that showed VR performance on AMD is nowhere near as bad as your grossly exaggerated claims.

 

I think I have proved my point and don't want to take this thread any further off topic.

Edited by ICDP
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chiliwili69
9 hours ago, ICDP said:

have maybe referred to this as black levels.

 

Ok, so you referred to glare/glow/haze as black levels.

 

Now it is clear. As shown in this review: https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/c71trv/my_valve_index_review_my_new_king_of_vr/

 

One item is glare or godrays:

godrays-glare.thumb.jpg.018b352efd33e418cff2e67b5372e3ee.jpg

 

And another item is BlackLevels

blacklevels.thumb.jpg.764810390fcaadcdbd1d9f473929e77a.jpg

 

As you said, from VP2 we could expect some godrays since it uses same double fresnel lenses. But let´s see.

For blacklevels, if they are in the line of the Index it would not be too bad.

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ICDP
Posted (edited)

I just did a 1080p 2D test of both GPUs for comparison in IL2.  QMB 8v8 Moscow, Heavy clouds, midday.  Identical graphical settings.

 

6700XT Min: 161

6700XT Avg: 193

6700 XT Max: 244

 

3080 FE Min: 192

3080 FE Avg: 241

3080 FE Max: 324

 

% Increase over 6700 XT

Min = 19%

Avg = 25%

Max = 33%

 

So 2D results are similar to Pimax 8KX results where the 3080 FE is approximately ~30% faster overall.

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

Ok, so you referred to glare/glow/haze as black levels.

 

Now it is clear. As shown in this review: https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/c71trv/my_valve_index_review_my_new_king_of_vr/

 

One item is glare or godrays:

godrays-glare.thumb.jpg.018b352efd33e418cff2e67b5372e3ee.jpg

 

And another item is BlackLevels

blacklevels.thumb.jpg.764810390fcaadcdbd1d9f473929e77a.jpg

 

As you said, from VP2 we could expect some godrays since it uses same double fresnel lenses. But let´s see.

For blacklevels, if they are in the line of the Index it would not be too bad.

 

I liked your subtle pun :)

 

Yes my posts were an attempt to point out that LCDs have limitations on haze or black levels and what we get with VP2 remains to be seen.  My 8KX is not great in this regard but better than the 5K+, so I am hoping for an improvement in VP2.

 

The Godrays could be a big deal for me, I just wanted to find out for myself and have the 14 day DSR as a backup.

Edited by ICDP
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chiliwili69
3 hours ago, ICDP said:

Second PC (son's) has a 5600X, 6700XT, 32GB DDR 3400 CL14 RAM

 

Hey, so you have one of the latest AMD GPU. 

In three tests of the SYN_Vander benchmark for one 6900XT @RufusK and two 6800XT @thermoregulator @nickj123, the 4K test and VR tests were well below the other 3080 and 3090.

This bad performance was particular for IL-2 and we don´t know why. But someone told me that this problem has been solved. But no facts yet.

So anyone with a 6700XT, 6800XT and 6900XT is welcome to run the SYN_Vander test for 4K test and VR.

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, ICDP said:

I just did a 1080p 2D test of both GPUs for comparison in IL2.  QMB 8v8 Moscow, Heavy clouds, midday.  Identical graphical settings.

 

6700XT Min: 161

6700XT Avg: 193

6700 XT Max: 244

 

3080 FE Min: 192

3080 FE Avg: 241

3080 FE Max: 324

 

% Increase over 6700 XT

Min = 19%

Avg = 25%

Max = 33%

 

So 2D results are similar to Pimax 8KX results where the 3080 FE is approximately ~30% faster overall.

You say you don't want to continue, yet post a comparison...

 

For the third and last time, I was talking about the entire package.

 

In VR, not in IL-2 exclusively, 50-60% SS with VRSS 4x, against 100% SS without VRSS, with what the companies bring to most new VR titles:

 

That's 3090 with VRSS vs 6900XT without VRSS, or 3080 with VRSS vs 6800XT without VRSS, both in VR as the Radeons are losing ground inexplicably in VR. There's an up to 30-40% performance difference considering the full stack that I have experienced.

Had several GPUs of the new gen too, 5 in total since RTX-3000/Radeon release. Kept the 3090.

 

We can't compare their 2D performance and deduct performance to VR with the Radeons at the moment.

 

And the new versions of several feature sets do not explicitly require forward shade rendering anymore by the way.

 

My goal is not to fight over nitpicky stuff, but that the dude who asked questions, or anyone who's looking to buy a new GPU to start VR adventures - should or should not aim to get. 

 

So the conclusion is, for VR players and looking at GPUs, always aim at Nvidia right now. Ultimately, buy what you can get, but that's the preference. They just got these awesome tricks up their sleeves which need to be in the benchmark to avoid warping reality.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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ICDP
1 hour ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

Hey, so you have one of the latest AMD GPU. 

In three tests of the SYN_Vander benchmark for one 6900XT @RufusK and two 6800XT @thermoregulator @nickj123, the 4K test and VR tests were well below the other 3080 and 3090.

This bad performance was particular for IL-2 and we don´t know why. But someone told me that this problem has been solved. But no facts yet.

So anyone with a 6700XT, 6800XT and 6900XT is welcome to run the SYN_Vander test for 4K test and VR.

 

I'll try to make time to test it later this week.

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dburne

I am pretty sure you guys are talking in a foreign language now...

:o:

Guess I need to study up some on some of this new found technology stuff.

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chiliwili69
11 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

So the conclusion is, for VR players and looking at GPUs, always aim at Nvidia right now.

 

Concerning IL-2 here, for monitor or VR, we have seen that 6800XT and 6900XT had really bad performance due an issue (apparently with IL-2). But someone told me that this issue has been solve. So right now, if someone is looking to buy a new GPU for monitor (4K) or VR (latest devices) I would wait until we have done more tests to check if the issue has been solved.

 

Off course the safe bet is NVidia 3070, 3080, 3090. But currently they difficult to find and overpriced. So, let´s see the tests.

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blue_max
27 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

Off course the safe bet is NVidia 3070, 3080, 3090. But currently they difficult to find and overpriced. So, let´s see the tests.

overpriced is the understatement of the year

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, blue_max said:

overpriced is the understatement of the year

 

The GPU situation is shocking right now and I feel both Nvidia and AMD are drip feeding to keep their prices high.

 

I bought a 6800 (non XT) for just over MSRP and after a few months I impulse bought an RTX 3080 that came up for MSRP on partalert discord.  Sold the 6800 for what I paid for it as I am not a scalper and being one just would not sight right with me.  I know people are entitled to make a few bucks but when someone offers you a 3080 for a ~400 Euro mark up they are kind of a dick in my book.  I have to be honest the 6800 was only ~15% slower than the 3080 in 2D and in VR when both were overclocked but that extra VRAM really was nice in DCS.

 

Then about a month ago I managed to get a 6700XT at just over MSRP and used it to replace the RTX 2080 from my sons PC.  I could have sold the 2080 for a massive mark up but just took a few hundred pound from a good friend who was having problems finding a GPU to replace his old GTX 970.

 

I have yet to find any issues with AMD in VR on any game.  Just plug in and go and get performance roughly in line with expectations.  Things like VRSS or FFR or DLSS all have promise in VR and or 2D, so given a choice take an Nvidia GPU.  But if an AMD 6000 series came up for a decent price, you would not be disappointed.

Edited by ICDP
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shirazjohn

I'm praying my 1080 ti doesn't give up the ghost before i can purchase a reasonably priced new gpu whatever/whenever that is.🤞

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3 minutes ago, shirazjohn said:

I'm praying my 1080 ti doesn't give up the ghost before i can purchase a reasonably priced new gpu whatever/whenever that is.🤞

 

I have seen that happen to a few people on some forums.  Out of warranty GPU dies and they are faced with scalpers pricing and in some cases paying massive prices for a downgrade.

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shirazjohn
5 minutes ago, ICDP said:

 

I have seen that happen to a few people on some forums.  Out of warranty GPU dies and they are faced with scalpers pricing and in some cases paying massive prices for a downgrade.

I'm afraid if this happens it will be time out for gaming until prices become more sensible (if they ever do) i just flatley refuse to line some scalpers pocket , its just adding fuel to the fire.

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30speed
6 hours ago, blue_max said:

overpriced is the understatement of the year

 

and the demand for the overpriced cards on Ebay is growing as well! That's the amazing part. About 2 months ago you could find a 3090 for ~$2,900-$3,000 USD.  Now it's up to $3,500.  😄 

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Drum

I jumped on a new Alien CPU to get my hands on one of the first 3080's back in Dec.  It was $4,000 Canadian ($3,300 U.S) with free shipping.  Do not pay those ripoff prices guys, you'll get more bang for your buck buying a premade with a 3080/3090...

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

I bought 5 cards in total for friends and family (OG member of PartAlert in Europe yours truly).

 

Now.. should've kept them I think sometimes :))

6-7000 dollars gain for nothing would have been nice, holidays on the Maldives with family.

 

None of those I got them for thanked me even twice  :lol:

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