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Well, I finally got VR going in IL2GB using my Quest 2.  I can't totally explain it, but I'm a bit disappointed.  Being more closer to experiencing the actual cockpit is pretty cool, but it isn't as earth-shaking as I thought it would be.  Yes, it is visually more realistic, I guess?  I didn't have to turn down my graphics settings from 2D at all (Ultra and 4K).  My RTX 2080 runs VR mode very well.  Flying is totally smooth. I thought the VR combat experience would be more satisfying, but so far (this is my first day with VR) it is not. I didn't try ejecting while in VR.  Maybe that will be really cool?  I know this is my first day, but I am surprised to be underwhelmed by the VR experience in IL2 and MSFS 2020.

 

I bought my VR headset about three weeks ago.   I do like VR.  There are some really good experiences to download and store directly to the Quest 2. I've had fun with a couple of them.  But 90% of the reason why I bought the Quest 2, my first VR headset, was for flight sims and racing sims.  Maybe Project Cars 2 will be spectacular in VR.  

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2 hours ago, Trek64Trek64 said:

Well, I finally got VR going in IL2GB using my Quest 2.  I can't totally explain it, but I'm a bit disappointed.  Being more closer to experiencing the actual cockpit is pretty cool, but it isn't as earth-shaking as I thought it would be.  Yes, it is visually more realistic, I guess?  I didn't have to turn down my graphics settings from 2D at all (Ultra and 4K).  My RTX 2080 runs VR mode very well.  Flying is totally smooth. I thought the VR combat experience would be more satisfying, but so far (this is my first day with VR) it is not. I didn't try ejecting while in VR.  Maybe that will be really cool?  I know this is my first day, but I am surprised to be underwhelmed by the VR experience in IL2 and MSFS 2020.

 

I bought my VR headset about three weeks ago.   I do like VR.  There are some really good experiences to download and store directly to the Quest 2. I've had fun with a couple of them.  But 90% of the reason why I bought the Quest 2, my first VR headset, was for flight sims and racing sims.  Maybe Project Cars 2 will be spectacular in VR.  

 

That is a reaction that is not often seen, but does exist. Some folks are just not blown away with it like much of us are though.

If IL-2 and MSFS 2020 does not give you that feeling, then I doubt any VR game will.

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I have a same kind of feelings with my Reverb 2. IL-2's VR implementation is great and the feeling is spectacular. But still so many things are way better with TrackIR. Like using wind-correction tool; you have to take VR helmet away when using external tools.

 

It is a bit like when working with networking devices... the WebUI is great and intuitive and looks good, but when you really have to get things done, the good old CLI is the way to go.

 

Both are great, but neither is perfect.

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13 hours ago, Trek64Trek64 said:

I didn't have to turn down my graphics settings from 2D at all (Ultra and 4K)

 

If you were playing at 4K, then going to VR through the Quest2 you will have a large downgrade in resolution. Take into account that although the number of pixels of the Quest2 is quite OK for a VR device, the image you obtain is lower quality than other VR devices which uses the Display Port cable, both in graphics quality and latency.

The Quest2 have to compress-decompress the image for every frame in other to fit it to the USB bandwidth, and this decrease the graphics quality and increase latencies.

 

But in any case, if you don´t like IL-2 in VR with the Quest2, you will most likely will not like either with other devices (like G2 or others) since the biggest factor is inmersion and believing that you are "there", sitting in a warbird in the middle of a battle scene. (and not in your room sitting in front of monitor which display a battle scene like watching TV).

 

But yes, there is a percentage of people which, after testing IL-2 VR, prefered monitor over VR, it was about 4+4%. Look here.

So your case is not "rare". But honestly, I really really don´t understand that 8% and that´s why I was making that pool. 

I also used TrackIR and 4K monitor before moving to VR, and even with the old Rift CV1, the IL-2 VR experience has always blown my mind

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Different strokes for different folks really.

 

16 hours ago, Hanu said:

you have to take VR helmet away when using external tools

 

I had mixed results using pinned windows in VR using the Oculus Dash (I guess you can do similar with some virtual desktop app), usually pinning them on my "knees" in VR. The most cumbersome thing so far was having to alt-tab out of the game and finding the mouse cursor to interact with the other window; with an AutoHotkey script I can alt-tab quickly back in to the game with any input from my flight controls.

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It's definitely a trade off, like the loss of resolution and accepting that I have to use icons on a toggle button if I want to see any enemies, but for me it's definitely worth it. It's the feeling of "being there"... things you usually read in books but are hard to see on a flat screen, like how big American cockpits are compared to German ones. The amazing visibility from the FW 190 cockpit... The mirrors on the P-38 engines to see the undercarriage. I'm still amazed by it all.

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I have a Rift S and not the Quest but maybe these 2 apps can help you by making it look and run significantly better. This is a SteamVR game and sometimes that does not work the best with with Oculus. I do believe from what I have read the Rift S comes out better even though it has less res in the panel  but this might help you mate. Costs nothing to try and all up a couple of minutes to set up so well worth a try in my book.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

1: Download OpenComposite. (Replaces SteamVR is makes it run so much better on the Rift S)
You can download the System Wide Installer but that does all Steam Games. I do not wish to touch anything that does not have a problem so I did not use this one. I downloaded the Per-Game Installation.

In this case the 64 bit version.

2: Replace the dll that fires up Steam VR.
Find openvr_api.dll and back it up. In this case it is found here... "IL-2 Sturmovik Great Battles\bin\game" and replace it with the dll you just downloaded.

3: Some people ran fine just at that but I needed this...
In the same folder that you just put that dll create a txt file and rename it to
opencomposite.ini

Edit that and put in this one line...
enableAudio=False

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oculus Tray Tool (Makes it look much clearer by doing stuff and things)

 

Download the app and make a profile for IL2... in that set the super sampling to 1.5. Anything over that is diminishing returns I think but I run mine at 1.5

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

If none of that helps you out then as the others have said maybe it isn't for you. I went from a triple monitor setup and track IR to the first Rift when it came out all those years ago and have never once gone back. It is interesting to note I wasn't really thrilled with IL2 either until I installed opencomposite. It never performed really well and I have a decent system (i9 9900 and 2080ti). Little stutters and stuff that normally happen with SteamVR only games. Now I can't get enough of it.

 

All the best mate. If you can get half the thrill out of it as I do then you'll be good :)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The opencomposite link is here, sorry can't edit my posts yet :)

 

https://gitlab.com/znixian/OpenOVR/blob/master/README.md

 

 

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Read my posting here and at the RoF & Woff  forums I you will read that I as an “ matter of fact” person, was very skeptical about all that Vive & OC fuss. Did have an very good 27” 2650/1440 IPS monitor in combination with an Track5/clip, but after trying a Vive at an arcade-hall, I directly noticed the possibility in race/fly sims and since that I never did roll back. 

 

Only for me its not only the eyecandy but also the better immersion in VR. As an sample once I was driving in a prewar race at Historical Zandvoort, in my 1937 red Alfa, while another Alfa did bounced back from an dune, straight over my red Alfa. You will not believe that, but as an natural reaction I did bent my head as trying to avoid injuries, just like in real life. I never had that in the flat world.

So this is the point that is for me very important. 

 

Eventually if the more powerful Vcards become available for normal prices and the next gen VR HS are being introduced I will move over to a more crystal sharp image.  But right now, I’m very satisfied with the O+ and  if a game does not have VR I’m not going to buy it. 

 

 

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VR is overrated by some folks, yes it adds something new to the table but that doesn't mean it will translate your experience into something astonishing. You have to know that many flight sim folks are older and easy to impress, younger people that have much more experience with tech and games are harder to impress.... I have tried VR many times and I am not convinced by any way that this is the future of gaming in fact I am against it and I really doubt it will expand further, some people don't like to have something on their heads(heavy) and disconnect from the reality that much.

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I let all of my friends visiting me to try my VR set and to fly free flight with Me109 G2 (full throttle, no engine management).

They all are blown away, no matter young, old, men, woman.

Only minority of them actually have "strange" feeling that "it looks right but something is wrong" to them, and they stop after 5 min.

Mostly they are carried away and play until VR sickness (usual for beginners), or sometimes they play 1-2Hrs and then they stop just because it is expected from their wives 😄

 

PS: I have Pimax 5k+ and 8KX; it is great except for people with small ipd (distace between eyes)

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9 hours ago, SJ_Butcher said:

VR is overrated by some folks, yes it adds something new to the table but that doesn't mean it will translate your experience into something astonishing. You have to know that many flight sim folks are older and easy to impress, younger people that have much more experience with tech and games are harder to impress.... I have tried VR many times and I am not convinced by any way that this is the future of gaming in fact I am against it and I really doubt it will expand further, some people don't like to have something on their heads(heavy) and disconnect from the reality that much.

 

In that case I sure am glad I am older.

;)

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16 hours ago, SJ_Butcher said:

younger people that have much more experience with tech and games are harder to impress...

 

that's one pork bologna right there..

 

the existence of Minecraft and its extremely wide popularity (plus a VR support for it as well) among "younger people who are harder to impress" should tell you everything you need to know about the technological relevance to the application's popularity. It has nothing to do with it. VR is just a tool, nothing more nothing less. You can cut grass with a scythe or with an electric mower or with a 2-stroke loud-as-f^ck gas powered landscaping machine. Some folk like one type of tool, others another.

 

To like/dislike a tool you need to use it for some time to understand its pro's and con's. Same thing with VR.

 

@Trek64Trek64 give it couple of weeks and see if your opinion changes. There ain't no shame to dislike stuff.

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Well, I've only been playing flight Sims since 1985 so I clearly don't have as much experience as young people, but I'd say VR is the biggest leap forward for the genre since rudder pedals were invented. 

 

And before you ask, the joystick was there since day one, so it doesn't count.

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1 hour ago, F19_Haddock said:

Well, I've only been playing flight Sims since 1985 so I clearly don't have as much experience as young people, but I'd say VR is the biggest leap forward for the genre since rudder pedals were invented. 

 

And before you ask, the joystick was there since day one, so it doesn't count.

 

I started around the same time and feel the same.

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On 3/3/2021 at 11:41 AM, SJ_Butcher said:

VR is overrated by some folks, yes it adds something new to the table but that doesn't mean it will translate your experience into something astonishing. You have to know that many flight sim folks are older and easy to impress, younger people that have much more experience with tech and games are harder to impress.... I have tried VR many times and I am not convinced by any way that this is the future of gaming in fact I am against it and I really doubt it will expand further, some people don't like to have something on their heads(heavy) and disconnect from the reality that much.

 

I recon myself and many other older people would have little more experience with tech then most "young people" unless they have been plugging away on something earlier than my Vic 20 in the early 80's.

 

Because of that experience It is quite possible that some of us know and understand enough about technology to have realistic expectations and can see exactly where this is actually going and where it has been... because we actually experienced it. Over all my years of simulation VR is the first time I have ever appeared to be sitting in the actual cockpit of my plane of choice and not watching a monitor.

 

5 years ago I bought my first VR HMD (CV1 Rift) and it was less pixelated then I was expecting so it was amazing. I didn't have over expectations and I knew exactly what I was getting into. That was also the last time I ever played a non VR game and that is also when TrackIR and the triples went into some cupboard somewhere never to return.

 

The real problem is that some people expect those triple screen setups to be jammed into something the size of a scuba goggle a bit too soon but some of us are suitably impressed by the state of the art because it is pretty damn impressive for the price and is only getting better and cheaper all the time.

 

VR isn't overrated. The tech is amazing for the price. I do believe however that some people just expect way to much for too little and want it yesterday. There rest of us are smiling :)

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, shrubbo said:

when TrackIR and the triples went into some cupboard somewhere never to return

 

Good post. I was also a kind of gamer/hacker with my Sinclair Spectrum 48K. The Fighter Pilot game was amazing. And I was young, a not easy guy to be impressed. (irony tone).

 

I also had my old TrackIR5 in a cupboard for more than 5 years, but just two weeks ago I decided to sell in Ebay (I hate to have things I don´t use) and got 75€!!

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14 hours ago, shrubbo said:

The real problem is that some people expect those triple screen setups to be jammed into something the size of a scuba goggle a bit too soon

 

you're spot on. It's the lack of historical knowledge and understanding of the technological advancement and its hurdles in the VR development is the main reason people expect magic from VR.

 

There's a very high chance that we do sound like a couple of boomers with their "when I was your age I was walking to school 10 miles uphill in both directions", however there is absolutely no exaggeration in making such statements when it comes to the technology we lived through these years.

 

I remember seeing VR in movies (Johnny Mnemonic and others) and I couldn't wait for VR to become mainstream. 

 

Then in 2014 on youtube I saw some guy testing out the first Oculus DevKit1 in DCS in his basement (not a company demo room). When instead of using the hat switch or the keyboard he actually used his whole body/head (with 1:1 movement ratio) to lean out of the p51 cockpit so he could see the runway while landing, then briefly checked his instruments, verified both ailerons and elevators are working correctly I screamed: "wow!! this is it!! how?  how do I get my hands on this???".

 

Then 2 years later I was already using the CIV1 and giggling like an elementary school kid. I still remember my first lawndart in to the ground in DCS. It was so vivid, scary as hell, the realization of the inevitability of death, yet somehow super exciting.

 

Ah, the memories. VR 5 years ago feels like the ancient history. 😄

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38 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

More along the lines, my first VR flight exactly 6 years ago, it was as good to leave IL-2. But returned when they did VR.

 

 

you were one of the lucky ones to manage to get the DK's from Oculus!

 

"From now on, there will be "a before" and "an after" in all my thinking about flight simulators." 

 

😄 Right on!

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2 hours ago, SJ_Butcher said:

But Microsoft is promoting AR and not VR

 

This was news to me, but it looks like they are going in both directions with Mesh:

 

image.png.f6c4eb3e4a8cc89dce42fc68d6e1279d.png

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7 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

More along the lines, my first VR flight exactly 6 years ago, it was as good to leave IL-2. But returned when they did VR.

 

 

 

I resisted the urge to get the dev kit. It was hard but I wanted the best experience I could possibly get with the tech available at the time and I can still remember sitting up until 2 in the morning enduring the pre-order charlie foxtrot,  picking my CV1 up from the airport and hour a way a couple of months later, driving home, opening that box and firing the thing up for the first time. Better than I was expecting and it has been VR or no sale ever since.

 

I eventually wanted to upgrade to the Index but I ran into "Not available in your country" BS and then found a Rift S on amazon that I could get in 2 days so I bought that as a stop gap. Anyway a couple of years later I am so impressed with the S that I still have it and didn't bother with the Index. I am so happy with it that I am in no rush to upgrade until I see something suitable that has a wider FoV which is what I am really hanging for. Yes I do look at pimax from time to time heh.

 

Watching what is going on with the market and tech has me absolutely foaming at the mouth for what is already here and what is coming. The hand tracking is particularly interesting because I really want to reach out and flip that switch. AR is interesting but I am more interested in VR. I want to be in that plane/car/train/truck and totally disconnected from reality because... that is the point of playing a sim in the first place.

 

Now for that motion rig... 😄

 

EDIT: The Rift S has a halo design head strap. That means you can pull the face plate off and move those lenses right up to your face and get a significantly bigger FoV and also no heating issues. It took me about 5 minutes to learn to ignore the light leakage from the peripherals and anyway the FoV and the temp control is worth the trade off for me.

Edited by shrubbo
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On 3/1/2021 at 11:43 PM, shrubbo said:

I have a Rift S and not the Quest but maybe these 2 apps can help you by making it look and run significantly better. This is a SteamVR game and sometimes that does not work the best with with Oculus. I do believe from what I have read the Rift S comes out better even though it has less res in the panel  but this might help you mate. Costs nothing to try and all up a couple of minutes to set up so well worth a try in my book.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

1: Download OpenComposite. (Replaces SteamVR is makes it run so much better on the Rift S)
You can download the System Wide Installer but that does all Steam Games. I do not wish to touch anything that does not have a problem so I did not use this one. I downloaded the Per-Game Installation.

In this case the 64 bit version.

2: Replace the dll that fires up Steam VR.
Find openvr_api.dll and back it up. In this case it is found here... "IL-2 Sturmovik Great Battles\bin\game" and replace it with the dll you just downloaded.

3: Some people ran fine just at that but I needed this...
In the same folder that you just put that dll create a txt file and rename it to
opencomposite.ini

Edit that and put in this one line...
enableAudio=False

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oculus Tray Tool (Makes it look much clearer by doing stuff and things)

 

Download the app and make a profile for IL2... in that set the super sampling to 1.5. Anything over that is diminishing returns I think but I run mine at 1.5

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

If none of that helps you out then as the others have said maybe it isn't for you. I went from a triple monitor setup and track IR to the first Rift when it came out all those years ago and have never once gone back. It is interesting to note I wasn't really thrilled with IL2 either until I installed opencomposite. It never performed really well and I have a decent system (i9 9900 and 2080ti). Little stutters and stuff that normally happen with SteamVR only games. Now I can't get enough of it.

 

All the best mate. If you can get half the thrill out of it as I do then you'll be good :)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The opencomposite link is here, sorry can't edit my posts yet :)

 

https://gitlab.com/znixian/OpenOVR/blob/master/README.md

 

 

Thanks for the suggestions, but I have this sim on digital download direct not Steam.

I'm old.  I was born when Eisenhower was President.  I'm not as skilled with tech as some in this forum, but I know a disappointment when I see one.  The in-the-cockpit experience is cool, but VR is sucking it for air combat.  Perhaps that is a bit harsh.  I think a large monitor and TrackIR is better for situational awareness in air combat.  I'll say this, crashing in VR is a more realistic treat.  Or should I say "crash landing."  It freaked me out in a good way, in VR, to skid through really tall grass.  

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3 hours ago, Trek64Trek64 said:

Thanks for the suggestions, but I have this sim on digital download direct not Steam.

I'm old.  I was born when Eisenhower was President.  I'm not as skilled with tech as some in this forum, but I know a disappointment when I see one.  The in-the-cockpit experience is cool, but VR is sucking it for air combat.  Perhaps that is a bit harsh.  I think a large monitor and TrackIR is better for situational awareness in air combat.  I'll say this, crashing in VR is a more realistic treat.  Or should I say "crash landing."  It freaked me out in a good way, in VR, to skid through really tall grass.  

 

I also have the version from il2sturmovik.com (Not the Steam Version)  but it still uses Steam VR so those tips can help if you are running Oculus.

 

You are right with the situational awareness and at this point a VR player has no chance against someone with triples and TrackIr (Or even a single decent monitor really, I don't have an owls neck) but the immersion factor for me is so high I can't go back. The first time that fire came under the instrument panel... true horror! So I play with VR players only. Conveniently my wife has a similar setup and so do my friends so all good.

 

I am assuming you also have an Oculus setup (If not ignore) and if you do that first tip about changing the dll file that should give you a much smoother experience and also allow you to up some of the graphics and it really is very simple if you follow those three steps. I would not bother with the Oculus Tray tool in your case. Honestly there is more work writing it down here then it is to do it and you are at best old enough to be my brother mate so you aren't dead yet 😄

 

 

Edited by shrubbo
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I have the opposite experience. I have always played IL2 in VR (cv1, rift S, reverb g2). My reverb g2 cable gave up last week and I had to play with trackir this weekend on a 49" IPS 4k60 display maxed out and I couldn't really fight effectively. I had a hard time going from 1:1 head tracking to the accelerated tracking of track ir. Also I had alot of trouble guessing ranges for deflection shots as well as tank gunnery. VR just always felt much more natural. From my experience it may not feel like it at first glance, but if you have the gpu power a reverb g2 and a rift S is a night and day difference when it comes to spotting and clarity. 

14 hours ago, Trek64Trek64 said:

Thanks for the suggestions, but I have this sim on digital download direct not Steam.

I'm old.  I was born when Eisenhower was President.  I'm not as skilled with tech as some in this forum, but I know a disappointment when I see one.  The in-the-cockpit experience is cool, but VR is sucking it for air combat.  Perhaps that is a bit harsh.  I think a large monitor and TrackIR is better for situational awareness in air combat.  I'll say this, crashing in VR is a more realistic treat.  Or should I say "crash landing."  It freaked me out in a good way, in VR, to skid through really tall grass.  

 

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