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AngryPanda

Hows the historical accuracy in this title?

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Im looking for a WW2 flight sim game that is as realistic/historic as it can be. I have been playing this other "WW2 Arcade-Sim" hybrid type game for a while now (Wont mention the name since I dont know if it's against the rules and I don't want to advertise it either) and I am completely done with it now after it not being historically accurate as advertised and the "Russian bias" it has making Cold War propeller planes fighting WW2 Germans for example. Anyway, would this be a game I should buy if I am looking for a WW2 sim that depicts each aircraft like how it was in real life? I have watched a bit of gameplay and I like what I see. Just wanted to hear some opinions before making a final decision. (Really leaning to buying it after looking through the sites about page and the video I watched)

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Historical accuracy is high with great attention to detail.

 

Things like this are never going to be 100%, but BoS is striving for perhaps 90% and definately puts accuracy over game balance and the like.

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I think this is probably what you're looking for. IL-2 Battle of Stalingrad is a much more focused product than say World of Warbirds or War Thunder. It's one map, one time period from Nov 1942 to Feb 1943, and one set of key aircraft that were present at that battle (or as in the case of the FW190A-3... nearby).

 

The kinds of arguments we have over historical details are in the rivet counting territory rather than any issues with the broad strokes. The aircraft flight, damage, and weapons modelling is also aimed towards the highly realistic and while, again, we may have some issues with aircraft here and there, by and large we have a simulator here. The Bf109s are superior fighters to anything that the Russians have present but they are also finely tuned machines with their own issues (and using historical boost levels for the Bf109G-2 which had issues early in its deployment during the Stalingrad battle), the LaGG-3 is fairly tough but sluggish, the La-5 is a better LaGG-3 but not a super fighter, etc. And we have or will have a couple of really finely detailed bombers too in the Pe-2 and He111 which still to come and of course the titular IL-2 is present and the no East Front sim should be without the Ju87.

 

This product has flaws but it is aimed at the more realistic side of things and is less casual.

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Thanks for the comments! I surely will be getting it then. Reading more I see it will be coming to steam as well around the summer so I may wait for that or purchase before since im sure you can use the key to activate anyway.

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The clouds, the ground handling, flight model, and most of all the sound in this game really take immersion to the next level. I think being able to hear the wind as you speed up or turn hard doubles the pleasure of flying by itself. Realistic or not it sure feels like it. Compared to other games, this feels like being in the air, while they feel like flying a ufo through space.

 

I think you can trust the devs to nail the flight models because there aren't a huge number of planes available.

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definately puts accuracy over game balance and the like.

Thats one of the things thats most important too me

way to many "simulators" ruin the simulation to benefit balance

i really hope that they keep it realistic and don't make up their own "realism" like War Thunder do..

but as i know 777 they will keep it clean and real just like they did with ROF :)

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Well if I fly for blue side the game is biased towards red side and if I switch to red side the bloody game switch its bias to the blue side. 

No way to win!

 

Master

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Well if I fly for blue side the game is biased towards red side and if I switch to red side the bloody game switch its bias to the blue side. 

No way to win!

 

Master

 

Haha nice :) I think this is firmly in "the world is out to get me" territory :D

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Its meant to be joke but as all "good jokes" it's true.  What is deemed to be realistic is very much a perception and expectation in the mind of the user, based on his culture, national history and the education or propaganda received in his education.

Of course the BoS team strive to make a simulation as close to reality and history as is possible but with the above said some users will find it lacking in realism and then without exception always to their disadvantage.

 

Master

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Oh dear, another Luftwaffe [Edited]. All I can say is as far as the Red Army's succes in the front against Nazi Germany during WWII they aren't given much credit. Much of their heroic deeds were disrespectfully trampled on by Cold War propogandists of the day. Now that the Cold War is over, I am happy there are unbiased sources in the west that can settle this plane question once and for all.

 

There is this company which sells guns, military machines etc and they have a website called militaryfactory.com. Of all the people in the world, it is not the historians with no personal experience I trust, but the people who actually got to handle these military machines, aircraft in this instance and write their review on the planes. So here the flight characteristics go, and I will post the links on the bottom if you want to verify the statistics:

 

Lavochkin Series:

LaGG-3:

Year: 1941   Engines Power: 1260 hp   Maximum Speed: 575 km/h    Service Cieling: 9,700 m   Rate of Climb: 899 m/min

La-5:

Year: 1942   Engines Power: 1850 hp   Maximum Speed: 648 km/h    Service Cieling: 11,000 m Rate of Climb: 1,000 m/min

 

There were many Yakovlev aircraft, but none was as mass produced in the Red Army as the Yak-9. Look at the characteristics to see why:

Yak-9:

Year: 1943   Engines Power: 1650 hp   Maximum Speed: 698 km/hr   Service Cieling: 11,900 m Rate of Climb: 1,500 m/min

Here are the characteristics of the Bf 109, the most mass produced military fighter in human history

Bf 109:

Year: 1937   Engines Power: 1,200 hp  Maximum Speed: 578 km/h    Service Cieling: 11.125 m Rate of Climb: 1,006 m/min

 

In fact, the only "advantage" per say that German fighters had over Soviet ones was that the Soviet Union never employed high altitude strategic bombers. That is because instead of bombing civilian cities and terrorizing innocent people not involved in the war, the Soviets prefered to build low altitude tactical bombers which this site is named after, whose sole purpose was to attack tanks and ground targets that Russian tanks couldnt destroy themselves. Most people say the Red Army beat the Whermacht, while the Luftwaffe still had air domination, but the reality is the lighter Russian tanks defeated heavier German tanks not just in numbers, but thanks to extensive air support. Back to topic, the low flying IL-2s meant that the Soviet fighters also flew low, which is why the German pilots continued to use B&Z tactics, however unlike their campaigns in Poland and Spain Soviet pilots were more than capable of following their attackers, but were limited to a certain distance away from their ILs. This meant a solid line of defense in the air, with no intent for Soviet pilots to pursue their surprise attackers for too long. It may interest you to know that the first major battle to Soviets won, the Battle of Stalingrad, was the first battle where the Soviets used their famous La-5s. The Russian winter is a myth, as Stalingrad is so deep south in Russia, their winters were the same, if not slightly warmer than German winters. Maybe in Leningrad it was a different story, but the Germans managed to seige that city for quite a while despite a harsh winter. Anyways, if you want a truly historically accurate game, I can't argue that planes such as the Polikarpov series, and LaGG-3 were nothing compared to Bf 109. However War Thunder does the later Soviet planes justice by making them practically undefeatable, as the stats above show. In fact, I would go as far to say as if War Thunder truly made the Soviet planes just like their historical counterparts, nobody would be playing on any planes but the Soviets. Since you do not believe me, and probably were brought up with Cold War propoganda your entire life, let me enlighten you by giving you the links to the information. Again, these aren't historians paid by the government (American or Russian) to praise their armed forces. This is an independent group that sells weapons, and makes tables of characteristics of weapons and military machines they have tried out themselves. If you are Russophobic enough to assume that all Russians (such as Gaijn) will provide you with bias, rest assured these people are as American as you or I. It's ok to admit, the Russians do a swell job in war, there are no more police waiting at people's doors to arrest you for being "communist" just because you love the AK series :D. Good day and here are the links:

 

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=553

 

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=554

 

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=187

 

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=83

 

Moderated 01/04/15 0840EST

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Wow, just like the old days. CrazyIvan you might want to step in with you ban hammer soon...

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Talk about raising the dead. OK... this thread will stay open as long as it stays civil. This one must have slipped through the cracks.

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Here are the characteristics of the Bf 109, the most mass produced military fighter in human history

Bf 109:

Year: 1937   Engines Power: 1,200 hp  Maximum Speed: 578 km/h    Service Cieling: 11.125 m Rate of Climb: 1,006 m/min

 

Finally someone other than the common sheep who subscribe to Cold War propaganda! Because as any history professor would tell you, during the 1937 Messerschmitt Massacre, the SS killed the entire factory personnel, planners and anyone who knew how the -109 was constructed due to Nazi ideology which had predicted that the first version of the plane would be the superior one, and that any attempt at upgrading the -109 would lead to the Norse gods cursing all the planes and Germany. For this reason no Bf-109 was ever upgraded. The lack of knowledge as to the construction of the plane did also cause some maintenance issues, which is the real reason the Fw-190 was constructed.

 

I could also make some parody about the sentiment that the Soviet Union didn't develop high altitude bombers due to their concern about harming innocent people, but I think everyone gets the point I'm trying to make here.

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This is my favourite bit :biggrin:

 

 

 

The Russian winter is a myth, as Stalingrad is so deep south in Russia, their winters were the same, if not slightly warmer than German winters.

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Well Angrypanda, have you read Adolf Galland's book the first and the last?

The most poinient chapters are at the end. He details how the young pilots were to inexperienced to last long enough to unlock the armor, weapons and markings they needed to stay on an even footing with the Americans and British and soviets. They were brave, but didn't have the time to rack up their XP. Such are the horrors of war.

These horrors are portrayed in this game.

Edited by forsale
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Russia Stronk 101!!!!

 

Can we keep him please?  This gotta be good.

 

 

Popcorn.gif

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Well Angrypanda, have you read Adolf Galland's book the first and the last?

The most poinient chapters are at the end. He details how the young pilots were to inexperienced to last long enough to unlock the armor, weapons and markings they needed to stay on an even footing with the Americans and British and soviets. They were brave, but didn't have the time to rack up their XP. Such are the horrors of war.

These horrors are portrayed in this game.

 

You forget that these horrible unlocks even lowered there performance of the planes when it came to fighting, poor pilots

 

(Not that I like the unlock system, but for the fighters it is really not that dramatic)

Edited by Saurer

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Its highly biased! No matter which side I fly.

Master

 

 

i'm willing to buy this quote as a signature! 

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What a dumb thread this turned into. Couple of funny lines in it at least.

 

"The most poinient chapters are at the end. He details how the young pilots were to inexperienced to last long enough to unlock the armor, weapons and markings they needed to stay on an even footing with the Americans and British and soviets. They were brave, but didn't have the time to rack up their XP. Such are the horrors of war.
These horrors are portrayed in this game."

 

 

"Its highly biased! No matter which side I fly."

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