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Hello, IL-2 team!

 

How much money do we have to throw your way to get a PTO game? I'm aching for some Carrier Vs. Carrier action! 

Let's also especulate a bit, what scenario could be done for an eventual Battle of PTO game? I think the Salomon Islands have seen plenty of action and would make for a great place. It'd have many islands so that it's not just water, there were both surface to surface and carrier action. And there're also some ground airfields (Henderson field for example, at Guadalcanal. But I think there're some more) for ground-based planes to use. It'd be quite an interesting map to fly in, and it could be expanded further to the sides to include more water surface and maybe have open-seas battles

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What kind of ship selection can we expect? just general class models or specific ships?

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I'm afraid it's not only a matter of money.

Available data is another point.

It is very difficult to get permission to take pictures in Japanese museums too.

Some systems are not in use for a long time anymore and nobody knows how the worked, let alone how everything looked like. 

language, Japanese is a very livid language and the Japanese they spoke in WWII differs reasonably with the one they speak today is also a problem.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

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2 minutes ago, FlyingShark said:

I'm afraid it's not only a matter of money.

Available data is another point.

It is very difficult to get permission to take pictures in Japanese museums too.

Some systems are not in use for a long time anymore and nobody knows how the worked, let alone how everything looked like. 

language, Japanese is a very livid language and the Japanese they spoke in WWII differs reasonably with the one they speak today is also a problem.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

There's people in a certain other sim that says you can find enough documentation if you look for it hard enough and know the language...

They plan on making the Zero, maybe that's the exception to the rule and finding stuff for other planes is more difficult. But in any case, throwing money at the problem tends to be a good way of making it go away.

 

10 minutes ago, tomver said:

f66fb705.thumb.jpg.8c1e593074a752aa46e9aeebde974682.jpgae544abc.thumb.jpg.c37b3d01d98409f4b49d942093db52a7.jpg

What kind of ship selection can we expect? just general class models or specific ships?

Well keeping in mind that some ships were vastly different from each other, even within the same class, having a "global" class for ships would be a bit difficult if you want to make it fully reallistic. 

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d6ad8932.thumb.jpg.056de9110f01c440baabd73fb46f2406.jpga504091b.thumb.jpg.b4facd4e82c087f3413fc32a7f61c113.jpg

About the ships:

As you can see the left image is the "Atago" in the "Takao" class. The right one is the "Maya" from the same class. Yet the "Maya" has one turret less. So would there just be 1 model for the "Takao" class or would there be a more specific model for the Maya since it has 1 turret less?

 

Edit:

The turrets are not the only difference but i used those as an illustration of the situation.

Edited by tomver

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Maybe for air battles that's not much of an issue? After all when you see a heavy cruiser and you're gonna dive bomb it, the differences between an Atago, a Furutaka and a Mogami are merely academical as all of them use the 25mm gun 😜

 

 

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23 minutes ago, [N.O.G.F]ResonantCard1 said:

There's people in a certain other sim that says you can find enough documentation if you look for it hard enough and know the language...

They plan on making the Zero, maybe that's the exception to the rule and finding stuff for other planes is more difficult.

Jason once said in an interview a few months ago that making a Zero isn't a problem.

But to simulate an all out Pacific war you need more than just the Zero (carrier ops, ground forces, dive bombers,...) and there lies the problem.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

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If a Zero or a Corsair was built as a collector plane it would fly off the virtual shelves. People would throw money at pre-orders like confetti at a wedding.

 

Unfortunately, some people insist! that these planes not be built and offered as collector planes because they feel it would represent an incomplete scenario and cause actual harm to the game and flightsim industry itself.

 

Because people buying planes and giving money to the developers... is bad. Go figure.:rolleyes:

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Maya is a different class from Takao.

 

Takao's sister ship is Atago.

 

Maya and Myoko classes were follow on ships that were built to address the stability problems suffered by the Takaos.

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41 minutes ago, CanadaOne said:

If a Zero or a Corsair was built as a collector plane it would fly off the virtual shelves. People would throw money at pre-orders like confetti at a wedding.

 

Unfortunately, some people insist! that these planes not be built and offered as collector planes because they feel it would represent an incomplete scenario and cause actual harm to the game and flightsim industry itself.

 

Because people buying planes and giving money to the developers... is bad. Go figure.:rolleyes:

 

 

None of us think it is a bad thing per-se, the developers have said time and again that the current model works for them the best, they should know.;)

 

I would love a Zero and all the other associated planes, ships and vehicles also but I would prefer not to just have a Zero as a single aircraft with nothing purposeful to do with it, that is for other sims/games, this series builds a complete theater of operations and the stuff required for it and I for one want the maps for the Far East operations as well even if it is possible to texture the existing ones as placeholders there is nothing quite like the immersion of actually being in a Zero or Corsair using a proper map of the Pacific or Far east.:drinks:

 

Bye the way, that is not to say I would not actually buy one of those single aircraft, just that I prefer it to be as part of a overall collection with all relevant material to allow the making of a career or campaign, sadly though money is limited for most of us and if push came to shove then what little money can be spared would most likely go to putting it towards the current system, the development team know this so have to choose carefully what they devote time to, there are other sim/games out there that do single aircraft exceptionally well, it works for them but could be a financial disaster for others, each will be better served not competing with each other but concentrating on their own speciality.

 

As for information, there are a lot of videos that have been made by Japanese film makers in recent times, their ships and aircraft look awesome and the stories are magnificent, where does their information come from? 

 

Maybe Jason and the gang could approach those people and see who actually makes those things for those films, it might just be that the necessary information is already out there if you look in the right place or to the right people, just a thought.

 

 

 

Take care and be safe.

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete.:biggrin:

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I agree with all of that, and well said. 

 

But there are some people who insist the planes not be made available to anyone unless their own criteria are met. I simply find it odd that "the guy next door" would get his panties in a twist because of the way I fly on my own PC.

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2 hours ago, FlyingShark said:

Jason once said in an interview a few months ago that making a Zero isn't a problem.

But to simulate an all out Pacific war you need more than just the Zero (carrier ops, ground forces, dive bombers,...) and there lies the problem.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:


Nah.  If they just kicked things off with a Zero and fictitious Pacific Islands map, similar to what the old Aces Expansion Pack did before Pacific Fighters was released; I’d be as happy as a clam. 🙂

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1 hour ago, CanadaOne said:

If a Zero or a Corsair was built as a collector plane it would fly off the virtual shelves. People would throw money at pre-orders like confetti at a wedding.

 

Unfortunately, some people insist! that these planes not be built and offered as collector planes because they feel it would represent an incomplete scenario and cause actual harm to the game and flightsim industry itself.

 

Because people buying planes and giving money to the developers... is bad. Go figure.:rolleyes:

 

I honestly have no idea what 1C's marketing data and ROI studies look like.  However, we do know that the product is marketed as Great Battles, not Great Individual Airplanes.  A battle consists of a map and a set of planes.  The planes go with the map and with each other. Even collector planes can be used on existing maps and within the existing plane set.  That is how they are building the product.

 

At some point in the future will they simply start pumping out unconnected collector planes?  Maybe.  But that is a serious divergence from their product line and the expectations of many of their customers.  Maybe you are right and people would throw money at them, but you might also not be right enough.  There has to be enough money thrown at them to feed the whole organization, and individual planes without a home may not be a good answer.  Again, no clue what their marketing data suggests in that regard.

 

For myself, I would probably buy a Corsair, but I would also probably wait for it to go on sale.  Without a proper home it is less appealing to me.  It would be a QMB thing and that's it.  That is not demand or insist, it is just a reflection of what I want from the game.  

 

Last note: I guarantee you that if 1C thought a Corsair would make enough to fund the team for a year we would have a Corsair in short order :) . People buying planes and giving them money is, of course, a good thing.  Not enough people buying a plane for perfectly logical reasons (what am I going to do with a Corsair?)  is not.

 

10 minutes ago, Feathered_IV said:


Nah.  If they just kicked things off with a Zero and fictitious Pacific Islands map, similar to what the old Aces Expansion Pack did before Pacific Fighters was released; I’d be as happy as a clam. 🙂

 

A Zero and another plane (Corsair?) played on an existing map might make a certain MP segment happy.  Might make some SP players happy enough to buy it too, even if they are limited to QMB.  Question is, is that enough to justify investment?  

 

Other than that ... see long post above :) 

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Funny ironic joke.  
This game are so realistic that we cannot have PTO planes in it???

In my opinion we can have flying flame-throwing dragons. It will still be up to server owners to decide what to use. 
And up to SP players to use. 
It simply do not hold water. I agree Zero and Corsairs would bring money throw in a Hellcat,  Dauntless kate and Val some Oscars and you will have new customers. We need only bok to fly in

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The game in it's current state suffocates when running 70 to 80 players and a few AA guns on the map. Unless a major optimisation update comes out there's no way it can succesfully replicate two task forces duking it out with 100 odd guns on each capital ship and wings of 60 to 200+ aircraft engaging in battle. 

 

One can hope though. 

Edited by ACG_Onebad
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With all due respect, I think the language is not a problem at all, and Japanese is not Maya or Ancient Greek. Japanese documents with a history of more than 600 years have also been correctly interpreted by modern people. However, it will not be a simple matter to translate and organize these large amounts of information.
@Jason_Williams If you need translation help, please don't forget me.

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5 minutes ago, ACG_Onebad said:

The game in it's current state suffocates when running 70 to 80 players and a few AA guns on the map. Unless a major optimisation update comes out there's no way it can succesfully replicate two task forces duking it out with 100 odd guns on each capital ship and wings of 60 to 200+ aircraft engaging in battle. 

 

One can hope though. 

We talk about only some planes

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Just now, 216th_LuseKofte said:

We talk about only some planes

 

Well, not according to the OP.

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7 minutes ago, Oyster_KAI said:

With all due respect, I think the language is not a problem at all, and Japanese is not Maya or Ancient Greek. Japanese documents with a history of more than 600 years have also been correctly interpreted by modern people. However, it will not be a simple matter to translate and organize these large amounts of information.

 

The issue is that a lot of Japanese war-time technical documentation was intentionally destroyed and there are no copies to translate, and a lot of it that wasn't destroyed is locked up in archives that aren't very cooperative with simulation companies. Been the same story since 2006

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Much of the documentation is written in something called Technical Japanese.  It is a written language unto itself and one that few contemporary Japanese are able to read.  

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16 minutes ago, 216th_LuseKofte said:

Funny ironic joke.  
This game are so realistic that we cannot have PTO planes in it???

In my opinion we can have flying flame-throwing dragons. It will still be up to server owners to decide what to use. 
And up to SP players to use. 
It simply do not hold water. I agree Zero and Corsairs would bring money throw in a Hellcat,  Dauntless kate and Val some Oscars and you will have new customers. We need only bok to fly in

 

There is a certain irony, but also a lot of simple truth.  Would you accept a plane set that flew like Aces Over The Pacific?  See posts above on the difficulty of getting proper documentation.  Now throw in past history on these message boards. Any perceived flaw brings a torrent of criticism.  If you were the game developer, wouldn't you feel a bit like you were being set up to fail?

 

1C is in a bit of a bind with regards to the PTO.  I know Jason would like to make it.  He is probably getting feedback from the team that they cannot make the planes to the level of quality that they (and we) are used to.  So what to do?  Make something that you know does not meet standards or shelve it until you can meet standards?

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40 minutes ago, Feathered_IV said:

If they just kicked things off with a Zero and fictitious Pacific Islands map, similar to what the old Aces Expansion Pack did before Pacific Fighters was released; I’d be as happy as a clam. 🙂

I'd be as happy with that as you are.

But there's also the rest of the community who would want way more and start complaining about fictitious islands.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

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I'm happy to wait so its correct when we do finally get it

And i've still not flown many of the lastest released aircraft

I'm just not got the time

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28 minutes ago, FlyingShark said:

 

But there's also the rest of the community who would want way more and start complaining about fictitious islands.

 

 

Well, we could always tell them to look at the existing maps we use and point out which of them is 100% accurate... and if they think they are they should bugger off back to that alternative universe they seem to be living in...

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35 minutes ago, Trooper117 said:

Well, we could always tell them to look at the existing maps we use and point out which of them is 100% accurate... and if they think they are they should bugger off back to that alternative universe they seem to be living in...

Good idea.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

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Map making is the bottleneck. I would surely hope that if we got a PTO only plane that the devs wouldn't waste time on some BS map and instead just let up fly it on the maps we have already and spend the saved time on giving us more planes.

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