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Developer Diary 265 - Discussion


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11 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

One nice thing about Great Battles is that to make a second install all you have to do is copy everything to a new directory.  I have my modded version but if I ever try MP I will just make a copy without mods to get access to servers.  

 

12 hours ago, cardboard_killer said:

Personally, I don't mod anything. That way leads to 1946 insane complexity.

 

Or simply select 'No' for'Enable Mods' in the game's settings for playing online.

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17 hours ago, ADorante said:

I imagine people from this and other sim-related forums traveling back in time not to do the obvious but trying to convince German aircraft designers to build other types but 109s.

 

No need to travel back in time for that one!

The Luftwaffe evaluated the Italian Series 5 fighters with a view to manufacturing them, especially the Fiat G.55, in Germany... see below from Wiki:

 

In December 1942, a technical commission of the Regia Aeronautica was invited by the Luftwaffe to test some German aircraft in Rechlin. The visit was part of a joint plan for the standardization of the Axis aircraft production. In the same time, some Luftwaffe officers visited Guidonia where they were particularly interested in the performance promised by the Serie 5 fighters. On 9 December, these impressions were discussed in a Luftwaffe staff meeting and raised the interest of Hermann Göring himself. In February 1943, a German test commission was sent in Italy to evaluate the new Italian fighters.[19] The commission was led by Oberst Petersen and was formed by Luftwaffe officers and pilots and by technical personnel, among them the Flugbaumeister Malz. The Germans also brought with them several aircraft including a Fw 190 A-5 and a Bf 109 G-4 for direct comparison tests in simulated dogfights.

The tests began 20 February 1943 with the German commission very impressed by the Italian aircraft, the G.55 in particular. In general, all the Serie 5 fighters were very good at low altitudes, but the G.55 was also competitive with its German opponents in term of speed and climb rate at high altitudes, while still maintaining superior handling characteristics. The definitive evaluation by the German commission was "excellent" for the G.55, "excellent" for the Re.2005 although very complicated to produce, and merely "average" for the C.205. Oberst Petersen defined the G.55 "the best fighter in the Axis" and immediately telegraphed his impressions to Göring. After listening to the recommendations of Petersen, Milch and Galland, a meeting held by Göring on 22 February 1943 voted to produce the G.55 in Germany.

German interest, apart from the good test results, derived also from the development possibilities they were able to see in the G.55 and in the Re.2005. Particularly, the G.55 was bigger and heavier and was considered a very good candidate for the new, significantly larger and more powerful DB 603 engine, which was considered too large to fit in the Bf 109's airframe. Other visits were organized in Germany during March and May 1943 in Rechlin and Berlin. The G.55 was again tested at Rechlin at the presence of Milch. Gabrielli and other FIAT personnel were invited to visit German factories and to discuss the evolution of the aircraft. The specifications of the German G55/II included the DB 603 engine, five 20 mm guns and a pressurized cockpit. The suggestion of weapons in the wings, limited to one 20 mm gun for each wing, originated the final configuration of the Serie I, while the DB 603 engine was successfully installed in what became the G.56 prototype. As a concrete expression of the German interest in the G.55, the Luftwaffe acquired three complete G.55/0 airframes (MM 91064-65-66) for evaluations and experiments providing three DB 603 engines and original machinery for the setup of other production line of the Italian copy of DB 605. Two of the Luftwaffe G.55's remained in Turin, at the Aeritalia plants, where they were used by German and Italian engineers to study the planned modifications and the possible optimizations to the production process. Later these two were converted to Serie I and delivered to the ANR. The third one was transferred to Rechlin for tests and experiments in Germany. The DB 603 engines were used to build the G.56 prototypes.

The interest in the G.55 program was still high after the Armistice. In October 1943, Kurt Tank, who previously personally tested a G.55 in Rechlin, and who had had nothing but praise for the aircraft, was in Turin to discuss G.55 production. However, events in the war and the not yet optimized production process were the reasons for which the G.55 program was eventually abandoned by the Luftwaffe. Early production of G.55 required about 15,000 man-hours; while there were estimates to reduce the effort to about 9,000 man-hours, the well-practiced German factories were able to assemble a Bf 109 in only 5,000 man-hours. The DB 603 were instead to be used in Tank's own Ta-152C.

 

Also, Series 5 fighters reportedly fought over the crumbling ruins of Berlin!

 

Sorry for posting off topic, but I couldn't help myself!

 

FIAT G.55 Centauro for IL-2 Great Battles!

 

 

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Whenever I'd hear people talking about and getting upset of the idea of getting a nearly identical 109 to ones we already have, with basically no new developments made, I'd tell them that maybe they will offer every possible option and modification that was available for the Bf109 G-6, kinda like they did with the Fw190 A-8 or the Hurricane, like even nitrous oxide injection (if that was used on G-6), to make it worth it for someone who already owns the rest of the game.  I really hope that this might be partially true.


Is there any benefit whatsoever for those who have already purchased the stand alone premium plane, Bf109 G6?  and once I own both, will there be any benefit to owning the collector's G6?

 

 

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3 minutes ago, SCG_FeuerFliegen said:

Whenever I'd hear people talking about and getting upset of the idea of getting a nearly identical 109 to ones we already have, with basically no new developments made, I'd tell them that maybe they will offer every possible option and modification that was available for the Bf109 G-6, kinda like they did with the Fw190 A-8 or the Hurricane, like even nitrous oxide injection (if that was used on G-6), to make it worth it for someone who already owns the rest of the game.  I really hope that this might be partially true.


Is there any benefit whatsoever for those who have already purchased the stand alone premium plane, Bf109 G6?  and once I own both, will there be any benefit to owning the collector's G6?

 

 

Looks like Nope. If on the future they are not goind to add the As the new G6late is the same as the collector G6 or at best with all the mods like the G14. 

Are devs going to give back the money to the ones who buyed the collector G6? 

Edited by E69_geramos109
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42 minutes ago, SCG_FeuerFliegen said:

Whenever I'd hear people talking about and getting upset of the idea of getting a nearly identical 109 to ones we already have, with basically no new developments made, I'd tell them that maybe they will offer every possible option and modification that was available for the Bf109 G-6, kinda like they did with the Fw190 A-8 or the Hurricane, like even nitrous oxide injection (if that was used on G-6), to make it worth it for someone who already owns the rest of the game.  I really hope that this might be partially true.


Is there any benefit whatsoever for those who have already purchased the stand alone premium plane, Bf109 G6?  and once I own both, will there be any benefit to owning the collector's G6?

 

G-6 early: heavy canopy frame, short tail unit

G-6 late: option for MW 50 (as seen in the screenshots), optional Erla canopy (again, as seen in screenshots), tall tail unit

 

Both types were in service well into 1944.

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Not really, but it would be cool to not be able to see "Aha, short tail means no MW50" as an allied pilot. That's a bit gamey in my opinion
also, the short tail and old canopy are more beautiful

Edited by Johnno
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I really don't understand what is so funny about having another model of Bf-109 series ?

 

The fact of life is that Bf-109 series represented Luftwaffe fighter force from 1939 - 1945... assisted by FW-190 in the "second half" of the game.

It represented Luftwaffe in Early wars, Scandinavia, Channel & Atlantic coast, North Africa, Italy, Eastern front in 3 directions, Reich defense...

 

Luftwaffe was Bf-109 series and Bf-109 series was Luftwaffe...  

 

Germany did not have the whole "zoo garden" - of birds of prey : Hurricane, Spitfire, Mig, Polikarpov, Yak, La, F4F,  P-38, P-39, P-40, P-47, P-51, Tempest, Typhoon...

 

If  G6 Late does not fit in French sky and 3 Eastern skies, I don't know what plane does ???

 

Did you expect F-16 Falcon or Su-27 Flanker ? ...or developers should invent an alternative version of history ?

 

My genuine support to devs team for implementing G6-Late - as important part of realism and history...

 

 

Edited by esk_pedja
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By far, this is the best simulator I have ever played, and I do own DCS. Thank you for the great work, and the timely notifications. I like how you really seem to care about us, the customers. Well done all around! Now if you will excuse me, I have a date with destiny going toe to toe with a German/Russian/American aircraft and/or tank.

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12 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

G-6 early: heavy canopy frame, short tail unit

G-6 late: option for MW 50 (as seen in the screenshots), optional Erla canopy (again, as seen in screenshots), tall tail unit

 

Both types were in service well into 1944.

So if you dont put the mods on the G6 late you have the G6 early collector. That means they sold the same plane twice

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13 minutes ago, E69_geramos109 said:

So if you dont put the mods on the G6 late you have the G6 early collector. That means they sold the same plane twice

No since you still have the improved/later tail. :)

And this is still better than the "big" differences between the F2/F4 or G2/G4, so no need to grumble around that the dev's are selling the "same" plane twice when those are obviously no problem for you^^. Besides the point that we don't know the full/final loudout options for the G6 "Late" and even when the AS/ASM variant is not included (as you mentioned in your former posts) it's still a good mix. I agree on the point that the "early" G6 looks kind of usesless now, but even here I would wait to see how it will turn out with her older sister around.

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27 minutes ago, E69_geramos109 said:

So if you dont put the mods on the G6 late you have the G6 early collector. That means they sold the same plane twice

 

Although they are close, they are not the same. With the tail section being the most noticable visual difference.

 

In a historical context they are also not similar: When flying a Luftwaffe campaign at Kuban, the early G-6 will be available in the later phase of the battle. The late G-6 most likely won't, since it wasn't around at the time.

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With these two Bf 109G-6s, early and late models, don’t whe need two Spitfires Mk IX, the late model we already have and the early model, with the rounded tail unit of the Mk V ?

Edited by Pierre64
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18 minutes ago, 6FG_Big_Al said:

I agree on the point that the "early" G6 looks kind of usesless now, but even here I would wait to see how it will turn out with her older sister around.

 

I'd say the "early" is good for 1943 scenarios - no matter if WF or EF. It's still a useable airplane.

 

4 minutes ago, Pierre64 said:

With these two Bf 109G-6s, early and late models, don’t whe need two Spitfires Mk IX, the late model we already have and the early model, with the rounded tail unit of the Mk V ?

 

I'd love to see an early Spit IX!

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I don't mind paying for the same a/c twice. I'd prefer to do that then to have modules not produced for fear of having to sell the same plane twice. If the only thing keeping them from producing a Kursk module is that they'd have to package it with a G-6 in order to fill out the German OOB for new players, I'd shell out the bucks and bless them that I had a map and more Soviet bombers.

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On 11/14/2020 at 1:53 PM, ww2fighter20 said:

The 9th version of the Bf109 and people are still demanding more bf109's, and then to think the allies (British/American) don't even have an flyable bomber and have to do with an soviet modified A20B.

 

Pretty much...

For the sake of completeness I don't particularly mind, more so especially since it has been over a year (and then some, I think!) since the Axis received any kind of release. However, it is somewhat tiresome to see yet another 109 varient creep in to the game when so much more could be done. Maybe one day we'll see the B-26 and B-25 made flyable, or basically any twin-engined aircraft! I'm quite tired of the single-seat machines, and would rather see some light/medium bombers appear.

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1 hour ago, Pierre64 said:

With these two Bf 109G-6s, early and late models, don’t whe need two Spitfires Mk IX, the late model we already have and the early model, with the rounded tail unit of the Mk V ?

The spitfire Mk IX with the M61 and  M63 engine would be a really nice adition in to the game. 

The thing is that there were no such a plane called G6 late. The G6 was the name of the plane and the rest was improvements and modifications that were coming and that were mixed. That is why they named the G14 trying to standarice all the mods. 

So to include the new G6 late mods that could be done with our current G6. New tail and new cockpit are minimum 3D changes and the Mw50 mod and AS mod would be the engine mod options. 

 

I can undestand they want to shell the G6AS as separate plane with all the modifications on that. This way we have a different plane on the family also fitting on the map but We did not need another G6 that if you put all mods is a G14. 

Is like if you sell twice the spit with cliped wings as the only diffence and even that would be a bigger difference than the new G6 late with the G6 early and the G14

Edited by E69_geramos109
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I'm happy about every additional plane in this sim for the fact it shows this project goes on to the future.

 

For the historical correctnes, a late version of the G6 is a pretty good thing an i don't really care about the fact that there are so much other versions allready.

 

And as the devs told, this plane comes now beacuse of the pre-work they had done with previous versions of this airframe and we'll get other palnes when they are completed so I can't see any problem with it.

 

Maybe we should mention that we all are talking about a game that is still in devellopment and not released.....and we'll get more two engined planes as well (Mosquito/Me 410/Ar 234)😉

 

Long talk short... thanks to the devs for the whole work and I'm exited what ist to come in the next year👍

 

 

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6 minutes ago, easterling77 said:

I'm happy about every additional plane in this sim for the fact it shows this project goes on to the future.

 

For the historical correctnes, a late version of the G6 is a pretty good thing an i don't really care about the fact that there are so much other versions allready.

 

And as the devs told, this plane comes now beacuse of the pre-work they had done with previous versions of this airframe and we'll get other palnes when they are completed so I can't see any problem with it.

 

Maybe we should mention that we all are talking about a game that is still in devellopment and not released.....and we'll get more two engined planes as well (Mosquito/Me 410/Ar 234)😉

 

Long talk short... thanks to the devs for the whole work and I'm exited what ist to come in the next year👍

I completely agree.

 

Have a nice day.

 

:salute:

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5 hours ago, E69_geramos109 said:

So if you dont put the mods on the G6 late you have the G6 early collector. That means they sold the same plane twice

 

Aircraft that require my team to spend considerable time and effort to give you said plane is not the same plane as an earlier one. It's like you going to work, whatever it is you do and doing a "similar" task day in and day out, but your bosses say they are the same, so you should only be paid for one day, regardless of how long you have been there. I don't think you'd like that very much. Take a hike. You like to stir up trouble and all you do is complain here and on FB. We tire of your nonsense.

 

Jason

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22 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

 

Aircraft that require my team to spend considerable time and effort to give you said plane is not the same plane as an earlier one. It's like you going to work, whatever it is you do and doing a "similar" task day in and day out, but your bosses say they are the same, so you should only be paid for one day, regardless of how long you have been there. I don't think you'd like that very much. Take a hike. You like to stir up trouble and all you do is complain here and on FB. We tire of your nonsense.

 

Jason

Hear hear! Thank you for acknowledging this. I wish we could go back and time and ignore his tears and gnashing of teeth about 3dMigoto :)

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