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Developer Diary 264 - Discussion


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I do agree

And it is possible that "old" C47, le without this device, were probably retrofitted 

All picture I get about D Days C47 showed this device...

 

For example, french C47 in use after WW2 had this device too... 😋

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On 10/28/2020 at 3:28 AM, Cleo9 said:

 

Modified Soviet Hurricane... With a rear gunner station !!

 

 

modified.jpg

Very interesting picture. The Hurricane was a fighter. Maybe not of the level of a Spitfire, but during the battle of England it was able to stand with some success against the Messerschmitts. This is testament that it was a real fighter. When I see this picture, I find it in a first impression as  "absurd".

First this brings additional weight which will handicap the plane in its maneuvering and speed capability. 

Second I cannot imagine the gunner behind , being jostled around, and apart from spraying bullets all over the place, to do any real harm or have any precise shooting capability in the midst of a fighter action.

So the question here is why and for what mission.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

It was used as an artillery spotter.   The VVS never considered the Hurricane adequate in the fighter role.

Why not? At the beginning of the Eastern front War they didnt have good planes, every plane counted, no?

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On 10/25/2020 at 12:17 PM, mattebubben said:

So while sure they could add a Finnish skin to simulate the captured hurricane.

 

If only there was a way for server admins to define skin locking so that you can define which default skins are available and then allow custom skins too. Alas, that isn't the case currently.

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49 minutes ago, Zeev said:

 

48 minutes ago, Zeev said:

Why not? At the beginning of the Eastern front War they didnt have good planes, every plane counted, no?

Of course they took every plane they could get their hands on, but, that does not change the fact that they found the Hurricane to be lackluster in it's role as a fighter.

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15 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Of course they took every plane they could get their hands on, but, that does not change the fact that they found the Hurricane to be lackluster in it's role as a fighter.

Was it even worse than i-16? (I love i-16 but in real I understand it was horrible).

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It is probable that most of the Hurricane  aircraft that the soviets received were very tired and had been used heavily previously. Quality of fuel may have also been an issue. Added to the Soviet doctrine of kicking the tires, lighting the the fires and away you go, one would assume that running them into the ground wouldn't take very long at all. Many Soviet pilots didn't think much of  Spitfires either, whilst the RAF seemed to get on with them just fine.

 

The Spitfire always gets the glory but the real workhorse during the Battle of Britain was the Hurricane.

 

This is one old girl that I have waited years for. Not the best looking or particularly a high performance aircraft but historically very important one. 

 

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30 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

The Spitfire always gets the glory but the real workhorse during the Battle of Britain was the Hurricane.

 

I could make a good argument that it was the Hurricane that won the war. I'm not saying I'd be right, but it would be a good argument... 😉

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24 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

It is probable that most of the Hurricane  aircraft that the soviets received were very tired and had been used heavily previously. Quality of fuel may have also been an issue. Added to the Soviet doctrine of kicking the tires, lighting the the fires and away you go, one would assume that running them into the ground wouldn't take very long at all. Many Soviet pilots didn't think much of  Spitfires either, whilst the RAF seemed to get on with them just fine.

 

The Spitfire always gets the glory but the real workhorse during the Battle of Britain was the Hurricane.

 

This is one old girl that I have waited years for. Not the best looking or particularly a high performance aircraft but historically very important one. 

 

 

Good points, from what I've read they also lacked spares (at least with the Spitfire), so the chance of a technical issue would have been much higher compared to RAF use.

 

And importantly, a better gun platform... and that's often an under appreciated part of a fighter's ability to do the actual job.

 

Until the DM changes came about, it was hard to distinguish this in-game.

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The Russians received the Hurricane at a time when they were very, very short of fighter aircraft. 

During Lend Lease the British government supplied them with over 3,000 Hurricanes, which were specifically asked for by the Soviets by the way.

These aircraft stayed in the frontline until late 1943.

They may have been deemed obsolete by the time the Russians received them, but more than a dozen Soviet pilots became aces flying them. (How strange if they were that bad).

After WWII we very rapidly moved into a 'Cold War' and I suspect that the Russian government did not want to give much credence to the western allies for all the help given to them when they were desperately short of everything after Barbarossa...

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Quote

when we complete another stage of the Career mode improvements

This again makes me wonder why we cannot get the Career mode in offline. Size cannot be a problem anymore as the whole directory already is >40 GB so a few GB more won't be a problem.

And it would be a great extension for all that do not/cannot hold a line open all the time. There are still places where the internet connection isn't stable to say the least.

 

So, please devs, make the Career mode a part of the regular (offline) updates.

 

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3 hours ago, Trooper117 said:

They may have been deemed obsolete by the time the Russians received them, but more than a dozen Soviet pilots became aces flying them. (How strange if they were that bad

The P-39 was also considered by many pilots to be an inferior plane and had it's foibles but again there were several Russians who were very successful flying it.

It follows an old axiom in music, "it's the player not the instrument".  You can own Jimi Hendrix's guitar but that doesn't make you as good as Jimi Hendrix.  He could make a POS sound like the best guitar in the world.

It has been my experience that the more I fly to the planes strengths, the more successful I am.  And my experience with the Hurricane in IL-2 '46 was get in close and shred your enemy.

Personally I'm looking forward to the Hurricane and the fact that there will be several variants is really exciting to me.

 

I'll leave my 2 kopecks here.

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7 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Of course they took every plane they could get their hands on, but, that does not change the fact that they found the Hurricane to be lackluster in it's role as a fighter.

 

One Soviet pilot said the Hurricane was great if one wanted to tour the countryside, but that of course they didn't have that luxury. 😄 

5 hours ago, AndyJWest said:

Yup. Given a choice, I'm sure the Soviets might have preferred something else, but given the situation in the early days of the war on the eastern front, tired Hurricanes were better than nothing.

 

Were most of the planes delivered used or new? It seems that with more than 3000 delivered, a substantial portion of them would have been new planes.

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37 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

One Soviet pilot said the Hurricane was great if one wanted to tour the countryside, but that of course they didn't have that luxury. 😄 

 

Were most of the planes delivered used or new? It seems that with more than 3000 delivered, a substantial portion of them would have been new planes.

 

Yeah, I was probably thinking of the Spitfires delivered to the Soviets - which certainly included a lot of well-used ones. The Hurricanes were mostly new it would appear, and available because the capacity remained to manufacture them while Hawker's tooled up for later aircraft.

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Curious, here - has IL2 BoX ever converted an AI-only aircraft to player flown?  I know that most/all would love to fly the C-47 and see the B-25 make it to the player-flown venue.  I also know that Jason has indicated that it ain't near as easy as we think.  I believe that the B-25 issue revolves around the number of gunner stations their interior modeling and server load for the AI?  Not sure though why the C47 will remain AI only - the JU-52 is actually kind of fun sometimes, esp. in TAW.  Anyway, just curious if there's any history here or if it would be a new thing.  

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42 minutes ago, ACG_PanzerV said:

Curious, here - has IL2 BoX ever converted an AI-only aircraft to player flown?  I know that most/all would love to fly the C-47 and see the B-25 make it to the player-flown venue.  I also know that Jason has indicated that it ain't near as easy as we think.  I believe that the B-25 issue revolves around the number of gunner stations their interior modeling and server load for the AI?  Not sure though why the C47 will remain AI only - the JU-52 is actually kind of fun sometimes, esp. in TAW.  Anyway, just curious if there's any history here or if it would be a new thing.  

 

Yes, the Ju 52 was originally AI-only.

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On 10/28/2020 at 3:28 AM, Cleo9 said:

 

Modified Soviet Hurricane... With a rear gunner station !!

 

 

Isn´t that the seat for the NKVD Flight-Officer? You know the guy who points his Makarow at the pilot to assure maximum pilot motivation for ermm... "slightly challenging" missions?

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On 10/30/2020 at 4:23 AM, Zeev said:

Why not? At the beginning of the Eastern front War they didnt have good planes, every plane counted, no?

 

They got used equipment flown by teenagers. The engines were worn as well as the airplanes. The British when they could finally spare aircraft didn't send factory fresh. Similar reasons for not liking the SpitV's. They were already beat up before they got shipped.

Edited by ACG_Smokejumper
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1 hour ago, ACG_Smokejumper said:

 

They got used equipment flown by teenagers. The engines were worn as well as the airplanes. The British when they could finally spare aircraft didn't send factory fresh. Similar reasons for not liking the SpitV's. They were already beat up before they got shipped.

 

No, a good number of the Hurricanes they sent over were new planes.

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2 hours ago, ACG_Smokejumper said:

So not the same as Spits? New Hurris and older Spit V's?

 

Thanks for the heads up on that!

 

Yes, that's right. I've seen one source that says all the Spitfire Vs were veterans of North Africa. 

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9 hours ago, ACG_Smokejumper said:

 

They got used equipment flown by teenagers. The engines were worn as well as the airplanes. The British when they could finally spare aircraft didn't send factory fresh. Similar reasons for not liking the SpitV's. They were already beat up before they got shipped.

Good to know. Thanks for the information

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  • 2 weeks later...

correct, and these spitfires were sent via Iran to the Caucasus regions. 

As for the Hurricanes, the majority were shipped via arctic convoy or actually flying them over, while there were some new ones made from factory spare parts of the mkla and mklla specifically for the russians as the british had ceased production, the majority were veterans of the battle of britain and the later stages of the blitz (1941) many having close to 4000 hours on their frames and having bullet patches on the fuselauge. 

This along with Merlins not liking Russian fuels caused the soviets a lot of headaches. lack of ammo did too hence most were converted to soviet armaments. 

i actually helped work on the Hurricane 'K' (P3351) restored in NZ in 2000 which was a lend lease recovery from near St Petersburg. it had originally started service with the RAF during the Battle of France!! 

low-res-hurricane.jpg

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