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Reverb G2 or Quest-2, which one to pick for IL-2 VR?


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chiliwili69

I have seen a number of folks here which would want to buy a new VR device, either upgrading their device or being new in VR. For sure, everyone is free to choose whatever they want but I would like to point out some aspects than should be taken into account whn taking a decission. These are some of them:

 

- PC-games are much much better than standalone games (just compare IL-2 with Ultrawings or VTOL), so most of the games you will like to play will be connected to PC. So you will be using a USB cable with compression-decompression algorithms and the quality of the image and latency will be always below PC tethered devices like Reverb G2 or Pimax8KX or any future device with similar resolution to Quest-2. (I had an Quest-1 and I didn´t even tried to test the link cable, having and Index why should want to use Quest-1 with link).

 

- Standalone devices like Quest or Quest-2 will be always a bit less confortable and with more momentum inertia than the PC thetered devices since they need to be equiped with a battery which contributes to increase the weight in the front side. This was reported by TESTED and other reviews I have seen. From my experience, the Rift-S or G1 for example is much confortable than the Quest. In the Quest-2 the Elite strap is a must have, but even with that, reviews report that it is not well balanced and overall less confortable than other devices like Rift/Rift-S/REverb G1 or G2.

 

- The G2 uses a 2 panel design with better IPD adjustment than Quest-2, which it based in one single panel and 3 IPD position (your IPD could be in your range but not exactly in matching your IPD). It is important to fit well your IPD to have no distortions, eye fatigue or chromatic aberrations. Perhaps you will be lucky that your IPD matches the 3 IPD settings, so check this before.

 

- In IL-2 and all other seated games (flight sims, space sims, race sims) the cable is not an issue (IHMO). The app VirtualDesktop can stream VR games through wifi to Quest-2, but at the cost of compressing the image and adding latency (and after 2 hours your battery is empty). So, I see no reason to not use a cable for a seated games.

 

- Resolution: 2160x2160 (G2) vs 1832x1920 (Quest-2), so G2 has 30% more pixels, but the important thing here is not just the number but the DisplayPort connection which is not using a compressed image

 

- The G2 run at 90Hz and the Quest-2 run at 72Hz and in future 90Hz(beta) but it would be at the cost of compressing more the image since the USB Link cable has the same limited bandwith not comparable with a DP cable.

 

- The audio (which is very important for inmersion) in the Quest-2 cannot be compared  to the audio of the G2 (same than Index). With the Quest-2 you will need extra headphones to be at the same level.

 

- With the Quest-2 you need a Facebook account (with your real name) and accept all their terms. Note that Quest-2/Rift-S is not sold currently in Germany due to privacy concerns with their terms.

Don´t be tempted by the price 450$ (300+49 Elite-strap+ 99 Link)+ your data.

 

- According to Tyriel videos there is some ghosting in the Quest-2 for fast moving objects. Look here.

Quest2.png.e95b7c57fd460386c793cf7b67f9ca3d.png.6a448db191ee29035ac56a548ce13379.png

 

Apart for all these reasons, if you buy an Facebook VR device you will be contributing to a company which has done the following:

- The initial relation of IL-2 team (Jason) with Oculus was just not continued after Facebook acquisition.

- Oculus initial target was to create a VR experience as good as possible (PC) with state-of-the-art devices. (More FOV, more resolution, better confort). Facebook destroyed that.

- Facebook burnt all their original founders (none of them is now in Facebook, even Carmarck). The obssesed Mark perverted the use of VR for just social media and the like.

- They totally neglect the PC gaming by cutting the PC VR line (Rift-S is discountinued in Feb-2021 with no succesor)

- They promote exclusive tittles only officially supported by their devices. This is not good for game developers or open standards.

- Having the larger budget for VR R&D they could produce a awesome high-end PC VR device (Where is half-dome??). But they neglect those flight/space/race freaks.

 

Well,  that is my view as a DK1/DK2 backer. You might think it is a bit biassed. Perhaps it is true. But it is what Facebook has basically done. Not as good as it was promised.

I hope it would help some of you.

 

Edited by chiliwili69
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messsucher

Good writing, I don't think it was biased. Facebook have different interests with VR than what I have, hence their product is bad for me.

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TWC_Sp00k
3 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- "...They promote exclusive tittles ...."    Surely this is a positive?

 

3 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

 

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6 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

I have seen a number of folks here which would want to buy a new VR device, either upgrading their device or being new in VR. For sure, everyone is free to choose whatever they want but I would like to point out some aspects than should be taken into account whn taking a decission. These are some of them:

 

- PC-games are much much better than standalone games (just compare IL-2 with Ultrawings or VTOL), so most of the games you will like to play will be connected to PC. So you will be using a USB cable with compression-decompression algorithms and the quality of the image and latency will be always below PC tethered devices like Reverb G2 or Pimax8KX or any future device with similar resolution to Quest-2. (I had an Quest-1 and I didn´t even tried to test the link cable, having and Index why should want to use Quest-1 with link).

 

- Standalone devices like Quest or Quest-2 will be always a bit less confortable and with more momentum inertia than the PC thetered devices since they need to be equiped with a battery which contributes to increase the weight in the front side. This was reported by TESTED and other reviews I have seen. From my experience, the Rift-S or G1 for example is much confortable than the Quest. In the Quest-2 the Elite strap is a must have, but even with that, reviews report that it is not well balanced and overall less confortable than other devices like Rift/Rift-S/REverb G1 or G2.

 

- The G2 uses a 2 panel design with better IPD adjustment than Quest-2, which it based in one single panel and 3 IPD position (your IPD could be in your range but not exactly in matching your IPD). It is important to fit well your IPD to have no distortions, eye fatigue or chromatic aberrations. Perhaps you will be lucky that your IPD matches the 3 IPD settings, so check this before.

 

- In IL-2 and all other seated games (flight sims, space sims, race sims) the cable is not an issue (IHMO). The app VirtualDesktop can stream VR games through wifi to Quest-2, but at the cost of compressing the image and adding latency (and after 2 hours your battery is empty). So, I see no reason to not use a cable for a seated games.

 

- Resolution: 2160x2160 (G2) vs 1832x1920 (Quest-2), so G2 has 30% more pixels, but the important thing here is not just the number but the DisplayPort connection which is not using a compressed image

 

- The G2 run at 90Hz and the Quest-2 run at 72Hz and in future 90Hz(beta) but it would be at the cost of compressing more the image since the USB Link cable has the same limited bandwith not comparable with a DP cable.

 

- The audio (which is very important for inmersion) in the Quest-2 cannot be compared  to the audio of the G2 (same than Index). With the Quest-2 you will need extra headphones to be at the same level.

 

- With the Quest-2 you need a Facebook account (with your real name) and accept all their terms. Note that Quest-2/Rift-S is not sold currently in Germany due to privacy concerns with their terms.

Don´t be tempted by the price 450$ (300+49 Elite-strap+ 99 Link)+ your data.

 

- According to Tyriel videos there is some ghosting in the Quest-2 for fast moving objects. Look here.

 

 

Apart for all these reasons, if you buy an Facebook VR device you will be contributing to a company which has done the following:

- The initial relation of IL-2 team (Jason) with Oculus was just not continued after Facebook acquisition.

- Oculus initial target was to create a VR experience as good as possible (PC) with state-of-the-art devices. (More FOV, more resolution, better confort). Facebook destroyed that.

- Facebook burnt all their original founders (none of them is now in Facebook, even Carmarck). The obssesed Mark perverted the use of VR for just social media and the like.

- They totally neglect the PC gaming by cutting the PC VR line (Rift-S is discountinued in Feb-2021 with no succesor)

- They promote exclusive tittles only officially supported by their devices. This is not good for game developers or open standards.

- Having the larger budget for VR R&D they could produce a awesome high-end PC VR device (Where is half-dome??). But they neglect those flight/space/race freaks.

 

Well,  that is my view as a DK1/DK2 backer. You might think it is a bit biassed. Perhaps it is true. But it is what Facebook has basically done. Not as good as it was promised.

I hope it would help some of you.

 

 

Carmack is still with Oculus as the CTO.

Granted he has more of a "laid back" role now. I am sure he is still involved in future developments.

I would also note that Oculus recently stated they would make the upcoming Medal of Honor available on Steam as well. This is a new thing for them, as previously they have been Oculus exclusives. They have sunk a ton of money into it.

 

It will be interesting to see what Oculus does going forward on the gaming side. 

I note that you present a next headset as a Reverb G2 versus Quest 2. But you yourself chose Index over Reverb (G2 has same res as G1).

Maybe a more accurate choice might be between an Index and a Reverb G2. Obviously Index is still doing quite well as they stay backordered.

I will say if Valve offered an updated Index with Inside/Out tracking I would be all over it.

 

As far as Oculus Link with Quest 2. If they continue to improve upon what they have already done with Link and the first Quest, this will be

certainly a very viable option. I spend a few hours with my Quest connected via Link in IL-2, DCS, and Asgard's Wrath. I was amazed at how well it did perform.

Course I prefer Rift S over Quest via Link. Wireless with Virtual Desktop seems promising, but then one has the battery drain to deal with.

And with Quest 2 of course the biggie - the Facebook requirement. That alone is the main reason I did not get a Quest 2.

It will be very interesting to see where Oculus puts their efforts software rise throughout 2021. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by dburne
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AuburnAlumni

I have Quest, Quest 2, and Rift S.

 

I've got a G2 on preorder as well and will own both.

 

ChillWill's stance against all things Oculus are noted in just about every post he makes.  If you hate Facebook/Oculus, then obviously you'll choose a G2.  

 

But if we are looking at this from purely a VR and not political view...I can say after owning a Quest 2 for over a week..I'm very happy with its performance and resolution.  The advances in both the Link cable and Virtual Desktop are very impressive as well as I've flown in IL2 using both.  The interface is nice and the library of native Oculus titles is huge between both mobile and PCVR titles.  And the price is absolutely absurd for the level of quality you are getting.  It's a great headset IMO.

 

That being said...the Reverb G2 has better resolution, lighter headset that is most likely much more comfortable long term, and has oustanding built in audio.  If you are thinking purely in terms of IL-2 and other sims....I think the G2 is the way to go...even at double the price of the Quest 2.

 

But either way...both are great headsets and both will work wonderfully with IL2.

Edited by AuburnAlumni
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7 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- PC-games are much much better than standalone games (just compare IL-2 with Ultrawings or VTOL), so most of the games you will like to play will be connected to PC. So you will be using a USB cable with compression-decompression algorithms and the quality of the image and latency will be always below PC tethered devices like Reverb G2 or Pimax8KX or any future device with similar resolution to Quest-2. (I had an Quest-1 and I didn´t even tried to test the link cable, having and Index why should want to use Quest-1 with link).

 

 Yes but but how much better at these resolutions is the question. Tyriel the only person I know who has both headsets and early build of the new link update said "They are very, very close" in (COFFEE & VR - Podcast - Guest Tyriel Wood, Quest 2 vs Reverb G2 50 min mark)

7 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- Standalone devices like Quest or Quest-2 will be always a bit less confortable and with more momentum inertia than the PC thetered devices since they need to be equiped with a battery which contributes to increase the weight in the front side. This was reported by TESTED and other reviews I have seen. From my experience, the Rift-S or G1 for example is much confortable than the Quest. In the Quest-2 the Elite strap is a must have, but even with that, reviews report that it is not well balanced and overall less confortable than other devices like Rift/Rift-S/REverb G1 or G2.

 

 

I agree the elite strap is a must have. I have the elite with battery and can say it is super comfortable. I fell this aspect is a little more subjective though as head shape and size vary but have not seen really any complaints online of the elite strap. Just omg so much better buy it! TESTED loved it and Tyriel put it fighting for number 2 in "comfort" behind the G2.

 

7 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- The G2 uses a 2 panel design with better IPD adjustment than Quest-2, which it based in one single panel and 3 IPD position (your IPD could be in your range but not exactly in matching your IPD). It is important to fit well your IPD to have no distortions, eye fatigue or chromatic aberrations. Perhaps you will be lucky that your IPD matches the 3 IPD settings, so check this before.

people found you can put the lenses in between for 5 points. But yes not the best solution but a compromise for the masses.  The Rift S had one screen and software IPD adjustment. I have a feeling a future update will have the combo of the 3 point slide and software fine tuning. someone found software points already on reddit.

 

7 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- According to Tyriel videos there is some ghosting in the Quest-2 for fast moving objects. Look here.

quote from Tyriel using link on: THROUGH THE LENSES - Oculus QUEST w/ LINK vs RIFT S vs Rift

NOTE: the shutter, in the Oculus Quest AC part, is due to the shutter speed of the camera (lower to avoid black lines).

he would have to do the same for that video to accommodate the 72hz.

lower shutter speed will blur moving objects.

 

 

anyway, I know that the G2 will be awesome. But Q2 is the best do everything swiss army knife of a headset. Super happy with mine as a rift S replacement. Playing wireless, wired and on the go just brings so much to the table.

Edited by kuk111
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Quest 2 is clearly being sold below cost, with Facebook planning to make the money back either in the Oculus walled-garden app store or (maybe later) via Facebook data/advertising. Whether you're worried about that or not is a personal decision. Looking at what Facebook has done elsewhere -- allowing their platform to subvert elections, failing to police the platform, allowing it to be used for obviously-terrible-bad-stuff -- I would be very nervous about opting into their ecosystem.

 

For me, Reverb G2 (or a hypothetical Index G2 with better resolution) is the headset of choice, since $300 vs $600 doesn't make a huge difference given the rest of the costs ($1000+ on flight peripherals, $1500+ on a gaming PC).

 

But for my girlfriend's parents who are stuck indoors and can't do their usual traveling in their retirement? Sure, get a Quest 2 and some fun VR apps and have some fun.

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kisschicken

I went with Quest 2. It was a huge improvement coming from CV1 and Il2 performs well with my current video card (AMD Vega 56). The Reverb was tempting, but was double the price and would have required a more powerful video card. Happy spending $300 vs the cost of the Reverb 2 and a 3070 video card. 

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1 hour ago, kisschicken said:

I went with Quest 2. It was a huge improvement coming from CV1 and Il2 performs well with my current video card (AMD Vega 56). The Reverb was tempting, but was double the price and would have required a more powerful video card. Happy spending $300 vs the cost of the Reverb 2 and a 3070 video card. 

 

:good:

 

Nothing wrong with that, enjoy!

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15 hours ago, Alonzo said:

Quest 2 is clearly being sold below cost, with Facebook planning to make the money back either in the Oculus walled-garden app store or (maybe later) via Facebook data/advertising. Whether you're worried about that or not is a personal decision. Looking at what Facebook has done elsewhere -- allowing their platform to subvert elections, failing to police the platform, allowing it to be used for obviously-terrible-bad-stuff -- I would be very nervous about opting into their ecosystem.

 

On top of this last I heard they are planning to come out with their own currency? Imagine the above coupled with (in my view totally artificially forced) economic power. Toying around with the economy in a way that some people can simply say I have a new currency is very dangerous.

 

Best to stay as far away from all this.

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

Q2 ist effectively on Index level, graphics wise, but with a tiny FOV. It doesn't compare to Reverb G2. Sound wise the difference is night and day. 

 

But why compare them? Different use-cases!

To buy the Q2 to use it for serious PC gaming , especially sim-flight, is false.

Buddy of mine has both Index and Quest 2 and says the Index is so much better for IL 2. Same quality graphics wise (the Q2 is not better!) And all compression hacks and dedicated router used.  He loves Hellsplit via VD in the Quest 2 though!

 

You don't buy a minivan to race the Ring and not a horse to walk the desert either.

 

Different use cases.

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I think we all need to step back a bit and remember we all simply love VR flying. How we  accomplish that and experience it will be different for everyone. We have old school headset users,  bleeding edge ones, people who have full flight seats. We can’t dismiss a path for someone to experience this game simply because there is something better. This is PC, there will always be something better. All our options bring something to the table. I am happy we are in a state of VR where we can have options that can open this up to as many users as possible. 

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

What kind of post , this is neither a political discussion nor to appease snowflakes.

 

There are shit headsets and there are good headsets.

 

We're sharing our information and discussing about which headset belongs in what category. 

 

Wanna get the blue Cosmos? Sure go ahead but you're not going to have a good time. Use an Oculus Rift CV1? You can also drive 30 years old Lada for fun. What our chats here do is to get people to avoid bad products which they shouldn't spend their hard earned money on. Not everyone here is from Europe or NA and can easily buy 3 or 4 headsets to see which one fits him. So, it's important to share our experiences truthfully and straight to the point :good:

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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5 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

You can also drive 30 years old Lada for fun

Had to look up the reference, they look awesome!  You should ship them to the States. You would make a killing with our hipster market haha

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HagarTheHorrible
5 hours ago, kuk111 said:

Had to look up the reference, they look awesome!  You should ship them to the States. You would make a killing with our hipster market haha

 

My God, he hasn’t even seen a Trabie (Trabant), get the Kleenex ready, he’s gonna need them when he sees the gorgeous curves of that baby ( if he can see them through the exhaust smoke that is).

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57 minutes ago, HagarTheHorrible said:

gorgeous curves

Haha now that is something! 
 

wiki

no external fuel door, and drivers had to pour a mix of gasoline and oil directly under the bonnet/hood.

 

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

Haha yeah I went ice drifting in Lada in Chelya that was some fun 😂

 

Also rode a Lada that had a hole in its bottom, you could have stuck your foot to the ground flintstone-style. You can do amazing stunts with stuff if you can afford to lose it, just wear your seatbelts and don't play it too rough! 😁

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15 hours ago, HagarTheHorrible said:

 

My God, he hasn’t even seen a Trabie (Trabant), get the Kleenex ready, he’s gonna need them when he sees the gorgeous curves of that baby ( if he can see them through the exhaust smoke that is).

 

Yeah Trabant was the real thing. Lada was the car of the elite like waiters, bricklayers, taxi drivers etc, Trabant was the car for the poor like teachers, scientists etc.

 

Polski Fiat was for the fat.

 

And above all was shining the diamond, the glorious Volga for the politicians.

 

 

Edited by HunDread
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3 hours ago, =VARP=Ribbon said:

This is the most powerful derail i've ever encountered on internet😂🏆

 

Yes! @chiliwili69 I hope you placed a bet when submitting your OP that this thread will turn out as a socialist era car showcase because you are damn rich now if you did.

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