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"The Kuban Wall" Campaign Released !


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On 7/14/2020 at 11:39 AM, IckyATLAS said:

Gambit is right when he says that the number of aircraft flown is not always the first TD culprit. Finding the exact cause that is the cause of the slow down is difficult, and there can be may reasons combined. This campaign tries to have a theater where you have Land, Air and Sea action that happens independently of your mission as in real life. This means you have ships, trains, convoys, planes all alive across the map. It is an ambitious target lot to handle but that was part of the initial objective and really a challenge. 

Now to be fair I did not try to reach the limits at editor level, it is simply that I did not encounter them  as I was developing the campaign. 

In my system I run between 80-90 FPS, with everything set to ULTRA or MAX and in 4K  3820x2160. Antialising is MSAA. This is my reference, which I agree is totally subjective and personal.

I know that many systems out there will have problems to handle this campaign and I have mentioned it in the initial post. New hardware will probably cope better over time and I hope too that Jason will improve the speed of his simulator.

I have not made a TD analysis at the moment, but I will do and see how it handles in my system and post results. I have some ideas to improve TD on Mission 00, but it has to be tested.

This is a WIP Campaign and all your comments are warmly welcomed.

 

I assume you have RTX2080TI? What CPU?
I am running the game at similar settings, but the CPU plays a much higher role here.

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14 hours ago, Zeev said:

I assume you have RTX2080TI? What CPU?
I am running the game at similar settings, but the CPU plays a much higher role here.

I have an Asus Strix slightly overclocked version of a RTX2080Ti.  I have a CPU Intel 9900KS running flat at 5 GHz on all cores.

I have also 64 GB of G.Skill RAM running at 3600. I run Win 10 Pro, and IL2 game are each on a separate  1 TB Samsung 970 Evo Plus NVMe, M.2 SSDs.

A pretty beefy system.

 

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48 minutes ago, Paintball said:

The readme downloaded alright, but when I click on the The Kuban Wall link, all that comes up is - the readme again! Is it me? or is it the link? Please advise.

 

You are right, link is wrong. Has been corrected now and should work. 🙂 

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As promised I measured the Time Dilation factor. Again on my reference machine.

For Mission 00 it is of 1.5 . This means that 1 game minute is 1min and 30 sec real time. That is a TD of 50%, which I agree is high.

With some simple changes I could lower it to 35% and if we take away altogether the Krasnodar Air traffic (3 A20 and 3 Pe3) then we have 26%.

 

MIssion01 stands at 23%, which should be acceptable.

Let me know your opinion.

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Icky, maximize usage of static vehicles, minimize use-simultaneous activation of “real” vehicles

 

Minimize the number of active attack logic/MCU’s

 

Minimize the number of guns/searchlights that are active at any moment.

 

Note: My Havoc missions on the Kuban map are very heavy and no noticeable TD.

I’ve only run into TD concerns since building on the Rhineland map. This leads me to believe that your Kuban mission files are VERY heavy and perhaps not optimized to the extent that they could be.

 

TD tends to happen beyond a certain point regardless of system specs.

Good luck!

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The read me tells me to place the folder "The Kuban Wall" into "o …/IL-2 Sturmovik Great Battles/data/Campaigns/ " however my game (Steam) is called "Steam > steamapps > common > IL-2 Sturmovik Battle of Stalingrad > data > Campaings

Is this the correct place to put this?

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12 minutes ago, MichaelTurner said:

The read me tells me to place the folder "The Kuban Wall" into "o …/IL-2 Sturmovik Great Battles/data/Campaigns/ " however my game (Steam) is called "Steam > steamapps > common > IL-2 Sturmovik Battle of Stalingrad > data > Campaings

Is this the correct place to put this?

 

Yes

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Icky,

     I'm still experiencing slow running times after your updates.  It must be my computer, not the fastest made I'm afraid.  Hopefully in time you'll find a solution for us "slow" folks!!

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On 7/20/2020 at 1:10 PM, IckyATLAS said:

.

 

MIssion01 stands at 23%, which should be acceptable.

Let me know your opinion.

 

14 seconds per minute...that's very high honestly.

Some days ago busdriver was testing new mission file and we've been working on TD and minimizing it (Rhineland map)

On this outing he reported 45 seconds of TD total during a 50 minute session which to me is acceptable.

At 23% he would have experienced almost 12 minutes of TD...way too much.

 

Anything beyond a few seconds per minute you should try and crush.

 

 

Edited by Gambit21
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On 7/29/2020 at 3:03 AM, Gambit21 said:

 

14 seconds per minute...that's very high honestly.

Some days ago busdriver was testing new mission file and we've been working on TD and minimizing it (Rhineland map)

On this outing he reported 45 seconds of TD total during a 50 minute session which to me is acceptable.

At 23% he would have experienced almost 12 minutes of TD...way too much.

 

Anything beyond a few seconds per minute you should try and crush.

 

 

That's a hard challenge at the moment because it means an improvement by a factor of 10. Will do my best but according to the original campaign concept.

I hope also that coming new hardware may help. The Devs should also improve their internal "machinery" too 🙂 

 

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11 hours ago, IckyATLAS said:

That's a hard challenge at the moment because it means an improvement by a factor of 10. Will do my best but according to the original campaign concept.

I hope also that coming new hardware may help. The Devs should also improve their internal "machinery" too 🙂 

 

 

I hear ya.

That’s one of the biggest (and most important) challenges of mission building.

 

Creating something compelling, that doesn’t appear as though you skimped on anything, and also runs well.

 

If I may, I think one of the issues is your “things are happening whether you’re there or not” building scheme. The only things that add to the player experience are those things the player can observe.

 

Everything else is wasted resources.

 

Ignore this reality enough in a given mission and TD will bite you, all the while FPS seemingly unaffected.

 

This is why you need to trick the player, and be clever with your logic.

Use larger “activate/deactivate zones” for regions of the map, then smaller “activate/deactivate” zones within those regions.

 

Use static objects wherever possible.

 

Additionally, use a modular “building block” approach to your logic so that you can build/test/add layers to isolate and reduce TD problems.

 

You simply cannot have a “live” map where everything is active everywhere - doesn’t work. You can however create the illusion of this with some smart logic.

 

That’s the key really - illusion.

Best to embrace this now - trust me. :)

I’ve just completed a “live” map of sorts so believe me I know of what I speak.

 

Good luck!

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Thanks for the advice Gambit. I need to review a few things to create an "all alive map illusion" as to be as good as when it is really alive. 🙂 

All this will unfortunately delay mission 03. But I will probably release Mission 03 with Mission 01 and 02 revised as well.

 

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@IckyATLAS  Even if I am more interested to the tank part of this game your work is clearly outstanding and your commitment, dedication and passion about this project are surely admirable.

Our community highly needs people like you so many thanks for all your work!

 

Keep up the good work, Salute!

Edited by SKG_210_Belial
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1 hour ago, IckyATLAS said:

Thanks for the advice Gambit. I need to review a few things to create an "all alive map illusion" as to be as good as when it is really alive. 🙂 

All this will unfortunately delay mission 03. But I will probably release Mission 03 with Mission 01 and 02 revised as well.

 

 

Very nice. :)

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  • 1 month later...

Hi All. Have just downloaded both files [welcome to Kuban and know your enemy]  and i have all the required aircraft for the campaign. and its there on my scripted campaign screen, but when i hit the start button i get that dreaded message " mission description is loading ! "    and nothing happens ? which is a shame because i just purchased the Yak 9.

 

Am i doing something wrong ?    Cheers.

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11 hours ago, taffy2jeffmorgan said:

Hi All. Have just downloaded both files [welcome to Kuban and know your enemy]  and i have all the required aircraft for the campaign. and its there on my scripted campaign screen, but when i hit the start button i get that dreaded message " mission description is loading ! "    and nothing happens ? which is a shame because i just purchased the Yak 9.

 

Am i doing something wrong ?    Cheers.

 

It's probably related to the newest update. All 3rd party missions are not functioning anymore and get that message, unless you use the editor (go to the tool tab convert to binaries for new campaigns or resave all missions for those already in progress). It works for most missions and campaigns, but not all of them.

Edited by Cleo9
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9 hours ago, taffy2jeffmorgan said:

Hi All. Have just downloaded both files [welcome to Kuban and know your enemy]  and i have all the required aircraft for the campaign. and its there on my scripted campaign screen, but when i hit the start button i get that dreaded message " mission description is loading ! "    and nothing happens ? which is a shame because i just purchased the Yak 9.

 

Am i doing something wrong ?    Cheers.

Unfortunately the missions are not compatible straight out of the box with Game version 4.501. Up to 4.009c it was all fine, but this new version is not compatible. Please allow some time for me to do the necessary and update the missions.

Try what Cleo9 has advised. It may work.

Edited by IckyATLAS
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Just relating back to my original post, I was under the impression that if a 3rd party mission or campaign was downloaded and installed after an update that it would incorporate the changes that came with the new update and so be playable ! if this is not the case, then most of the 3rd party missions/campaigns could be unplayable, is this correct ?

 

Cheers

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On 9/20/2020 at 10:36 PM, Cleo9 said:

 

It's probably related to the newest update. All 3rd party missions are not functioning anymore and get that message, unless you use the editor (go to the tool tab convert to binaries for new campaigns or resave all missions for those already in progress). It works for most missions and campaigns, but not all of them.

You dont have to do it this way.
You guys can use resave tool and/or use my application that does all this automatically (it loops through all the missions and tells resaver to resave the files) and with few clicks you can resave all your mission/campaign library.
More info in 3rd party forum.

Edited by Zeev
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19 hours ago, taffy2jeffmorgan said:

Just relating back to my original post, I was under the impression that if a 3rd party mission or campaign was downloaded and installed after an update that it would incorporate the changes that came with the new update and so be playable ! if this is not the case, then most of the 3rd party missions/campaigns could be unplayable, is this correct ?

 

Cheers

 

You're conflating two different things.

Sometimes the format changes necessitating the re-save. This has nothing to do with changes that come with the update.

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11 hours ago, Zeev said:

You dont have to do it this way.
You guys can use resave tool and/or use my application that does all this automatically (it loops through all the missions and tells resaver to resave the files) and with few clicks you can resave all your mission/campaign library.
More info in 3rd party forum.

 

Please to hear that; where can we find your application ?

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9 hours ago, Cleo9 said:

 

Please to hear that; where can we find your application ?

It is in sticky 3rd party forum.
Here is the link. You choose IL2 category and then click "Resave missions" from the top right.

The name of the program can confuse you but it has some other useful functions like the one I have described previously.

 

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  • 1 month later...

Here some updates about the campaign and the work done lately.

The main topic is reducing the time dilation to zero. Just to remember time dilation in the first mission was 1.5 which means 1 minute in the game was 1 minute 30 seconds in reality.

This made all moving things appear slower in the game as in reality and this was very visible. The reason we have this is due to computing power. The CPU is the main culprit as this time dilation does not really impact FPS which is not really the problem.  So having a more powerful GPU will not change anything. Having a more powerful CPU with faster memory yes. This means that in a few years we may be able to run the simulation as it was initially designed with no major slowdown effect.

 

Good news the first mission went from 1-1.5 to better than 1-1. In fact it is 1 minute in game is 58 seconds in true life. Considering my delay to start and stop the chronometer it is safe to say that we have a robust 1-1. So perfect score here. Flying the mission one can really feel it. But something has to give. During the mission I have not measured this all along, but even if in certain moments which are more loaded we are a little over like 1.05, the impact should be very low.

 

It is a long a delicate work, and different for each mission, for the following reasons:

 

1) The scenario must be the same, otherwise the reworking becomes enormous and it is as redoing the campaign.

2) The concept changes from a world centric view to a pilot centric view. This has a big impact.

3) You cannot anymore leave the pilot and go across the map with many cameras around (up to 20) and observe all the events happening in the world.

4) All dynamic events become triggered by the pilot himself. The pilot becomes the generator of the dynamic world and it is not a world for which everything is alive independently of the pilot who is immersed in it and can choose to do as he wish, which can impact events or not.

5) You have to ensure that when the pilot triggers an event it will be correctly timed. Synchronisations have to be matched to make sense. This impacts the sub-design of the event and my need reworking.

6) Finally you have to have less of everything. Shorter trains (Instead of 13 or 14 vehicles just 7 is ok), less trains, shorter vehicle columns, less columns, smaller flights etc. etc. in a way that if many events get triggered you still impact the time dilation by a very small factor.

 

Finally I am still in the testing phase of the first mission. When the two first missions will be ready I will replace them in this thread and move to adapt the third and the others. Most probably I will post them once tested with the last update coming by next week. Maybe I add the Hurri and the Dakota in the missions just to give some refresh, if we get them by the next update.

I know you will say: beware time dilation! you are starting to load up again the mission you will say, but if I add them I will take away something else. Not the Yak 9 I promise. 🙂 

 

 

 

 

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  • 1 month later...
On 11/28/2020 at 7:37 PM, Aufpassen said:

Hi there, were there ever more than the first two missions released? I don't seem to be able find the rest. Or was it never released? Thank you very much for any pointers.

 

Let me give you some updated information here about this campaign, and what happened over the last five months:

 

Two missions had been released so far. They are not compatible with the last updates and those trying to load and play where unable to do so. I stopped releasing the next ones as I decided a complete redesign of the missions for reasons I will explain in detail below. I hope before Christmas to release  a fully updated campaign (the new planes like the Hurry and the Dakota will be in) with the initial two missions plus a third one will be released with a different design concept. This means that the old Campaign has to be scrapped and this one will completely replace it. The basic campaign storyline is the same and the advertised mission topics remain the same but they will be more fun to play, I hope.  The upcoming additional missions will then be released and will be added as they come to the campaign, as it has been initially advertised.

 

The first players of my campaign have rightly complained about the very slow behavior of the fighters. It has appeared that I have overlooked an important factor in my missions design and that is the Time Dilation factor. It came up that I was with a time dilation factor around 1.5. This means that if you measure a minute in the real world you get 1 minute and 30 seconds in the simulated world. This made all dynamic objects moving much more slowly. Fighter planes would be more slow and less reactive and so on. Clearly this is a game killer and I had to completely review the concept.

 

The initial mission concept was of a world-centric approach to the war theater where a lot of different actions take place independently of the player. The player is immersed in the war theater and by his actions will have an impact but the whole war theater goes on. About twenty cameras allowed the player to switch and see various battles or actions taking place on various places on the map. There is a mission to be carried out which allows you to switch to the next one, but you could stay in the mission even after having successfully completed it and continue flying and fighting all over the map. The problem here is computer power, mainly CPU power. To be able to run without Time Dilation this kind of approach we need a computer at least with double the CPU power of the best CPU's of today. This means at least not before another three generation of CPUs or in about five years time. Graphics is not an issue here as you still get very decent framerates between 60 to 80 in the middle of the action with top cards, and with the new 3000 series probably even more. 

 

The new mission design concept is now of a war theater that will be pilot-centric or player-centric. The war theater is active around the player. In this way everything that is outside a certain radius (the radius varies depending on visibility distance of the objects), around the player cease to exist and this brings down enormously the processing power needed to handle the missions. On the other hand you can increase the action around the player without visible impact on the time dilation factor.

 

Nothing to say but these fundamental changes meant to completely review the whole design and created a tremendous amount of work. But now that the model is set, libraries updated, redesign of additional missions will be easier as they are built chronologically one after the other. 

 

At release time I will give some additional details about the new improvements in the missions. Stay tuned and thank you for your patience. 🙂 

 

 

Edited by IckyATLAS
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  • 2 weeks later...

I have decided to consider then new effects, mainly the fires and smoke that now are natively running constant with smoke plumes that are stable. Using the new effects will simplify a lot the design of smoke and fire effects, and reduce cpu use. And in my campaign whatever can improve processing speed is good to have. This adaptation is pretty straightforward. It should not stop the release planned by next week just before Christmas 🙂 

 

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Didn't make it. A mix of family and business obligations have slowed me down. 

Merry Christmas and a happy new year to you all fellow mission builders and fellow mission players. 

I have also got the famous developer sickness, were keeping delivery dates are slippery.😔

Anyway the good news is that it should be out before Battle of Normandy 🙂 

 

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  • 1 month later...

Work is ongoing, and I have a question:

 

Should I have with each mission a flightpath defined on the map but also that can be flown with autopilot. 

 

or

 

would you prefer to have the written instructions some information on the map but no flightpath defined and no autopilot mission flying.

 

Any input is welcome.

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  • 4 weeks later...

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