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jokerBR

Finally almost no shimmering (for nVidia users) without taxing 4xSGSSAA

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Posted (edited)

Hi guys, I've been trying to get rid of shimmering on IL-2 for a long time, and up until now the only solution was to use 4xMSAA and 4xSGSSAA, which unfortunately was too heavy to my setup to achieve at least 60 FPS under ANY situation using everything on ultra in game - but now on version 4.006 I've found a way.

First things first: this was tested on a GTX 1080 + 2560x1080 144Hz monitor, on an old i5 3570K @ 4.4Ghz (hence my efforts on ochieving best performance while pursuing better IQ at the same time).

 

The trick is to gain back the performance by using only 2xMSAA and 2xSGSSAA, but setting the Compatibility Bits to 0x004412C1 on nVidia Inspector.

In game, also set terrain filter to BLURRED and activate the SHARP filter as well.

 

On my setup, this translated to ZERO almost none shimmering at all, no matter the altitude, and I was able to withstand 60 FPS on my two benchmark tests: 

a) 6x6 low fight over Kuban on a heavy weather

b) very low flying over a large and dense forest (skimming the trees!) while looking 90 degrees to either side - the forest should not present any sort of micro stutter while passing by

 

If you want to give your graphics card a little room (avoiding it to run full boost all the time) then just set target fps on 60 into game. It will remain there, whithout hiccups, and your card will even run cooler without being demanded 100% all the time. Although I have a 144Hz monitor, I did this so my 1080 has ample room to spare when things get crowded, giving me a zero micro stutter ambient too.

 

Ingame.thumb.png.538f3cf38bbb399f8d1ed6ac984549a8.png

 

nVidiaInspector.png

 

Oh, and don't forget to set Power Management Mode to " Prefer Maximum Performance", of course. 

 

Cheers.

 

EDIT: noticed that in some maps depending on time of day the shimmer can still occur on some roads, but all in all, the results are on pair with 4xMSAA+4xSGSSAA IQ with half the cost.

EDIT2: link for nVidia Inspector

EDIT3: After last patch, got some stuttering when panning with TrackIR, although my fps was the same. I've discovered that disabling 4K skins got rid of the stuttering. Before the patch it was the opposite. Weird. If using TrackIR, don't forget to cap to 60 fps (or 120 if you can sustain), otherwise you'll get stutters while panning.

Edited by jokerBR
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Where do I find this screen?

 

I want to check my settings but I have practically eliminated shimmer already, but when it gets a bit intense down low I do get the occasional stutter. I know I have quite a lot of headroom already on my system, so further enhancements are possible.

 

TYIA

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Posted (edited)

You guys talking plane-in-front-of-cloud shimmering or something else?

Edited by ACG_crane
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1 minute ago, ACG_crane said:

You guys talking plane-in-front-of-cloud shimmering or something else?

Basically terrain shimmering. It gets better in front of clouds too, but it is still there.
I did more tests in different times of day and noticed that there were occasionally shimmering on some roads... but very faint. All in all, it gave me the 4xMSAA+4xSGSSAA IQ with half the cost. Very happy.

14 minutes ago, Reggie_Mental said:

Where do I find this screen?

 

I want to check my settings but I have practically eliminated shimmer already, but when it gets a bit intense down low I do get the occasional stutter. I know I have quite a lot of headroom already on my system, so further enhancements are possible.

 

TYIA

This screen is from nVidia Inspector. You can grab it here.

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I have no shimmering at present but low FPS .Should I try to find my 1080 graphics card settings and and adjust as the guys above has done.If so where on my PC should I look?

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1 hour ago, Blitzen said:

I have no shimmering at present but low FPS .Should I try to find my 1080 graphics card settings and and adjust as the guys above has done.If so where on my PC should I look?

Blitzen, the screen on the OP is from the nVidia Inspector, which you can grab on the link that I've just put on the first topic.

As for the settings inside the game, I'm also using a 1080, and I've added the settings on the OP as well. 

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Thx for the hints, it's even a bit more easy for me - in game:

4006-graph.thumb.png.de7b168a58930c746ab797e66439b123.png

no need for the good old inspector:
4006-nvid01.jpg.209f475907dc638723a83153fedcfa63.jpg

4006-nvid02.jpg.2439eb298756bca6f2540e3795fc5b4e.jpg

4006-nvid03.jpg.cdcef461433bc011ec6919773baf04be.jpg

 

With 1440p and 144 Hz G-Sync my 1060 6GB delivers 80 (down to 70 if MP-Server is loaded) to 130 FPS (just sky). Contacts against the sky up to 10 km as 1 pixel. Looking from cockpit (like a pro does) there's no shimmering at all. External views sometimes still tend to show flickering along long, nearly horizontal lines like rivers or streets.

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I always fly only from cockpit too, but in some maps (specially with rivers at the horizon, like Stalingrad at summer/autumn) the shimmering can be quite heavy with your settings (at least on my machine), depending on time of day. My settings aim to counter the effect, no matter the map/time of day. Maybe the fact that you're flying at 1440p diminishes the effect.

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I've tried a lot of options last night, after the hot-fix. All AA-methods with or without Nvidia-enhancements plus Reshade up and down, too. But for my old system it is that simple and the best I could get. Can't complain.

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I tried your method, but still I can not defeat the disgusting overflows on the new bright rivers.:dash:

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Hi FoxbatRU, sad to hear that. I don't know exactly what you are referring to ("overflows"?) but on my system everything looks in place. Are you running at full screen?
Anyway, it seems that the solution may not be as universal as I was thinking... 😔
I'm using the nVidia 442.59 driver, if this helps.

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I am using 445.98. Overflows, it is possible the program translated incorrectly. I mean that the edges / banks of the rivers are not flattened and therefore move in some positions.
But maybe I myself messed up something in the
nVidiaInspector. I will try again. :)
 

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3 hours ago, jokerBR said:

I always fly only from cockpit too, but in some maps (specially with rivers at the horizon, like Stalingrad at summer/autumn) the shimmering can be quite heavy with your settings (at least on my machine), depending on time of day. My settings aim to counter the effect, no matter the map/time of day. Maybe the fact that you're flying at 1440p diminishes the effect.

I did some testing on the older maps (usually I test on Kuban and Rheinland) and you're right - there's something to enhance. Flying low looking out of the 109 G-14 it's still ok. P-51, too, just a tiny flimmer. But looking from the Ju-52-cockpit there's a flickering triggers the need to care about. Jumping outside the planes it becomes really strong.
As a first step I went to the Nvdia-Control-Panel, AA-mode "Enhance the app. setting", "AA-setting" 2x and "AA-Transparency" to 2x (supersample). From the Ju-52-cockpit-view now it is down to an acceptable degree of flickering. Can't see much difference from inside 109 or P-51, but external view is definitely much better. For 5% lower FPS and no negative impact on long range contact detection against the sky it's well worth to check it out. My vague impression is I lost some contact contrast against the lower horizon and ground, but that's more a feeling than something I could measure. I'll fly a few days with 2x MSAA enhanced by supersample, let's see. Thanks for pointing on the older maps, they need extra care.

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Posted (edited)

When flying over Kuban there are lots of rivers which shimmer and antialias badly on the horizon (BTW: It seems this has gotten worse after the switch to a new renderer).

This is what gave me best results to mitigate this:

1) In NVIDIA Control Panel: set "DSR - Factors" to 1.50x

2) In IL2 Graphics menu:

a) set resolution to 150% of what your monitor supports

b) set "Antialiasing type" to FXAA

c) set "Landscape filter" to Blur

e) adjust other settings depending on your preferences and/or desired fps

Edited by WheelwrightPL
REMOVED d) set "Sharpen" to yes (this is for cockpit only)
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7 hours ago, jokerBR said:

Hi guys, I've been trying to get rid of shimmering on IL-2 for a long time...

 

Me too and after reading through your post and giving your Nvidia inspector settings a go, I can say they are virtually gone :good:

 

So far so good 8x8 on all maps running like I always hoped it would.

 

Thanks for that.

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1 hour ago, WheelwrightPL said:

When flying over Kuban there are lots of rivers which shimmer and antialias badly on the horizon (BTW: It seems this has gotten worse after the switch to a new renderer).

This is what gave me best results to mitigate this:

1) In NVIDIA Control Panel: set "DSR - Factors" to 1.50x

2) In IL2 Graphics menu:

a) set resolution to 150% of what your monitor supports

b) set "Antialiasing type" to FXAA

c) set "Landscape filter" to Blur

d) set "Sharpen" to yes (this is for cockpit only)

e) adjust other settings depending on your preferences and/or desired fps

Hi Wheelwright, haven't tested with DSR and FXAA (just because DSR in the past always have been more taxing than simply using 4xSGSSAA in my case), but maybe this changed with the FXAA option? May try to see if it show a better compromise than my actual Compatibility Bits solution. Thanks.

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Quite interesting results. What are the performance gains or loss with these settings?

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1 hour ago, Geronimo553 said:

Quite interesting results. What are the performance gains or loss with these settings?

In my case, I've got the same visual of 4xMSAA + 4xSGSSAA @ 50 FPS limit (and occasional micro stutter when on heavy ambient) with the performance of 2xMSAA + 2xSGSSAA @ 60 FPS limit without micro stutters at all. 😉
Obs: the fps limit I use is adjusted to get my gfx card some juice to spare when things get messy pretty fast, so, all in all it means that the gpu will get near 95%~98% on heavy moments, but almost never hit 100% no matter how hairy things are - so I never get stutters.

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Thanks for the tip! This works pretty nicely on my 2070.

 

Spent the last day playing a couple hours on FXAA, MSAA, no AA, and ReShade SMAA/FXAA respectively and I think this may be the best looking setup so far. Stacked a gentle ReShade FXAA on top and it looks great on my 3440x1440

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, DrKarrot said:

Stacked a gentle ReShade FXAA on top and it looks great on my 3440x1440

 

S! @DrKarrot,

I want to install the new Reshade 4.6.1
What  option should I choose if I want to adjust the FXAA and the colors in game?
Any tips are welcome!

 

Cheers,
GenMarkof

Edited by II./JG1_GenMarkof

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, jokerBR said:

Blitzen, the screen on the OP is from the nVidia Inspector, which you can grab on the link that I've just put on the first topic.

As for the settings inside the game, I'm also using a 1080, and I've added the settings on the OP as well. 

 

Hey mate thanks for sharing this.

 

Had to enable 4 MSAA in game though as the jaggies with in-game 2 MSAA are unacceptable I find. 

 

The issue I have with shimmering is the distant roads. Awful jagged stepped lines that stick out as and just can't get rid of them.

 

Regards

 

 

Edited by Bilbo_Baggins
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Are some using this Nvidia inspector with an VR headset? 

 

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12 hours ago, II./JG1_GenMarkof said:

 

S! @DrKarrot,

I want to install the new Reshade 4.6.1
What  option should I choose if I want to adjust the FXAA and the colors in game?
Any tips are welcome!

 

Cheers,
GenMarkof

These two shader packs will give you the "classic" FXAA/SMAA and basic color/curves adjustments. I am not too familiar with what is in the rest of the shader packs, so there may be others worth including. The good news is you can re-run the installer to add/remove different packs easily.

 

image.png.4bd205cfea63815aa624a3891147d5bc.png

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On 5/22/2020 at 11:38 PM, jokerBR said:

but setting the Compatibility Bits to 0x004412C1 on nVidia Inspector.

 

 

jokerBR, just wondering - what does this 0x004412C1 setting do and why is it recommended?

 

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On some games, it forces the AA to be applied to all screen. I was skeptical that it could work on Il-2, but gave a shot and it enhanced the image in the end. On my system at least, if I disable the code (i.e., return to default 0x00000000), it is very noticeable.
Right now I'm experimenting with 0x004032C1 and SHARP/SHARPEN filters, and beginning to like it more than BLURRED/SHARPEN as suggested on the first post - although I don't know if the code changing has something to do, it seems to work the same with 0x004412C1, or at least the difference is negligible (hard to tell because I have to restart the game every time I change the codes, difficult to compare exactly which is best). Guess I'll just leave at what it is by now and play.
 

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23 hours ago, Retnek said:

.... I'll fly a few days with 2x MSAA enhanced by supersample, let's see. Thanks for pointing on the older maps, they need extra care.

Flying low near Stalingrad or Moscow is the true enemy of Nvidia-cards in IL2-GB!

 

Nasty conflict finally solved - 2x MSAA enhanced by Nvidia-Control-Panel "supersample" isn't able to suppress the flickering as much as I need it. Adding further AA-features via the Nvidia inspector or using 4x MSAA dropped my FPS below 60 occasionally - no way. Won't make this with 1440p and a Nvidia 1060 6GB.

So I had to activate "landscape filter = blurred" again. Not nice for my bomber-missions. But the most efficient way to get a somewhat steady horizon low over the woods or the steppe. Good sight down there is more important than some comfort while navigating from high above. I'll stay with the in-game options for now - let's see if the community offers a better way to go.

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Perhaps it is worth compiling a report on the smoothing operation error (on the horizon and rivers)? I left on the Russian forum, but here are more users. I think this would not be out of place.

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I think I found a good combination to minimize flickering & shimmering and still retain good framerates. It is ready to use as is except you need to change "Screen resolution" to match your monitor. I know the below settings just elevated my enjoyment of this sim to new levels during early-morning Kuban JABO mission in 190A-5, therefore I wanted to share.

2020_5_24__2_7_14.jpg

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Posted (edited)

Is this working for us VR ppl too ????

 

Someone  who have tried 

Edited by Niiranen-VR

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Posted (edited)
On 5/24/2020 at 4:38 AM, jokerBR said:


Right now I'm experimenting with 0x004032C1 
 

 

Mate that one certainly made some difference for me! I'm using a GTX1660. Where the hell are you getting these numbers from BTW? 

 

Shimmering jagged roads are the biggest issue I have with the game's graphics. 

 

On 5/24/2020 at 11:19 AM, WheelwrightPL said:

I think I found a good combination to minimize flickering & shimmering and still retain good framerates. It is ready to use as is except you need to change "Screen resolution" to match your monitor. I know the below settings just elevated my enjoyment of this sim to new levels during early-morning Kuban JABO mission in 190A-5, therefore I wanted to share.

2020_5_24__2_7_14.jpg

 

What DSR smoothness setting are you using?

 

 

Edited by Bilbo_Baggins

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6 hours ago, Bilbo_Baggins said:

What DSR smoothness setting are you using?

 

I didn't change it so I guess the default one.

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12 hours ago, Bilbo_Baggins said:

 

Mate that one certainly made some difference for me! I'm using a GTX1660. Where the hell are you getting these numbers from BTW? 

 

From my personal notes after a lot of reading and using these in the past (mind you that, depending on game engine, these numbers vary a lot). 

I just tried some with which I had success in the past on other games:
0x00401241 (Performance)

or 0x004412C1 (Performance/Quality)

or 0x004032C1 (Quality) or 

0x004012C1 (SGSSAA)

In theory, they aren't suited (or tested) against IL-2 Great Battles engine, but I gave a shot and got good results. Who would say?

You can find this type of info on Internet in several forums or even on nVidia's site by searching for "compatibility bits nvidia". ;)

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Before the latest small pach ( 900MB ) i was using the default  Nvidia ispector profile for il2 battle of stalingrad 

with changes to 4xAA + 4xSGSSAA in Nvidia inspector

also changed the AA mode to " overide any application settings" 

and vertical sync to aplication controlled

My monitor  is 24" 1080P 144hz adaptive sync

 

I had around 70-90 frs ( online) with my GTX 1060 6GB GAMING + OC  (latest driver)

just small statterings but not something teribble

The visibility of contacts was great ( sky or ground)

But there was shimmering issues for long distance landscape ( roads- coastline when i fly low and clouds when i fly high)

 

in game settings

HIGH

mirrors off

shadows medium

grass off

ANTIALIASING  4

MSAA

SSAO

SHARPEN

LANDSCAPE blurred

Vsync off

all the others to maximum

 

I tryed jokkers suggestions

RESULTS

Shimmering still  remains for long distance landscape ( roads- coastline when i fly low and clouds when i fly high)

Fps drop to 50- 60fps even if i set Vsync to aplication controlled

Contact visibility got worst in ground

No stutters smoother play ( limiter to 60fps)

 

What am i doing wrong ? ( exept my bad English 😄)

 

 

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9 minutes ago, dimitris said:

 

Shimmering still  remains for long distance landscape ( roads- coastline when i fly low and clouds when i fly high)

 

What am i doing wrong ? ( exept my bad English 😄)

 

 

 

I'm almost convinced there's nothing that can be done about the flickering jagged roads apart from setting an incredible high resolution. Changed VGA card, tried everything but another monitor it seems.

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Noch einmal 

Is This only for flatscreen or is it for us VR too ???????? 🤔

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8 hours ago, dimitris said:

Before the latest small pach ( 900MB ) i was using the default  Nvidia ispector profile for il2 battle of stalingrad 

with changes to 4xAA + 4xSGSSAA in Nvidia inspector

also changed the AA mode to " overide any application settings" 

and vertical sync to aplication controlled

My monitor  is 24" 1080P 144hz adaptive sync

 

I had around 70-90 frs ( online) with my GTX 1060 6GB GAMING + OC  (latest driver)

just small statterings but not something teribble

The visibility of contacts was great ( sky or ground)

But there was shimmering issues for long distance landscape ( roads- coastline when i fly low and clouds when i fly high)

 

in game settings

HIGH

mirrors off

shadows medium

grass off

ANTIALIASING  4

MSAA

SSAO

SHARPEN

LANDSCAPE blurred

Vsync off

all the others to maximum

 

I tryed jokkers suggestions

RESULTS

Shimmering still  remains for long distance landscape ( roads- coastline when i fly low and clouds when i fly high)

Fps drop to 50- 60fps even if i set Vsync to aplication controlled

Contact visibility got worst in ground

No stutters smoother play ( limiter to 60fps)

 

What am i doing wrong ? ( exept my bad English 😄)

 

 

Hi dimitris, 


My experience on IL-2 GB is that when you "override" AA settings, your FPS will be lower than if you let the in game AA be "enhanced", so, for performance, the recommended settings for IL-2 GB isn't to "override", but to "enhance" AA, and then let the MSAA in game work together with SGSSAA in Inspector. Make sure that both are the same number, i.e., 2xMSAA in game and 2xSGSSAA on Inspector. With 4x you sure will get the best image possible on this game, and even good FPS on calm situations (few AI around, few explosions, etc) but as soon as you get near more AI, cities and explosions, be prepared to see the FPS plummet and greet the stuttering fest - unless you change your GFX for some 2080+. 

 

So, looking at your scenario, I would still go with 2xMSAA ingame + 2xSGSSAA in Inspector (enhance, not override!), and use my Compat Bits. You may try without the Compat Bits to see the difference on your system, if any. Anything below this, and your shimmering/AA will get worse. You may also try Reshade and a bunch of filters combining FXAA, SMAA, etc - but on my tests I've found that they too fall short when things get busy, and the IQ isn't better than 2xMSAA+2xSGSSAA (we are talking nVidia here!).

About VSync, use only if you have tearing, otherwise, leave it off and make sure you're using FULLSCREEN option (not borderless or other). Vsync is not a guarantee that your FPS will not drop, it is only a way to keep the resulting FPS in sync with your monitor to avoid tearing. If it fails to achieve the max (let's say, 60 FPS), it will force drop to half that number automatically, but potentially causing stutters in the process, because your eye will detect the change. That's why technologies like Gsync or Freesync are so popular nowadays, because the monitor itself "adjusts the refresh rate" according what your GPU is throwing at it.
On some maps/time of day/angles the shimmering will still appear, but it will be greatly reduced (very near the reduction observed with 4x, but with way less penalty to your FPS).

Unfortunately, there's not a silver bullet to cure the issue, unless the devs change something in the way textures are drawn in game. So, all we can do is to try to get a good compromise between target spotting/visibility/blurring/shimmering/fps to enjoy the game. 

On my end, on most MP maps the shimmering was reduced to almost zero with no cost in FPS, but as I said, your mileage may vary based on maps and time of day (and your specific system/drivers/etc). I may need to change the title of this thread now, after flying on some different maps/time of day and seeing that sometimes the shimmering is still there, unfortunately.

Cheers

6 hours ago, Niiranen-VR said:

Noch einmal 

Is This only for flatscreen or is it for us VR too ???????? 🤔

Not tested in VR, Niiranen. I would like to, but I don't own VR. Feel free to test and report back if you can, please.

Thanks

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21 minutes ago, jokerBR said:

...
My experience on IL-2 GB is that when you "override" AA settings, your FPS will be lower than if you let the in game AA be "enhanced", so, for performance, the recommended settings for IL-2 GB isn't to "override", but to "enhance" AA ...


On my end, on most MP maps the shimmering was reduced to almost zero with no cost in FPS ...

Just to underline the method "enhance" - that's the way to go! I've tried it with both options - "enhance" is better performing and the quality is better.

 

For owners of weaker graphic-cards and/or high-res-scree-resolutions it might be good enough just to use the Nvidia-control-panel according to the ingame-settings. With 1440p I'm fine with that, too.

I got a hint to check the setting "landscape = sharpen" (thx Luse) - an option I ruled out by try-and-error month ago. To my astonishment now this option is doing as fine against flickering as "landscape = blurred", too. And it offers better long-range ground visibility for bomb- and recon-missions. So this might be worth to check on other systems.

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Posted (edited)
On 5/24/2020 at 11:19 AM, WheelwrightPL said:

I think I found a good combination to minimize flickering & shimmering and still retain good framerates. It is ready to use as is except you need to change "Screen resolution" to match your monitor. I know the below settings just elevated my enjoyment of this sim to new levels during early-morning Kuban JABO mission in 190A-5, therefore I wanted to share.

2020_5_24__2_7_14.jpg

 

I tried out DSR 2.0x to see if I could get rid of the flickering roads and distant rivers etc. Honestly have to say this DSR is the best result for my screen, which I'm beginning to learn might be the problem? Using a 32 inch Toshiba Regza 32s10 TV which has resolution specs of 1366×768. It has 1080p HDMI so I always thought 1080 was it's real capable resolution, as it uses for the default game resolution! It's really quite misleading navigating all these terms.

 

Using DSR x2 with quite a lot of 'DSR smoothing' has resulted in a wonderful clean looking image with shimmering eliminated, and it still runs at the full 60 FPS V-sync. The machine is i3 6100 with GTX1660.

Edited by Bilbo_Baggins
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Posted (edited)

@ Retnek I have hardware similar to yours. Can you share your most recent settings? Thank you.

Edited by =ABr=BR_Paco
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