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PvWolfe

Future of the game?

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I really love WW1 flying sims ever since Knights of the Sky which to me was the ultimate game. Love the dogfighting in this game but I am hoping this is not the finished product. 

There is so much missing here. A campaign for starters. Only one season where the others have 4. Some sort of dynamic system where other planes are on their own missions.

I must admit that I've not delved too deeply as yet, especially in the multi player, but I hope there is more to come at this price tag.

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13 hours ago, PvWolfe said:

I really love WW1 flying sims ever since Knights of the Sky which to me was the ultimate game. Love the dogfighting in this game but I am hoping this is not the finished product. 

There is so much missing here. A campaign for starters. Only one season where the others have 4. Some sort of dynamic system where other planes are on their own missions.

I must admit that I've not delved too deeply as yet, especially in the multi player, but I hope there is more to come at this price tag.

 

If the amount of traffic this section of the forum gets is any indication; the market is certainly there.

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Well, yet another post decrying the state of FC1... how many more similar initial posts will we see I wonder?

Is it a fad of the times, or just that people really don't read the information that is available when you buy the thing?

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1 hour ago, kendo said:

 

Yeah, and if people keep talking its prospects down all the time, the outcome we don't want becomes more likely....

 

Bingo:salute:

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6 minutes ago, US213_Talbot said:

I've purchased 4 copies of FC. Gifted out three.

 Prosit!

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Trooper117 said:

Well, yet another post decrying the state of FC1... how many more similar initial posts will we see I wonder?

Is it a fad of the times, or just that people really don't read the information that is available when you buy the thing?

I bought it knowing exactly what I was getting into, that does not mean I can't hope there is more to come. I am not putting the game down at all, I just don't understand why it was not made to the standard of the others in the series, and to be fair, you cant argue that. Its obvious by the lack of other seasons and campaign. 

Edited by PvWolfe

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, US213_Talbot said:

I've purchased 4 copies of FC. Gifted out three.

 

What say you?

 

Well done you!

 

Doesn't change my point though. And there seems to be a lot of these comments lately - maybe your post is just the one that got to me.

 

Edit: I've taken it down. Sometimes we just react...

Edited by kendo
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The future of the product depends on the revenue stream. Not the opinion of some idiot (me) in the forums.

 

I've posted far more comments in favor of the game versus tongue-in-cheek posts about its future.

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I hope there's more on the way as well. I imagine Jason does, too. 

All we can do is sit tight and find out! 

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Comment from jason in todays devdiary thread mention they are working on scenarios with a lot of planes. I suppose this is single player.

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20 hours ago, PvWolfe said:

 

I must admit that I've not delved too deeply as yet, especially in the multi player, but I hope there is more to come at this price tag.

Multiplayer is where it's at.  Much more of a realistic experience than SP - danger lurks everywhere and is unpredictable.   Though to be fair that doesn't justify the price tag, since it is the players who are providing the content in MP.

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5 hours ago, =CfC=FatherTed said:

Multiplayer is where it's at. 

 

Sorry, but the cold hard facts just don't bear that out at all. Far more people play in SP than MP.

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10 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

Sorry, but the cold hard facts just don't bear that out at all. Far more people play in SP than MP.

 I've often heard this. Which makes me wonder why FC was released with virtually no SP content?

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2 minutes ago, J5_Gamecock said:

 I've often heard this. Which makes me wonder why FC was released with virtually no SP content?


Because SP content is a lot more expensive, and they can’t afford to risk a lot of resources on something that might not make that money back.  The more people who buy FC1, the more willing they’ll be to risk money on FC2.

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lol, i just bought it today. 80$ is steep for the content provided. Can hardly see any upgrade with regards to visual quality on the aircraft, but the VR made for a great flying experience nonetheless. RoF was such a great time i couldn't hold out anymore on trying it. Sadly, the first mp game i ever join is stacked 1/3 for more than an hour and over several missions, with none of the experienced players caring about anything other than keeping their scores up. I have no issue with getting blasted out of the sky, in fact, 50% of why i loved RoF so much was the damage model. However simply taking off to be target practice is not the flying i'm after in MP.

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4 minutes ago, BraveSirRobin said:


Because SP content is a lot more expensive, and they can’t afford to risk a lot of resources on something that might not make that money back.  The more people who buy FC1, the more willing they’ll be to risk money on FC2.

Fair enough.... And how the hell are ya?  

 

 Hope you're keeping safe during all this mess.  S!

 

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14 minutes ago, BraveSirRobin said:


Because SP content is a lot more expensive, and they can’t afford to risk a lot of resources on something that might not make that money back.  The more people who buy FC1, the more willing they’ll be to risk money on FC2.

Im sure that reasoning makes sense why evaluating the risk/benefit in basic terms but , to me at least,  the fact that there is no real SP element means its unlikely to ever attract the larger SP base Luke refers to and always risks under performing sales wise. Especially at the price point its at and particularily given the SP content of its predecessor.

 

Expecting people to back something on a very vague promise there may be a 2.0 and it may possibly be more SP friendly is equally something that im sure makes sense to someone.

 

Neither makes sense to me but im not a dev and dont  have any insight into the reasoning.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, BOO said:

Expecting people to back something on a very vague promise there may be a 2.0 and it may possibly be more SP friendly 

 


It wasn’t about “expecting” anything.  Either people buy it even though it’s not quite what they want, or they don’t buy it and the developer moves on to other things that should produce more revenue.

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1 minute ago, BraveSirRobin said:


It wasn’t about “expecting” anything.  Either people buy it even though it’s not quite what they want, or they don’t buy it and the developer moves on to other things that should produce more revenue.

I think having next to no SP worth unless you enter the clonky realms of the ME is a little more than it being "not quite want they want". If there is nothing of SPers to do out of the box then they wont buy it but surely without even trying a even a little bit that would never be tested?

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, =CfC=FatherTed said:

Multiplayer is where it's at.  Much more of a realistic experience than SP - danger lurks everywhere and is unpredictable.   Though to be fair that doesn't justify the price tag, since it is the players who are providing the content in MP.

I respectfully disagree that it’s more realistic, but it’s definitely more of a challenge. Every one of us has what? Maybe 3000, 5000 or 10,000 hours of combat flight time? What did the average WWI pilot have? Every server is packed full of Richthofens on steroids. Add to that voice coms ... and realism sort of goes out the window. It’s difficult to grow the user base with such a challenging environment. 

Edited by the_dudeWG
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Posted (edited)

Seems like the framework for SP is already in place now that the series has a career mode.  With a ton of the research already done on top of that.

 

At this point can it be more difficult and expensive than making a whole new 109 or 190 that just has minor differences from the last one?

Edited by J28w-Broccoli

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, BOO said:

I think having next to no SP worth unless you enter the clonky realms of the ME is a little more than it being "not quite want they want". If there is nothing of SPers to do out of the box then they wont buy it but surely without even trying a even a little bit that would never be tested?

 

Then buy the other great WW1 flight sim with modern graphics and realistic flight models.

 

Oh, right, that game doesn't exist.

 

So this is really your only option.  If enough people buy it, hopefully they can add more SP content.  If not enough people buy it, there will probably be no one developing WW1 flight sims for a while. 

 

Demanding that the developer risk a lot of money that they don't really have on SP content is probably a non-starter.

Edited by BraveSirRobin
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Well, when I bought FC, I also bought BoBP, it was kind of a goofy deal. Actualy I bought BoBP, and FC, I THOUGHT FC was included. I had the FC planes, but could not fly them😟. So I payed my monies to be able to fly them, but the advertising seemed to hint that it was a new release, and there was more to come. If one looks at the write up for FC right now, it still seems to hint at that, talking about careers, and missions and what not. Well, I don't see that happening, and either do most people going by what one reads in the threads about it. I started a thread asking about "Upgrades" and was pretty much informed not to hold my breath.

Now if the Devs come out with a "2.0" I'm sure they are going to want more money for it. Why would one pay more for it when the first edition doesn't live up to IT'S hype?

I can't say that I'm dissapointed in FC, but, I can't say I'm all that impressed either. I guess if I had to use one word to describe BoBP & FC it would have to be lac-luster. IMHO

KB

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23 minutes ago, Knarley-Bob said:

If one looks at the write up for FC right now, it still seems to hint at that, talking about careers, and missions and what not.

 

Where are you seeing this?  I checked https://il2sturmovik.com/store/flying-circus/ and the word "career" is not found on that page.  There isn't even a hint of a career.

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So now that we've determined that FC is pretty much exactly what they said it would be, what is it that you find "lac-luster" about BoBP?  Because that module probably has the most popular aircraft lineup of any of the GB games so far (unless you're Russian).

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, FarlanderMiG said:

80$ is steep for the content provided.

They should just keep the price of FC1 at $40 US, as its been stated, it’s just an experiment to see if there’s an interest. No Career (save for PWCG), no seasons except maybe in Mods, a small map and just 10 planes, including only 2 Two seaters.


A Vol.2 would likely require a complete map like in RoF, possibly with seasons, a Pilot Career, and multi seaters like the Breguet, DH4, DFW.CV, Handley Page and Gotha bombers. Planes like the BE2, Zeppelins, aka, planes that weren’t in RoF as well as maps such as Austria-Hungary would help boost sales.

 

But yeah, $80 US for FC1 is quite steep, possibly even beyond steep. Would understand if there was the large Western Front map and or 15-20 planes that are already in Rise of Flight, but for what’s in FC1, better to just leave it at $40.

Edited by Novice-Flyer
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Posted (edited)

 

"...but, I can't say I'm all that impressed either."  (name omitted to protect the innocently innocent)

 

 

I sure as heck can say I'm impressed!   I'm impressed I'm still playing a upgraded, continually improving FM and DM that has reportedly one of the best VR experiences out there.  One that I don't even have the ability to enjoy as I don't even own VR yet.   Yup, I'm IMPRESSED!  It's been 15 years since I first started playing WWI flight sims, which many uninformed newer and some Cynical veterans continually try to convince me and other potential new community members, is a niche and dying corner of the flight sim world.  Why would I ever listen to either?!  Yeah, I'm impressed as heck, alright!  Onward and Upward!

 

 

Edited by J5_Baeumer
added link to facts
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I’ve tried most WWI flying titles, in single player at least, since Red Baron days. With VR FC1 is blowing my head off. So are the Central pilots but that is another story! I’m loving it. I forked out for a Valve Index last year mainly for flight sims and with what that brings to  immersion and multiplayer like Jasta 5’s Bloody April server I think we are actually in a good place right now. 

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Posted (edited)

I think the issue is.. The experience is not really that different than what RoF would've been if they updated it to VR. Instead they have focused on other series and building up the engine around those. As someome in uni, 80$ is not excactly pocket change, and with the quality i get in DCS and other packs here (really enjoying BOBP right now) i'm left a little worried with what i'm seeing. I'm not a fan of the prop textures/animation at all, i think it looks really bad. The textures on the aircraft are, well.. i expected more. The 3d models themselves are the same, like they work.. But the major issue is that none of this rework seems to have used the new practices and qualities expected in the 3d industry by now? Talking about the aircrafts, you could tell me this was from 2013, and i would have believed you. 

 

Now this is not a complaint on the series in general, i love what they have done. But the FC1 just leaves me with questions. Who are they really targeting? It's gonna be very difficult to get those more casual RoF pilots with a new product that contains just a small percentage of the content at this pricepoint. Personally i've held off buying it from the start till now, as the servers seemed dead (presumably because others were also thinking like me) and the only feature i could see as really improving the experience was VR. And i'm not used to paying 80$ for VR implementation.

 

Quote

it’s just an experiment to see if there’s an interest

 

This worries me to, as i almost feel as if the price is basically them saying they don't think it's worth the development unless people are willing to pay up. Not having trust in the content to become popular.

Edited by FarlanderMiG
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Facts is, that many ppl have ambivalent opinions about whole FC experiment .

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hiya fellas,

I just got it, I had held out because I didn't see much difference with ROF and it has more content.

FC1 is good, I hope it continues as I would really to see all the ROF content and more..

I'm glad I have FC1 now and will get what ever is next.

seeyas 

spud 

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2 hours ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

Facts is, that many ppl have ambivalent opinions about whole FC experiment .


Fact is that many people in this community spend lots of time looking for things to complain about rather than having fun with what is available.

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3 hours ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

Facts is, that many ppl have ambivalent opinions about whole FC experiment .

 

...and I'm sure they'd have been much happier carrying on complaining that the WWI combat flight sim community had been abandoned entirely.

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2 hours ago, BraveSirRobin said:


Fact is that many people in this community spend lots of time looking for things to complain about rather than having fun with what is available.

 

Not going to have fun and just complaining is just unbelievable stupid , better to just turn away save the energy .

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40 minutes ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

 

Not going to have fun and just complaining is just unbelievable stupid , better to just turn away save the energy .


And yet, here we are.

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

Sorry, but the cold hard facts just don't bear that out at all. Far more people play in SP than MP.

That maybe true, but my point to the OP was that, IMO, multiplayer is the most enjoyable way to play the game.  By his own admission he hadn't tried it yet, so i was suggesting he should in order to get value for money.

Edited by =CfC=FatherTed

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21 hours ago, the_dudeWG said:

I respectfully disagree that it’s more realistic, but it’s definitely more of a challenge. Every one of us has what? Maybe 3000, 5000 or 10,000 hours of combat flight time? What did the average WWI pilot have? Every server is packed full of Richthofens on steroids. Add to that voice coms ... and realism sort of goes out the window. It’s difficult to grow the user base with such a challenging environment. 

Okay, so the key phrase in my post is "realistic experience". Any discussion about realism per se in videogames will always be reductive, because they're not real.  What I was trying to say was that in terms of SP vs MP in FC, the latter gives the player a better experience of what it was like to fly in WW1.  I'm not saying that FC MP is actually realistic.  I understand what you're saying about our ability to learn from mistakes, as opposed to the actual pilots, and our use of comms, but I still think that the "live" nature of a MP server generates more of a feel of what it was to fly in those times than any SP mission can.

 

We all have different definitions of "realistic", but for me it's how you feel when you fly.  In SP I know I'm coming up against a scripted occurrence and then predictable algorithms, whereas in MP I don't know what's going to happen, and that, to me, makes it much more realistic in terms of my experience.

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