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216th_LuseKofte

HS 129 is really just fun

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After a long while I finally can start it. The historical one level mixture setting does not work with mixture engine #1 like in fighters. 
Anyway have been in 7th heaven a couple of days in WOL server and finnish server flying it. 
I expected to get shot down a lot more, 

but I believe I flew under 100 KPH in a turn with 10% flap and the fighter could just not get me. 
I shot down one LA 5 in climb after attacking me. And the only fatality I got was my own screw up hitting a tree. 
I find it so far more survivable than the IL 2 with or without a gunner, it is more in line with a 41 mod with little fuel and full rear view. 
I really appreciate flying this plane now. 
But even if its management was unique historically. Its engine management should be standardized or settings for control should be possible to save for each plane like COD and DCS. Duck and JU 52 is among those very unique planes requiring special settings

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I agree, but I've always loved the duck since IL-2 1946 just for being such an underdog. Now all we need is a b-3 so we can play with that under slung 75mm cannon.

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42 minutes ago, Lord_Strange said:

I agree, but I've always loved the duck since IL-2 1946 just for being such an underdog. Now all we need is a b-3 so we can play with that under slung 75mm cannon.

 

Yes!

 

75mm cannons are a good thing. :cool:

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8 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

But even if its management was unique historically. Its engine management should be standardized or settings for control should be possible to save for each plane like COD and DCS. Duck and JU 52 is among those very unique planes requiring special settings

 

I don't know about JU 52, but HS-129 has standard settings which are simplified. The reason they are simplified is because your RPM-governor has only 1 position, so when you switch to constant-speed-propeller mode you cannot change your propeller RPM up or down (like you can in for example P-38, JU-87 and many other planes) because you're stuck with one "combat setting" RPM.

 

That being said I find that HS-129 is an amazing plane in VR. For example: with the cockpit open I can stick my head out, and observe each single rivet on the windshield frame. Plus the forward sitting position makes one feel like a bird, because there is such an unobstructed view. And it goes without saying the 3D cockpit just blows me away every time I sit in it. The gauges seem so real I feel I can literally touch them.

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9 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

I expected to get shot down a lot more, 

but I believe I flew under 100 KPH in a turn with 10% flap and the fighter could just not get me. 
I shot down one LA 5 in climb after attacking me. And the only fatality I got was my own screw up hitting a tree. 
I find it so far more survivable than the IL 2 with or without a gunner, it is more in line with a 41 mod with little fuel and full rear view.

 

The duck is shockingly maneuverable. What works for me when attacking them, if I don't hit them in my initial pass, is to climb to about 500-1k and keep my eyes on them. The first pass generally spooks the Henschel pilot and they'll turn for a while, but I'm too high for them to hit. Eventually they think I've lost sight of them and will start to run in a straight line. I can then dive on them again, and their visibility seems to be poor enough that they don't usually evade.

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7 minutes ago, Charon said:

 

The duck is shockingly maneuverable. What works for me when attacking them, if I don't hit them in my initial pass, is to climb to about 500-1k and keep my eyes on them. The first pass generally spooks the Henschel pilot and they'll turn for a while, but I'm too high for them to hit. Eventually they think I've lost sight of them and will start to run in a straight line. I can then dive on them again, and their visibility seems to be poor enough that they don't usually evade.

Well I do not expect the hunt is over after first pass. I do not circle that much. But I do odd manouvers to keep the attacker in sight. 

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4 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

I like to fly it manually. I do not fly it with automated settings. 

Manual is definitely better. Automatic RPM control just seems to make the engines freak out a bit. Maybe I fly it a bit too agressively.

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7 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

I like to fly it manually. I do not fly it with automated settings. 

 

I fly it with manual RPM on takeoff, flying to target, and landing. But in combat i just put it on auto and with full throttle you can fly for 30 minutes.

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I find it way more efficient than Stuka G to kill tanks. Btw I don't understand why it's so hard now to kill those tanks with the BK37 (it's since the update that improved the DM of tanks). 

 

The underbelly cannon is easier and more precise to use. About half of flaps down allows to fly with a nose down attitude, this way you can approach the tank sticked to the ground which is very fun and a bit safer (if you avoid trees...).

 

The only thing about this aircraft: it is not fast... making it a very easy target for the flak. 

 

 

5 hours ago, LLv24_Sukka24 said:

I fly it with manual RPM on takeoff, flying to target, and landing. But in combat i just put it on auto and with full throttle you can fly for 30 minutes.

 

Same. 30min is largely enough and you can focus on your targets and everything around instead of constantly ajusting your pitch. 

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For takeoff I stay at auto, so I don't have to care for the RPMs. I switch to manual as soon as gear and flaps are up. But I am really bad at hunting tanks, I am better destroying soft targets with the MG151/20. Those centered weapons are absolutely deadly.

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1 hour ago, JG300_Faucon said:

Same. 30min is largely enough and you can focus on your targets and everything around instead of constantly ajusting your pitch. 

 

Yep, that's why its engine system was designed that way.

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Lusekofte

Have you played Panzerknacker i found it very entertaining and a good way to learn the aircraft and tactics

 

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9 hours ago, LLv24_Sukka24 said:

 

I fly it with manual RPM on takeoff, flying to target, and landing. But in combat i just put it on auto and with full throttle you can fly for 30 minutes.

I did not know you could fly that long full power at auto. It sounds terrible doing that. Thanks

1 hour ago, Zippy-do-dar said:

Lusekofte

Have you played Panzerknacker i found it very entertaining and a good way to learn the aircraft and tactics

 

No did not know about that. Thanks will try it

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

Yep, that's why its engine system was designed that way.


Yes I know about why it was designed.  The gnome engines fitted really was not ideal. The designed auto pitch was not ideal but meant for make flying easier. 
It is one of the historical facts making me adore this plane. 

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Indeed a fun plane! Only realized I had to set it to manual RPM when I was in the air, but I managed in time without destroying the engine :).

 

I flew attached mission that I generated with the EMG. Also found a bug: Looks like the m1gun howitzer is not being counted in debriefing!

 

 

EMG_Hs129.zip

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Flying the HS 129 online render you to fly in wol. Only casualty I had there is twice a 109 hit me while I taxi to runway. 
So I will fly it most offline

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I Have had a lot of trouble just getting it off the ground during take off..that's what's prevented me from having more fun with it in the Scripted Campaign....

download (2).jpg

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I put it on manual pitch 0% and go. Look at instrument on witch way it goes so you do not groundloop. It must be handeled like the 

JU 88

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Don't forget boost

I also hold the brakes while i bring the revs up this has helped with take off

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I increase throttle quite slowly, so I see, when it starts to turn to one direction, then smooth breaking at the opposite side, to bring it straight again. Only with strong crosswinds it gets a bit tricky, but still managable.

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If you have two separate throttles, you can also use them asymmetrically.

Make sure you're quick with the rudder. Once a swing develops, it needs to be corrected quickly, or you're going for a ride!

 

The duck feels much like flying a chopper at low level. Contour-flying: Hopping trees and seeking cover by all kinds of contours.

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Yesterday I was down in 90 kp/h and turning without stalling. I had a chaser I simply could not get rid off. 
Later in the end of battle I saw it was a I 16

A smartypants had discovered HS 129 was in action, and chose his ride carefully. I ditched never able to gain speed when he hit my engine right side

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Yep I stand in the brakes and get the engines screaming on boost before I start rolling, that way the rudder has PLENTY of air going over it and is more effective at keeping any ground-looping tendencies at bay.  I also keep the stick back on initial roll to keep the tail planted, then transition quickly to some forward stick to get the tail off the ground and accelerate once it's clear that the takeoff roll is tracking OK and sufficient rudder authority is available. 

 

Went through the Panzerknacker campaign without ever using auto-mix or auto-pitch.    One of the rewards of flying this plane is seeing how well it responds to proper engine management.  I was about ready to swear this plane off until I was advised about reducing mix to 66% after takeoff and keeping the prop RPM in the happy zone.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, =[TIA]=Stoopy said:

Yep I stand in the brakes and get the engines screaming on boost before I start rolling, that way the rudder has PLENTY of air going over it and is more effective at keeping any ground-looping tendencies at bay.  I also keep the stick back on initial roll to keep the tail planted, then transition quickly to some forward stick to get the tail off the ground and accelerate once it's clear that the takeoff roll is tracking OK and sufficient rudder authority is available. 

 

Went through the Panzerknacker campaign without ever using auto-mix or auto-pitch.    One of the rewards of flying this plane is seeing how well it responds to proper engine management.  I was about ready to swear this plane off until I was advised about reducing mix to 66% after takeoff and keeping the prop RPM in the happy zone.

 

"If at first I don't succeed...etc...." I'll try try again following your advice...

 

 

ace2.jpg

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Otherwise fun plane, but I find 30mm cannon to be quite underwhelming against tanks anything bigger than T-70. You can kill perhaps 1-3, but you get much better results with Ju-88 and bombs. And safer too.

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It's one of the plane that I haven't flown much, but it's definitely fun. Took it for a couple of rides on WOL the other day, I enjoyed it and even managed to survive an attack by a La-5 and come back home to tell it.

Only think is that beside of its AT guns (which are not easy to use), its bomb load is not really impressive, as a 110 or a Fw-190 can both carry more and heavier bombs while being faster. It's a terrific strafer against softer targets though.

 

P.S.: and why are the prop pitch (same also in the early Pe2) and especially pitch trim inversed in this plane ?

Edited by SYN_Ricky

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On 2/9/2020 at 3:50 AM, Yogiflight said:

 But I am really bad at hunting tanks, I am better destroying soft targets with the MG151/20. Those centered weapons are absolutely deadly.

 

17 hours ago, Hanu said:

Otherwise fun plane, but I find 30mm cannon to be quite underwhelming against tanks anything bigger than T-70. You can kill perhaps 1-3, but you get much better results with Ju-88 and bombs. And safer too.

Using Jade Monkey's tank busting practice mission has helped me a lot in destroying tanks.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25593-jade_monkeys-single-player-sp-missions/

 

Edited by Plurp

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1 hour ago, Plurp said:

Using Jade Monkey's tank busting practice mission has helped me a lot in destroying tanks.

Yes, I know that mission, and I was quite successfull in destroying tanks, too, but not with the gun.:dash:

:biggrin:

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3 hours ago, SYN_Ricky said:

P.S.: and why are the prop pitch (same also in the early Pe2) and especially pitch trim inversed in this plane ?

 

Because it's a direct pitch control instead of RPM control. 

Pitch angle increased will lower the RPM. That's why it's inverted.

Edited by JG300_Faucon
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My problem with the HS 129 is not the way it works it is the control setting interphase that now is a complete mess. You need to have two sets of prop pitch switches two for PE 2 that allow you to to seperately set them and 1 for both pitches in HS 129. 
this sim suppose to be less complicated than DCS and I have problems remember what buttons set to what when one fly all types and sides. It should simply be all combinations you need and you can put axis or buttons as you choose. 

Edited by LuseKofte

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2 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

My problem with the HS 129 is not the way it works it is the control setting interphase that now is a complete mess. You need to have two sets of prop pitch switches two for PE 2 that allow you to to seperately set them and 1 for both pitches in HS 129. 
this sim suppose to be less complicated than DCS and I have problems remember what buttons set to what when one fly all types and sides. It should simply be all combinations you need and you can put axis or buttons as you choose. 

 

I dont exactly know what you mean. I haven't flew the early pe2, the one with switches instead of leavers for RPM in a while. But I can use the same buttons for RPM/prop pitch on every aircraft that doesn't use leaver/axis.

109(manual), 110(manual), pe2,190(manual)

 

I have set 2 buttons for engine 1, overlaping prop pitch and RPM

AND another 2 buttons for the same on engine 2

I have a CH throttle quadrant, so that's not an issue :)

 

But I can control RPM/prop pitch of hs129 and pe2 with the same buttons allright.

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I have axis enough and buttons enough. I cant use axis for the HS 129 because I have engine 1 and 2 rpm set on two axis if I set one axis for all it will override the two seperate rpm axis on other planes. 

298CADBF-E978-496A-A9A6-B00B2CC9734E.jpeg

Edited by LuseKofte

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1 hour ago, LuseKofte said:

. I cant use axis for the HS 129 because I have engine 1 and 2 rpm set on two axis if I set one axis for all it will override the two seperate rpm axis on other planes. 

The RPM should not be on axis for the Hs 129, anyway. The RPMs were set with switches for RPM higher/lower. So no need for axis. I use for the Hs 129 the three switches on my Saitek Throttle Quadrant. The right switch up for change prop pitch between auto and manual for engine 1l, down for engine 2. The left switch for prop pitch for engine 1 higher/lower, the middle switch the same for engine 2. The same switches I can use for manual prop pitch of the Bf 110, when I fly it with manual prop pitch, no matter, that in the 110 you don't regulate the RPMs, like in the 129, but the prop pitch itself. It should work for the Pe 2, too.

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4 hours ago, LuseKofte said:

I have axis enough and buttons enough. I cant use axis for the HS 129 because I have engine 1 and 2 rpm set on two axis if I set one axis for all it will override the two seperate rpm axis on other planes. 

298CADBF-E978-496A-A9A6-B00B2CC9734E.jpeg

Omg i love your setup!!!!

If i was wealthy after a pc for vr and vr Id want somethimg like that.

Jeesh i thought the warthog hotas would be a dream!

If I rlly had money Id also goto that company selling joysticks that are bf109 replicas

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5 hours ago, Yogiflight said:

The RPM should not be on axis for the Hs 129, anyway. The RPMs were set with switches for RPM higher/lower. So no need for axis.

 

Yep, in fact, you can't even use the RPM axis with the Hs 129. It's all keyboard / switch inputs, like you talked about here. 

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5 hours ago, Sublime said:

Omg i love your setup!!!!

If i was wealthy after a pc for vr and vr Id want somethimg like that.

Jeesh i thought the warthog hotas would be a dream!

If I rlly had money Id also goto that company selling joysticks that are bf109 replicas

This throttle cost me 225$ and a little time setting it up

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

Yep, in fact, you can't even use the RPM axis with the Hs 129. It's all keyboard / switch inputs, like you talked about here. 

I think you can put it on axis. At least someone told me. But why cannot the rpm buttons be the same as PE 2 just backwards? 

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22 minutes ago, LuseKofte said:

I think you can put it on axis. At least someone told me. 

 

No, you cannot put the Hs 129 RPM controls on an axis, just like the Bf 109 and Fw 190's RPM cannot be put on an axis.

 

 

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50 minutes ago, LuseKofte said:

This throttle cost me 225$ and a little time setting it up

I think you can put it on axis. At least someone told me. But why cannot the rpm buttons be the same as PE 2 just backwards? 

Reaaaly nice setup!  o7

 

As I tried to say before. You CAN have the same 2 buttons for engine #1 prop pitch on hs129, and RPM on pe2 series 35

 

And and another 2 buttons for engine #2 hs129 prop pitch and pe2 series 35 RPM

 

Go into key maping and look engine maping, go low and go to engine #1 maping.

You can put button "A" to engine 1 increase prop pitch. AND the same "A" button to increase engine 1 RPM

 

Then button "B" to decrease engine 1 prop pitch and decrease RPM

 

Repeat on engine #2 with buttons "C" and "D"

 

You are putting the same "A" button on 2 diferent actions. But you either have direct pitch control, or RPM control on a given aircraft.

 

This is all independant of selecting "Z" axis as RPM axis on aircraft that alow it..

 

So you end up with 3 modes of controling RPM/prop pitch. It just happen that 2 of them use the same buttons.

 

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