Atlantic Carrier Ops Possible?

[FliegerAD 15]

On 2/2/2020 at 7:32 PM, III/JG53Frankyboy said:

hell yes, Corsairs, Hellcats, Martlets, Barracudas..... wet dreams

 

And the scenario would be fresh. It is not often that you would see traditional German and US (build) naval fighters clash, and harrassing German ships in Fjords or protecting them... ah that would be great. And although sea planes like the BV 138 may not be hot sellers, they offer interesting new mission ideas.

[Bies 470]

Sounds like a great idea. This could be a gap closer for the Pacific in the future. Carrier operations without need of modeling Japanese planes with scarce data.

Actually it sounds brilliant.

[COVIDCowboy 31]

It's not too late to bump this thread is it?

 

 

Battle of Atlantic:

 

Area: near celtic sea/western approaches area (airfields located on minimal land mapped in both UK and France)

 

Aircraft:

USN/FAA - Primary missions range from hunter-killer tasks against u-boats to defending convoys against Fliegerführer Atlantik raids/recon

 - Wildcat/Martlet

 - F4U/Corsair

 - Avenger (swordfish if early)

 - Seafire (skua if early?)

 - Firefly (Hurricat/catafighter if early)

 

Fliegerführer Atlantik - Primary missions range from ship attack, minelaying, recon, etc...

 - FW200

 - HE-115

 - Do-217

 - Ju-88c

 

Ships:

USN/RN:

 - Bogue class escort carrier

 - Illustrious Class fleet carrier

 - Capital ships

 - Merchants (various classes)

 

Kriegsmarine:

 - Type VII U-boat

 - Merchant Raider

 - S-100 class

 - Capital ships?

 - Merchant (various classes)

 

 

General idea is smaller scale operations with carriers in realistic way. Escort carriers especially offer a chance for less AI, and almost mirror IL-2:PF (imagine a flight of two avengers and two martlets instead of a massive fleet carrier attack). There are many cons for something like this however, as the content is stacked in favor of the Allies. Additionally, historic convoy routes might not match up with what a BoX map would allow, diminishing realism. Furthermore, we can only have so many aircraft. As much as I want to see the F6F, sea hurri, ar-196, sunderland, and many many more, we are naturally limited.

 

 

 

[DD_Arthur 2752]

1 hour ago, COVIDCowboy said:

It's not too late to bump this thread is it?

 

No but I think you've actually made a good case for invading Sicily.  The most numerous aircraft operating from carriers in the Atlantic throughout the war was the Fairy Swordfish.

It proved to be a brilliant, adaptable anti-submarine aircraft.

 

It could only do that as it had no aerial opposition.

 

Now Sicily....or better still, Salerno......... 

[-RR-Napoleon- 39]

I am a huge fan of the battle of Sicily or Central Med or whatever you want to call it. 
I have taken the liberty to overlay the Kuban Map over a proposed area. The green bar is an extend few Km to help include more Allied bases. 
A plane set for this wouldn't need to differ too much from what we already have. 

Here are extreme examples for both Sicily and Malta campaign with as many DIFFERENT aircraft as possible. The list is incomplete but I'm sure you guys will have some opinions on this!

Battle of Sicily
Allied:
Fighters Options:

• P-40F
• Seafire IIC

Attackers Options:

• Beaufighter (type unkown)
• P-38G

Bomber Options:

• B-25 C/D

Collector Options:

• A-36 Apache
   

Axis:
Fighter Options:

• Bf-109F4 (Trop)
• Bf-109G2 (Trop)
• MC.205

Attacker Options:

• Bf-110G

 

Bomber Options:

• Ju-88C Torp
• S.M. 79

 

Collector Options:

• Fiat G.55

Battle of Malta:

Allied:

Fighters:

• Sea Gladiator Mk.I
• Hurricane Mk.I

Attacker:

•  

Bomber:

• A-30 Baltimore Mk. V

Collectors:

• Spitfire Mk Vc

 

Axis:

Fighter:

• Fiat G.50
• Cr.42

Attackers:

• Ju-87B

Bombers:

• CANT. 1007

Collectors:

• C.200
  
   

(Maps shows Kuban sized map + added (green area) for additional allied bases)

Edited March 27, 2020 by -RR-Napoleon-
Add Ju-87B to the Malta Axis Planeset

[SqueakyS 66]

Quote

Fighters Options:

• P-40F
• Seafire IIC

Attackers Options:

• Beaufighter (type unkown)
• P-38G

Bomber Options:

• B-25 C/D

Collector Options:

• A-36 Apache

 

Looking at this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Husky_order_of_battle#Allied_Air_Forces

 

Beauforts, Blenhiems, wellingtons, or Hudsons would be a better replacement to the B-25

[-RR-Napoleon- 39]

While I agree, I think it would be more disappointing to have another map without a flyable B-25. Also, there is a significant number of B-25 squadrons for the USAAF and RAF

[56RAF_Roblex 1080]

I would love to see carriers in a Med theatre but while that is historic, it is not really fair when the Axis don't have a carrier of their own.   Personally I would be quite willing to see a fantasy scenario where the Graf Zeppelin carrier actually got launched with its tail hook JU87s and 109s. 

 

I would still be happy to see a Med scenario without the British carriers if it brings us Beauforts and mossies operating out of Malta etc.     Lots of anti-shipping missions and harbour attacks.

[Keko_ 185]

On 3/25/2020 at 3:12 AM, -RR-Napoleon- said:

I am a huge fan of the battle of Sicily or Central Med or whatever you want to call it. 
I have taken the liberty to overlay the Kuban Map over a proposed area. The green bar is an extend few Km to help include more Allied bases. 
A plane set for this wouldn't need to differ too much from what we already have. 

Here are extreme examples for both Sicily and Malta campaign with as many DIFFERENT aircraft as possible. The list is incomplete but I'm sure you guys will have some opinions on this!

Battle of Sicily
Allied:
Fighters Options:

• P-40F
• Seafire IIC

Attackers Options:

• Beaufighter (type unkown)
• P-38G

Bomber Options:

• B-25 C/D

Collector Options:

• A-36 Apache
   

Axis:
Fighter Options:

• Bf-109F4 (Trop)
• Bf-109G2 (Trop)
• MC.205

Attacker Options:

• Bf-110G

 

Bomber Options:

• Ju-88C Torp
• S.M. 79

 

Collector Options:

• Fiat G.55

Battle of Malta:

Allied:

Fighters:

• Sea Gladiator Mk.I
• Hurricane Mk.I

Attacker:

•  

Bomber:

• A-30 Baltimore Mk. V

Collectors:

• Spitfire Mk Vc

 

Axis:

Fighter:

• Fiat G.50
• Cr.42

Attackers:

•  

Bombers:

• CANT. 1007

Collectors:

• C.200
  
   

(Maps shows Kuban sized map + added (green area) for additional allied bases)

I like the Idea!! 

[gimpy117 132]

ask the dev team who's putting in the martlett in clod very very nicely? one on a jeep carrier in normandy would be interesting 

[Oliver88 248]

On 3/28/2020 at 4:56 AM, gimpy117 said:

ask the dev team who's putting in the martlett in clod very very nicely? one on a jeep carrier in normandy would be interesting 

 

Interesting but not relevant to the proposed area that we are receiving. The map area would need to be stretched much further west to include them. The escort carriers were in the South West approaches. Everyone else, or at least anyone closer, from the Fleet Air Arm supporting the invasion were doing so from shore bases. In the proposed map area that (at least when last checked them in December) provides us with the squadrons listed below. But reckon you can forget the idea of carrier based operations for Normandy.

 

808 Squadron. Lee On Solent 14/05/1944. Departed 04/08/1944
During this time the squadron used the Seafire L.III and Spitfire L.Vb carrying out bombardment spotting, offensive sweeps, anti-submarine patrols and escort for transport aircraft.

 

819 Squadron. Manston 20/04/1944. Departed 01/08/1944. Swingfield 08/08/1944. Departed 01/10/1944. St Croix 29/10/1944. Maldeghem 11/11/1944. Departed 14/12/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Swordfish II and Swordfish III carrying out patrols and attacks on coastal shipping.

 

848 Squadron. Manston 20/04/1944. Thorney Island 14/06/1944. Lee On Solent 28/08/1944. Departed 16/09/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Avenger I and Swordfish I carrying out anti-shipping patrols.

 

854 Squadron. Hawkinge 23/05/1944. Thorney Island 07/08/1944. Lee On Solent 27/08/1944. Departed 07/09/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Avenger II carrying out anti-shipping patrols and were also credited with somehow shooting down two V1 bombs.

 

855 Squadron. Hawkinge 26/05/1944. Thorney Island 03/08/1944. Departed 07/08/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Avenger II carrying out anti-shipping patrols and strikes.

 

885 Squadron. Lee On Solent 13/05/1944. Departed 04/08/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Seafire L.III and Seafire F.III carrying out bombardment spotting, offensive sweeps, anti-submarine patrols and escort for the invasion fleet and subsequent ship movements.

 

886 Squadron. Lee On Solent 20/05/1944. Disbanded 19/07/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Seafire L.III carrying out bombardment spotting, offensive sweeps, anti-submarine patrols and escort for bombers.

 

897 Squadron. Lee On Solent 21/05/1944. Disbanded 17/07/1944.
During this time the squadron used the Spitfire L.Vb would have been doing the same sort of tasks as 808, 885 and 886 Squadrons.

 

Data gained from The Squadrons and Units of the Fleet Air Arm through seeing what squadrons were given Normandy and English Channel for Battle Honours. There are other squadrons with those honours than listed here but they were not based anywhere in the proposed map area during 1944.

Edited March 29, 2020 by Oliver88