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Am I the only one that would love to see a modification allowing the 1.42ATA power setting in the 109 G2? It is my current understanding that it would be one of the top performing 109s as far as speed in level flight and climb rate if it were capable of using the max power settings which I believe were cleared for use in very late 1942? Please correct me if I'm wrong. 

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It still is one of the best performing 109s all around without 1.42 ata tbh. With the G4 in this sim i dont think we need this mod.

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I don't really get wet, because I can use 1.42ATA in the G4 for one minute. So it is nothing I really miss.

But to answer your question, no you are not the only one, as this is not the first thread with this suggestion.

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1.42 ata for G-2/4/6 as a modification would be the best option imo.

 

Not cleared until October 1943 ?

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29 minutes ago, Yogiflight said:

I don't really get wet, because I can use 1.42ATA in the G4 for one minute. So it is nothing I really miss.

But to answer your question, no you are not the only one, as this is not the first thread with this suggestion.

 

37 minutes ago, H_Stiglitz said:

It still is one of the best performing 109s all around without 1.42 ata tbh. With the G4 in this sim i dont think we need this mod.

 

The G2 in combat power has even higher speed and climb rate than G4 in combat power. I'm certain that a G2 with 1.42ATA capability will be faster and also have better climb rate than G4 at all altitudes.

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2 minutes ago, III./JG7-MarkWilhelmsson said:

The G2 in combat power has even higher speed and climb rate than G4 in combat power. I'm certain that a G2 with 1.42ATA capability will be faster and also have better climb rate than G4 at all altitudes.

oh yes, that's for sure, but even the G2 outmatches its opponents by a s**tload already if done right. even higher performance with a mod is definitely not **needed**. It'd be mostly cosmetic and locked anywhere online anyway. maybe for SP, but i have to admit i rarely if even play SP so i dunno how needed such a mod really is

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Just now, H_Stiglitz said:

oh yes, that's for sure, but even the G2 outmatches its opponents by a s**tload already if done right. even higher performance with a mod is definitely not **needed**. It'd be mostly cosmetic and locked anywhere online anyway. maybe for SP, but i have to admit i rarely if even play SP so i dunno how needed such a mod really is

 

For people that wish to have a nicely competitive aircraft in late war scenarios if they only own Battle of Stalingrad maybe? I don't believe it would be a hard thing to do at all. Same engine settings as the G4 but with G2 airframe which is lighter and slightly more aerodynamic.

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7 minutes ago, III./JG7-MarkWilhelmsson said:

ish to have a nicely competitive aircraft in late war scenarios if they only own Battle of Stalingrad maybe?

It is hardly an interest of the devs to make it competitive in late war, but rather sell BoBP ;) i see your point and i would not complain getting the mod, but i don't expect it to happen at all :)

Edited by H_Stiglitz

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On 1/21/2020 at 4:51 PM, III./JG7-MarkWilhelmsson said:

 

For people that wish to have a nicely competitive aircraft in late war scenarios if they only own Battle of Stalingrad maybe? I don't believe it would be a hard thing to do at all. Same engine settings as the G4 but with G2 airframe which is lighter and slightly more aerodynamic.

I can confirm that. As someone who doesn‘t own BOK I have a disadvantage on „late“ war scenarios on TAW with the G2. It would be a great addition to have 1.42 ATA. Of course it isn‘t a top priority of the dev team, but still if it takes a while i still would love to have the mod. 
Edit: Just bought BOK in the sale😄

Edited by JuliMonkey
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I think that providing this expanded ATA would fit well with other modernization that is in progress such as the later version of the G6.

 

I know that some servers would have the late G6 AND an unlocked G2 prohibited as they don't like the fact that German planes are for the most part superior to Russian planes already 😉 

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if you need (or want hard) 1.42 ata in the G2, you are doing something wrong. Period.

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It should come with the larger wheel bulges and fixed tailwheel as was retrofitted in 1943, essentially bringing it to G-4 level.

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3 hours ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

It should come with the larger wheel bulges and fixed tailwheel as was retrofitted in 1943, essentially bringing it to G-4 level.

 

Which is something that constantly is overlooked, is that when it was given the 1.42 ATA, it was essentially converted to a G4.

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S!

 

@III/JG53Frankyboy You would be surprised. Finland got their brand new Bf109G-2´s in March 1943. And for example JG 5 up north flew Bf109E-7 as late as 1942 before converting to a newer model. Walter Schuck was one of their aces. According to Finnish pilots I have spoken to it was rather easy to get 1.42ata from the G-2, remove a restricting bolt in front of the throttle..But this was not done to preserve planes, we did not have an endless supply of them after all. The later acquired Bf109G-6´s were using 1.42ata. Those planes came in 1944.

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i knew one of our finnish friends would mention these finnish G-2 s.  I had them in my mind ( for the old VOW missionbuilding times i have some literature abou the Finns in WW2 ) , but wanted to see who would come up with this 😉

 

Salute Flanker !

Edited by III/JG53Frankyboy
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S!

 

 Of course 😄 The Bf109G-2 brought our air force up to the challenge VVS was making. The Brewsters and other planes began to be worn and outdated. Only the pilot skill saved from heavy losses and assigning the aged planes to other duties or more quiet front areas. Brewster could hold it´s own even against the La-5FN, but the performance gap was big. Bf109G-2 closed it and made it possible to intercept incoming air raids. Combined forces of Brewsters and 109s fought until end of hostilities in autumn 1944.

 

 It is interesting to read that even the Bf109G-2 was restricted to 1.31ata the performance was still sufficient. Juutilainen, Karhila and others said they had no problems outclimbing any VVS planes they faced: Yak-1/7/9, P39N/Q, LagG-3 and La-5F/FN. And they did face tough opponents like 4th GIAP KBF etc. Also the 24,5:1 K/D tells how good the 109G was :) Brewster had 32:1 K/D. Fiat G.50 48:1 if deducting losses to AA.

Edited by LLv34_Flanker
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1 hour ago, LLv34_Flanker said:

Brewster had 32:1 K/D. Fiat G.50 48:1 if deducting losses to AA.

 

This really shows how pilot tactics and training matters more compared to pure aircraft performance. These two fighters had performance similar to that of the I-16 Type 24 or maybe a bit slower at low altitudes based on their top speed at high altitude (though I haven't seen speed curves of them, if someone have them it would be nice). And they faced  MiGs, Yaks, Las, etc. If one day we get them in the game it will be quite the challenge to do well in them as the playing fields are equilibrated between players. Most people would stay in the 109. Unless they are used in something like the first map of TAW against the I-16 and upcoming Hurricane.


 

Edited by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard
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8 hours ago, III/JG53Frankyboy said:

i doubt much G2s survived till 1943 in Luftwaffe units....

 

Plenty of G-2s flew in the Caucasus battles of 1943.

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I'd be more interested in a F-4/Z (GM-1 Nitrous Oxide boost)

After all apparently 544 of them were made of the 1841 BF109 F-4's that were manufactured 

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On 1/22/2020 at 6:17 PM, LukeFF said:

 

Plenty of G-2s flew in the Caucasus battles of 1943.

my mistake ! i was not precise enough. I ment till fall 1943 when the Start-/Notleistung was given free (  IF some enginemodifications were done, not only removing a barrier at the throttle)

Edited by III/JG53Frankyboy

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49 minutes ago, novicebutdeadly said:

I'd be more interested in a F-4/Z (GM-1 Nitrous Oxide boost)

After all apparently 544 of them were made of the 1841 BF109 F-4's that were manufactured 

As much as I would like to see this variant, I highly doubt that there will be any use to none use in IL2. MW50 is effective up to 6000m and who flies higher than 6000m in an usual sortie?

Edited by JuliMonkey

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I've found that if you switch over to manual pitch control for the G2 you can up the RPM in order to squeeze out a bit more acceleration at crucial points.
You have to be careful with it though, because if you do it for too long or too hard the engine will seize with effectively no warning.

Bf-109 Reference Sheet.jpg

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On 1/21/2020 at 10:49 AM, H_Stiglitz said:

oh yes, that's for sure, but even the G2 outmatches its opponents by a s**tload already if done right. even higher performance with a mod is definitely not **needed**. It'd be mostly cosmetic and locked anywhere online anyway. maybe for SP, but i have to admit i rarely if even play SP so i dunno how needed such a mod really is

This is interesting. What oppos? More than a f4 or g4? I avoid G2s like the plague because the ata restriction I read about. When ive flied them they werent anemic feeling like F2s but..

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1 hour ago, Sublime said:

This is interesting. What oppos? More than a f4 or g4? I avoid G2s like the plague because the ata restriction I read about. When ive flied them they werent anemic feeling like F2s but..

The G2 is by far the best performing 109 in its timeframe, it outmatches the heavier G4 and at altitude also the F4. The acceleration and maneuverability are a mix between an F4 and G4, pretty nimble, really really fast.

the engine limit means nothing, slam throttle to max for 30 minutes and forget about it. You‘ll be surprised how good the g2 is.

i take the g2 over a g4 or g6 anytime if possible. 

Edited by H_Stiglitz

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6 minutes ago, H_Stiglitz said:

The G2 is by far the best performing 109 in its timeframe, it outmatches the heavier G4 and at altitude also the F4. The acceleration and maneuverability are a mix between an F4 and G4, pretty nimble, really really fast.

the engine limit means nothing, slam throttle to max for 30 minutes and forget about it. You‘ll be surprised how good the g2 is.

i take the g2 over a g4 or g6 anytime if possible. 

 

F4 is faster than the G2 at low and medium altitudes and is only about 3-4 kmh slower at 6km alt (on max combat power). It turns a lot better, is more fuel efficient and cockpit visibility is better. In the F4, on 1.34 ATA you have at least 7 minutes until the engine blows up. 

 

The G2 has better climb rate and maybe I'm imagining, but seems to roll better at high speed. Overall, I find the F4 superior to G2.

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8 hours ago, Bremspropeller said:

The one thing this game desperately needs is another 109 version.

 Aaaand;... what happend with G[6]-AS, or G-10 ?? ... As everyone will already know "G6 late" never existed. :umnik2:

image.thumb.png.5195ba2710efed7c5d4f460210652db3.png

By the way; there was only little differences between all Gustav series and Kurfurst series. I.A.W. real Bf-109´s Manuals,
The main difference was the engine, and associated systems. I think that it's is not an enormous developers work, because they have several Gustav´s modeled done yet.
image.thumb.png.7f19aa27c1994f94c0056e6a3787dc7c.png
 

 

Edited by III/JG52_Otto_-I-
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Ok as someone else noted Im almost certain I checked when playing SP months and months ago a 109 career in Stalingradand the 104 G4 is a few km/h faster at sea level at 2km meters or something.  Or maybe up to 5.  I do remenlmber my sweet spot for sp at the time meant on paler the f4 looked a teeny bit better.  It noted the new engine but said rush to service plus teething probz meant a lower ata limit and pilots didnt like.

I gotta gve it another chance I guess. Franklt in that time frame I gravitate to the F4 almost always.

That said I have invariably ended up in G2 cockpits a few times and ISTR it not going so hot.  Of course thats happened to me in *every* cockpit so I wouldnt use that as a metric 

Edited by Sublime

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On 1/22/2020 at 1:04 PM, III/JG53Frankyboy said:

i knew one of our finnish friends would mention these finnish G-2 s.  I had them in my mind ( for the old VOW missionbuilding times i have some literature abou the Finns in WW2 ) , but wanted to see who would come up with this 😉

 

Salute Flanker !

 

Aside from the Finnish example, the Royal Bulgarian Air Force operated around 84-88 G2s and G4s, mostly G2s, these being heavily engaged against the 15th USAAF from Operation Pointblank up to September 1944. The first batch of brand new 16 G2s was develivered in March 1943, followed by more (new and used) from June 1943 onwards, the last batch arriving in January 1944. I would imagine these were, at least most, enabled for 1.42ata. Bulgarian pilots certainly felt confident when engaging even Mustangs and considered the 109 a very fast fighter (it's official nickname was Стрела - Arrow). These were, ironically, later used against the Germans although they didn't see air combat against the Luftwaffe.

 

As far as I know, Romania used a fair number of G2s including against the USAAF over Bucharest and Ploesti, and I believe the Royal Hungarian Air Force too used them extensively. Both fought against the Soviets.

 

Between these you have four Axis nations that used several hundred G2s (and G4s) throughout '43-45. I don't see why it wouldn't be overall historically accurate to have a 1.42ata G2 against late war USAAF or Soviet airplanes.

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I'm not a technical pilot, but I found when flying 109s,

that I nearly always got home in a G2, not quite so often in  F2 and F4s.

I burned up a lot of F 2 and F4 engines, but never a G2.

And then there's the  Artificial Horizon, which earlier 109s don't have.

A life saver in the horrid Russian winter weather.

For all the more recent 109 versions, faster, better armed, I still given the chance,

take a G2. It just feels right for a guy like me.

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I absolutly prefer the F4 and the G4 over the G2. I think the G2 isn‘t that bad on stats but if you are in a dogfight or you have to escape really fast out of a situation the lack of the emergency power really puts you on a disadvantage. The argument of just slamming the throttle to max combat power and forget about it is worth nothing. The G4 and F4 also have combat power for 30 minutes and you can forget about it, but you still have the emergency power for bad situations. Overall i prefer the F4 just, because it is in my opinion the most balanced 109 in terms of its flight characteristics. It turns-, climbs-, accelerates well and is pretty fast.

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On 1/27/2020 at 8:15 PM, Burdokva said:

 

Between these you have four Axis nations that used several hundred G2s (and G4s) throughout '43-45. I don't see why it wouldn't be overall historically accurate to have a 1.42ata G2 against late war USAAF or Soviet airplanes.


While this is all true, the G-4 itself was little more than a late production G-2 (which usually had the non-retractable tail wheel and larger main wheels with small wing bulges) with a VHF radio (with longer range and clearer receive/transmission) fitted. 
 

So, IMO an 1,42 ata G-2 is largely redundant because of this as it would look and fly just like the G-4 - the different radio has no relevance to us simmers, as we have Disqus radio fitted ;with thousands of miles range 😄 )   to all planes anyway.

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perhaps WG should create ONE generic Bf109G and than give it ALL possible modifications from -1 to -10 . So everyone ca build a 109G for its personal taste......🤣

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On 1/25/2020 at 2:24 PM, Bremspropeller said:

The one thing this game desperately needs is another 109 version.

 

Oh yes you know it and you know that you want it also. G-10, G5-AS, G6-AS, G14-AS. This sim feels really empty without those. 😉

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On 1/30/2020 at 11:07 AM, VO101Kurfurst said:


While this is all true, the G-4 itself was little more than a late production G-2 (which usually had the non-retractable tail wheel and larger main wheels with small wing bulges) with a VHF radio (with longer range and clearer receive/transmission) fitted. 
 

So, IMO an 1,42 ata G-2 is largely redundant because of this as it would look and fly just like the G-4 - the different radio has no relevance to us simmers, as we have Disqus radio fitted ;with thousands of miles range 😄 )   to all planes anyway.

 

Here's a good comparison of the two: https://stormbirds.blog/2016/12/23/reviewing-the-bf109g-4/

 

The G-4 is heavier (reinforced undercarriage system and wing) and has more drag (fixed tail wheel, wing bulges). Yes, it's not as major as on the G-6 but is is noticeable. It climbs worse and is slower than the G-2 at the same ATA rating.

 

The G-2 with 1.42ATA would be some 10-15km/h faster than the G-4. That's not something to throw away especially if you're up against a P-51.

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7 minutes ago, III/JG53Frankyboy said:

typical Dogfight thinking.....how much 109G-2s (with modified DB605 to allow Notleistung) encountered P-51s in WW2 ?

 

Did you just completely ignore what I posted above? 

 

I don't fly on dogfight servers such as Berloga, mind you.

 

On 1/27/2020 at 9:15 PM, Burdokva said:

Between these you have four Axis nations that used several hundred G2s (and G4s) throughout '43-45. I don't see why it wouldn't be overall historically accurate to have a 1.42ata G2 against late war USAAF or Soviet airplanes.

 

Bulgaria, Romania and Hungary all were targets and fought actively against the USAAFs strategic bombing campaign. There were tens of dogfights between '109s and P-51s over Bulgaria alone with confirmed losses on both sides. 

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