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NETSCAPE

how do I turn off the Stuka dive recovery system?

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The default keybind does nothing. I tried rebinding it to other keys and buttons on my VKB stick and that did nothing. What's the trick?

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3 hours ago, NETSCAPE said:

The default keybind does nothing. I tried rebinding it to other keys and buttons on my VKB stick and that did nothing. What's the trick?

Just set up recovery for 0m.

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You can not turn off dive system at Ju-87. Control key (LCtrl+D by default) used at Ju-88 and Pe-2.

And contact altimeter is not connected with dive system, it is used only for sound warning.

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5 hours ago, Gavrick said:

You can not turn off dive system at Ju-87. Control key (LCtrl+D by default) used at Ju-88 and Pe-2.

And contact altimeter is not connected with dive system, it is used only for sound warning.

 

It would be a nice feature to disable it entirely on the Ju-87. They didn't use the dive recovery system this late in the war. 

 

6 hours ago, InProgress said:

Just set up recovery for 0m.

 

I'll relook at the keybinds and give it a go.

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34 minutes ago, NETSCAPE said:

It would be a nice feature to disable it entirely on the Ju-87.

Dive brakes and trimmers on the right side of elevator linked by hydraulic line, an there is no valves in this hydraulic line. And electrical part of dive system - electromagnet and spring in the trimmer control - "blocked" with the bomb drop system, and can be turned off only with it.

37 minutes ago, NETSCAPE said:

They didn't use the dive recovery system this late in the war. 

Do you have any document, mentioned that dive system is can be turned off some kind?

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@Gavrick

Sorry, I am not arguing they had a "turn off" button in the cockpit of the Stuka. 

 

However, there are first hand accounts of squadron and group leaders who said they uninstalled it immediately after receiving new machines. 

 

I gave examples of dive bombing and why they disabled dive recovery systems in this thread: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/39526-stuka-dive-bombing/

 

In short,

Helmut Mahlke:

 

"And what did we think of the automatic recovery system that was now being installed in production Ju 87's? Not a lot, was the short answer to that. It was useless on operations, as it couldn't be manually overridden. We didn't want it, didn't need it, and had it disconnected on all our new machines the moment they were delivered. Once the enemy's Flak gunners cottoned on to the fact that everyone of us was recovering and climbing away at exactly the same height and at exactly the same angle they would have had an absolute field day. During this most vulnerable phase of our attack we needed full tactical freedom of movement, which is why we preferred to fly by hand. This enabled us to twist and turn in all directions and thus ave us a much better chance of being bale to dodge whatever Flak was being thrown at us " 

Edited by NETSCAPE
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Looks like they had to modify the plane's hydraulic lines to disable the recovery system, or remove the dive break system altogether. Are there accounts of them keeping the dive breaks but not the recovery system? If that was done a solution could be to set the recovery system as a modification that can be taken or not, similar to the sirens.

Edited by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard
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4 minutes ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

Are there accounts of them keeping the dive breaks but not the recovery system?

 

Yes, they would leave the dive breaks on of course.

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Perhaps have a field mod to disable it?

 

(though I don't see what the problem is, you can still jink and so on when recovering even with the system.)

 

Edited by migmadmarine

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wait, we have the recovery system implemented? I have not flown the stuka for rather a while (or anything really thanks to work and RDR2) but I never noticed it recovering from a dive by its lonesome.

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2 hours ago, E4GLEyE said:

wait, we have the recovery system implemented? I have not flown the stuka for rather a while (or anything really thanks to work and RDR2) but I never noticed it recovering from a dive by its lonesome.

 

Look at the latest update notes.

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16 hours ago, NETSCAPE said:

@Gavrick

Sorry, I am not arguing they had a "turn off" button in the cockpit of the Stuka. 

 

However, there are first hand accounts of squadron and group leaders who said they uninstalled it immediately after receiving new machines. 

 

I gave examples of dive bombing and why they disabled dive recovery systems in this thread: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/39526-stuka-dive-bombing/

 

In short,

Helmut Mahlke:

 

"And what did we think of the automatic recovery system that was now being installed in production Ju 87's? Not a lot, was the short answer to that. It was useless on operations, as it couldn't be manually overridden. We didn't want it, didn't need it, and had it disconnected on all our new machines the moment they were delivered. Once the enemy's Flak gunners cottoned on to the fact that everyone of us was recovering and climbing away at exactly the same height and at exactly the same angle they would have had an absolute field day. During this most vulnerable phase of our attack we needed full tactical freedom of movement, which is why we preferred to fly by hand. This enabled us to twist and turn in all directions and thus ave us a much better chance of being bale to dodge whatever Flak was being thrown at us " 

It seems their issue with the dive recovery system was that it impeded their ability to manoeuvre as it was active. But it seems that in game we still have control over pitch, roll and yaw.

 

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Ok I just took the Stuka out and did a few more test runs. I guess just being aggressive and throwing the stick around sort of "overrides" the forces of the recovery system it feels like. The first test I ran through the correct or typical dive sequence... and did a very "hands off" dive. This initial test gave me a very dissatisfying dive experience with an automatic nose down and automatic recovery with a climb to absurd altitude that would get you killed in real life by flak gunners...which is why I jumped the gun and made this thread. 

 

Something new that is really throwing me off is the fact that once the dive brakes are deployed the Stuka just noses down on its own. Is this part of the dive system itself or just a FM adjustment on how the dive break would affect the aircraft? I used to trim out quite nose heavy to relieve stick pressure while diving on my target (yes that includes a nose down method AND a roll-over/invert method). Now I find that with almost neutral trim my Stuka just keeps wanting to nose down. Again, is this the Dive System taking control? or is this just the Air Breaks FM affect on the aircraft now?

 

Either way it feels completely different and will take awhile to get as accurate as I used to be.

 

Aside from how the dive recovery system worked in real life and historical anecdotes about why it was disabled - a full run down on how it functions IN GAME would be nice. 

 

@InProgress I looked through the keybinds and I didn't see anything that's has to do with changing the recovery altitude??

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The system sets heavy down trim when you extend the dive brakes, leading to the pitch down effect. It trims nose up when you retract the dive brakes. 

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25 minutes ago, migmadmarine said:

The system sets heavy down trim when you extend the dive brakes, leading to the pitch down effect. It trims nose up when you retract the dive brakes. 

 

Thanks for the explanation. Again, it's just going to take awhile to get used to. 

 

Maybe later I'll see how the AI is handling this. If they can actually attack like they used to I'll make some Stuka missions. But at this point I'm not very optimistic. 

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Contact altimeter:  Plane controls:  Near the end of the list;  Contact altimeter increase/decrease.

 

Once you hit the dive brakes you can adjust the trim to control how you want to dive.  Once you hit the bomb release button, start trimming to control the pull out.

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1 hour ago, migmadmarine said:

The system sets heavy down trim when you extend the dive brakes, leading to the pitch down effect. It trims nose up when you retract the dive brakes. 

So to assist on the recovery before extending the dive brakes one should set the trim for pitch up?

 

Because when I use it seems the dive recovery is very mild and doesn't pull out fast enough (this in the ju 87)

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