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33 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

Oh dear....You think that a company can stop generating revenue and continue to exist. If Nothing new is being created how does a company make money?

Now go and take a chill pill have have a think about it :)

 

Agree!

Stopping everything and building new engine and game on it would take years and burry this studio.

Only choice they have is polishing existing engine or developing new engine as side project while keep publishing new expansions on current engine (which Arma3 devs did and they have resources) and when new engine is done making new game on it.

Now, only 1C devs know how much can be squeezed from this engine, and only them.

Problem with this engine isn't gfx as much is cpu usage and performance, for example i get good perfprmance on Kuban map in VR on high settings but when you add AI on it it almost become unplayable with stutters (note that fps count remain stable during those stutters).

As my dev friend says (he plays il2 too and familiar with problem) they would need to rewirte core engine fundimentals (cpu/gpu and memory usage) which is huge job and maybe equivalent to creating new engime, if possible.

I find gfx in il2 very good, what is missing are scope of battles that did happen in ww2 and their scenery, not being sterile as they are now.

Game being able to sustain larger number of planes (big bomber formations) and ground units without dipping down performance as it is now.

I hope they will go for that rather than graphics improvements!

 

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2 hours ago, AeroAce said:

No im not a dev of games. I just have seen a lot of things that have been left behinded! The devs IMO have seemed to push to get new aircraft and features out and have not have worked out bugs or inefficiency or flow that have been here for a long time. Get the money and work out the small things later!

 

Before it was ok but unless they sort out some of the smaller problems I will have lost faith.

 

Have u tried using the mouse turret aim on a tank for example? It does not work well. Or wanted better icons? Or Clounds or a work around for why this game eats so much cpu but does not even touch ur GPU?

 

Why can I play Bat 5 on 60 fps but not this?

 

work needs to be done instead of a new theather

 

I will say it, f it, the devs of this kinda get a secured order list because they know a certain population will always buy. Their problem is getting people from WT ....U can see that in thing they tried to develope like auto aim and mouse control. The sad thing is, is that they got them people and then didnt support them 

 

Fuck it devs im sure ur gona tell me tomorow how hard u work .....

No streamline the game or Im not buying anymore!!

 

I totally agree about you not buying anymore. I think you would be better off buying a dictionary 🙂

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Im dyslexic sorry, I dont rely on spell check and get our chip off our sholders!!

Edited by AeroAce

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1 hour ago, AeroAce said:

Im dyslexic sorry, I dont rely on spell check and get our chip off our sholders!!

 

At least get your sayings correct or is that another condition you have?

 

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3 minutes ago, Haza said:

 

At least get your sayings correct or is that another condition you have?

 

i type on for do a lot sorry, its called dyslexia, the contexted is all there!!!!!!!!!!!! All my teachers have alywas said that I cant spell or do grammer but they know what im saying

 

Edited by AeroAce

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1 hour ago, AeroAce said:

i type on for do a lot sorry 

 

?

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when i touch type my brain says do but i type on 

 

or the other way round

4 minutes ago, Haza said:

 

?

Ur quite a pernickity person, u will not understand, sorry

Edited by AeroAce

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I didnt want to say much more but I have to say this!

 

Dyslexia is not something that will stop you in life and it does not mean you are stupid. 

 

You will have problems in school with some things but some of the best people were.... do not think u are stupid if u have dyslexia 

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1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

 

New product generates new revenue. Without new revenue a company cannot pay it's staff or continue to be viable. With more revenue coming in this allows developers to then revisit the project and improve things. BOX has come along in leaps and bounds over the last 2+ years with many changes for the better. 

 

However, there are still things that need to be improved and every time someone invests in a new theater or collectors plane that is another chance for the project to be continued and improved.  

That is true, but if previous project is bad, then there is no people buying next one, so that slows revenue. Has happened to many car companies, game devs etc. I have bought almost everything they have developed, but now im on position where im not buying anything anymore because im so dissapointed to AI glitches.

 

When they spend money to fix the ai, i will buy their next release, but now we are on position where they have lost paying customer If they just push new content without fixing previous. I would even donate money just to get as good ai as in 1946.

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1 hour ago, [Pb]Cybermat47 said:


You’re seriously ragging on someone with dyslexia for not being able to spell properly?

 

Do you even know what dyslexia is?

 

Here you go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyslexia

 

Cyber,

I'm well aware of what dyslexia is and certainly don't need a Wikipedia link, but thank you for your kind thoughts. However, venting off and swearing in the forum and just being down right rude towards the developers has nothing to do with dyslexia. 

 

Regards

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6 minutes ago, henri290 said:

When they spend money to fix the ai, i will buy their next release

Where do they get the money from? It's a vicious circle, engine updates and work on AI takes hundreds (and hundreds....and hundreds) of work hours and therefore additional money.

AI is being constantly worked on and improved, just like many other aspects of the game.

 

Anyone who is invested in this game cannot say that constant improves are not being made because they are. 

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This game cant handle more than 60 players online. Until they fix their game engine and netcode (stutters online) I will wait with purchases...

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Sturmovik great battles is expanding, when they first built the game engine and battle of Stalingrad most of our pc could cope with it and play with good FPS and have good performance.

My point is any new game is made around what the average pc the customer is using at the time, hence older PCs can cope with say bos and bom but have trouble with newer versions.

so any new theatre will be done on the average pc specs most people will own as off now.

maybe in a few years time when they bring out these new quantum computers they are testing and talking about ( that are thousand times more quick processing speed )

then we can have 50 + b-17 bombers with escorts epic battles scenario.

so yes it’s a hard one for the devs I just hope they keep in the scope for now off what most people’s PCs can handle, and delay the bigger stuff a few years till we have the software too cope with it.

i for one have older pc but play mostly ok,you can never keep up with the newest software, I think I will upgrade in the new year but I do not want pay huge money in case they bring out these quantum pc and make everything else really slow in comparison

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10 minutes ago, Haza said:

However, venting off and swearing in the forum and just being down right rude towards the developers has nothing to do with dyslexia.


Exactly. Stop ragging on him about the spelling, and criticise him for the rudeness.

Edited by [Pb]Cybermat47
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1 hour ago, AeroAce said:

I didnt want to say much more but I have to say this!

 

Dyslexia is not something that will stop you in life and it does not mean you are stupid. 

 

You will have problems in school with some things but some of the best people were.... do not think u are stupid if u have dyslexia 

 

AeroAce,

I have 2 kids and each has their own issues, therefore, please spare me the sob story! However, coming on here and bad mouthing the Devs in your usual manner perhaps is just bloody rude. If you have any complaints, just raise them in the appropriate forum area. 

 

Regards

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6 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

Where do they get the money from? It's a vicious circle, engine updates and work on AI takes hundreds (and hundreds....and hundreds) of work hours and therefore additional money.

AI is being constantly worked on and improved, just like many other aspects of the game.

 

Anyone who is invested in this game cannot say that constant improves are not being made because they are. 

I have played for couple of years and now when bodenplatte got fully released the ai is just full of shit. Ite was better before. I have played 10 missions and they all were complete joke. Ai just not attacking ground, flying infinite circle until hitting ground, dogfight is just flying around, Enemy ground attackers not dropping bombs etc. I have cheated myself for 2 years that i can live with bad ai, but now i cant anymore. Im very intrested about tank crew and fc, but that is no for me with these Bugs.

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1 hour ago, AeroAce said:

Im not talking about the pros or cons of pre order per say. Im just saying that I have given this team enough time and they have focused on new content over engine improvements. And yes they did the dx11 upgrade and yes some little things have been sorted, but it is all too much too late for me. Like the normal sound bug and poor performance in certain areas such as the ui and much more that we have had for years. 

 

I love this game, let me have my bitch, but im no longer after supporting from the start gona be supporting again. Too many bugs just left on the side

i don't know what you mean by "improve the engine." If they were to do that, then everything they have done here would be on this current engine. New content would not be integrated. Given they just released Tank crew and Flying Circus, they are not going to create another engine. 

 

When other companies make improvement, they are not "improving the engine, they are utilizing more of its features. In other words if there are inherent bugs or if there are limitations, there is no way to "improve it" outside of utilizing to its full potential. The game also have to be accessible. It is already command a lot of computer resources. 

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13 minutes ago, Haza said:

 

AeroAce,

I have 2 kids and each has their own issues, therefore, please spare me the sob story! However, coming on here and bad mouthing the Devs in your usual manner perhaps is just bloody rude. If you have any complaints, just raise them in the appropriate forum area. 

 

Regards

ha

I should have stowns trown at me for what I said before the deslexic thing! So please do

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1 hour ago, =VARP=Tvrdi said:

This game cant handle more than 60 players online. Until they fix their game engine and netcode (stutters online) I will wait with purchases...

 

I'm sure I have played on a few MP servers without stutters and the numbers have been in excess of 60. That said, I guess in the real world of IT, nothing will be perfect and spending your hard earned cash on what you want is your choice. 

However, in the grand scheme of things the price of a game here is cheaper than a bottle of Lagavulin. 

Therefore, I for one will gladly part with my cash even if the next campaign is based on Tatooine.

 

However, I will eat my hat if that is announced!

 

Regards

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Just now, Haza said:

 

I'm sure I have played on a few MP servers without stutters and the numbers have been in excess of 60. That said, I guess in the real world of IT, nothing will be perfect and spending your hard earned cash on what you want is your choice. 

However, in the grand scheme of things the price of a game here is cheaper than a bottle of Lagavulin. 

Therefore, I for one will gladly part with my cash even if the next campaign is based on Tatooine.

 

However, I will eat my hat if that is announced!

 

Regards

 

I know u dont like me but see that other see the same thing as me

u dont have a had to eat anyway

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1 hour ago, AeroAce said:

ha

I should have stowns trown at me for what I said before the deslexic thing! So please do

 

Life of Brian "Jehovah"!

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3 minutes ago, Haza said:

Therefore, I for one will gladly part with my cash even if the next campaign is based on Tatooine.

 

However, I will eat my hat if that is announced!

I could see that as an april fools thing... oh wait, this is not war thunder

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I need to learn this is not insta chat! Please out and read a lot of what I put before ..

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Wonderful discussion guys, keep going. I said a few pages ago that I consider yet another one of those "what's next" threads a bit boring and repetitive (got some flak for it), but now I see how wrong I was. 

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Devs built a very good simulation, which can be quite engaging in multiplayer, if you care about that sort of thing, but there's almost no single player game, with the exception of the career mode, which feels like an afterthought.

 

New scenarios and new planes are not going to cut it. It's probably necessary to churn out this stuff to keep the company afloat, since many of us will buy new planes and maps regardless, but it does not address the fundamental flaw:

 

THERE IS PRECIOUS LITTLE GAME TO KEEP SINGLE PLAYERS INTERESTED AND ENGAGED.

 

The capability of the engine, as in number of planes in the air, is mostly irrelevant. Air armadas of bombers and escorts would not make an ounce of difference if SP missions always follow the same boring pattern. Fly to point A, strafe or bomb or dogfight, return to base chased by brain dead and suicidal enemies, land, rinse, repeat.

 

This project needs a leap of creativity, some good ideas to allow the players to do something interesting with these beautiful planes, give players the feeling that the missions are useful to reach an objective, give players agency, a sense that their efforts are meaningful.

 

As a bare minimum career mission variety should be increased, whereas at the moment it seems the career is largely a forgotten backwater.  

 

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That may be and for sure SP improvements along with AI would be most welcome and hopefully will be addressed as the game continues to grow, however the SP aspect of this game has improved quite a lot since the original release.

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13 minutes ago, Nibbio said:

This project needs a leap of creativity, some good ideas to allow the players to do something interesting with these beautiful planes, give players the feeling that the missions are useful to reach an objective, give players agency, a sense that their efforts are meaningful.

 

As a bare minimum career mission variety should be increased, whereas at the moment it seems the career is largely a forgotten backwater.  

 

While I do think that the present career mode is not that bad (and I have been spending quite some time playing that), I heartly agree with you here. Right now the missions you get during a campaign seems to be happening in some sort of a vacuum. There is no connection between missions, so there is no sense of been part of something bigger. Mission results are only reflected by the progress of your own personal career (or lack of it). But as the battles are taking their course regardless, mission results are otherwise meaningless. And your own AI buddys don't get thinks done either, so you just stop carying for them, too. 

 

So overall yeah, I too wish the devs would improve the career mode.

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The engine is showing it's age, be sure.  To move on to the theater that Jason, and many others myself included want next, the Pacific, will require a new engine, or a seriously improved current one.  This engine will simply fall to it's knees trying to replicate fleet actions like say, the battle of Midway, or the vast numbers of ships taking part at Okinawa.  The only way to go to the Pacific with the current engine would be to go with a land based scenario that emphasizes what this engine does best, small unit tactical missions.  That would leave us with New Guinea or Burma.  If you want carriers, you need a new engine.

Edited by BlitzPig_EL
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31 minutes ago, dburne said:

That may be and for sure SP improvements along with AI would be most welcome and hopefully will be addressed as the game continues to grow, however the SP aspect of this game has improved quite a lot since the original release.

 

I agree, but the improvement is not nearly enough.

Let me give you an example: while in the standard career the level of friendly and enemy AI is always the same, and depends only on the difficulty level you choose, in Pat Wilson career your wingmen's experience and AI level increases for each mission they survive, so it is in your interest to keep them alive.

This is what I mean with agency, it is a simple feature but it creates an engaging mechanic that makes you care for the virtual lives of your pixel wingmen.

In my view there has been virtually no effort spent by devs in creating this sort of thing.

 

22 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

The engine is showing it's age, be sure.  To move on to the theater that Jason, and many others myself included want next, the Pacific, will require a new engine, or a seriously improved current one.  This engine will simply fall to it's knees trying to replicate fleet actions like say, the battle of Midway, or the vast numbers of ships taking part at Okinawa.  The only way to go to the Pacific with the current engine would be to go with a land based scenario that emphasizes what this engine does best, small unit tactical missions.  That would leave us with New Guinea or Burma.  If you want carriers, you need a new engine.

 

Masterful computer games only have to create the plausible illusion of complex and massive engagements. The approach is not to absolutely simulate every nut and bolt, but to give a very convincing appearance of reality to the player, who is a single pilot in a cockpit. I'm sure there are clever ways to do it without spending a fortune to create an engine that no reasonable PC of the early 21st century could ever run 🙂

Edited by Nibbio
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S!

 

 Pretty much agree with BlitzPig EL. Current engine is not capable of portraying those huge fleet operations without resorting to a stuttery mess. Propably in SP to some extent, but online, forget it. If Rheinland causes problems already imagine PTO. Smaller scenarios like Port Moresby, Rabaul, New guinea etc. could propably be done, just like Kuban etc. Nibbio, Falcon 4.0 could, and still can, achieve an illusion of being there in a big battle. A game that was made when every single CPU cycle counted. I recall the campaign programmer was given 2-5% of CPU time to run the dynamic campaign engine. He did not want to do such an endeavour again :P But IF a modern WW2 simulator could have something like that, a dynamic campaign rolling regardless if you fly or not and making you a small part in a larger conflict = bliss. And total heaven if could run on a server 24/7.

 

People diss SP and it´s importance. Immersion is a big part of that. In BoX there is next to none. You do a string of canned missions in a sterile and empty world where only fighting is near your waypoints. Rest of it is as pristine as ever. Not quite immersive or making you connected with the great struggle. Pat Wilson has done great work with his PWCG, making things better.

 

Anyways, my bet for next expansion is not PTO due obvious reasons. It might be something smaller. Eastern or Western front, hard to say. But something that can utilize already existing planes to reduce time of production and costs.

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10 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

If you get into a knife fight on the deck while flying a Wildcat against a Zeke,  you're likely dead even if you're the superior pilot.

Yes, and a rookie I-16 can take out a "veteran" Bf 109 F4 pilot if the F4 decides to give up every single advantage and turn-fight on-deck -- but i would not call a pilot who makes that decision a "veteran" or "skilled".

 

Like with any form of combat, the victor is determined by factors much more complicated than aircraft capabilities and skill. these would be: 

  • Intel -- the first to spot has the best chance of winning since they get the most time to shift factors to their advantage
  • Mistakes -- forget to check your six, misread the enemy's movements, or put yourself in a bad energy situation and you'll end up dead real quick. Requiem even has a video on this where he forgets to check his six fully and gets bounced dying almost instantly. 
  • Picking your battles -- Properly taking into account the capabilities of your aircraft and choosing when to fight and when to wait is arguably more important than general piloting ability. If you only engage when you have the advantage then you negate much of the abilities of your target. Choosing to say not engage a zero on the deck at low speeds is a part of this. 

Comparing aircraft with vastly different specs in a single scenario is just as futile as the "on-paper" tank comparisons of M4 Sherman vs Pz IV. If you setup an ideal scenario for one virtually no amount of skill will let the other win, but this comparison completely neglects the skill or mistakes which went into setting up that specific scenario. 

 

Plus, i would be willing to bet that if you put me on the deck in an A6M against a good pilot like Requiem in an F4F, i would end up with a lot of holes in my aircraft. 😁

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13 minutes ago, Kataphrakt said:

Yes, and a rookie I-16 can take out a "veteran" Bf 109 F4 pilot if the F4 decides to give up every single advantage and turn-fight on-deck -- but i would not call a pilot who makes that decision a "veteran" or "skilled".

 

All veteran and skilled pilots make mistakes. That's why combat is, well, combat. Being smart and skilled all the time isn't possible. Some mistakes aren't fatal, and some are.

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Just now, cardboard_killer said:

 

All veteran and skilled pilots make mistakes. That's why combat is, well, combat. Being smart and skilled all the time isn't possible. Some mistakes aren't fatal, and some are.

Exactly. I've had this pounded into me from ArmA and Airsoft, and am now re-learning it for Il-2. 

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1 hour ago, Nibbio said:

in Pat Wilson career your wingmen's experience and AI level increases for each mission they survive, so it is in your interest to keep them alive.

Hi, could you please explain this for me? I'm just begin to use PWCG.
******
I've almost done my Kuban fighter career(bf-109), the Kuban campaign is near the end.
My squad and team mate was always been dead easily, now they are all new face, nobody have 10+ air combat victory.
I wont be sad for their death, because they just like robot, nobody is my comrade.😭
I miss the strong AI in IL-2 1946, they can really cover you, help you, and make a perfect bombing.

Edited by Oyster_KAI

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2 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

The engine is showing it's age, be sure.  To move on to the theater that Jason, and many others myself included want next, the Pacific, will require a new engine, or a seriously improved current one.  This engine will simply fall to it's knees trying to replicate fleet actions like say, the battle of Midway, or the vast numbers of ships taking part at Okinawa.  The only way to go to the Pacific with the current engine would be to go with a land based scenario that emphasizes what this engine does best, small unit tactical missions.  That would leave us with New Guinea or Burma.  If you want carriers, you need a new engine.

 

We'll see. The next announcement will certainly tell us what the devs seriously think their game engine is capable of.

 

I too have the impression that we won't see carrier battles any soon, but this doesn't exclude the possibility of some limited carrier action, be it around New Guinea or Sicily.

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8 hours ago, AeroAce said:

No, I think a company should stop generating revenue and make the base game work as intented!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sick of pay before ....I know flight sims are a small game but that does not allow for them to just add and bloat a game without work on the base of it all

im sick of the small company tears argument 

Yes u are typing but they have sorted thing out! in 7 years that is not very good? And they still have massive problems that may not ever be worked out. Im not paying anymore until there are some engine fixes


Nope im sick of people defending pre-order games! 


"No, I think a company should stop generating revenue"

That's all I ever need to hear from you

I think you forgot to put on your clown shoes and nose dude. 

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As with just about anyone else, i would like to see improvements to the game. The devs have already been improving the game in ways that I think is acceptable -- When they release new content they also add new or improved systems which apply to all the "games" (in quotes since it's content rolled into one actual program). This is similar to how the developers of ArmA 3 performed some of their improvements. When ArmA 3 had its Marksman DLC new core systems got added like weapon resting, and improved ballistics, anyone who had the game with or without the DLC got these updates. The same was done with other DLCs which really brought the base game up a few notches. 

 

Now if we're all going to talk about what we'd like to see, i would personally like to see a dynamic campaign setup similar to how Falcon BMS does theirs. Every mission you run has an impact on the overall battle which unfolds. Destroying a specific bridge might hinder an enemy's supply lines; however, your own troops might find trouble when they come to cross it. Mostly i want to feel like my squadron's performance is having an impact on the war. This might be unrealistic to let a single squadron determine the course of the campaign, but i feel that the current campaign has a lot of immersion issues too. If I crash my aircraft every sortie with no results no one gets angry at me, there seems to be a scheduled resupply of infinite aircraft to replace anything i break. Prop strikes on landings doesnt seem to put my aircraft out of commission while its repaired, the ground crew always has it ready for the next sortie, even if it's one that day. 

 

I think this suggestion would be a hefty amount of work to put into the game for the dev's standards. Perhaps I should post this in suggestions mentioning that i'd pay for a dynamic campaign add-on. 🤑

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2 hours ago, Oyster_KAI said:

Hi, could you please explain this for me? I'm just begin to use PWCG.
******
I've almost done my Kuban fighter career(bf-109), the Kuban campaign is near the end.
My squad and team mate was always been dead easily, now they are all new face, nobody have 10+ air combat victory.
I wont be sad for their death, because they just like robot, nobody is my comrade.😭
I miss the strong AI in IL-2 1946, they can really cover you, help you, and make a perfect bombing.

 

I'll let Pat himself explain it:

 

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