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GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk

AI flight not moving after Engine Start

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Could one of you very kind, patient & knowledgeable  souls please tell me just where the hell I'm going wrong all of a sudden.

Thinking I'd gotten the hang of this M.E. & having written some basic but working S.P. missions, I was asked to write a simple 'Airfield Strike' mission whereby the player is #3 in the flight of 4 109's. (This I usually do as it gives the player a bigger sense of involvement, keeping with formation etc & following a lead & so far has been problem free with previous attempts written). I can't think for a second that this would have anything to do with things but I don't fly axis & have never written an Axis mission but I'm sure that as long as the entities & countries are set correctly along with 'Axis' as true in any of the triggers etc, there shouldn't be a problem right?

Well I had to get the mission written for this weekend & I've spent 2 solid evenings with this and have yet to see a 109 even move an inch from its ramp.

I've written the mission as I always have done ... created a flight, linked them to the lead, set the flight plan etc & have even tried lots of variations in the taxi node points etc as I know this can be quite a bug bear at times but whatever I do the 109's will not move once engines are running.

I've scrapped the mission, started from scratch & still no luck and so I've included a simple 2-ship example with a simple flight plan for someone to hopefully peruse at and to hopefully tell me just what the hell I'm missing out all of a sudden. (A glaring oversight hopefully).

Any help would be so appreciated (I used to have very long hair but most of it's on the floor after these previous evenings lol). Further more if anyone could send back the files with the 109's actually moving to runway & taking off I'd be elated. The example is from the new Rhineland map & I don't believe I've taken away the un needed cities etc like I normally do so apologies in advance if it takes a while loading up.

Thanks. Baz.

 

**EDIT** This is getting very curious indeed. Is it a problem with this a/c model? The reason I ask is I copied & pasted in a known working ai circuit from one of my previous missions (2x Po-2's) & checked that they worked in this map (which they did), so changed the Po-2's to Bf 109 G-14's, set the country to Germany, renamed the flight back to 'Stork' etc & back to usual .... not moving an inch. Has got me very beat indeed.

 

AI_taxi_and_takeoff_TEST.rar

Edited by GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk

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I took a look at your mission and your setup appears OK. I tried the following without success each time:

  • Moving the taxi points further out from each plane
  • Moving the initial taxi point in front of the leader
  • Switching the order of planes so that the leader was not passing planes as it taxied.

I saw this difficulty with another open-field taxi scenario but could not solve the issue.

 

There may be an issue with certain plane models, certain maps, open field versus runway terrain, or just AI taxiing in general. Careful testing is needed.

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I’m having the same issue with a 109 flight and an open field on Rhineland.

 

@Habu

FYI

 

I will put together a demo mission and post in beta when I have a chance. That might not be for a few days.

 

If you want to verify and post sooner if you have a chance, please do. :)

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I can confirm these issues too.

On our training mission we have respawning "random" AI planes.

The planes spawn with engine off, then they receive a takeoff command, followed by a force complete MCU shortly (1 second) thereafter.

Made all planes start their engines and wait for the next takeoff command to start taxiing to the runway.

This worked fine until the La-5FN was released, where for some unknown reason AI seems to be inept to start the engine, so I've explicitely changed the La-5FN to spawn with running engines.

Now since version 3.201 the 109s start to act crazy.

The 109K-4 sometimes can start the engine, sometimes it can't,

When it can, there's a very tiny chance that it starts taxiing, but usually it's just sitting there.

The 109G-14 start the engine but never starts taxiing.

Other 109s seem fine so far.

I've set all AI planes to spawn with running engines for the time being as this seems the only reliable way to make them taxi and take off.

 

:drinks:

Mike

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Thank you to JimTM for taking the time and effort in looking at my example.

 

Well I tried different models of 109 on different maps and for the life of me I cannot get them to taxi once they start engines. 

Even a pre made and working group of bf110s (from cold start to landing again) changed to 109s has the same result. 

So after 3 entire evenings of trying to write this simple 4-flight 109 mission I gave up on the 109s and went for 190’s instead.

They start engines and move off the ramp but what they do next is embarrassingly ludicrous. They spend their time spinning around, roaming around the ground as if looking for the taxi nodes.

With time being against me now, for this mission I’ve had to revert back to the using of Bf 110 G-2’s that have always seemed to work fine.

Flying exclusively allied, I’ve never come across these problems but the German fighters within the ME seem completely un useable at the moment.

Edited by GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk

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On 10/16/2019 at 8:23 PM, Gambit21 said:

I’m having the same issue with a 109 flight and an open field on Rhineland.

 

@Habu

FYI

 

I will put together a demo mission and post in beta when I have a chance. That might not be for a few days.

 

If you want to verify and post sooner if you have a chance, please do. :)

Copy that, but i have no much time. I want to investigate about what i MP you.

 

But as i see, the problem is with the 109, i can quickly adapt my test mission. I'll try to check that tonight.

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Habu said:

Copy that, but i have no much time.

 

My problem to.

I’ll try and post it to beta this weekend.

 

Working on a campaign it’s difficult to take the time to make separate bug/demo missions.

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Ok.

I checked with 109 G2, and i confirm that there is a bug.

It starts its engine but do not move. I have to test in other version, and if i have the same result, i will report the problem.

 

 

@GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk :

Which 109 did you use ?

 

 

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Have tried G6, E7, G14 & K4 on various airfields on the Rhineland, Kuban and Stalingrad maps.  All results are the same. Engines start but don’t move from ramp.

resorted to 190 D9’s which will actually move off-ramp but then spin around in circles, all over the airfield,

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Ok, thx, i'll check that tomorrow.

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3 hours ago, Habu said:

Ok.

I checked with 109 G2, and i confirm that there is a bug.

It starts its engine but do not move. I have to test in other version, and if i have the same result, i will report the problem.

 

 

@GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk :

Which 109 did you use ?

 

 

 

I used the G14.

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I checked all the AI (not on the public version) and only one is still bug (report has been done). So, the problem should be fixed in the next update.

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I have more check to run. I discover that the problem is fixed in single mode (except for one plane), but maybe not in multiplayer.

Edited by Habu
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On 10/18/2019 at 12:52 PM, GSHWK_Houndstone_Hawk said:

Have tried G6, E7, G14 & K4 on various airfields on the Rhineland, Kuban and Stalingrad maps.  All results are the same. Engines start but don’t move from ramp.

resorted to 190 D9’s which will actually move off-ramp but then spin around in circles, all over the airfield,

 

 

That's what My B-25's did until I added OnEvent. But now, like all here; they just sit there.

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It's always something...gets old.

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Gambit, the problem of Spektre76 is not fully link to that.

 

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On 10/19/2019 at 1:00 PM, Habu said:

I checked all the AI (not on the public version) and only one is still bug (report has been done). So, the problem should be fixed in the next update.

Habu thanks for reporting the bug. But devs "should" when there is a bug not just fix that one but use that occasion to improve the Taxiing which has many more other issues. Probably now is not the time with BOBp imminent delivery, but in more general terms, bugs fixing should be combined with some functionality "improvement". 

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No. You fixe a bug. There is no obligation to improve the feature. The first thing when you have a problem is to fixe it. When you fixe it, you look that it doesn't break something else. And after, you can improve the feature. Sometimes you can do the both at the same time, but it's not the goal, and in general, it' took more time.

 

Which other issues have you with taxing ?

For me there is the limitation in the taxi path, we should have more segments for Bodenplatte, where airfields are bigger.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Habu said:

Which other issues have you with taxing ?

For me there is the limitation in the taxi path, we should have more segments for Bodenplatte, where airfields are bigger.

 

Salutations,

 

Personally, I have not experienced a lack of taxi path segments. Please correct me if I am wrong but we can place segments where we desire them on the fields. I don't remember if I could add segments or not. 

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24 minutes ago, Thad said:

 

Salutations,

 

Personally, I have not experienced a lack of taxi path segments. Please correct me if I am wrong but we can place segments where we desire them on the fields. I don't remember if I could add segments or not. 

 

You can add taxi points using the Add Taxi Point After and Add Taxi Point Before buttons in the Airfield Chart Editing dialog. Last time I tested, I found that you can have a maximum of 12 taxi points before the take-off VPP and 12 taxi points after the landing VPP.

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3 hours ago, JimTM said:

 

You can add taxi points using the Add Taxi Point After and Add Taxi Point Before buttons in the Airfield Chart Editing dialog. Last time I tested, I found that you can have a maximum of 12 taxi points before the take-off VPP and 12 taxi points after the landing VPP.

That's what i'm talking. On some big airfield on bodenplatte, we don't have enough.

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10 hours ago, Habu said:

That's what i'm talking. On some big airfield on bodenplatte, we don't have enough.

Please see my comments in a post some time ago below.

It's a lot of stuff for taxiing but it would make the airfield aircraft movements just perfect. 

 

Take the case of Myskhako airfield in BOK.  I have a leader and five wingmen. I have three planes that are in their parking places on the main taxiway that goes to the runway. The first plane is the leader. This means that the two last wingmen are in the parking places further behind. The first three planes taxi correctly to the runway. The  two last wingmen just cut across the fields and bang into whatever objects they are, and do not follow the taxipath, even if I managed to have some taxipoints to oblige them to do so. Probably distances between taxipoints and the takeoff point could be a problem.

You see also that the taxiway branches into two taxiways. I could have planes parked in each branch and still have them taxi to the main branch. The taxi path cannot be branched. 

The branching feature but not only would allow for very interesting airfield aircraft movements.

 

 

 

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Put the mission, or just the group of your Ai at the right location.

 

If you really have a group of 5 planes with 3 which follow the taxipath, and 2 which not, there could be a bug, or your mission has a problem.

 

When i test Ai, one of my test is with 5 AI plane, and i have no problem, which doesn't mean that there are none.

 

Branching feature will be cool, but i think it would be hard to implement it, and in game it would take some resources.

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The last planes (or any plane) will go to the closest point, which isn’t always the point that you intend. 

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