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Eli_201

Engine smoke

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Hi all

I mast to say that the smoke of the engines is extremely  visible, this is not a phantom.

I hope it will be fix to reality.   

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43 minutes ago, Eli_201 said:

Hi all

I mast to say that the smoke of the engines is extremely  visible, this is not a phantom.

I hope it will be fix to reality.   

 

Fuel in ww2 for the Germans especially was a much lower quality than you see today making it burn "messy" . Make sure your mixture is set properly and the smoke almost disappeares completely in the allied birds. For the late war German aircraft there will always be a trail of smoke from the engine, it is perfectly accurate. 

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For the late war german planes, you can fly at a lower throttle. I dont think every german Pilot flew their planes at Max combat power the whole time, it is even  a tactical cosideration, flying at a slightly less speed, but with a higer chance of go unseen.

 

I even remember reading somewhere that late in the war some Alied pilots claimed damaged enemy while in fact they had just gone  full throttle to escape!

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I see a lot of the new Allied aircrafts smoking in Multiplayer because pilots have their mixture set at emergency full instead of auto rich.

 

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Engine smoke is totally realistic and correct…..so close this wasted thread!

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I have just finished reading 'The Big Show'  by Pierre Clostermann (Essential reading for any Tempest or Spit IX pilot!) and he did comment at one point about seeing a FW190 start to trail blacksmoke so knowing that he had engaged emergency power.  Whether he meant 'the smoke went from pale grey to black' I cannot say.    What RoflSeal said is also true ie that many Allied aircraft only smoke when the fuel mix is wrong.   Only last night someone told me my Tempest was smoking and I saw that I had the mix at 70%. I set it to 50% and the smoke stopped.

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10 hours ago, =362nd_FS=RoflSeal said:

I see a lot of the new Allied aircrafts smoking in Multiplayer because pilots have their mixture set at emergency full instead of auto rich.

 

P-38 smokes at auto rich too. You need to fly with auto-lean if you want no smoke in it.

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Personally I think the effect is slightly overdone, but just slightly. 

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Yes, the smoke trails are exaggerated.

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P-51 smokes like a tractor at "Run" setting on the mixture control. Going lower to idle or cut-off doesn't reduce the amount of smoke either..

 

I kinda like it. And I did manage to confuse myself with p-51 thinking it was a D9  😄

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At close distance the smoke is like in previous patches... but it seems there are some glitches at long ranges, with big columns of smoke (like if the planes were on fire) and contrails at low altitude (as if they were losing coolant massively). Haven't confirmed it yet but looks like the mixture smoke effect which I think is well done at close distance has some problem with the distance scaling and it either turns thick black or contrail white at long ranges. It's also noticeable with Me 262s around (no contrails at low altitude and no coolant to lose).

 

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10 hours ago, spitfirejoe said:

Engine smoke is totally realistic and correct…..so close this wasted thread!

Ok

show me the smoke.

Wher is it????

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8 hours ago, Eli_201 said:

Ok

show me the smoke

 

Modern fuels are better quality than back during the war. You were already told that up above.

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Sure wish the in-game 51 sounded like that one😑

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Posted (edited)

This has nothing to do with the fuel quality. If the mixture is rich and the exhaust is straight (like no catalytic converters crap) you'll see dark smoke at or around maximum power with any fuel. I think the reason why there's no smoke in the above videos is that the aircraft wasn't captured with throttle and mixture set to maximum position. Especially the modern one at the airshow. I bet they baby those engines for obvious reasons.

 

Once I got rid of the OEM exhaust on my car and installed a catless straight pipe, along with the pro tune by a professional shop, every time I step on the throttle really hard, there's dark brownish smoke coming out of the exhaust, pretty much like in the game. That's on the highest octane available at the pump. I've seen race cars with turbocharged engines that emit dark smoke and they are running on a race gas that is even higher quality. The reason is they have catless exhaust and they are tuned rich.

 

Here's how it looks like, from the 6th second of the video:

 

Obviously WWII era aircraft didn't have any catalytic converters in their exhausts, either. 

Edited by Arthur-A

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20 hours ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

I have just finished reading 'The Big Show'  by Pierre Clostermann (Essential reading for any Tempest or Spit IX pilot!) and he did comment at one point about seeing a FW190 start to trail blacksmoke so knowing that he had engaged emergency power.  Whether he meant 'the smoke went from pale grey to black' I cannot say.    What RoflSeal said is also true ie that many Allied aircraft only smoke when the fuel mix is wrong.   Only last night someone told me my Tempest was smoking and I saw that I had the mix at 70%. I set it to 50% and the smoke stopped.

 

Use ye the Clostermann ‘facts’ with extreme care! However, there are a lot of pilot accounts that cite examples of exhaust smoke becoming more or less evident (normally when viewing and enemy aircraft) at differing throttle settings and probably mixture.

 

IIRC, Tempest should be on middle mixture setting 95% of the time.

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30 minutes ago, EAF19_Marsh said:


Use ye the Clostermann ‘facts’ with extreme care!

 

I use all pilot accounts with extreme care. I have seen both Spit pilots and 109 pilots from 1940 say they loved being outnumbered 3 to 1 as it just gave them more kills. I have seen spit pilots say that the best way to get a 109 off your tail was to climb steeply away as they could not follow etc.

Nevertheless Clostermanns book is a great read and I did not find it as boastful as many had led me to believe unless it was his kill claims. He describes many occasions where he or his flight totally screwed up while I have seen many other pilot bios where they never admit to making mistakes.  

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18 minutes ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

Nevertheless Clostermanns book is a great read and I did not find it as boastful as many had led me to believe

 

It is a great read. But factually it is all over the place, something which you can easily cross-reference with other works. He is wrong on technical issues, operational issues, strategic issues. He talks up his ‘leading’ of 122 Wing which apparently went unnoticed by the C/Os of the other squadrons. He totally fabricates events (loss of W/C Brooker) and leaves out inconvenient facts (who was Mouchette’s wingman that abandoned him to chase off after enemy fighters? Oh, I wonder why Pierre was suddenly less welcome in 341...)

 

He is a terrible witness but a great author. I re-read the book recently and have now come to the view that anything he says has to be checked thoroughly before accepting.

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there are many films from the war as well that show nothing about any smoke.

The smoke in the game is like the jets from the 60', this is ridiculous

I will stop here, do some home work and not writing jokes.

 

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19 minutes ago, Eli_201 said:

there are many films from the war as well that show nothing about any smoke.

The smoke in the game is like the jets from the 60', this is ridiculous

I will stop here, do some home work and not writing jokes.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Eli_201 said:

there are many films from the war as well that show nothing about any smoke.

The smoke in the game is like the jets from the 60', this is ridiculous

I will stop here, do some home work and not writing jokes.

 

 

Maybe it is you who should do some research and your home work. There are plenty of REAL (that is right, I said real) videos and not movies as well as reports as you can see above that show/describe engine smoke trails. Facts do not care about your feelings and claiming something based on no evidence ("many films from war") will not help your false claims ... Perhaps it is indeed better for you to just stop as you said.

Edited by SCG_Riksen
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21 minutes ago, Eli_201 said:

there are many films from the war as well that show nothing about any smoke.

The smoke in the game is like the jets from the 60', this is ridiculous

I will stop here, do some home work and not writing jokes.

 

They are somewhat exaggerated, yes, but not nearly as much as you think.
The late War Planes are running either Synthetic or EXTREMELY Leaded Mineral Fuels. The German Planes are also running Air Fuel Ratios of 10:1 + Water Injection to keep Intake Temps down and prevent Knock under High Boost. Because they are unleaded or Low Lead Synthetic they have worse Knock abilites than the Mineral Fuels, but only create Carbon Soot Fouling, which burns off easily once Power is reduced for short Periods.

But still, only about 2/3rds of the Fuel is burned under High Boost, while 1/3rd is just used for evaporative Cooling of the Intake Air. The Burn is thus extremely Sooty.

Also: With Planes using MW50, you also have some 2 Stroke Oil in the MW50 Mix.
 

High Lead Mineral Fuels are more Knock Resistant, but have to Burn Hot as to prevent Lead Buildup on the Spark Plugs. So the Max A/F Ratio the Mustangs run is about 12:1 with 150 Octane. This is still a Burn in which 20% of the Fuel simply cool down the Intake Air through evaporation without Burning.

If you run too rich you lose Power and Foul Valves and Plugs in Minutes normally.

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Was watching this last night and it reminded me of this thread so I thought I'd share. Take off at 2:07 clearly shows a defined smoke trail and this, with modern fuel. I think the devs have done a good job.

 

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Here's a good example of the FW using a lot of power to get off the deck at 3:58 :biggrin: (Though it is clearly visible in the rest of the video too)

 

(And yes I do know that this FW isn't powered by a BMW)

 

 

The representation of this effect in IL-2 is really nicely done. It lets me know when the baddies are running their engines harder then I am :P

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The smoke should exist primarily at full throttle and more in overboost (more profound on German aircraft). 

 

Also, for clarity, Mustangs are maxing out their boost nowadays at 55 inches due to the low octane etc.(Blue, 100LL).

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On 10/4/2019 at 7:55 AM, Eli_201 said:

do some home work and not writing jokes.

lol

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Posted (edited)

In the original Memphis Belle, the 1944 version, smoke trails from German fighters are occasionally visible.  Scroll to 24:34, 25:05, 26:15, and 26:34.  Unfortunately this copy isn't that great:

 

 

 

Edited by Rebel_Scum
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On 10/4/2019 at 4:14 AM, 56RAF_Roblex said:

 

I use all pilot accounts with extreme care. I have seen both Spit pilots and 109 pilots from 1940 say they loved being outnumbered 3 to 1 as it just gave them more kills. I have seen spit pilots say that the best way to get a 109 off your tail was to climb steeply away as they could not follow etc.

Nevertheless Clostermanns book is a great read and I did not find it as boastful as many had led me to believe unless it was his kill claims. He describes many occasions where he or his flight totally screwed up while I have seen many other pilot bios where they never admit to making mistakes.  

 

Just a random fact that I can't contain myself from sharing: Closterman was born here in my hometown in southern Brazil. His father was a foreign (from our perspective) diplomay and worked around here in those days.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_Clostermann

 

 

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Also back in the days, damaged engine used to emit black smoke if it still running. now it only smoke when it's about to quit.

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