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Black September IV - Flying Circus

Black Septermber IV - Flying Circus  

110 members have voted

  1. 1. How do you prefer to fly this introductory campaign?

    • Central and Entente Teams that DO NOT SWITCH each week.
    • Red and Blue Teams that DO SWITCH sides each week.
    • Pilots (not teams) MAY SWITCH sides on a first come, first served space available basis at the start of each weeks mission. Would help even sides if attendance is unpredictable.
  2. 2. Which side would you prefer to fly? (select all that apply)

    • Both (I may wish to fly different sides different weeks sometimes)
    • Either side (put me where you need me if there are teams/sides)
    • German Preferred
    • German Only (don't select other options)
    • Entente Only (don't select other options)
    • Entente Preferred
  3. 3. Do you plan on flying Black September?



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Well I for one think there is no place in this game for sadistic butchers who shoot helpless individuals floating down in chutes. You people need to do it while those helpless people are still IN their planes like the rest of us. That way everyone can continue pretend that we're only shooting inanimate planes and not humans.

 

Butchers.

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47 minutes ago, US103_Talbot said:

[...] You people need to do it while those helpless people are still IN their planes like the rest of us. That way everyone can continue pretend that we're only shooting inanimate planes and not humans.

 

Butchers.

 

I'm sorry but, put this way, it looks like a battle between honesty and hypocrisy. I'd rather go with the honest butcher. Actually, I don't think it is this simple. But I believe we can go around the whole moral problem, which is too hard and maybe impossible to solve, and just stick with the scoring / penalty issues.

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1 hour ago, US103_Larner said:

 

ditching next to some farmstead in the middle of nowhere would warrant a similar walk :biggrin:

 

That's what I had in mind! You land in the middle of nowhere, no cell-phone, no taxi. By the time you get back to your unit there's fresh reinforcements arriving and fellow officers almost taking over your tent and personal posessions.

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4 minutes ago, J2_Jakob said:

[...] By the time you get back to your unit there's fresh reinforcements arriving and fellow officers almost taking over your tent and personal posessions.

 

And worse: farmer's daughters don't develop object permanence until early married life!

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I've solved it. Since we know cows are modeled on the map we should be able "steal" one for a ride to the home field. We would use the average land speed of a cow traveling one grid square multiplied by the distance you are from your field. That will be the time it takes you to travel to your field and how much time you would sit out. Now, if you take the farmer's daughter you will add or subtract 2 and one half minutes- dependent on how many bananas you've eaten that day.

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4 minutes ago, US103_Talbot said:

I've solved it. Since we know cows are modeled on the map we should be able "steal" one for a ride to the home field. We would use the average land speed of a cow traveling one grid square multiplied by the distance you are from your field. That will be the time it takes you to travel to your field and how much time you would sit out. Now, if you take the farmer's daughter you will add or subtract 2 and one half minutes- dependent on how many bananas you've eaten that day.

 

Good.

 

Now - what was it... Oh, when you ditch into a friendly territory (farmstead in the middle of nowhere). We have 5 minutes there, right? 🤔
Perhaps the cow or daughter could be used to tow the crate back to the aerodrome, saving the airframe, at the cost of another 20 minutes.

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12 minutes ago, J2_Jakob said:

Perhaps the cow or daughter could be used to tow the crate back to the aerodrome, saving the airframe, at the cost of another 20 minutes.

 

Additionally, if you only get the cow back, you can take off immediately in an RE8.

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Ok! Yes!

 

Option one: If you ditch and land the plane without wrecking, the farmers daughter seeing your daring skills will accept your advance (woof!), she gets you a car, you keep the airframe, and you sit out 10 mins. 

 

Option two: if you are shot down, the farmers daughter rejects you on account of lack of coolness, you lose the airframe, you get no car and have to ride the cow. You sit out 20 minutes.

Edited by US103_Talbot
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1 minute ago, US103_Talbot said:

Option one: If you ditch and land the plane without wrecking, the farmers daughter seeing your daring skills will accept your advance (woof!), you keep the airframe, and you sit out 10 mins. 

 

I'll need at least 45 minutes. Someone may spawn in my spot.

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19 hours ago, Oliver88 said:

Did anyone record any of the event. Was hoping to see videos and images from the event being spammed in the relevant area. :(

 

 

The sole thing mentioned in the written rules was 20 minutes for death. I saw no penalty mentioned for ditching over enemy or friendly lines.

 

For my first sortie my aircraft became damaged due to flak to the extent that I had to jump to my death. So I spent 20 minutes on penalty sitting in Reserve channel. For my second sortie I was wounded and my engine damaged but managed to survive and land the aircraft over enemy territory. I checked and was informed that I needed to spend 20 minutes for being captured, same as death. For my third sortie I was wounded and my engine damaged but managed to return to my own lines and ditch. I checked for that also and was informed I needed to spent 5 minutes for ditching in friendly territory though the mission ended at that point.

 

From what I was told during the event seems its 0 minutes penalty for landing at base, 5 minutes penalty for ditching in friendly territory, 20 minutes penalty for ditching in enemy territory, and 20 minutes for death. So consider me a little confused about what the penalties are now and would be good to have more about such things mentioned in the written rules?

 

 

Indeed having parachutes ought to make no difference to the Entente side. But having parachues ought to make quite a difference to the Central side (though am unaware about survival rates as have never used them). Any case where an aircraft cannot be landed over friendly territory (or when on fire for that matter) results in death for the Entente pilot but can result in survival for Central pilots. I am not stating that this did have an impact in any manner on the event (and I enjoyed it a lot). But I can see that such a situation might cause an inbalance to occur.

 

As an example take two pilots (one Central one Entente) both with four sorties over thier own territory that ended in identicle circumstances;

  1. Engine seized through damage. Ditched in field.
  2. Aicraft wings lost during a dive.
  3. Pilot died due to enemy fire.
  4. Aircraft wings lost due to enemy fire.

The Entente pilot would have spent 65 minutes on penalty while the Central would have spent 35 minutes. Had these pilots both been over Central territory it would have been 80 minutes versus 35 minutes spent on penalty. Had these pilots both been over Entente territory it would have been 65 minutes versus 80 minutes.
 

Oliver88

 Bender has it correct, land at your home field, re fly immediately. Anywhere else in friendly territory, 5 minutes. Anywhere in enemy territory, or killed, 20 minutes.

 Also, next week penalties on re flight will be enforced by the server. You will be unable to fly until your time is up.

8 hours ago, 56RAF_Talisman said:

Can't find any information on this event.  Time, date, rules, link?  If someone could steer me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated.

 

Happy landings,

 

56RAF_Talisman

 Talisman

  The info is at the beginning of this thread, The event runs Saturdays from 1700 UTC - 2000 UTC.  

   You are more than welcome to join us. Just jump onto J5 Teamspeak, (jasta5.teamspeak3.com), around 1630 to get a slot and the server password. (It WILL be in place this week).

  

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2 hours ago, J2_Jakob said:

 

That's what I had in mind! You land in the middle of nowhere, no cell-phone, no taxi. By the time you get back to your unit there's fresh reinforcements arriving and fellow officers almost taking over your tent and personal posessions.

When you glide to ditch you have some control on where you land, and save yourself some walk (glide close to the farm that may have a cart rather than in jump middle of nowhere and walk).

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1 hour ago, J5_Gamecock said:

Oliver88

 Bender has it correct, land at your home field, re fly immediately. Anywhere else in friendly territory, 5 minutes. Anywhere in enemy territory, or killed, 20 minutes.

 Also, next week penalties on re flight will be enforced by the server. You will be unable to fly until your time is up.

 Talisman 

 

Understood. And I also therefore had them correct in my previous post, and its just the written rules that have the matter incorrect.

Your latter note is welcome though as that makes the matter about the disparity between the spoken/written rules somewhat imaterial, the game sets the rules. 👍

Edited by Oliver88

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I see you completed the survey and indicated Entente.  You are assigned Entente.  Subscribe to this thread for updates on the first post where Notices to Airmen are found.  Download and read the rules.  Show up on Teamspeak at 1630 UTC etc....have fun!

Notice To Airmen Updated - see original post of this thread.

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3 hours ago, Rubberducky said:

I'll be joining as soon as my weekends are free.

 

Will be good to have you back Rubber Ducky.

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Here is the rest of Matthias' analysis that was not included in the post above when it was copied and pasted from our forums.....also the link to the actual data file is included below ....but it may require you to sign in to our forum to download it here....

http://www.jasta5.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=118&t=14799&sid=63a8dcca198e812545de2711a50f0340.

Our apologies for any confusion.

 

Assessment: The scores confirm that my flying experience was not unique. There were multiple German two seaters smashing Entente front line positions with little to no opposition. It wasn't until I went looking for trouble over Yantar after about five successful sorties that I became engaged. I am very surprised that the Entente got so few of the larger point objectives considering how heavily they attacked them.

And here's the actual parser log if anybody wants to dig further.

Edited by J5_Baeumer

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4 hours ago, J5_Baeumer said:

I am very surprised that the Entente got so few of the larger point objectives considering how heavily they attacked them.

I suppose the main reason of this are AAA's. 

Entente bombers have no chance make the second pass to bomb the target if the AA guns stay alive. Besides that, any mistake of target's aproach or another troubles to come and destroy factory from the one pass mean "Take a 20 minutes pause, pilot!" thanks to AAA.

I need to say seeing what happened above factories and airfields, the factories are protected much better as the airfields 😂

 

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1 hour ago, BaronVonMyakin said:

I suppose the main reason of this are AAA's. 

Entente bombers have no chance make the second pass to bomb the target if the AA guns stay alive. Besides that, any mistake of target's aproach or another troubles to come and destroy factory from the one pass mean "Take a 20 minutes pause, pilot!" thanks to AAA.

I need to say seeing what happened above factories and airfields, the factories are protected much better as the airfields 😂

 

 

I haven't played as Entente, but from what you say - shouldn't the Entente go for hi-alt bombing run, if the factory is well protected by AA?

I've flown a Halb and tried to make a low-alt bombing run on Artillery position during training. There was a single AA machinegun IIRC and that nearly killed me before I could even drop the bombs... Going low surely is a problem when you have WW2 machineguns around.

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23 minutes ago, J2_Jakob said:

 

I haven't played as Entente, but from what you say - shouldn't the Entente go for hi-alt bombing run, if the factory is well protected by AA?

I've flown a Halb and tried to make a low-alt bombing run on Artillery position during training. There was a single AA machinegun IIRC and that nearly killed me before I could even drop the bombs... Going low surely is a problem when you have WW2 machineguns around.

 

The artillery position is deadly for a lone Halberstadt, as we've found out during training these last few nights. I suppose it will be a lot better if you hit it in force at very low altitude and go straight for the machineguns, but you should still expect casualties.

 

Of course, a lone Halberstadt is a liability in any case, as you really need a second gunner to cover you against scouts. This is not a (slow) German Bristol anymore, as it was in RoF.

Edited by J5_Hellbender
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6 hours ago, J2_Jakob said:

 

I haven't played as Entente, but from what you say - shouldn't the Entente go for hi-alt bombing run, if the factory is well protected by AA?

I've flown a Halb and tried to make a low-alt bombing run on Artillery position during training. There was a single AA machinegun IIRC and that nearly killed me before I could even drop the bombs... Going low surely is a problem when you have WW2 machineguns around.

Especially since you do have WW2 bombsights now :).

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Expecting 60 pilots for the next one? Bugger! It's the one week I can't make! Hope that the numbers stay that high for weeks 3 and 4! 

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Read the latest notices. So server enforced  20 minutes death 1 minutes for everything else but landing at base.

 

Quote

Excepting for the above, Black September is intended to be server enforced.  If you can refly (or get in a backseat during your timeout as long as there are no reserves waiting to take your place), then you can fly.    The rules should probably also specify crash, regardless of where in addition to "die").  It would be most sportsmanlike for everyone to interpret the rule in this manner, regardless of whether or not you actually "died".  This will be most realistic and allows the most pilots to enjoy the event.  In this way nobody spends much time at all waiting in line as a reserve and each team flies at full strength the longest making for a better event.

 

What does the text in bold mean?

 

5 hours ago, US103_Larner said:

Expecting 60 pilots for the next one? Bugger! It's the one week I can't make! Hope that the numbers stay that high for weeks 3 and 4! 

 

Where did you see that its expected to be 60 pilots for this weekend?

Edited by Oliver88

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Requesting those that are able to (or remember to  😮) record some tracks. I'd like to see people's skins in action, either screenshots or videos.  

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Ok, I'll give this a shot.  Sign me up, Entente side.  And Jasta 5, I don't shine shoes anymore.🤣

Edited by SeaSerpent
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2 hours ago, II./JG1_Vonrd said:

Requesting those that are able to (or remember to  😮) record some tracks. I'd like to see people's skins in action, either screenshots or videos.  

 

I got some tracks for ya! 

 

2 hours ago, SeaSerpent said:

Ok, I'll give this a shot.  Sign me up, Entente side.  And Jasta 5, I don't shine shoes anymore.🤣

 

Well, well! How long's it been since Ice A*Ahem*  SeaSerpent flew a WW1 crate? 

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6 hours ago, Oliver88 said:
Quote

The rules should probably also specify crash, regardless of where in addition to "die").  It would be most sportsmanlike for everyone to interpret the rule in this manner, regardless of whether or not you actually "died".  This will be most realistic and allows the most pilots to enjoy the event.  In this way nobody spends much time at all waiting in line as a reserve and each team flies at full strength the longest making for a better event.

 

What does the text in bold mean?

 

It means that, in addition to dying, if you mess up and crash land anywhere on the map, it would be sportsmanlike for pilots to exit the server and go on teamspeak reserve channel and let the next reserve pilot in line take your place and get in line yourself.   In the event there are no reserves waiting to fly you can go back in the server and refly if it allows you to, or get in as a back seat Gunner if the server is enforcing a 20 minute death or captured penalty for you.

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8 hours ago, SeaSerpent said:

Ok, I'll give this a shot.  Sign me up, Entente side.  And Jasta 5, I don't shine shoes anymore.🤣

 

Image result for joe pesci goodfellas I don't shine shoes

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I think it's a good idea to separate death penalty (leave sever, take 20 minute break then come back as reserve if dead or captured) from  stranded penalty (leave server, go straight to reserve if alive and stranded behind friendly lines).

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Was so looking forward to this Saturday's event, but family commitments have now taken priority.  Hope to join you all next Saturday.  Good luck all.

 

Happy landings,

 

56RAF_Talisman

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On 9/11/2019 at 11:51 PM, II./JG1_Vonrd said:

Requesting those that are able to (or remember to  😮) record some tracks. I'd like to see people's skins in action, either screenshots or videos.  

 

On 9/12/2019 at 2:41 AM, US103_Larner said:

 

I got some tracks for ya! 

 

Could I have access to those tracks too? I might be able to make a YouTube video about the first ever Flying Circus event! 👍

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1 hour ago, JG1_Hotlead_J10 said:

 

 

Could I have access to those tracks too? I might be able to make a YouTube video about the first ever Flying Circus event! 👍

 

Sure! On hindsight, can't quite remember if they were tracks, Shadowplay recordings, or both! Either way I'll send what I have over ;) 

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