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Field-Ops

Raise the angle of fire on S.E.5a

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Hello, It was brought to my attention after exploring the 3d model of the S.E.5a and reading comments every once in a while that the primary MG is not in line with the bullets trajectory. I'll try and provide pictures of it all and get a more in depth analysis visually rather than just words. 

 

Looking into it further it looks like this has been brought up before here https://riseofflight.com/forum/topic/1740-se5a-gunsight-out-alignment/

 

Forst point, the gunsight angle is modeled incorrectly. The red line is our current gunsight modeling alignment where it should be following parallel to the blue line. To fix this the front ring sight needs to be brought up more. The bullet trajectory also follows the red line currently, whereas it should follow the blue. 

image.thumb.png.188987746f6b30a46c2ee9832149003f.png

 

From ingame, rather than the viewer, we see the aldis ring mount being used as a gunsight in the default view. It follows the same low bullet path. you can see the tracers in the red circle, the blue circle would be the corrected firing arc.

 

 

image.thumb.png.7c1b44f333c8d0ee1c3f9fcf93dc85d8.png

The next pic will be easier to see a discrepancy I believe with the comparison of a real photo, of course, no tracers in the real photo. Again, red is current firing point, blue is ideal firing point. You can barely make out the tracers in the red circle of this photo.

y0RwRvq.jpg

se5a-walkaround-014.jpg

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, 307_Tomcat said:

Nor is overwing Lewis gun .

Have not checked, but the primary is way more noticeable. I know the overwing MG shoots really high but thats all i know.

 

Just checked and the overwing gun has the same incorrect firing angle as our primary MG. It was the new Albatros with overwing MG that I was thinking of that shoots high. But thats another topic. Attached below is a pic of the ideal firing arc of both MG's 

 

iPwMrdL.png

 

Edited by Field-Ops
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24 minutes ago, Plank said:

 

Heck great to see other people bringing this argument up !!! 

( I wrote about it in RoF forum and got told to "move on" ...)

 

Apparently the game engine cannot change where the bullets go vertically.

So gun harmonization is only in one plane. Therefore the bullets do not "travel the bore" ... etc etc.

 

 

 

Gun harmonization in IL-2 BoX series can certainly be adjusted vertically:  take your 109-F4 and fire from the runway at 100m and 1000m convergence: in the first case the tracers head straight for the centre of the Revi sight, in the second they rise up well above it before falling back. I think this does not apply to the FC planes, however, or if such a large error as in the SE5a can be corrected.

 

I agree this needs to be sorted if FC is to be presented as the same level of authentic simulation as the WW2 chapters.

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Didn‘t they say in an other thread that the AI can‘t shoot if it is not allowed to fire exactly straight ahead?

 

It would explain why the SE5 simply doesn‘t fire where its gun point to and why it is is never corrected.

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4 minutes ago, ZachariasX said:

Didn‘t they say in an other thread that the AI can‘t shoot if it is not allowed to fire exactly straight ahead?

 

It would explain why the SE5 simply doesn‘t fire where its gun point to and why it is is never corrected.

I never heard of that issue...

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19 hours ago, unreasonable said:

Gun harmonization in IL-2 BoX series can certainly be adjusted vertically:

 

Must try this out.  Never bothered as I am still on RoF mode.

Will crank up the I-16 in due course.

 

Salute!

 

Planky.

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Plank said:

[edited]

Well we are not. and why the fricking TESTERS

 

Well I tester do point it out in  beta  forum , so what I have to do , make hunger strike ?  All about limits. 

Edited by SYN_Haashashin
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20 hours ago, 307_Tomcat said:

Well I tester do point it out in  beta  forum

 

I see. Thank you for trying.

 

I don't mean to be rude and I certainly don't want to make anyone feel bad..

but it would be great if "limits" were discussed with the actual people buying in.

 

If there is a reason why certain things have to be arranged due to "limits" then  

it's good to let people know why.

 

I was told I was "seeing things" with the Se5a at one stage. and that I was so wrong.

That really pi55ed me off. I was not wrong, I was dead right.

 

I regard the planes as being the most important thing in the game.

They need to be right. or some good reason why they can't be and

what they hope to do about it in the future.

 

Salute!

 

Planky.

 

 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Field-Ops said:

@airahusky I believe this is more a bug than just a suggestion. Perhaps I put it in the wrong place? 

 

It is not a bug it is a design choice inherited from RoF. There is a possibility that it could be revised in FC: I very much hope that it will be, so I think leaving it in suggestions is best.

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@Field-Ops So far, we will not be able to change the angle of fire, because there will be a huge number of problems, the solution of which is not in priority. For example, AI will not be able to aimshooting  on other aircraft

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1 hour ago, airahusky said:

@Field-Ops So far, we will not be able to change the angle of fire, because there will be a huge number of problems, the solution of which is not in priority. For example, AI will not be able to aimshooting  on other aircraft

Thank you for this clarification!

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The AI could just keep the current angle of fire method so their aiming process wouldn't need  changing and Human controlled SE5a's have the correct angle of fire..  It is a pretty big feature of the aircraft to just ignore. :huh: 

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2 hours ago, airahusky said:

For example, AI will not be able to aimshooting  on other aircraft

 

Fix the Se5a right, then release it as a variation and let the AI fly the old ones. ???

 

Se5a MK2 ?  Se5b ?

 

Most people in MP at least would probably like to try out the historical one.

If it's not what they want well they can fly the old version. 

 

Without sounding trite I think having had to suffer the thing all through

rise of flight ( not to mention the N17 GBR etc ) it actually is a bit of a priority.

Then you can have the satisfaction of trying up a lose end. : - )

 

The great thing is that it's not an opinion this time, it's an actual real tangible thing.

 

The worst that can happen is that people just don't like. ( well that's life eh )

But they can't say it's not the real deal.

 

imagine being able to shoot up while in the turn on the six of a DR1 ??

(  with the H stab cranked up too for good measure ) what fun !

 

Salute!

 

Planky.

 

 

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I appreciate there is obviously some cross over with my thread on bullet drop in the FC forum but........

 

If there is indeed a player controlled vertical adjustment in BoX , as has been suggested, testing WW2 types, that presumably is only applicable to player aircraft then could not the same thing be done for FC aircraft ?  If so could the SE5a’s default range be set to extremes to raise the level in line with the actual weapons and then have that point as the base marker for further adjustment by the player.  The A.I could continue to use the existing default in the same way as, one imagines, the WW2 birds do in BoX  without it buggering up the A.I ?

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1 hour ago, HagarTheHorrible said:

I appreciate there is obviously some cross over with my thread on bullet drop in the FC forum but........

 

If there is indeed a player controlled vertical adjustment in BoX , as has been suggested, testing WW2 types, that presumably is only applicable to player aircraft then could not the same thing be done for FC aircraft ?  If so could the SE5a’s default range be set to extremes to raise the level in line with the actual weapons and then have that point as the base marker for further adjustment by the player.  The A.I could continue to use the existing default in the same way as, one imagines, the WW2 birds do in BoX  without it buggering up the A.I ?

 

Ahhh Hagar is onto something here, this problem lends way into why we need vertical convergence settings perfectly. Well done sir.

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7 hours ago, airahusky said:

@Field-Ops So far, we will not be able to change the angle of fire, because there will be a huge number of problems, the solution of which is not in priority. For example, AI will not be able to aimshooting  on other aircraft

Thanks for the clarification. I do hope one day this can get addressed because it could impact future content the same way. I understand other things take higher priority right now but please dont forget about it, thanks.

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