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Jason_Williams

ALERT!! NEED MORE INFO ON EUROPEAN AIRFIELDS

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Posted (edited)

In France, there is a site (IGN) that allows to see aerial photos of France in the 1950s.

 

http://www.ign.fr/institut/activites/patrimoine

 

 

Unfortunately, this site only shows France, I do not know if other countries have the same.

  

- example:   The aerodrome of Maubege south of Mons

 

https://remonterletemps.ign.fr/comparer/basic?x=4.031771&y=50.311591&z=15&layer1=GEOGRAPHICALGRIDSYSTEMS.MAPS.SCAN-EXPRESS.STANDARD&layer2=ORTHOIMAGERY.ORTHOPHOTOS.1950-1965&mode=doubleMap

 

 

 

 

Aide carte Bodenplatte.jpg 

 

another example: The aerodrome of Valencienne west of Mons

 

 

 

 

Aide carte Bodenplatte 2.jpg

Edited by Pollux
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Error in writing Froidchapelle and not Floidchapelle

 

 

 

 

Aide carte Bodenplatte 3.jpg

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Hello all!

 

The best things I have are four photos (or assemblages of photos); most of them are from 1944, but probably just prior Allies arrival. However they are quite high definition and concerns: Antwerpen Deurne, Evere, Grimbergen and Ghent St Denis. the Antwerpen one is an assemblage I did not finish very well being not very cognizant with the subtleties of AutoPano. The result is still most usable as a reference (very accented pillow effect, but far from the airfield). The other ones are quite OK. Only Evere and Gent are single photos (the Evere one is well known) but very beautiful as they were scanned properly from an WWII Recce original photo.

 

You may download the from here (31MB zip...for four photos!):

 

https://wetransfer.com/downloads/1da1e7ac2fa9d5191f5ab3132549c7af20190504203015/f2ebb2cd8d2d629ac5200d0a7893b49220190504203015/28b14a

 

I have some interesting stuff but from France NW (who said BoB and 1944? 🙂 ...I know very well the real german airfields of the time; I even have photos from these places now...for colours and relief, it is interesting!))?

 

amically

 

JVM

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Not airfield but map related suggestion. You missed out 2 important Locations:

 

1.) Xanten, where Operation Blockbuster took place in Feb 1945 and where 15th Scottish Div crossed the Rhine 24th March 1945

2.) Rees, where Operation Turnscrew took place and XXX Corps crossed the Rhine 23rd March 1945

 

Best online source(s) about all this you can find here: http://ww2talk.com/index.php?forums/nw-europe.49/

 

Map attached:

 

 

Unbenannt.jpg

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Posted (edited)

Guys, one airfield that has been hard to find wartime images of is Köln-Wahn. Everything I've found so far are postwar images, when the airfield underwent a significant change in appearance. Anyone have any good images of what it looked like during the war?

 

The same goes for Bad Lippspringe, Hesepe, and Düsseldorf-Lohausen - not much found at this point. 

Edited by LukeFF
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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, JtD said:

 

Additional Infos about Koeln-Wahn here:

 

http://www.luftfahrtarchiv-koeln.de/1940_start.htm

 

1912 map (1/25.000) of shooting range/training range here: https://www.kuladig.de/Objektansicht/O-121073-20150410-2

 

Old postcards of shooting range Koeln-Wahn here:

 

https://oldthing.de/Wahn-Koeln-Schiessplatz-Wahn-Baracken-Koeln-Koeln-Stadtkreis-0023734506

 

Osnabrueck-Hesepe, with original pics of the 1945 bombing run:

 

https://www.untergrundosnabrueck.de/chronik/ereignis.vierter-luftangriff-auf-den-einsatzhafen-hesepe.html

Edited by sevenless
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Hi guys from Germany, why not contact the local historical group / authority  or the PR-department from the airfield, if the airfield still exist.  Here in the Netherlands most local governments do have some archives thats open for public studies and use. 

Think one Email that explains what you are searching and why, in decent German language of course, could be enough. 

 

 

 

 

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[slightly OT]

The place refered to as "Snow Eifel" is "Gerolstein". The "Schnee-Eifel" is a region. 

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Posted (edited)
On 4/23/2019 at 12:14 AM, Jason_Williams said:

Can anyone help me get these books? Are they in digital form anywhere?

 

https://www.amazon.de/s?k=Flugplätze+der+Luftwaffe+1934-45+und+was+davon+übrigblieb&__mk_de_DE=ÅMÅŽÕÑ&ref=nb_sb_noss

 

Which volume covers western Germany and the airfields important to us? Do these books have diagrams at all of the runways?

 

Jason

I've got most of them in my possession. They include the GPS coordinates for every airfield in the Reich, complete with topographic maps that show the location and aerial photographs for most of them. The books also include tons of photographs of buildings still standing today, mixed with archival photographs and also some blueprints for the hangars and stuff. There are no ebooks available, but I think it would be legal for me in Germany to provide you with scans of relevant pages you'd need that contain the info for the airfields you are looking for. I can't provide you with the whole books, though. Unfortunately one of the books relevant to you, the one on Airfields in Nordrhein-Westfalen, is not yet published, and I don't know if it ever will be... But the series also contains a book with all the airfields in alphabetical order, but (almost) without pictures, but still with the other infos. 

 

There's also another book: https://www.amazon.de/FLIEGERHORSTKOMMANDANTUREN-FLUGPLÄTZE-DEUTSCHEN-LUFTWAFFE-1935-1945/dp/B006W6K2T0

It contains all the airfield ever used by units of the Luftwaffe, inside the Reich and in occupied Europe, in alphabetical order. It contains also the information what units were stationed on these airfields at what time and with which aircraft. It's a little hard to read though, since it is a scientific publication obviously not intended for a broader audience...

Edited by ACG_daHeld
some more informations

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Here's the email-adress of the author of the books: zapf4712.juergen@flugplaetze-der-luftwaffe.de

 

Maybe you could ask him directly, he should have tons of unpublished materials on the topic. Perhaps he will help you out.

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I post this request for information on our French-speaking forums, hoping that it will provide you with valuable information

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It took me a while but I got by from my mess the only wartime photo of Plantlünne I ever found; combine with the actual Google Earth location, I am pretty sure the team will be able to do something quite OK, Plantlünne having been quite an important airfield, especially in 44-45.

 

As usual, I can give assistance in interpretation if needed.

 

JVM

Plantlunne.jpg

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13 hours ago, beepee said:

Kirchellen 23rd March 1945

 

https://ncap.org.uk/frame/1-1-74-2-82

 

If you subscribe you can zoom.  You can also purchase hi-res scans from the website

Hello all!

 

Capitalizing on Beepee find, and because I do have the subscription I got the parts of the full image and reconstituted the full image (2836X2798)...the results are excellent, and you will be able to reproduce the full extent of this airfield, down to the last revetment...Please get it here:

grosfi.ch/bRcXj5sKeqN

 

It is not very big (1.4MB).

 

As usual I can help with interpretation. If someone has found another one with a NCAP image, I can do the same (I do not have too much time to check all the potentially NCAP photographed airfield, unfortunately...for instance, Plantlünne is not here...)

 

JVM

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2 hours ago, jvm said:

As usual I can help with interpretation. If someone has found another one with a NCAP image, I can do the same (I do not have too much time to check all the potentially NCAP photographed airfield, unfortunately...for instance, Plantlünne is not here...)

 

Yes, could you download some more larger size images? I have downloaded a truckload of the small, low-res images from there for this project, so getting the larger-size images would be great. In particular (for now, at least) would be:

 

NCAP-000-000-264-893

NCAP-000-000-264-894

NCAP-000-000-177-807

NCAP-000-000-177-818

NCAP-000-000-177-819

NCAP-000-000-177-820

NCAP-000-000-177-840

NCAP-000-000-177-841

NCAP-000-000-177-842

 

(The airfields in question are Babenhausn and Wiesbaden-Erbenheim)

 

Thanks!

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Posted (edited)

Here you are...

 

grosfi.ch/M5SrJK6NXTc

 

 

Is this OK? I did not get the other pictures of Babenhausen as they do not bring any additional details; this one is centered on the airfield. As for Wiesbaden, of the two oblique photos this one is the wider encompassing, the other one again does not bring a lot more. You may be however of a different opinion...just tell me! I need 1/4h of work per image.

Edited by jvm
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Here comes Eudenbach/Asbach

 

grosfi.ch/WFh8zT9U5v5

And very interesting photos from Alkmaar/Bergen, and camouflage methods on this field...(maybe known photos already...in this case I apologize!)

 

grosfi.ch/6F63vUNPuip

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Posted (edited)

@jvm, thank you very much! It's much appreciated you taking the time to upload these. I'll have to look through the library of photos we've collected to see if there are any more NCAP photos that need a larger size.

 

If you could, here are a couple more NCAP images that would be good to upsize:

  • Achmer:
    • NCAP-000-000-016-288
    • NCAP-000-000-016-289
  • Bonn-Hangelar:
    • NCAP-000-000-064-544
  • Essen-Mulheim:
    • NCAP-000-000-027-704

Thanks!

Edited by LukeFF

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13 hours ago, LukeFF said:

@jvm, thank you very much! It's much appreciated you taking the time to upload these. I'll have to look through the library of photos we've collected to see if there are any more NCAP photos that need a larger size.

 

If you could, here are a couple more NCAP images that would be good to upsize:

  • Achmer:
    • NCAP-000-000-016-288
    • NCAP-000-000-016-289
  • Bonn-Hangelar:
    • NCAP-000-000-064-544
  • Essen-Mulheim:
    • NCAP-000-000-027-704

Thanks!

 

Here they are:

 

grosfi.ch/dAwXUE4na3W

 

I have made a composite of the two useable Achmer photos. I have added Monchengladbach but it is unfortunately at a very low scale, but good enough to make a good interpretation if you do not have anything better.

It is very interesting to see the dispersal areas of Hangelar quite far from the field, at the top of the photo!

 

Cordially

 

JVM

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Thank you so much!

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Regarding to your map (https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/uploads/monthly_2019_04/BOBP_Map_with_Codenames.jpg.102bfaef1ec05f3f8b9d4591245daacf.jpg):

The cities of Wiesbaden and Idstein are inverted, Wiesbaden is at the location of Idstein and vice versa. 😉

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@jvm  Nice work!

 

PM'd you about your method.

 

:drinks:

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Posted (edited)

could you please post for which airfields you still need further help?

 

So we could perhaps provide you with some info...

 

For Düsseldorf, I found the following:

145763275_PlanskizzeDsseldorf.thumb.jpg.f0130fc46c92f8c8e500f44b9e9a43e0.jpg

Edited by ACG_daHeld

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Geachte,

 

Als antwoord op uw elektronisch bericht over de locatie van vliegvelden van de Tweede Wereldoorlog in BELGIË, ontvangen op 10 mei 2019, kunnen wij u verwijzen naar de

publicatie CELIS, Peter, Reference guide to Belgian Airfields used by the Allied Forces,

- Runways to Victory, Belgian Airfields and Allied Tactical Fighter Operations 1944-1945,TIELT, 2003, p. 221-260.

 

Hoogachtend,

 

 

Kathleen VAN ACKER

Chef van de sectie Classified Archives

(Centrum voor Historische Documentatie van Defensie - ADIV-S-CA)

 

CONVERTED IN ENGLICH

 

Dear,

In response to your electronic message about the location of airports of the Second World War in BELGIUM, received on 10 May 2019, 
we can refer you to the publication CELIS, Peter, Reference guide to Belgian Airfields used by the Allied Forces, - Runways to Victory , 
Belgian Airfields and Allied Tactical Fighter Operations 1944-1945, TIELT, 2003, p. 221-260.
Yours sincerely,

Kathleen VAN ACKER

Chief of the Classified Archives section

(Center for Historical Documentation of Defense - ADIV-S-CA)
Another thing: you really have an interest in opening a part of this software to moders, it will help you and will give a certain 
attraction to all of your achievements which are excellent.
On the other hand, many of my fellow developpers of maps and missions (formerly on il2 1946) replied that they would not help you 
because you did not replied when they volunteered to help you develop maps at all at the very beginning of IL2 BOS release

cordialement


 

 

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Posted (edited)

A somewhat belated contribution:

 

Apologies if this is no longer useful: I was hoping to have dug up some useful PR data, but found the archive I have access to to be incomplete and catalogued by people didn't necessarily have our mission at the forefront of their minds...

 

Fürstenau (aka:  Lonner Tannen or Handrup) was located to the immediate south of the village of Vechtel. A grass airfield of limited size and minimal infrastructure - including a prefabricated / temporary hangar and wooden billets for aircrew. It was used as a base by Stab and I Gruppe of JG26 quipped with FW190A's / D's. The Geschwaderstab were billeted in Handrup Monastery 3km away. Aircraft dispersal appears to have been in neighbouring woodland. The base was operational between 24/11/1944 and 25/031945 before being heavily damaged by air attack, with units relocating to Drope. In addition to JG26, the base was briefly used by III/JG54 (29/12/1944-05/01/1945). Considering the dates it would appear that sorties of the Bodenplatte strike flown by III/JG54 would originate from Fürstenau.

 

See the link below for details of the location, history, units deployed there and maps. The page contains a link to an English translation.

 

https://www.relikte.com/vechtel/

 

vechtel.png

 

I've marked the airfield boundary for scaling:

 

unknown.png

 

I've centred this map reference to illustrate the field boundaries that made up the airfield perimeter:

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.5586311,7.6316363,2209m/data=!3m1!1e3

 

 

 

Drope was a better appointed site with a longer occupancy. Again it appears to be a grass-only airfield with limited overt infrastructure. It served as a satelite field other larger air bases in the region until more westerly airfields fell to the Allies.

 

II/JG1 operated from Drope between 17/12/1944 and 19/01/1945, making this base the nexus of operations for the FW190A's of II/JG1 during the Bodenplatte air operation.

 

It was used by the RAF as a base for a Typhoon Wing during the closing days of the war, and I believe in this respect was host the squadron which conducted operational trials with Typhoons armed with napalm.

 

See the link below for details of the location, history, units deployed there and maps. The page contains a link to an English translation:

 

https://www.relikte.com/drope/index.htm

 

drope.png

 

As above I've marked the airfield boundary for scaling:

 

unknown.png

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.5967769,7.4704277,2213m/data=!3m1!1e3

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Johnny-Red

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Posted (edited)

I could provide some research for Werl (B 157. still needed?

Had very limited time lately, but its getting better now.

image.png.ae236bd527b2633537ebbcf3eec559f9.png

Is written with a D btw. Dortmund.

Edited by DerSheriff

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hi jason, ive just come across this post. i own a copy of a pilots map circa 1943 i think, that has hand drawn locations of all A and B airfields marked on it. i dont know if its of any use to you but the map was marked up by a pilot of the day. let me know if i can help. im over in iraq until next week but should you need the original copy im more than happy to post it to you To help out with airfield placement

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8 hours ago, DerSheriff said:

I could provide some research for Werl (B 157. still needed?

Had very limited time lately, but its getting better now.

 

Yes, that would be great. I've submitted a few photos of Werl to the team, but more would be greatly appreciated.

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On 4/20/2019 at 6:24 PM, Jason_Williams said:

Guys,

 

We have an official problem that we need help with. The team has been working on the Bodenplatte map feverishly and they have the cities/towns/villages more or less figured out and under control. However, we now need to focus our attention to airfields and we're missing too much info to be able to do them to our satisfaction. 

 

So, we turn to the community for help. The more history minded brains working on this the better. If anyone has information such as maps, books or can lead us to such material to help get a better understanding of runway layouts, taxi ways, runway materials and other useful information please post it here so we can examine or acquire it. Western WWII airfields is an unfamiliar part of the world for the map team and it is proving tougher than originally thought to learn about them.  

 

We want the Bodenplatte airfields to be good, so we need your help. Here is a sample of some info we came across, but is it part of a larger archive or wartime publication?

 

een-geallieerde-kaart-van-het-vliegveld-bij-woensdrecht.thumb.jpg.dc5f52a3390fffb21f2f08a9d748ae52.jpg

 

Also, any info on the airfields marked on this map is what we are looking for. 

 

BOBP_Map_with_Codenames.thumb.jpg.4a9719fedb108c611973ec5a40c93685.jpg

 

Please post any useful or potentially useful info here in this thread. We greatly appreciate it.

 

P.S. please don't post about the map in general. Let's focus on the airfields. The map itself is very much a Work in Progress.

 

Thanks,

Jason

 

 

 

Hi Jason

 

I guess you have this one : https://www.vliegveld-ockenburg.net/pages/gallery/stand-vlieghaven-ockenburg53.php

 

My father was recruited during mobilization, and was 'emergency' Sergeant (son of an ex army captain who turned medical doctor after ww1), 19 years old then, and fought there.

A quite small airfield. I think it was a sports field too, but a crucial battle happened there with a lot Ju52s destroyed and Gerry paratroopers killed during the first day of the Nazi invasion of Holland. There was some special museum about it, dunno if it still exists, but i can suss out more as i know a guy who ran the now closed to the public war museum in Hook of Holland, in a German bunker, and expert in local military history. Pensioned off ex marine soldier himself BTW. PM me if you still need some help. J

 

plattegrond vlieghaven Ockenburg.jpg

Edited by jollyjack

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I do miss Deelen airfield near Arnhem on the map. Does that mean you already have enough info on it, or that you don't currently plan to include it?

 

Although, if memory serves me right, it stopped being an active airfield just before the start of the proposed timeframe for BOBP, in the years before that it was actually one of the major airfields in the Netherlands, especially used by night fighting squadrons (I think I've seen at least two different stock skins of aircraft stationed at Deelen). Also, the Luftwaffe tactical command center of a large part of NW Europe was located right outside the airbase, in the huge Diogenes bunker (https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenesbunker). There were also three Y-Gerät towers (a transponder-based targeting system used to direct night fighters and bombers to their targets) located just east of the airfield (see https://www.luchtoorlog.net/teerosen.html for a map). For any information about Deelen and its surroundings, you should be able to contact the small museum there: https://www.museumdeelen.nl/.

Toren%20Anton.jpg

 

Hence Deelen would be, IMHO, a good addition to the game, as it enables a whole new type of mission: intercepting large groups of British bombers at night. I still hope you do one of the big bombers as AI aircraft sometime!

 

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Some historical data I could find of some important dutch airfields ,
I certainly find more i needed but just for sake of the information ,
This info comes from the  NIMH (Nederlands instituut Militaire History or Dutch institude for Military history, Say bit like IWM in the UK)
They brought out a book called "Vliegvelden in oorlogstijd" Much documentiation in combi with the available mappingdata could bring up some interesting stuff.
Below is vlissingen , a old harbour(major) town with historic walling north is the flight field. it had an important role in the battle of the schelde wich was an effort to open up supply lanes to the east. 
IMG_20190915_110348.thumb.jpg.062454b7421603a6c4a99f0888530801.jpg

 

Next up: Soesterberg , highly detailed map just , this is a major military  airfield in defense of "huis soesterberg, a royal residence" where the kaiser wilhelm lived after WW1 , operational for the germans till april 45 for example fw190f nightbombers and nightfighters where stationed here. 

The aircraft where stationed in the forest area , tis is a major feature of this dutch airfield.  The purple areas are moorland  the treelines are dense with high trees mixed with bark and foliage. I hope this gives some idea bout what the airfield looked like. the it has not changed that much exept for modern cold war bunkers.
 

IMG_20190915_105703.thumb.jpg.1981e2e8793bf3f966700545c2833c59.jpg1760070903_images(1).jpg.8591006ee2442455632f75e0257a9224.jpgimages.jpg.ebc66681dcb1afa04f4c2d5d1f65acdb.jpg1327916379_soesterberg(17).thumb.jpg.f2708031de31ea0a50b484a5a176a1b5.jpg

 

Next up volkel , an important airbase after the war , i figure it was also major during the war (most post war bases where major airfields)  
IMG_20190915_110309.thumb.jpg.dcca9092eb16a8f0308bccf1bb971282.jpg

 

Next up something i want to bring to attentions , the radar stations in the north could be operational at a large part of the timeframe , excelent targets

IMG_20190915_110144.thumb.jpg.7b0e63b7f5901299d689d5ae9c1a8016.jpg

Edited by RNAF_SkekTek

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On 4/21/2019 at 4:35 AM, LukeFF said:

Airfield B-91Kluis:

 

Thanks for sharing the link.

Lots of good reading.

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