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Does anyone know if we'll see campaigns involving Yak-3 and Yak-9 in game?


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Aside from reading the DDs, I don't read the forum often enough to keep up to date on IL2's future, and I'm just curious, does anyone know if there's been discussions about campaigns that would involve Yak-3s or Yak-9s in the future?

 

I know I've heard Jason mention in a video that their team would definitely want to add the Yak-3 and 9 in the future, but I just don't know if there's been any more discussed on that topic, and I'm pretty sure the Pacific is the goal after BoBP. Is that still true, or are other campaigns being discussed too?

I'm sure that if there are campaigns that would involve Yak-3 and Yak-9, they wouldn't be created for awhile. That's fine. I'm just curious if there have been discussions on that topic, and if so, what are some possible battles where those campaigns could take place.

 

Edited by terrible_pilot
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I know Jason would like them eventually, but there's a lot of things he would like eventually so that's not a guarantee of anything.

All depends on revenue and resources. This is why you buy everything now so that little treats like this that might be more to your liking become more plausible later on.

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11 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

I know Jason would like them eventually, but there's a lot of things he would like eventually so that's not a guarantee of anything.

All depends on revenue and resources. This is why you buy everything now so that little treats like this that might be more to your liking become more plausible later on.

 

Yup, I'm supporting these guys for as long as I'm interested in flight sims and have money! I own all of the Great Battles stuff and may venture into the WWI planes soon too. Hell, maybe even tanks.

Seems like this is probably a topic for far down the future. I just love the Yaks and would love to fly the Yak-3 in this sim, so I wondered if there's been more discussions on it besides the interest he mentioned.

 

Quote

All depends on revenue and resources.

 

Yeah, I definitely understand. One can hope that someday we'll have those later year Yaks though! In the meantime I'll just enjoy BoBP as it gets released.

Edited by terrible_pilot
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Yak-9 can fit existing maps and could easy be added to game, and fit campaign or career, but yak-1b is already similar to it and better or same performing, just Yak-9 version brings nothing new. Yak-9T could be posible as you could use it in Kuban campaign/ career and atleast it would bring Yak with great 37mm cannon, and would be something worth getting compared to Yak-1b that is already collectable airplane.

 

Yak-3 that would bring good fighting chance in late 44-45 scenarious dosent fit any map in game and would not be able to be used in campaign or career so low chances well see that one any time sone.

Edited by 77.CountZero
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19 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

Yak-9 can fit existing maps and could easy be added to game, and fit campaign or career, but yak-1b is already similar to it

 

I had a different understanding that Yak-3 was an improvement to Yak-1, and Yak-9 was an improvement to Yak-7.
 

19 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

Yak-3 that would bring good fighting chance in late 44-45 scenarious dosent fit any map in game and would not be able to be used in campaign or career so low chances well see that one any time sone.

 

Yeah, agreed. I doubt we'll see either 3 or 9 added anywhere in our current campaigns. Well possibly the 9s (they were released first IIRC), but I'm not sure if they were in Kuban or not so I agree it will be awhile before we see these. I still wonder what battles would be interesting for them. I don't know the entire air battle history of WWII, but if 190 D9s or late 109s ever fought with Yak-3s, I'd love to play those battles.

I'm all for a Pacific campaign if it's feasible, but I'd settle for anything to be honest! Even if it's another Eastern Front campaign, but later war.

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19 minutes ago, terrible_pilot said:

 

I had a different understanding that Yak-3 was an improvement to Yak-1, and Yak-9 was an improvement to Yak-7.
 

 

Yeah, agreed. I doubt we'll see either 3 or 9 added anywhere in our current campaigns. Well possibly the 9s (they were released first IIRC), but I'm not sure if they were in Kuban or not so I agree it will be awhile before we see these. I still wonder what battles would be interesting for them. I don't know the entire air battle history of WWII, but if 190 D9s or late 109s ever fought with Yak-3s, I'd love to play those battles.

I'm all for a Pacific campaign if it's feasible, but I'd settle for anything to be honest! Even if it's another Eastern Front campaign, but later war.

Yes Yak-9 is coming from Yak-7 line, but when you compare it by look its more like Yak-1b, and Yak-1b in game is better performng then Yak-7b, and also if you compare Yak-9 and Yak-1b carachteristics, they are almost same, so why would player buy both, ppl would either get Yak-1b or Yak-9 if both are collectable airplanes, its better to leve plane Yak-9 version for some future east front DLC as when its part of 10 airplanes you dont mined it mutch ( situations with 109g4 and 109g2 for example)

 

Yak-9 and Yak9T were used in Kuban

 

I would like Yak-3 or Yak-9U also but as there is no map for them in game and devs claim 95% of users are SP, why would 95% of users buy thouse airplanes as they can not use them in SP for anything els then QM.

 

Yak-9T could be used by 100% users and its atleast something differant then already existing Yaks so more ppl would be tempted to buy it compared to Yak-9 or Yak-3 by my logic :)

 

go for Yak-9T as next collectable and get some easy money i say 😄 

 

 

Edited by 77.CountZero
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29 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

Yes Yak-9 is coming from Yak- ine, but when you compare it by look its more like Yak-1b, and Yak-1b in game is better performng then Yak-7b, and also if you compare Yak-9 and Yak-1b carachteristics, they are almost same, so why would player buy both, ppl would either get Yak-1b or Yak-9 if both are collectable airplanes, its better to leve plane Yak-9 version for some future east front DLC as when its part of 10 airplanes you dont mined it mutch ( situations with 109g4 and 109g2 for example)

 

Yak-9 and Yak9T were used in Kuban

 

I'm not really concerned with whether or not they'd be collector items or just in-game planes since it would depend on the situation and game or battle they're making.

 

What I'm saying is that, from my understanding:
* Yak-3 came from Yak-1 and both are similar,

* Yak-9 came from Yak-7 and both are similar.

There could be more details I'm missing, but from wikipedia, these say that Yak-3 came from Yak-1 development and that Yak-9 was basically a lighter Yak-7.


Yak-3
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakovlev_Yak-3

Quote

In 1943, Yakovlev designed the Yak-1M which was a lighter version of the Yak-1. It incorporated a wing of similar design, but with smaller surface area and had further aerodynamic refinements, like the new placement of the oil radiator, from the chin to the wing roots (one of the visual differences with the Yak-1, -7, -9). A second Yak-1M prototype was constructed later that year, differing from the first aircraft in that it had plywood instead of fabric covering of the rear fuselage, mastless radio antenna, reflector gunsight and improved armor and engine cooling. The chief test pilot for the project Petr Mikhailovich Stefanovskiy was so impressed with the new aircraft that he recommended that it should completely replace the Yak-1 and Yak-7 with only the Yak-9 retained in production for further work with the Klimov VK-107 engine. The new fighter, designated the Yak-3 entered service in 1944, later than the Yak-9 in spite of the lower designation number.



Yak-9
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakovlev_Yak-9

Quote

The Yakovlev Yak-9 was a single-engine fighter aircraft used by the Soviet Union in World War II and after. Fundamentally a lighter development of the Yak-7 with the same armament, it arrived at the front at the end of 1942


I haven't looked at the Yak-9's specific traits though so i don't know if it's just like a 1b, but from what that says, the Yak-9 is essentially a lighter Yak-7, which would mean more armament than the current 1b.

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18 minutes ago, terrible_pilot said:

 

I'm not really concerned with whether or not they'd be collector items or just in-game planes since it would depend on the situation and game or battle they're making.

 

What I'm saying is that, from my understanding:
* Yak-3 came from Yak-1 and both are similar,

* Yak-9 came from Yak-7 and both are similar.

There could be more details I'm missing, but from wikipedia, these say that Yak-3 came from Yak-1 development and that Yak-9 was basically a lighter Yak-7.


Yak-3
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakovlev_Yak-3



Yak-9
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakovlev_Yak-9


I haven't looked at the Yak-9's specific traits though so i don't know if it's just like a 1b, but from what that says, the Yak-9 is essentially a lighter Yak-7, which would mean more armament than the current 1b.

 

Yes, that's all right, however, what Count Zero said has merit too. If you compare the early version of the Yak-9 and the Yak-1B Series 127 that we have.. they are extraordinarily close in performance, armament, etc. As it is, the late model Yak-7B that we have is very close to the Yak-1B. For variety's sake I'm on board with the idea of the Yak-9 that we get being the Yak-9T.

 

I should jump in right now too and say that the Yak-9T was a major production version, saw a ton of service across dozens of fighter units, and was not an anti-tank version despite what some literature may say. The 37mm cannon was implemented as an anti-fighter and anti-bomber weapon. It always comes up :)

Edited by ShamrockOneFive
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26 minutes ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

 

Yes, that's all right, however, what Count Zero said has merit too. If you compare the early version of the Yak-9 and the Yak-1B Series 127 that we have.. they are extraordinarily close in performance, armament, etc. As it is, the late model Yak-7B that we have is very close to the Yak-1B. For variety's sake I'm on board with the idea of the Yak-9 that we get being the Yak-9T.

 

I should jump in right now too and say that the Yak-9T was a major production version, saw a ton of service across dozens of fighter units, and was not an anti-tank version despite what some literature may say. The 37mm cannon was implemented as an anti-fighter and anti-bomber weapon. It always comes up :)

 

Yeah, I was just going to edit my post to clarify that I missed parts of what @77.CountZero said. And also,  I don't know much when it comes to these planes. I'm still learning like many of us. So if the 9 and 1b are similar, I can accept that.

 

But as for the 7b and 1b, I think they're quite different personally. Everyone has their own experiences, but the first career I flew in Kuban was with the Soviets in the 6th GIAP (at Gelendzhik) and they flew both the 7b and 1b. So when I flew alternating missions between those two planes, I definitely got a feel for their differences, and you can definitely feel it. In fact, much of the things I noticed were things that actual pilots commented on which is a testament to how great this sim is, but there were definitely differences for me. Mainly that the 1b felt lighter and more agile, and that the 7b had more guns/ammo. Between the two, I'd choose the 1b any day, which is why i want to fly the 3 :)

If I had the option I might purchase the 9 as DLC in Kuban just to see what a lighter 7 was like, but perhaps you guys are right that it would be just like a 1b but with better armament! 🤷‍♂️

Also, this post was to see if there's been any discussion on where battles with Yak-3 could take place since it's a later war plane. I suppose I can lookup where most of it's battles took place. Has there been any discussion on late war Eastern Front possibilities though?

Edited by terrible_pilot
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Let me shed some light on the perplexing Yak story discussed above. Yes, Yak-9 is basically evolved Yak-7, and Yak-3 follows Yak-1B. However, Yak-9 and Yak-1B have nearly the same performance as well as external appearance.

 

Reason why is that so however is quite amusing - long story short: Actually, a factory separate from Yakovlev bureau ("Factory No. 301") was selected for the assembly of trainer Yak-7s. However, on their own (= without Yakovlev bureau instructions) they performed various modifications to these planes, among others they also attempted to turn the plane into the makeshift fighter. It turned out it's a complete success that can easily compete with the original design (Yak-1), so they kept this second line in production due to heavy demand for fighters. This is essentially how the Yak-7 -> Yak-9 line was born, while keeping Yak-1 -> Yak-1B in production as well.  In other words: It made more sense to keep the Yak-7 in production in this factory rather than retool and redirect it to produce Yak-1.

 

This is also the primary reason why the Yak-1B and Yak-9 are so very similar to eachother - same engine, same armament, nearly identical performance... The same or similar solutions/improvements were introduced on both planes in different factories.

 

The two families depart significantly from each other with ulitimate versions of both families: Yak-3 and Yak-9U.

 

It's hard enough to tell the Yak-1B and Yak-9 apart even for a trained eye in a peaceful environment of a living room on a computer screen (wonder how many people on this forum can do it), let alone during the heat of battle:

 

 

Yak-1B:

yak1b-c7.jpg

 

Yak-9:

yak9-c1.jpg

 

Edited by CrazyDuck
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7 hours ago, 77.CountZero said:

Yak-9 and Yak9T were used in Kuban

There were about 10 Yak-9s from the middle of May in the 278th IAD and 6th GIAP VMF received Yak-9D at the end of 1943. No Yak-9T during this period at Kuban.

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2 hours ago, BlackSix said:

There were about 10 Yak-9s from the middle of May in the 278th IAD and 6th GIAP VMF received Yak-9D at the end of 1943. No Yak-9T during this period at Kuban.

here they say http://airwar.ru/enc/fww2/yak9t.html

that in 1943 they were used for antiship in black sea, so they had to be in kuban area when you see front at that time. If that is not correct and no Yak-9T were used from area of Kuban map then no point in Yak9T also as it cant be used in SP. And adding just Yak9 or Yak9d dosent seam atractive option when you already have Yak-1b in game.

8 hours ago, thenorm said:

Would the Yak 9 and Yak 9T be similar enough to each other to have the 37mm be a mod? That way we could have both. 

No Yak-9T had whole cockpit moved back 

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14 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

here they say http://airwar.ru/enc/fww2/yak9t.html

that in 1943 they were used for antiship in black sea

The article says that it began to be used at the end of 1943. 

С конца этого года (from the end of this year - 1943) он с успехом использовался для борьбы с судами противника на Черном море.

I didn't study this period (Nov-Dec 1943), but I worked with the original documents of the Air Armies from March to October 1943.

No any Yak-9T during this period...

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Thanks for the clarity @CrazyDuck. Makes sense.

 

And the only difference I can see between the way those two look is the water radiator (if that's what that whole section is) being larger and pushed forward.

 

I can see why they might not want to add it yet. Can't wait for the 3 someday!

Edited by terrible_pilot
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3 hours ago, terrible_pilot said:

And the only difference I can see between the way those two look is the water radiator (if that's what that whole section is) being larger and pushed forward.

 

Yeah, at a glance from the profile air intake is the most prominent difference. However, also wings were somewhat different - Yak-1B had round tips, while -9 had corner on the front side:

 

Yak-1B:

410603640_Yak-1Bwing.JPG.a48ab326994281915472ceab3316b30b.JPG

Yak-9:

1884293720_Yak-9wing.JPG.883729c1460d11845fbe0fef5a7b3dcc.JPG

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You know its fascinating to me on the two lines of Yak development. You have the I-26 prototype design that then spawns a two seat trainer that ultimately becomes the Yak-7 which then gets turned into a fighter and developed separately. Meanwhile the Yak-1 series continues to be refined as a fighter design. Eventually both models get lightened, bubble canopy added, the armament becomes standardized with hub cannon and single machine gun (for a good long while) and they come within a hairs breath of each other performance wise while being distinct in their construction and design.

 

There's a divergence again later as the Yak-1 gets turned into the Yak-3 going the lightweight route while the Yak-9 gets developed into the Yak-9U adding back the extra machine guns, adding some weight and plenty of extra power with a new engine (in the later production series anyways).

 

It's quite a weird start from the same point, diverge, converge, diverge development history.

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45 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

Im sure P-63 was nice airplane in ww2, but in game i would rather have vvs airplane then usaf if posible, even early Yak-9 would be better in game 

True. But it would be nice collector for possible Berlin scenario 😁

 

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A shameless aside. I was in the pattern in a C152 when I started getting frantic calls for my position. After turning downwind, I looked back to see who was annoying me. One of the Yak-9 replicas (built from original blueprints, but Allision powered) was coming up my tailpipe. I landed as quickly as I could (I don't remember why I did not roll out and give way). The new owner taxied in and braked one wheel to spin into parking. He got out and stared at it for a while, then turned to me, pretended his knees were giving out and, grinning like a child, said "I can't believe this is mine." I don't think anyone ever reported Sean Carroll's signature low, high-speed passes.

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17 hours ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

You know its fascinating to me on the two lines of Yak development. You have the I-26 prototype design that then spawns a two seat trainer that ultimately becomes the Yak-7 which then gets turned into a fighter and developed separately. Meanwhile the Yak-1 series continues to be refined as a fighter design. Eventually both models get lightened, bubble canopy added, the armament becomes standardized with hub cannon and single machine gun (for a good long while) and they come within a hairs breath of each other performance wise while being distinct in their construction and design.

 

There's a divergence again later as the Yak-1 gets turned into the Yak-3 going the lightweight route while the Yak-9 gets developed into the Yak-9U adding back the extra machine guns, adding some weight and plenty of extra power with a new engine (in the later production series anyways).

 

It's quite a weird start from the same point, diverge, converge, diverge development history.

 

Yeah, I love learning history like this. I rarely have enough time to read up on all of it, but when I can, I'm just fascinated with how quickly advancements were made with both planes and their instruments. We're talking about a 6 year period where the planes at the end of war are much more advanced than the earlier planes, and learning about how certain planes progressed, like the Yak's history, is definitely cool.

One of these days I'll venture into the WWI planes too!

Edited by terrible_pilot
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8 hours ago, Trooper117 said:

all 'confirmed' and documented actions were against the Japanese.

And, I've already said it, but that is one scenario that would be a great way to get Japanese airplanes into the game if we don't go to the Pacific. The Russian attack on the Japanese in the last couple of weeks of the war. You'd get your Yak 9, your P-63...etc. We'd get Ki-84's, Ki-43's.....etc. No Zeros, but you can't have everything. I'd be happy to use the Kuban map as New Guinea, the Phillipines.....etc!

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18 hours ago, terrible_pilot said:

 

...We're talking about a 6 year period where the planes at the end of war are much more advanced than the earlier planes, and learning about how certain planes progressed, like the Yak's history, is definitely cool.

One of these days I'll venture into the WWI planes too!

 

That is one of my fascinations with WWI.  In 1914 they were up at a several thousand feet doing 70 MPH.  Amazing progress since the first flight, but what happened in the next four years was really remarkable.   By 1918 they were flying at well over 20K feet.  Speeds were doubled.  The first low wing metal monoplanes were flying.  Pressurized cockpits had been invented.  Control surfaces were so radically improved that they are not all that much different today.  Airfoil shapes were much better understood.  Combat capabilities went from zero to effective, specialized machines.  The advances were just incredible.

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9 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

 

That is one of my fascinations with WWI.  In 1914 they were up at a several thousand feet doing 70 MPH.  Amazing progress since the first flight, but what happened in the next four years was really remarkable.   By 1918 they were flying at well over 20K feet.  Speeds were doubled.  The first low wing metal monoplanes were flying.  Pressurized cockpits had been invented.  Control surfaces were so radically improved that they are not all that much different today.  Airfoil shapes were much better understood.  Combat capabilities went from zero to effective, specialized machines.  The advances were just incredible.

 

Well said. In a way, something similar could be said for WW2. In late 1930s majority of fighter aircraft in armed forces all over the world were still open cockpit biplanes, not really all that much advanced from the top WW1 fighters. Only the most powerful countries of the world just started fielding monoplane fighters with retractable gear and passing biplanes out. And after only 4 or 5 years we had operational jets whistling around in combat, airborne interception radars, deflection calculating sights, rear hemisphere alert radars, air launched guided anti-ship missiles...

 

War is, sadly, one of most powerful fertilizers of progress.

Edited by CrazyDuck
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Plato
Necessity is the mother of invention. A need or problem encourages creative efforts to meet the need or solve the problem. This saying appears in the dialogue Republic , by the ancient Greek philosopher
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1 hour ago, Royal_Flight said:

Meanwhile the F-35 first flew nearly two decades ago and it’s still not finished...

 

Lol, yeah the F-35's development has been messy (at least that's the argument) although, to be fair, it had three models that were being developed at once. And it's not the only plane that's taken long to develop. The Su-35's design started in the 80's.

 

I'm not trying to start a flame war about which is better or anything like that. Just saying I think all modern combat aircraft take longer to develop due to newer technologies.

EDIT: If development of modern day aircraft is also slow due to the fact that the super powers aren't at war, let's hope it stays that way!

Edited by terrible_pilot
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