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Developer Diary 212 - Discussion

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3 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

It's unlikely we can increase the number for MP slots. We hope to improve MP with the 84 players limit we have now. That would be a good step. We recently made some changes to MP code to try and improve things. 

 

 

This is what I like to read, improvements . These things give income in the long run

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The crew models are better than many 3rd person games that have a bigger focus on characters.

You guys outdid yourselves!

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1 hour ago, mincer said:

Will the infantry be modeled in the game?

 

Unfortunately not, due to in-game resource constraints.

Edited by FlyingNutcase

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There was mention of more detailed terrain elevations.  I wonder if there will be trenches or depressions in the ground so that anti-tank guns or tanks can hide or be protected.  I'm not talking about trench objects that are placed on top of the ground but rather as an actual trench below ground level. 

 

As you probably know, the Russians had extensive lines of trenches and defensive positions and minefields which made deadly killing zones.  It would be great to have these defensive lines and trenches on the map.  This would give more realism and be like the actual battlefield.

 

The size of this map is decent.  The old IL2 1946 Prokhorovka map is a similar size.  It will be sufficient for air battles without a doubt.

With the ability to have teammates in the air and on the ground, Tank Crew will be a great success!

Very much looking forward to its release.

 

 

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When you guys planning on doing infantry? Tanks without infantry to mow down is like cake without icing. I like FPS shooters a lot too. I'd never have to buy another game.

 

Sim quality WWII online would cast a wide net for customers and a great online experience. If we get VR and a running I've seen we'd all be healthier too. You'd be saving lives by preventing early heart disease!!

 

 

 

infadeck.jpg

Edited by 7./JG26_Smokejumper
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6 hours ago, TG1_Nil said:

@pilotpierre As far as I know, everybody has the same amount of gigs. It does not change according to what we paid.

So if you buy TC, no installation needed.

 

To free disk space easily, I highly recommend you this tiny powerful software "Scanner" You can download it for free here: http://www.steffengerlach.de/freeware/

 

Hi, I am aware everyone has the same no. of gigs. What I want is an all indication of how  many gigs each of BoBP, FC and the Tank Battles are likely to be before I decide to pre-order Tanks.

 

If someone can remember how many gigs the BoK update was I could use that as a rough guide.

 

I have cleaned up the disk already but thanks for the info.

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9 minutes ago, pilotpierre said:

 

Hi, I am aware everyone has the same no. of gigs. What I want is an all indication of how  many gigs each of BoBP, FC and the Tank Battles are likely to be before I decide to pre-order Tanks.

 

If someone can remember how many gigs the BoK update was I could use that as a rough guide.

 

I have cleaned up the disk already but thanks for the info.

 

A rich ex RAN should easily be able to afford extra RAM so dont hold back, although not sure Perth is in 2018 yet!?

 

 

PS.  I only bought tank and FC to support the team so you will not be alone in your metal coffin.

Edited by Haza

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Regarding infantry, a compromise could be to add static infantry, that can be placed inside field fortifications, similar to the machine gunners we already have in the game. This wouldn't require much work on AI and animations. What I would like to see are mortar teams, soldiers with anti-tank rifles, PM 1910 or the MG 34/42 versions without tripod.

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12 hours ago, sevenless said:

 

LOL. They all burned. That will be a firebrigade campaign.

 

The Panther made its operational debut on 5 July 1943 during Citadel, in which the High Command expected the 200 Panthers to contribute decisively to the stunning victory it expected to secure. 
Citadel involved a double-pronged German attack from the northern and southern shoulders of a large Soviet salient that jutted west into the German lines around Kursk. The Soviets, however, had detected the German preparations and had built up awesome defensive strength to resist the attack. This build-up did little to perturb German confidence; after all, given the widespread German belief in the combat power of the Panther tank, they simply reckoned that the greater the Soviet force deployed against them, the greater the victory they would achieve once their double pincers had linked up at Kursk to form the largest encirclement yet achieved in the war. 
The Panther units employed in Citadel - the 51st and 52nd Panzer Battalions - each fielded four companies of 22 Panthers, plus a further eight Model D tanks, to make a total unit strength 96 Panthers each. The two battalions came under the control of General von Lauchert's improvised brigade staff, itself equipped with eight Panthers, which fought alongside the Panzergrenadier Division Grossdeutschland as part of the southern prong of the attack.
Major problems, however, dogged the contribution made by the Panthers even before the offensive began. Because the two Panther-equipped tank battalions were deployed in the East just a few days before Citadel commenced, the units had little time for acclimatisation training in situ. Moreover, 16 tanks broke down on the short journey between disembarking from their transportation trains and reaching the front. Things went little better once the offensive began. In the face of fanatical Soviet resistance, large numbers of Panthers fell by the wayside. By 7 July 1943, the third day of the offensive, just 40 of the 184 Panthers that started Citadel were still operational, while by 10 July just 10 of them remained in front-line service. 
Of the remaining 174 Panthers that had begun Citadel, 23 had been lost due to 'brewing up' after enemy hits on their relatively vulnerable side armour, while two had burned after engine fires before combat had even been joined. Another 44 Panthers were being repaired after mechanical failure and a further 56 because of damage caused by enemy fire or anti-tank mines. German workshops had already repaired a further 40 Panthers with minor damage or mechanical problems, but these were still on the way to rejoin the brigade. The remaining nine tanks, which had been abandoned on the battlefield after sustaining damage, had still to be recovered.

The much vaunted debut of the Panther had proven to be a debacle. Admittedly the Germans could discern a few glimmers of hope from this serious setback. Post-combat reports from the fighting experienced at Kursk confirmed the anticipated combat power of the 7.5cm Panther gun; this weapon had accounted for many T-34 tanks, often at ranges of 1500m or more. In addition, the Panther's two machine guns had proven to be very reliable, with a very low incidence of jamming. However, most of the other aspects of the Panther mentioned in post-combat reports proved unfavourable. Troops observed, for example, that the Panther's turret grenade launchers soon became inoperative due to enemy small-arms fire, that its engine regularly broke down, that its over-stressed transmission often failed, and that its road wheels sometimes fractured. In addition, crews complained about fuel pump leaks that often led to dangerous fires starting inside the tank, the dangerous build-up of gun exhaust gases inside the turret, and the problems caused when driving rain entered the turret through the mantlet binocular periscope. Further modifications were needed, the Germans concluded, before the Panther realised the potential it clearly possessed to be a potent tank on the future battlefield.

I know that

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9 hours ago, mincer said:

Will the infantry be modeled in the game?

 

Im sure that soldiers will be in the game. But AI only, not like in the Red Orchestra game. Question is what kind of German soldiers will be - on southern side of the Kursk battle did attack SS Panzerkorps with elite units as Laibstandarte, Totenkopf and Das Reich. SS soldiers had very atractive camo uniforms, different from the Wehrmacht and SS tank crew used camo uniform too, not only black tankistic uniform. On other side the Wehrmacht used camo uniforms with different pattern (also atractive BTW) - especially the Grossdeutschland division what attacked soviet defend position from the northern sector.

 

Two examples of the uniforms from the Battle of Kursk:

 

Wehrmacht cam uniform

Spoiler

363e0d0d81b904d29c1bdcf02bdb3726.jpg

 


Waffen SS camo uniform

Spoiler

d9f440fe01862b1f4984cec04b28a896.jpg

 

 

 

...and finally I have to make modest remarks - damned i cant wait to Clash of Prochorovka :P:P:P

Edited by I./JG1_Baron

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Thanks BlackSix, that was a very interesting Dev Diary.

It's amazing how almost prehistoric or absent minded the Pz-IV looks with all its extra bits all tacked on.

 

Regarding the map, will it be shown in peacetime conditions with all areas intact, or will the devastation of the opening artillery and rocket barrages be a part of the landscape?

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"We were able to make its heightmap 16 times more detailed" - Why it looks same as detailed as Bodenplatte, Kuban, Moscow or Stalingrad maps?! It looks like DCS 1.5 - 🤣 🙄

 

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Looking good Alex - another great diary.

I cant wait to give the tanks a go when this module is completely fleshed out.

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Hmmm ... I understand the reasoning from the developer's POV, but I had hoped for a somewhat different approach. I, personally, would have made a bunch of "mini campaigns" around certain events during the campaign, no longer than 5 or 6 missions and utterly focused on that one event, using one tank type and one crew. That way the storytelling arch would have remained intact while at the same time keeping the campaign short enough to be believable. I am not a fan of cramming lots of different types into one campaign just to span a certain timeframe, but I guess the logistics of that make it doable for the developers.

 

Oh well, there are always player-built campaigns, aren't there? ;)

Edited by csThor

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I thought I read in an  older DD that TC won't have a dynamic campaign. It would not work that well, IMO, anyway.

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Just to reinforce what has been said above, the tanks were there to allow infantry to move. Tanks acted like an active shield. We can have pure tank to tank and plane to tank scenarios but that falls really short of context. I miss infantry units in the BOX aerial campaigns so maybe having infantry for tanks could be then also used for the BOX.  If I am not wrong DCS has animated infantry in its Normandy campaign, and as we know BOX is better visually than DCS Normandy (at least for me) so devs you have to beat them on infantry. 

 

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24 minutes ago, IckyATLAS said:

Just to reinforce what has been said above, the tanks were there to allow infantry to move. Tanks acted like an active shield. We can have pure tank to tank and plane to tank scenarios but that falls really short of context. I miss infantry units in the BOX aerial campaigns so maybe having infantry for tanks could be then also used for the BOX.  If I am not wrong DCS has animated infantry in its Normandy campaign, and as we know BOX is better visually than DCS Normandy (at least for me) so devs you have to beat them on infantry. 

 

 

Just leave it as is - adding infantry, mounted infantry and for details sake also Russian old farmer wives just to populate some poor Russian villages will not help to keep a

good and balanced performance on MP servers - we already have some issues since update 3.007 due to the enhanced damage model of ground vehicles.

 

Or, if you really want some infantry then TC CAP and BOX should be separate games - at least for the moment. Keeping all together under one "roof" is like

wanting a jack of all trades, also known in German as "Eierlegende Wollmilchsau".

Edited by -IRRE-Therion
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6 hours ago, Haza said:

 

A rich ex RAN should easily be able to afford extra RAM so dont hold back, although not sure Perth is in 2018 yet!?

 

 

PS.  I only bought tank and FC to support the team so you will not be alone in your metal coffin.

 

I have got sufficient Ram, it’s the SS disk space I am concerned about. Vas ist los mit der Perth??

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1 hour ago, -IRRE-Therion said:

 

Just leave it as is - adding infantry, mounted infantry and for details sake also Russian old farmer wives just to populate some poor Russian villages will not help to keep a

good and balanced performance on MP servers - we already have some issues since update 3.007 due to the enhanced damage model of ground vehicles.

 

Or, if you really want some infantry then TC CAP and BOX should be separate games - at least for the moment. Keeping all together under one "roof" is like

wanting a jack of all trades, also known in German as "Eierlegende Wollmilchsau".

 

I think they should make two seperate iterations. Update 3.007 showed that it's already too much fidelity for aerial campaign and rather spoiling the fun instead of adding. 

On the other side, the current state is not enough for a proper tank sim, too liveless. 

They should just roll back the latest update for the flight sim part and add as high fidelity as possible for the tank part, including infantry. Tank battles without infantry are rather moot. Would be nothing else then another more realistic World of Tanks E-sport kind of game, and surely not a tank simulation. Most historical tank operations just don't make any sense without infantry

Edited by II./JG77_Manu*
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Nice stuff!

 

Cant wait to see those tankman in my tank. They are looking gorgeous!

 

Panzer marsch!:soldier:

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7 hours ago, Livai said:

"We were able to make its heightmap 16 times more detailed" - Why it looks same as detailed as Bodenplatte, Kuban, Moscow or Stalingrad maps?! It looks like DCS 1.5 - 🤣 🙄

 

 

Because if it was the our usual heightmap standard is would be super flat. The area is not super hilly to begin with AND we have not applied our automatic angle textures. See other maps for examples. Once that is applied the ground will have more variation and the relief becomes more obvious. 

 

Jason

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Thanks again to the team for all the super work and effort, the creative thinking and problem solving.  It's exciting and invigorating to see the different directions and applications you have come up with using your engine not just for flight sims, but for trying to re-create the excitement of the conflict in as much of it's entirety as you are able.  Your efforts on the tank work and infantry are exciting developments.  I'm as impatient as I'm sure you are, but when you take the time out to bring us up to speed on your work and give us a glimpse of the creative process involved, you literally huddle us around the draft table with the rest of the team, and that's a cool place to be.  

Thank you.

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Coming along nicely, thank you very much for the update, really appreciated.:drinks:

 

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete.:biggrin:

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I love the simple things in life. You guys keep producing stuff like this and I happily keep giving you money. Everyone is happy!

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7 hours ago, csThor said:

Oh well, there are always player-built campaigns, aren't there? ;)

 

Salutations, and yes indeed there will be. :salute:

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The cavalary / tank troop skull with three bones without mandibula should not be censored, It is not the SS Skull with two bones and mandibula.

 

I recently found out that the "Panzer / Cavalary" emblem was also used by the SS  on caps of f.g.

the lower ranks. Still it was also used on the collars of non SS regular tank troops.

PZ_skull.jpg

SS-symbol2.png

 

Edited by [DBS]El_Marta
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3 hours ago, [DBS]El_Marta said:

The cavalary / tank troop skull with three bones without mandibula should not be censored, It is not the SS Skull with two bones and mandibula.

PZ_skull.jpg

SS-symbol2.png

 

 

Yes, some people confuse a lot of things / details - the blue Finnish swastika has another background too and has nothing to do with the historical

markings of the 3rd Reich.

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12 hours ago, pilotpierre said:

 

I have got sufficient Ram, it’s the SS disk space I am concerned about. Vas ist los mit der Perth??

 

Was on my phone that didn't show profile location and thought you were WA, however, I guess SA just qualifies as being in 2018!!

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14 hours ago, pilotpierre said:

 

I have got sufficient Ram, it’s the SS disk space I am concerned about. Vas ist los mit der Perth??

 

Hi Pete,

I think your PM box is full. Check these guys out, 1TB SSD at these prices made me purchase and swap  all my games on to a dedicated SSD and have never looked back.

 

 

 

 

https://www.msy.com.au/Parts/PARTS.pdf

Edited by bzc3lk

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Just now, bzc3lk said:

 

Hi Pete,

I think your PM box is full. Check these guys out, 1TB SSD at these prices made me purchase and swap  all my games on to a dedicated SSD and have never looked back.

 

 

https://www.msy.com.au/Parts/PARTS.pdf

 

 

Just to add to that, try these guys as well!

 

https://www.pccasegear.com/category/210_902/hard-drives-ssds/solid-state-drives-ssd

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23 hours ago, Juri_JS said:

Regarding infantry, a compromise could be to add static infantry, that can be placed inside field fortifications, similar to the machine gunners we already have in the game. This wouldn't require much work on AI and animations. What I would like to see are mortar teams, soldiers with anti-tank rifles, PM 1910 or the MG 34/42 versions without tripod.

 

Good idea, infantry with anti-tank weapons indispensable for a tank simulation, 

just soldiers with bazooka and light weapons together in a trench, or other individual object groups

low AI, shoot or run away like the Vehicles in Game ;)

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Tank crew starts to look even better than what i was expecting, good job!

Is there yet any plans for adding controller support yet? As for VR players ( like my self ), xbox/ps controller would be propably best to use with VR, when driving tanks.

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