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Great Battles on Linux? Valve might make it happen.

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Valve announced today a beta of Steam Play, a new compatibility layer for Linux, to provide compatibility with a wide range of Windows-only games.

See here for more information.

 

It seems that you will be able to mark those games in your library, that you like to see on linux. So please mark Great Battles and maybe in the future I can use that SSD hosting Windows for the sole purpose of being able to roam the skies for something more reasonable -- e.g. storing cat-videos on it. :crazy:

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Maybe.

 

I could run the 1946 under WINE and played WT in Linux before without problems. Hopefully, at next major code revision/rewrite the developers will consider a native version. So far, I keep Windoze only for the Il2 and would be so happy to ditch it...

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I'd love for this to happen. The only reason why I still have a windows install is to play games, but I doubt this project will fix all the shortcomings of Linux.

 

In my experience, native games for Linux run significantly worst than their windows version (same machine, just different OSs). There is also the problem of several incompatibilities between distros and GPU drivers, that make me go insane every time I need to update my drivers. And although abstraction layers are cool,  they usually come with a nice bite out of performance. Finally, even if BoX worked on Linux, most of my gear (Track IR, joystick, rudder pedals, throttle, etc... ) probably won't have drivers available for Linux.


 

 

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So if I'm comprehending this correctly, valve made a custom version of WINE, and are going to implement it on Steam to have an officially supported wrapper?

 

Neat.

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Please try Proton using Linux and launch the Sturmovik from Steam.

I would like to hear the results.

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4 hours ago, Pupo said:

Finally, even if BoX worked on Linux, most of my gear (Track IR, joystick, rudder pedals, throttle, etc... ) probably won't have drivers available for Linux.

 

Dunno about AMD, but nVidia has pretty good and quick Linux driver. Most of the time the repository manager will install and update it by itself. Many controllers work in the Linux, at least partially. I had no problems with Logitech or Thrustmaster. Can not say anything about IR (not using it) but it shouldn't be impossible, thought could be a little complicated.

 

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Performance problems aren't really a thing anymore (outside of bad implementation from the developer side it seems). Specifically NVIDIA drivers have come quite a way by now, can't speak for AMD. Peripherals aren't too much of a problem either, since DirectX input has become standard, so did the interfaces for the hardware. Problem could be those peripherals that need a driver to inject stuff around DirectX (can't name one out of the box though).

 

TrackIR will be a bit more of a hazzle. The protocol for communicating with the game has been reverseengineered. That allows projects like opentrack to use the interface and control things in a TrackIR like fashion (they learned to speak TrackIRs language and whisper sweet sweet things into the games' ears). Trackpoint didn't like that one bit and started idiotic shenanigans like including poems into their protocol so they could copyright it and block those free projects from using it. I don't know what came of that, maybe someone who uses freetrack or opentrack can elaborate how well they work and whether Trackpoint was successful with their haiku nonsense?

Edited by Mauf

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I've tried it, this is the error window I get. Then it just crashes once you press OK.

Hardware specs:
 

Spoiler

Computer Information:
    Manufacturer:  Unknown
    Model:  Unknown
    Form Factor: Desktop
    No Touch Input Detected
 
Processor Information:
    CPU Vendor:  GenuineIntel
    CPU Brand:  Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-7700K CPU @ 4.20GHz
    CPU Family:  0x6
    CPU Model:  0x9e
    CPU Stepping:  0x9
    CPU Type:  0x0
    Speed:  4500 Mhz
    8 logical processors
    4 physical processors
    HyperThreading:  Supported
    FCMOV:  Supported
    SSE2:  Supported
    SSE3:  Supported
    SSSE3:  Supported
    SSE4a:  Unsupported
    SSE41:  Supported
    SSE42:  Supported
    AES:  Supported
    AVX:  Supported
    CMPXCHG16B:  Supported
    LAHF/SAHF:  Supported
    PrefetchW:  Unsupported
 
Operating System Version:
    Linux Mint 19 Tara (64 bit)
    Kernel Name:  Linux
    Kernel Version:  4.15.0-33-generic
    X Server Vendor:  The X.Org Foundation
    X Server Release:  11906000
    X Window Manager:  Mutter (Muffin)
    Steam Runtime Version:  steam-runtime-beta-release_2018-06-14
 
Video Card:
    Driver:  NVIDIA Corporation GeForce GTX 980 Ti/PCIe/SSE2
    Driver Version:  4.6.0 NVIDIA 396.54
    OpenGL Version: 4.6
    Desktop Color Depth: 24 bits per pixel
    Monitor Refresh Rate: 60 Hz
    VendorID:  0x10de
    DeviceID:  0x17c8
    Revision Not Detected
    Number of Monitors:  1
    Number of Logical Video Cards:  1
    Primary Display Resolution:  1920 x 1080
    Desktop Resolution: 1920 x 1080
    Primary Display Size: 20.04" x 11.26" (22.95" diag)
                                            50.9cm x 28.6cm (58.3cm diag)
    Primary Bus: PCI Express 16x
    Primary VRAM: 6144 MB
    Supported MSAA Modes:  2x 4x 8x 16x  
 
Sound card:
    Audio device: USB Mixer
 
Memory:
    RAM:  16005 Mb
 

 

 

Screenshot from 2018-09-09 12-32-00.png

Edited by [SIMS]Nammi-namm

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Why bother with this when only half of a percent of Steam’s users run Linux?

 

8B3DAF41-468C-4FA6-9A66-42F9AA8A4ADD.jpeg

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18 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Why bother with this when only half of a percent of Steam’s users run Linux?

 

 

 

Even I'm counted in the Windows section over there, though I'd prefer to do all my stuff on Linux. SteamOS doesn't even get the Steam Survey. Then there was also this issue that still persists, deflating the numbers. You should also note that since the first year when Steam Linux came out, it reached as high as 2-3%. But today the amount of Linux Steam users has increased 4-5 fold. But its down to 0.%? One thing is Steam blowing up in China, Chinese Internet Cafe's, where lots of people use the same machines, where you could get the Steam Survey re-counting the same computers several times in fact. Its something Valve have confirmed and are exploring ways of getting rid of false positives like that. There's also a large swath of Chinese users who have Steam installed just to play PUBG, and nothing else.


The whole point of Steam Proton is to make *every* Windows game work on Linux. There will be no reason to stay on Windows then. It doesn't matter if its 0.1% or 70%, if every game works out of the box on Linux. Steam Proton is brand new stuff, give it a year or two and it should be flawless.

Steam Proton is already so good, you can play Windows VR titles on it, on Linux!


Why should the devs of Il-2:Sturmovik bother with a Windows server when only 0.% of Servers in the world run Windows?
 

Edited by [SIMS]Nammi-namm
  • Upvote 2

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So what’s the point? So it’s 2% vs .6%. Not enough people will care about this to make it worthwhile. Looks like a big waste of time. 

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14 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

So what’s the point? So it’s 2% vs .6%. Not enough people will care about this to make it worthwhile. Looks like a big waste of time. 


You do realise your argument could be used to justify nearly anything right?

Why bother with making bike paths if only 4% of all traffic are on bikes?
Why is anyone trying to make electric car charging stations when only 1% of all traffic are electric cars?
Why should a company make vegan friendly food if only 5% of people in the world are vegan?
Why should a headphone company bother with making aviation headsets if only 2% of all headset owners use aviation headsets?
What's the point in car companies making manual transmission cars in the USA if only a small portion of the population knows how to drive manual?

A reason why milk producers bother with making lactose free milk if nearly nobody is lactose intolerant?
Why does UTF-8 support Icelandic characters when only 0.0047105% of the world population can speak Icelandic?
Should we shut down public libraries if the amount of people using them is low?
Why does Nvidia bother with making the GTX 1080Ti if only rich hardware enthusiasts will ever buy it?
Why should any airline bother with flying to Greenland if only 30 thousand people of the words 7.6 billion people are even remotely interested in visiting Greenland?


Steam Proton is designed to not need devs to support Linux, for games to work on Linux. Its still in beta, you still have issues like the error screen I posted. Even GTA5 and several of the Call of Duty games work perfectly already! Once this is ironed out, any game that comes out on Windows will work on Linux. Increasing the amount of people able to play your game by a few million Linux users with no extra effort on 1C Game Studios part has 0% worth now?

Linux is objectively the better OS for gaming, we just need games to play on it. Why else do you think Valve is bothering with this?

Edited by [SIMS]Nammi-namm
  • Upvote 1

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1 hour ago, [SIMS]Nammi-namm said:


You do realise your argument could be used to justify nearly anything right?

No just stating the obvious. 

And gaming isn’t the only deciding factor in someone’s choice of an OS. Windows isn’t going away and Linux is at about 2% worldwide. 

On Steam it’s .59% so the most Steam could hope for is an increase of about 1.4% if everyone in the world who ran Linux bought games on Steam

Doesnt seem very worthwhile. 

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1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

No just stating the obvious. 

And gaming isn’t the only deciding factor in someone’s choice of an OS. Windows isn’t going away and Linux is at about 2% worldwide. 

On Steam it’s .59% so the most Steam could hope for is an increase of about 1.4% if everyone in the world who ran Linux bought games on Steam

Doesnt seem very worthwhile. 


Apparently total market share is the only thing you care about. You don't even seem to care about market demographics, just total numbers. War Thunder and X-Plane have had fully supported Linux versions for years. If it really wasn't worthwhile they'd have stopped supporting Linux long ago, or never done it in the first place.

There is always someone like you who comes in any Linux discussion and argues that Linux is useless and we should all just shut up. Like the mere idea that some people just don't want to use Windows and prefer Linux is a threat to you or something. Always against Linux just existing and being used because muh marketshare. Does it affect you in anyway if Il-2 Sturmovik works on Linux suddenly? I think its frankly trollish behaviour. If even just 1 person buys the game because it works on Linux, when the devs did nothing to support that clients system, then ITS WORTH IT! The devs got more money than they would have otherwise, with 0 effort. The Payoff/Effort scale would be 1/0! And with a niche game like this one, each sale counts.

By your logic, 1C Game Studios should just remove VR support, because the amount of people who have a VR headset is even smaller than the amount of Linux users on Steam. Do you go into the VR discussion linking VR headset market share arguing that it "doesn't seem very worthwhile"?

 

 

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3 hours ago, [SIMS]Nammi-namm said:

when the devs did nothing to support that clients system

Why do I have a hard time imagining the Steam can instantly make every Windows game run perfectly on Linux? These sims are complex games that require quite a lot of support just running on one OS.

But hey if it works? Great. You’ll still see Linux with a 1% user base on Steam. 

Edited by SharpeXB

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There are over 100 millions of Steam registered users. That "1%" could be a lot especially when compared to numbers of such niche game like the IL2 series.

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I believe it is silly to argue why based on percentages, that is not what this is about. This is about the future and not being dependent on a platform owned by Microsoft. Having a viable option to dump Windows if a user, software developer or publisher wants to can only be good development.

 

I am not saying get rid of Windows for gaming, just that it's not ideal to put all of the eggs in that one basket.

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In some realms the consumer normally benefits from competition in the market. But there are cases where this isn’t so. Basically concerning formats. Whether it’s media like VHS vs BetaMax, High def discs. Computer OS or certain industry wide software. Multiple formats can’t coexist and just sew confusion. So one will dominate, like Blu-ray Discs etc. Such is the case with Windows. Customers prefer gravitating to the primarily used or most compatable. Especially with an OS where compatibility and learning curve is a factor. Windows just isn’t going to be replaced. MacOS is a distant second place at 13% worldwide and lower among gamers as shown above. So consumers don’t even want an option to “dump Windows”

Edited by SharpeXB

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We are not "normal" customers here but a quite specialized niche. There is no much of learning curve today in more popular Linux distributions. No more than going to Win10 from previous versions and trying to configure it exactly to one's liking.

 

The major two reason why a "normal" customer can have a difficult time when using Linux are: format lock-downs (hardly a good thing) and peer pressure (not good, either).

Edited by Ehret

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17 minutes ago, Ehret said:

We are not "normal" customers here but a quite specialized niche. 

Yes, we’re gamers and even more specifically flight sim gamers.  So we are even more inclined to be on Windows for sheer compatibility. 

Most people just don’t care about the OS. They care about what they can run on their machine. 

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8 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

In some realms the consumer normally benefits from competition in the market. But there are cases where this isn’t so. Basically concerning formats. Whether it’s media like VHS vs BetaMax, High def discs. Computer OS or certain industry wide software. Multiple formats can’t coexist and just sew confusion. So one will dominate, like Blu-ray Discs etc. Such is the case with Windows. Customers prefer gravitating to the primarily used or most compatable. Especially with an OS where compatibility and learning curve is a factor. Windows just isn’t going to be replaced. MacOS is a distant second place at 13% worldwide and lower among gamers as shown above. So consumers don’t even want an option to “dump Windows”

With this state of mind, Internet wouldn't be born. Luckily you were not in charge back then. I still dont see the reason behind your charge against nux

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8 hours ago, kalbuth said:

With this state of mind, Internet wouldn't be born. Luckily you were not in charge back then. I still dont see the reason behind your charge against nux

I don’t really have anything against Linux. Just pointing out why a single OS dominates the market. Because that’s actually what customers want. 

The great majority of computer users do not care about or obsess over their OS. They’re going to just use the same thing everyone else uses for the obvious advantages. 

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On 9/11/2018 at 11:05 PM, SharpeXB said:

In some realms the consumer normally benefits from competition in the market. But there are cases where this isn’t so. Basically concerning formats. Whether it’s media like VHS vs BetaMax, High def discs. Computer OS or certain industry wide software. Multiple formats can’t coexist and just sew confusion. So one will dominate, like Blu-ray Discs etc. Such is the case with Windows. Customers prefer gravitating to the primarily used or most compatable. Especially with an OS where compatibility and learning curve is a factor. Windows just isn’t going to be replaced. MacOS is a distant second place at 13% worldwide and lower among gamers as shown above. So consumers don’t even want an option to “dump Windows” 

 

On 9/12/2018 at 4:03 PM, SharpeXB said:

I don’t really have anything against Linux. Just pointing out why a single OS dominates the market. Because that’s actually what customers want. 

The great majority of computer users do not care about or obsess over their OS. They’re going to just use the same thing everyone else uses for the obvious advantages. 


Next you're going to convince us electric cars are pointless because we already have petrol and diesel.

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On 9/12/2018 at 6:03 PM, SharpeXB said:

I don’t really have anything against Linux. Just pointing out why a single OS dominates the market. Because that’s actually what customers want. 

The great majority of computer users do not care about or obsess over their OS. They’re going to just use the same thing everyone else uses for the obvious advantages. 

 

If we are talking about "masses" that their "obvious advantages" are told them by commercials, usually...

There can be OEMs and shops contracts and incentives, too, to push "the masses' OS of choice". Often enough, one can not find a computer without installed Windows. That's just one of reasons "why" the single OS dominates.

 

Now, I wouldn't trust the MS Windows because they have a kind of internal conflict due the console business. One hour of a game played on the PC is one less hour played on the X-BOX, potentially. MS would prefer to have everything through them - with Windows they don't control 3rd party software and don't get fees like they do with software on consoles.

Edited by Ehret

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10 hours ago, [SIMS]Nammi-namm said:

 


Next you're going to convince us electric cars are pointless because we already have petrol and diesel.

Well this guy believes in electric cars

 

 

 

73FC4150-2248-4230-B180-51C559D20D56.jpeg

Edited by SharpeXB

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Well, I would love to see a Linux version as well.

Lately Windows evolves into a very irritating customer experience, and I would be really glad to get rid of it.

At least a server binary would be very welcome to me.

 

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I've got it running except for a little issue with BoS.LogParser.Offline.exe. For more details you can check my comment here:

 

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