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Considering that this is the only game I play really, it would make a lot more sense to get an overclocked 8700k, new mobo and ram, and it would still work out cheaper than a 2080Ti.

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13 minutes ago, 6./ZG76_Archie said:

Considering that this is the only game I play really, it would make a lot more sense to get an overclocked 8700k, new mobo and ram, and it would still work out cheaper than a 2080Ti.

I upgraded my PC some months ago due to a power supply failure. I was looking forward to the new 20XX series but seeing the price I will be getting a 1080 on the 550$ range if I can find it. 

As you said, it might be cheaper a full "upgrade" of your rig rather than a damm 2080TI. As I don't have VR and don't plan to go over 1080p on the next years, this might be the best option. Not interested in FPS games.

Edited by LF_ManuV

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1 hour ago, dburne said:

 

I guess they are trying to help more people to get one, however in my case was not any help.

 

I can't imagine anyone buying two.  I know, I know... Bitcoin miners.  I thought they had different equipment available now though.

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28 minutes ago, VBF-12_Stick-95 said:

 

I can't imagine anyone buying two.  I know, I know... Bitcoin miners.  I thought they had different equipment available now though.

Mining on gpu's is dead right now. Coins are almost worthless right now also, bitcoin is still at around 5k, but ethereum has plummeted, people lost a lot of money. Guy had two 1080ti's for 400 bucks on my local forsale website.

Edited by 15th_JonRedcorn
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regarding performance didnt they show the unreal demo running at 60 fps (because of vsync, otherwise it can push 75 FPS) in 4k ? I don't think a single 10 series card can do that today ?

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11 hours ago, LF_ManuV said:

I upgraded my PC some months ago due to a power supply failure. I was looking forward to the new 20XX series but seeing the price I will be getting a 1080 on the 550$ range if I can find it. 

As you said, it might be cheaper a full "upgrade" of your rig rather than a damm 2080TI. As I don't have VR and don't plan to go over 1080p on the next years, this might be the best option. Not interested in FPS games.

 

I´m still running at GTX970 and also was waiting for the new 20xx series but, considering I still run on 1920x1080, I think I´ll get a 1070 or 1080 at some point.

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I want this soooo bad... I feel like an Apple fanboi who wants to sleep in front of the store to get one.  But i'm going to want until the end of the year and at least grab a third party card like MSI or ASUS. Always cheaper and faster.

 

Grt M

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10 minutes ago, I./ZG1_Martijnvdm said:

I want this soooo bad... I feel like an Apple fanboi who wants to sleep in front of the store to get one.  But i'm going to want until the end of the year and at least grab a third party card like MSI or ASUS. Always cheaper and faster.

 

Grt M

 

third party cards are available for pre order right now.

https://www.ebuyer.com/search?q=2080+ti

 

I've been a bit underwhelmed after seeing this article. I don't speak german, but my understanding is that they are playing this on a 2080TI at 1080p with frame rates as low as 30 something FPS

http://www.pcgameshardware.de/Grafikkarten-Grafikkarte-97980/Videos/Nvidia-RTX-2080-Ti-Performance-in-Shadow-of-the-Tomb-Raider-1263244/

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This game (along with other sims i play) is cpu limited. My 1080ti isn't even currently running at max utilization using VR. I'm sitting this gen out, too expensive for what you get. Just ordered a new 8700k cpu/board/ram combo instead. As long as I can stay consistently above 60 fps in VR multiplayer, I'm happy. 

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29 minutes ago, =FEW=Herne said:

 

third party cards are available for pre order right now.

https://www.ebuyer.com/search?q=2080+ti

 

I've been a bit underwhelmed after seeing this article. I don't speak german, but my understanding is that they are playing this on a 2080TI at 1080p with frame rates as low as 30 something FPS

http://www.pcgameshardware.de/Grafikkarten-Grafikkarte-97980/Videos/Nvidia-RTX-2080-Ti-Performance-in-Shadow-of-the-Tomb-Raider-1263244/

 

Tempting. I'm still going to wait..  😉

 

The second article must be because of a bad console port. Wait for the real benchmarks. 

 

Grt M

 

 

Edited by I./ZG1_Martijnvdm

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I am still scared they didn't show graphs of improvements against 10xx series. Only with the ray tracing tech. Seems strange. Looks like a side improvement reather than a real improvement.

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RTX would be interesting it it allowed shaders processing refractions looking through our canopies. Rest... pretty but.. meh....

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6 hours ago, LF_ManuV said:

I am still scared they didn't show graphs of improvements against 10xx series. Only with the ray tracing tech. Seems strange. Looks like a side improvement reather than a real improvement.

 

I suspect the gains are fairly modest. The "new" 12nm is actually just 16nm+, which is a minor revision of the GTX 10xx series cards (think i7-6700k to i7-7700k). The core manufacturing tech didn't change any. This is why the die sizes increased so much when adding the ray tracing parts. Given the core specs, I expect the RTX 2080 to be roughly similar to the 1080 Ti if not actually a bit slower when ignoring ray tracing. The 2080 Ti should be clearly faster, but at that price...

 

Edit: Seems I'm not alone

 

Edited by BeastyBaiter

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I am definitely just gunna pick up a 1080ti for now and wait for 7nm or pray AMD gets back in the game like they did with Zen.

 

There's actually a new Zotac amp edition 1080ti on amazon for 529 bucks, doesn't have prime shipping or I'd buy it right now.

Edited by 15th_JonRedcorn
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That's a scream'n deal, I'd grab it if I wasn't already running a 1080 Ti. And my hopes are the same for AMD. Vega 56/64 wasn't overly impressive, but if they move to a 7nm process, even without any major architectural changes, I can see it smoking a 1080 Ti and probably the new 2080 Ti as well. But we'll have to wait and see on that. Supposedly early next year they'll be released for consumers.

Edited by BeastyBaiter

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3 minutes ago, BeastyBaiter said:

That's a scream'n deal, I'd grab it if I wasn't already running a 1080 Ti. And my hopes are the same for AMD. Vega 56/64 wasn't overly impressive, but if they move to a 7nm process, even without any major architectural changes, I can see it smoking a 1080 Ti and probably the new 2080 Ti as well. But we'll have to wait and see on that. Supposedly early next year they'll be released for consumers.

Hardware is so lame when there aren't at least two companies duking it out. Intel stagnated for years, and now it seems like Nvidia is doing the same. It is a really good deal though, I just don't have the money for it this week, spent a ton of money last week kind of screwed myself. I am eyeing a 1tb samsung 860 evo for 198 on amazon though, that I can afford and am still rocking regular hard drives.

Edited by 15th_JonRedcorn

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So here are numbers. Between 30 to 70 at 1080p if I understand comments properly. Raytracing is killing even RTX gpus it seems. Litteraly no point in getting into that tech yet. 

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Lol I just watched that video on YouTube and it only made me laugh.  It’s that typical marketing of new tech but what you get is abysmal frame rates.  It’s a total waste of money for RTX it will probably take two generations to get proper performance.

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I thought I was being cynical but you people aren’t easy to impress. 30 FPS 1080p real time ray tracing is awesome. Useless to us for IL2, but still...

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Looks like it's time to upgrade my 770 2GB and 1080p 60 MHz gaming to this new 2080 Ti and 1440p 144MHz. Although, I'm in no hurry, and will wait it out a couple more months atleast.

Edited by Warpig

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1 hour ago, Warpig said:

Looks like it's time to upgrade my 770 2GB and 1080p 60 MHz gaming to this new 20180Ti and 1440p 144MHz. Although, I'm in no hurry, and will wait it out a couple more months atleast.

Will negatively impact your ability to spot other aircraft, but it'll be prettier.

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4 hours ago, coconut said:

I thought I was being cynical but you people aren’t easy to impress. 30 FPS 1080p real time ray tracing is awesome. Useless to us for IL2, but still...

It's not even full blown full on ray tracing they are using tricks and using it only for certain things.

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7 hours ago, BeastyBaiter said:

That's a scream'n deal, I'd grab it if I wasn't already running a 1080 Ti. And my hopes are the same for AMD. Vega 56/64 wasn't overly impressive, but if they move to a 7nm process, even without any major architectural changes, I can see it smoking a 1080 Ti and probably the new 2080 Ti as well. But we'll have to wait and see on that. Supposedly early next year they'll be released for consumers.

FUCK DUDE, the cards gone off amazon, the prices for nearly all of them went up tonight, probably due to these new piece of shit cards releasing, thanks nvidia, double fucking us. I really can't stand them.

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7 hours ago, coconut said:

I thought I was being cynical but you people aren’t easy to impress. 30 FPS 1080p real time ray tracing is awesome.

It may be from technological standpoint but as pointed above it's not even full ray tracing for entire scene. Either way, for gamers FPS matter more, particularly in fast shooters and action games. People often REDUCE graphics in order to boost FPS. So the above results, if true, do not impress. Its not about introducing new tech, its about introducing new tech that is a viable option for average consumer and doesnt make him sacrefice any of the performance. 

 

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Well ,if this is needed for next gen of VR goggles, I decided I will never go on that bus, because having to buy this and VR . At least latest tech , is not worth it and never will . And you will never ever be able to buy such thing for a reasonable amount of money. I can afford it, but somewhere I draw the line

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17 hours ago, ZachariasX said:

RTX would be interesting it it allowed shaders processing refractions looking through our canopies. Rest... pretty but.. meh....

 

We have refraction like effects in current implementation of rain droplets, already. No need for any extra HW for this.

 

11 hours ago, BeastyBaiter said:

I suspect the gains are fairly modest. The "new" 12nm is actually just 16nm+, which is a minor revision of the GTX 10xx series cards (think i7-6700k to i7-7700k). The core manufacturing tech didn't change any. This is why the die sizes increased so much when adding the ray tracing parts. Given the core specs, I expect the RTX 2080 to be roughly similar to the 1080 Ti if not actually a bit slower when ignoring ray tracing. The 2080 Ti should be clearly faster, but at that price...

 

I'd hope for earlier GDDR6 adoption - it'd allow to make less expensive 64/128bit chips much faster. Will not happen, thought... :(

Edited by Ehret

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2 hours ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

FUCK DUDE, the cards gone off amazon, the prices for nearly all of them went up tonight, probably due to these new piece of shit cards releasing, thanks nvidia, double fucking us. I really can't stand them.

 

Just wait until next month. The 1080Ti will drop even further as the 2080's get closer to launch. I might not even keep a 2080 for myself and may just stick with what I got for now, because they're not that impressive honestly. I'll decide after seeing the benchmarks, but even the 1080Ti wasn't enough to make me leap from the 980Ti when it first came out.

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Hi gents,

 

I've just received a promotional mail from Digitec announcing the new NVidia graphic cards as to pre-order. Wow, those prizes are very very hefty

for not to say absolutely mad. Have a look:

 

Raytracing – die nächste Grafikrevolution?

RTX 2080 Ti

  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUKE 11G OC (11GB, Gaming)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUKE 11G OC (11GB, Gaming)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUKE 11G OC (11GB, Gaming)
NEU
1369.–
MSI GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUKE 11G OC (11GB, Gaming)
 
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING X TRIO (11GB, Gaming)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING X TRIO (11GB, Gaming)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING X TRIO (11GB, Gaming)
NEU
1389.–
MSI GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING X TRIO (11GB, Gaming)
 
 2
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Phoenix GS (11GB, High End)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Phoenix GS (11GB, High End)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Phoenix GS (11GB, High End)
NEU
1379.–
Gainward GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Phoenix GS (11GB, High End)
 
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GamingPro OC (11GB, High End)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GamingPro OC (11GB, High End)
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GamingPro OC (11GB, High End)
NEU
1379.–
Palit GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GamingPro OC (11GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUAL O11G (11GB, High End)
NEU
1399.–
ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 Ti DUAL O11G (11GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 Ti TURBO 11G (11GB, High End)
NEU
1319.–
ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 Ti TURBO 11G (11GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING OC 11G (11GB, High End)
NEU
1359.–
Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 Ti GAMING OC 11G (11GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Windforce OC 11G (11GB, High End)
NEU
1319.–
Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Windforce OC 11G (11GB, High End)
 
 
 

RTX 2080

  • GeForce RTX 2080 DUKE 8G OC (8GB, Gaming)
  • image.gif.edee1eecba219dafc4a57b1991a392f1.gif
  • image.gif.a349d3bfc2d2757037b5af6e2ea26d65.gif
NEU
959.–
MSI GeForce RTX 2080 DUKE 8G OC (8GB, Gaming)
 
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING X TRIO (8GB, Gaming)
  • image.gif.d6486393a31856bd43ce238ac4a1dd68.gif
  • image.gif.e23cfe1d42773aba449f8d0d271164e8.gif
NEU
989.–
MSI GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING X TRIO (8GB, Gaming)
 
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Phoenix GS (8GB, High End)
  • image.gif.924d364182da4efd877667cbd2b487fb.gif
  • image.gif.35924cdb018726836185f2933611f28c.gif
NEU
999.–statt vorher 1129.–1
Gainward GeForce RTX 2080 Phoenix GS (8GB, High End)
 
 
 
  • GeForce RTX 2080 GamingPro OC (8GB, High End)
  • image.gif.9b89078149543c252d473bd832da85bf.gif
  • image.gif.7666f1e8758802cbfbe2febe0a05b435.gif
NEU
979.–statt vorher 1129.–1
Palit GeForce RTX 2080 GamingPro OC (8GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 ROG STRIX O8G Gaming (8GB, High End)
NEU
1049.–
ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 ROG STRIX O8G Gaming (8GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 DUAL O8G (8GB, High End)
NEU
959.–
ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 DUAL O8G (8GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING OC 8G (8GB, High End)
NEU
979.–
Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING OC 8G (8GB, High End)
 
 
 
GeForce RTX 2080 Windforce OC 8G (8GB, High End)
NEU
929.–
Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2080 Windforce OC 8G (8GB, High End)
 
 

I for sure will wait for looong time and before even thinking about it, I need to upgrade my CPU which of course will also induce a new main board and new RAM.

 

Cheerio

 

P.S.: Those prizes indicated are in Swiss francs - so bloody expensive!

Edited by -IRRE-Therion

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18 minutes ago, -IRRE-Therion said:

Wow, those prizes are very very hefty

for not to say absolutely mad.

 

-> I assume the cards will be faster than the older Generations only in raytracing 🤩 🤣

 

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Honestly it looks that it is better to buy second hand 1080ti than this generation of cards... TFLOPS alone it is at absolute best 20% improvement over the previous gen, vs. 50% of what we got a generation ago.

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6 hours ago, Ehret said:

We have refraction like effects in current implementation of rain droplets, already. No need for any extra HW for this.

 

It seems that is not that simple. The devs made it quite clear that modeling refraction is out of reach for them. The problem is, refraction gives you a periscope vision that lets you look aroun corners, and this depending on the angle you're looking through the glass. This means, in one single FOV, how much the view is distorted will differ throughout. You cannot simply put a map of the "outside" of the Window on the "inside". Maps that work for mirrors like this can't be used.

 

The effect you see in raindrops is like blurring things behind your desktop windows, it just distorts what is behind. It doesn't compute a new line of sight. THis new line of sight most likelay has to be determined by raytracing. You'd need hardware capability for that. Unless this capability is mainstream, we will be stuck with The Bar™.

 

 

29 minutes ago, JaffaCake said:

Honestly it looks that it is better to buy second hand 1080ti than this generation of cards... TFLOPS alone it is at absolute best 20% improvement over the previous gen, vs. 50% of what we got a generation ago.

20% performance increase offset by ~20% price penalty. A 1080 TI is CHF 1100.- and a 2080 Ti is CHF 1300.-

 

But at least you can have 20% more power in one card. If you need that.

Edited by ZachariasX

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22 minutes ago, ZachariasX said:

The effect you see in raindrops is like blurring things behind your desktop windows, it just distorts what is behind. It doesn't compute a new line of sight. THis new line of sight most likelay has to be determined by raytracing. You'd need hardware capability for that. Unless this capability is mainstream, we will be stuck with The Bar™.

 

Hmm... One could compute a single ray per every flat (or close to it) part of the canopy then render it and distort around edges. At least do it for the armored glass in the front which is always flat. Not true per pixel diffraction but should be an improvement. Mirrors and rain drops (re-render and distortion) don't impact that much performance and dozen (or just one for the front) rays should be doable on current HW.

Edited by Ehret

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11 minutes ago, Ehret said:

One could compute a single ray and re-render "normally" the environment per every flat

It doesn't work this way. Every pixel on the screen is followed all the way back to the light source. But you can indeed split some of the workload. And this is what is happening in the games / tech advertisements (presented as "rewiev").

 

We will probably see this probaly in the future as a converging of both rasterizing and ray tracing. They are both good/efficient at different things. I see the 2080 series mostly as some tech demo showcasing such. Like back in stone age, where the Martox Millenium graphics card first could do (some) 3D. Redering games at 30 FPS in 1080p is not the level you expect of a thousand $ product, unless it is just to show off.

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42 minutes ago, ZachariasX said:

It doesn't work this way. Every pixel on the screen is followed all the way back to the light source. But you can indeed split some of the workload. And this is what is happening in the games / tech advertisements (presented as "rewiev").

 

Basically, I meant to render the armored glass as a shifted front POV within glass' borders - not unlike how mirrors are done. In most cases the glass is inside a non-transparent  frame so extra trickery to make it blend shouldn't be too difficult.

I'm just speculating on ways to do something without resorting to full RT. There should be a way - the rasterization itself is such trick and worked reasonably well to fool our eyes, so far.

Edited by Ehret

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1 hour ago, ZachariasX said:

A 1080 TI is CHF 1100.- and a 2080 Ti is CHF 1300.-

You compare prices balooned by miners with cards not yet released, with fixed price for pre-order in a specific situation. In my country you can easily get 1080 Ti priced around or even below MSRP - between 2.999 PLN to 3.800 PLN. 2080Ti costs 5.600 PLN to 6.000 PLN. I'd say it's not a 20 % price increase but 100 % and you should rather compare them by MSRPs.

I am fairly certain that once RTX GPUs will become available, high demand and low availability will make prices skyrocket.

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1 hour ago, ZachariasX said:

 

It seems that is not that simple. The devs made it quite clear that modeling refraction is out of reach for them. The problem is, refraction gives you a periscope vision that lets you look aroun corners, and this depending on the angle you're looking through the glass. This means, in one single FOV, how much the view is distorted will differ throughout. You cannot simply put a map of the "outside" of the Window on the "inside". Maps that work for mirrors like this can't be used.

 

The effect you see in raindrops is like blurring things behind your desktop windows, it just distorts what is behind. It doesn't compute a new line of sight. THis new line of sight most likelay has to be determined by raytracing. You'd need hardware capability for that. Unless this capability is mainstream, we will be stuck with The Bar™.

 

 

20% performance increase offset by ~20% price penalty. A 1080 TI is CHF 1100.- and a 2080 Ti is CHF 1300.-

 

But at least you can have 20% more power in one card. If you need that.

LOL where you getting a those prices? Right now I can get a 1080ti for 600 or a 2080ti for 1200 choice is clear. 

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I'll wait to see how they perform with the games and sims we all like to play. IL2, X-Plane, DCS, Post Scriptum. If it's not worth the price think I'll splurge for a 1080TI at hopefully a reduced cost as to what they are now. Or wait for AMD's next gen to come out, I've always had AMD cards and am kind of scared  of switching brands because I'm so comfortable with all the settings compared to learning something completely new. But it might be time to switch because Nvidia seems to be the standard these days and great for sims for years now.

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7 hours ago, =362nd_FS=Hiromachi said:

you should rather compare them by MSRPs.

 

7 hours ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

LOL where you getting a those prices? Right now I can get a 1080ti for 600 or a 2080ti for 1200 choice is clear. 

 

I compared list prices from one of the largest Swiss online retailers (that Therion linked to) that now are listing those items. It lists the 1080 Ti still at ~$1'100 USD. The 2080 Ti is listed at ~$1'300 USD. Getting a 1080 Ti for a mere $600 would be great. And death to many competing GPU's on that retailers site.

 

 

Edited by ZachariasX

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