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Wolf8312

Mongoose (VPC) Vanquishes the Warthog (Thrust-master)

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7 minutes ago, WheelwrightPL said:

I have a few questions regarding the desk mount you have to use with Virpil T-50:

 

- Is it comfortable to use with an office chair for a long time ? (BTW: my chair has adjustable armrests)

 

- Do you place the joystick between your legs or to the side ? And do you get enough range of motion with your preferred placement ?

 

- Is the desk mount a pain to install/uninstall every day ? (for those of us who don't have a dedicated desk)

 

- Is the desk mount wearing out the desk itself ? (I am concerned about the weight and forces being transferred)

 

And an unrelated question: does the stick allow you to fly more precisely in IL2 ? (I mean less wobble, greater gun accuracy, etc:)

Congrats on your purchase:salute:

 

1: For me it is very comfortable to use.

2: Between my legs with 150mm of extensions. With the desk mount bracket in lowest position, my arm is basically parallel to desk and is very comfortable for me. No problem with range of motion. I would note the desk mount puts the gimbal a little further away from desk, so you will likely be sitting further back than you normally would. For me in VR this is no issue.

3: No, I have mine mounted in about 1 minute, same with taking it back off.

4: I have a very solid wooden desk, not an issue for me.

 

Lastly, yes I especially found it really helped my gunnery skills, and I am much smoother with the flying.

I came from using a Warthog with a 7.5CM extension.

 

Edited by dburne
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16 hours ago, RhumbaAzul said:

I'd agree with the above statement, Thrustmaster whilst not perfect in anyway, at least aren't too hard to get hold of, for products or for support, i can't say the same about some of the 'boutique' brands being touted here. I use the word 'touted' as the op sounds like he's being paid by Virple....imho.

 

Poor form accusing me of being a Shill bud! It's just cognitive dissonance. Whether a VR headset (Rift VS  a VIVE/pro) or a flight stick, everyone wants to believe what they have is the best, even to the point of convincing themselves that a perfectly legitimate review like mine must have been written by a paid shill! 

 

By the way my VPC stick was pretty painless in terms of delivery as mentioned in the review so again I think that's just something you are telling yourself in order to convince yourself that you don't want a virpil!

 

PS virpil if you do want a paid shill I am game! :biggrin:

Edited by Wolf8312
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The Virpil is definately an upgrade on the Warthog.

We all have our own experiences of things and there clearly are people with trouble-free Warthogs. It's a good stick when it works.

However I've been through 5 of them (and at least twice as many replacement base units). Forget any 'stiction' issues (which can be easily sorted), mine all went slack in the middle and had handles that started to rotate.

If it had been made with a metal gimbal and plastic handle it would have been worth the money in my opinion. But as has already been said it costs far too much considering the poor quality of it's insides.

The handle is way too heavy for the rest of the unit, and I suspect using an extension makes things even worse. (So I'd think twice about mounting the WH handle on any other base.)

A bit of a shame as for me the WH design is slightly better. (Main thing being on the WH the 4-way thumb button is offset to the left, and feels generally more 'roomy'.)

 

Having said that I got used to the Virpil grip pretty quickly, and I wouldn't swap the Virpil even for a fully working WH.

 

Desk mount - been great so far. Can fit or remove in 15 seconds no problem. It's a little fiddly, maybe a clamp would be better but nothing to worry about. And yes you'll be a little further away from your desk. I'm thinking about a small notch in my desk as it could sit further forward..

Still using the WH Throttle which is also on a desk mount. Obvious concerns about the weight of the unit but it's pretty solid I have to say. There is a slight wobble, but if anything it's simulating a bit of cockpit vibration.

 

The crucial element of a stick is really the gimbal, and in that respect it's a no contest between these two.

My only concern so far is the red button - can be hit or miss if it triggers or not, but the others have been good so far. I'll obviously need to be careful of that flippy trigger switch, but as exclusively a WW1 virtual pilot I have the luxury of being able to use that as my reset center view command, so not needed often !

 

S!

 

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The sad part is that they don't answer to questions...

 

Was trying to upgrade also but to no avail... No answer from them, even writing in russian...

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13 minutes ago, MacLeod said:

The sad part is that they don't answer to questions...

 

Was trying to upgrade also but to no avail... No answer from them, even writing in russian...

 

That has certainly not been my experience, they have been very prompt whenever I contact them.

Are you emailing support@virpil.com?

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7 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

That has certainly not been my experience, they have been very prompt whenever I contact them.

Are you emailing support@virpil.com?

No, I tried facebook. Will try copying to their email. Thanks

 

Will update here if things change for me.

 

The funny thing is that they saw the message and decided not to answer :S

Edited by MacLeod

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Email them. As per my experience, they do answer you on Facebook eventually but it takes time. And they often refer you to their email support anyway.

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Not everyone can afford joystick with extension and not everyone have space for such setup. My rig is in my living room which inst small but my wife would kill me If I would make a simpit there. Not that I would do it myslef there...And no, I dont have a garage near my flat or some dump room to make a simpit.

Edited by blackram
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46 minutes ago, blackram said:

Not everyone can afford joystick with extension and not everyone have space for such setup. My rig is in my living room which inst small but my wife would kill me If I would make a simpit there. Not that I would do it myslef there...And no, I dont have a garage near my flat or some dump room to make a simpit.

 

I wouldn't say I have a sim-pit exactly. Its basically just a chair in front of a computer as it would be without all the flight sim gear. A throttle off to the side but it's no big intrusion and my flat/apartment is tiny.

 

As for the price I'm sure you could afford it if you really wanted it and saved up and paid it off little by little. They are expensive but they are not like buying new cars or houses/apartments. My full setup was built up over many years and I've spent a lot of money on it, but I also don't go out drinking at weekends to bars, and things as I used to, so that saves a lot of money. Sacrifice one thing to pay for the other I guess.

 

But then don't buy it if you don't want to!  

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I didnt say dont buy or that I wouldnt buy a joystick with extension. Its just a non reality in central europe due to economical reasons. Average salary here is 810 EUR.  You cna imagine what is left after you pay all the bills, kids, gasoline (which is 1,18 EUR per liter currently) and food.

Edited by blackram
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Well, I received a couple hours ago confirmation that a new trigger is coming to me. If I'm uncomfortable with design of that external trigger, than I must say that their customer support is top notch. They replied to my emails rapidly and provided support in that matter quite well.

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I would send at least two replacement triggers if I were them. The cost of one plastic trigger must be negligible compared with the shipping cost.

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2 hours ago, =362nd_FS=Hiromachi said:

Well, I received a couple hours ago confirmation that a new trigger is coming to me. If I'm uncomfortable with design of that external trigger, than I must say that their customer support is top notch. They replied to my emails rapidly and provided support in that matter quite well.

 

I received confirmation also, really looking forward to getting it as I am sure missing it.

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6 minutes ago, BP_Lizard said:

Is it going to be the same trigger or a redesign, dburne?

 

Same trigger. Guess I will try to take extra precaution with it now, although I thought I had always been gentle with it. They say there have been very few instances of this, so hopefully I will not have the problem again. Now that I was used to having it, I sure do miss it when I don't. 

I will say though have been waiting a while on this.

The downside of ordering from a boutique mfg overseas I guess. Absolutely love the stick though.

Edited by dburne

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6 hours ago, Seb71 said:

I would send at least two replacement triggers if I were them. The cost of one plastic trigger must be negligible compared with the shipping cost.

 

Humm will it be possible to buy a couple of replacement triggers from them do you think so if the unthinkable were to occur I would not have the wait you have endured?

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25 minutes ago, Wolf8312 said:

 

Humm will it be possible to buy a couple of replacement triggers from them do you think so if the unthinkable were to occur I would not have the wait you have endured?

 

Contact them at support@virpil.com and ask the question.

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2 hours ago, dburne said:

 

Contact them at support@virpil.com and ask the question.

 

Might just do that. I think it's best not to use the trigger for guns or cannons though far be it from me to tell anyone how to use their own flightstick! I use mine for bombs and rockets which I like because the flip down is as if I am flipping the safety off! Feels pretty cool. Since buying a throttle quartet, I am now able to off load some of my buttons that were previously used for my landing gear etc, and so can use the lower buttons on the mongoose for primary and secondary guns. Works good cause every finger is now on every gun trigger at all times! Little finger on the bottom, thumb on the middle and index on the main trigger.

 

I noticed in dogfights myself sometimes that I would become so entranced, that when I finally came out of it, I was actually pressing down on the trigger with quite alot of force. Just sort of clenched. Easy to see in that situation if I was using the flipper, how it might lead to an accident. Not sure about the design to be honest as part of the flipper sticks out and presses back into the stick itself.

 

PS here’s the quartet beautiful craftsmanship, highly recommended (it’s not a throttle!) although now I’ve got more axes than I know what to do with, and It kind of bums me out since BOS is having performance issues for me in VR. This was ordered before the problems started sigh!

D3DEDEE6-E570-46CB-906C-8A24DA54B813.jpeg

Edited by Wolf8312

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No trigger for guns or cannons?

Blasphemy I tell ya!!

;)

 

I tried assigning cannons to a button, just can't seem to get used to that. Triggers are just ah so natural so to speak.

I am living with cannons on first stage and machine guns on second stage of main trigger for now, will be so glad when replacement gets here.

 

Nice box!!

 

I have  a CH Throttle Quadrant in addition to my Warthog throttle for the extra axis and  buttons.

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6 hours ago, dburne said:

I am living with cannons on first stage and machine guns on second stage of main trigger for now

 

Wouldn't the other way around be better? You have more machine gun rounds than cannon rounds, so you can afford to use the machine guns more "carefree".

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3 hours ago, Seb71 said:

 

Wouldn't the other way around be better? You have more machine gun rounds than cannon rounds, so you can afford to use the machine guns more "carefree".

 

Yeah maybe, but with the missions I seem to be flying in the Career more often than not I will prefer Cannons first over Machine Guns, which is why I set them to my first stage trigger.

Hopefully my replacement flip down trigger will be here soon and I can get back to having them on separate triggers again.

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An good solution for this MG's and trigger problem was Cobra M-5 dual trigger in tandem:

 

M5_trigger.giffree image hosting

 

Could use only one - first or second - or both triggers simultaneous.

 

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, dburne said:

No trigger for guns or cannons?

Blasphemy I tell ya!!

;)

 

I tried assigning cannons to a button, just can't seem to get used to that. Triggers are just ah so natural so to speak.

I am living with cannons on first stage and machine guns on second stage of main trigger for now, will be so glad when replacement gets here.

 

Nice box!!

 

I have  a CH Throttle Quadrant in addition to my Warthog throttle for the extra axis and  buttons.

 

I tend to fire cannons and guns together anyway really (guess I'm doing it wrong?), my theory being that although I am using more ammo I tend to kill my targets quicker and so it ends up working out about the same as a prolonged singular MG or Cannon attack. Doubt this is right of course, and I am sure more experienced pilots are able to eke as many kills as possible out of either one, or the other instead of wasting precious ammo like I am probably doing. Is there a general rule about when it's best to use the 'fire all guns' option? Perhaps I am the only one who ever uses it?

Was looking into the CH Throttle Quadrant at one time. I was always put off by all the plastic! It was a similar quadrant that you have that I showed the guy when telling him what I wanted. I guess in VR it really makes little difference plastic or metal, but I am very happy with the quality, look and feel of the piece.

 

It's actually much nicer than I was expecting! I think it looks nicer in the photo above than the ones he posts on his advertisement page to be honest, kinda looks better in that light (or maybe its the angle), or context I think, and you get a better idea of its scale in comparison to it's surroundings.

The GVL quadrant is a bit of an extravagance some would consider unnecessary, as it's not an essential like the stick or rudder pedals. I think if my throttle ever tanks I would consider buying from him again though, as it was very much plug and play! Look at this beast haha- IMG_20180326_104457_01.jpg

Are you planing on getting the Virpil throttle Dburne?

 

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1 hour ago, Wolf8312 said:

 

I tend to fire cannons and guns together anyway really (guess I'm doing it wrong?), my theory being that although I am using more ammo I tend to kill my targets quicker and so it ends up working out about the same as a prolonged singular MG or Cannon attack. Doubt this is right of course, and I am sure more experienced pilots are able to eke as many kills as possible out of either one, or the other instead of wasting precious ammo like I am probably doing. Is there a general rule about when it's best to use the 'fire all guns' option? Perhaps I am the only one who ever uses it?

Was looking into the CH Throttle Quadrant at one time. I was always put off by all the plastic! It was a similar quadrant that you have that I showed the guy when telling him what I wanted. I guess in VR it really makes little difference plastic or metal, but I am very happy with the quality, look and feel of the piece.

 

It's actually much nicer than I was expecting! I think it looks nicer in the photo above than the ones he posts on his advertisement page to be honest, kinda looks better in that light (or maybe its the angle), or context I think, and you get a better idea of its scale in comparison to it's surroundings.

The GVL quadrant is a bit of an extravagance some would consider unnecessary, as it's not an essential like the stick or rudder pedals. I think if my throttle ever tanks I would consider buying from him again though, as it was very much plug and play! Look at this beast haha- 

 

That is a great looking quadrant!!

 

RE: Cannons versus Machine Guns. I prefer to have them separated, I am very conservative with my cannon ammo. It does not take much to down a plane with cannons, I find them very effective against those pesky 109's and 190's. If you hit them just right very easy to shoot a wing off.

 

 

I use my machine guns primarily on bombers, all one has to do is get them to drop their bombs for success, and I find I can do that fairly easily with my machine guns.

I find this really helps me conserve ammo and leave some in reserve for that trip back home just in case.

I very rarely combine the two together.

 

 

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On 4/7/2018 at 12:57 AM, =362nd_FS=Hiromachi said:

I broke my trigger (that outer one that you can flip outside) today while flying.

 

On 4/10/2018 at 8:20 PM, dburne said:

Well I spoke too soon, mine just broke the same way.

You have the MongoosT-50 or the MongoosT-50 CM grips?

 

The "CM" has a remodeled flip trigger.

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6 minutes ago, Seb71 said:

 

You have the MongoosT-50 or the MongoosT-50 CM grips?

 

The "CM" has a remodeled flip trigger.

 

I have the T-50.

 

I am told there was no change to the flip down trigger in the CM. 

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18 minutes ago, Seb71 said:

They list the flip trigger as one of the things that changed in the CM version.

 

Well the other guy here that had one break was with the CM grip.

After mine broke I had considered buying the CM grip until I saw that post. 

 

Edited by dburne

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CM trigger has different shape - more width, but still made in plastic. 

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On 4/23/2018 at 4:40 PM, dburne said:

 

Yes, they are supposed to be sending me a new flip down trigger.

As far as explanation not really, other than to say there have been very few instances of this happening.

 

Whenever I get it I will definitely try to be extra cautious with it.

 

 

Well I can only imagine they are inundated with customer complaints on this one as mine just broke as well, and I knowing of what happened to you guys was very wary and gentle with it. No other words to describe it other than brittle and poor quality! It was indeed as if it's structural integrity dimminished over time as well. Very dissapointed. Have asked for a replacement but to be honest the quality of that particular part is so poor that, even if they send me a replacement I could only assume it to be just a matter of time. They need a whole new trigger! Might as well assign cannons to another button, and just forget about it because that trigger will not last and wont be worth the frustration! The worst thing is its an addition I really grew to love, it felt bad ass, and was very efficent and convenient, but if I have to be any more gentle than I was being, its just a pain in the...

 

Good design, very bad materials. So yes metal innards are  great, but they have skimped with the outer parts!  Not the end of the world cause there are more than enough buttons but its something to be aware of if buying this stick, that trigger is deeply flawed!

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2 minutes ago, Wolf8312 said:

 

Well I can only imagine they are inundated with customer complaints on this one as mine just broke as well, and I knowing of what happened to you guys was very wary and gentle with it. No other words to describe it other than brittle and poor quality! It was indeed as if it's structural integrity dimminished over time as well. Very dissapointed. Have asked for a replacement but to be honest the quality of that particular part is so poor that, even if they send me a replacement I could only assume it to be just a matter of time. They need a whole new trigger! Might as well assign cannons to another button, and just forget about it because that trigger will not last and wont be worth the frustration! The worst thing is its an addition I really grew to love, it felt bad ass, and was very efficent and convenient, but if I have to be any more gentle than I was being, its just a pain in the...

 

Good design, very bad materials. So yes metal innards are  great, but they have skimped with the outer parts!  Not the end of the world cause there are more than enough buttons but its something to be aware of if buying this stick, that trigger is deeply flawed!

 

Yeah I really missed having that flip down trigger when mine broke until I got the replacement. I too am concerned my replacement is going to eventually break at some point also, even though I am being as gentle as I can with it. I tried assigning cannons to another button but just did not feel right to me. I ended up using cannons on first stage main trigger and machine guns on second stage until I received my replacement.

 

I am hoping this one at least lasts some time longer than my original one did. Think I am going to contact them and see if I can maybe buy some spares to have, if not too pricey may be worth having them.

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1 minute ago, dburne said:

 

Yeah I really missed having that flip down trigger when mine broke until I got the replacement. I too am concerned my replacement is going to eventually break at some point also, even though I am being as gentle as I can with it. I tried assigning cannons to another button but just did not feel right to me. I ended up using cannons on first stage main trigger and machine guns on second stage until I received my replacement.

 

I am hoping this one at least lasts some time longer than my original one did. Think I am going to contact them and see if I can maybe buy some spares to have, if not too pricey may be worth having them.

 

I was trying to be as gentle as possible, but the truth is in an intense dogfight you can only be so gentle and the parts should be strong enough to withstand such moments, but believe me I wasnt pressing down very hard, it was more that my finger had been pressed down for an extended period of time, than that I suddenly just applied brute force.

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On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 8:47 AM, BP_Lizard said:

Is it going to be the same trigger or a redesign, dburne?

If you have that much concern of it breaking again thentake the new trigger to a machine shop and have them machine a new one from metal or aluminum.  

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