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Venturi

Mirror ... in Bf110

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Just something to think about possibly adding..?

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No..no...please dont install this ugly thing into my beloved 110.

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Well you'd be able to see on your 6, but you'd still have that massive red clown nose right between your eyes blocking your 12.

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Well you'd be able to see on your 6, but you'd still have that massive red clown nose right between your eyes blocking your 12.

The nightmares of that skin... I've seen the quick flash of it many times before something important gets torn off my plane.

And it won't go away in the future either! The Yak-7 has one too!

 

post-19-0-63836600-1507925317.jpg

 

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Looks like a field mod,no?Anybod knows how common it was?

 

German aircrafts were a patchwork due to the realities of war. You can rest assured almost everyone had his shaving mirror / Kübelwagen mirror mounted in the cockpit. There are multiple accounts of tales of and from the pilots checking their mirrors e.g. in 109, most famous one being Hartmann. They should have a lot of vibration going on though, even if handheld. The simulation games so far don't reflect that because mirrors were not factory mounted. Hence they all portray German aircraft without the option to mount mirrors.

 

To get a picture by analogy, the German Army and Luftwaffe of the time were very much like the modern Israeli Army in terms of equipment. Auftragstaktik (loose mission goals, achieve as you see fit on the tactical level), gear of even the common soldier (you can find many pictures and documentations of Germans using Russian guns, or Ukrainian boots and winter clothing under white overalls), and other things were up to the troops themselves. Same with the pilots, their modifications to their own aircraft, individualization to them, etc.

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It's seam to be more for keeping a visual contact with his gunner than to "check his six". 

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Hence they all portray German aircraft without the option to mount mirrors.

 

Not so - take a look at the Hs 129. 

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gear of even the common soldier (you can find many pictures and documentations of Germans using Russian guns, or Ukrainian boots and winter clothing under white overalls), and other things were up to the troops themselves.

 

It was "up to the troops themselves" because the Wehrmacht couldn't keep said troops properly supplied and was utterly unprepared for fighting in winter combat in the East - the alternative for those guys was to freeze to death. 

Edited by LukeFF
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It's seam to be more for keeping a visual contact with his gunner than to "check his six". 

Yes that mirror looks useless for anything else, especially in a 110 with all the canopy bars and gunner in the way. 

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One thing I've learned about mirrors (Spitfire) is that if you see an enemy on you six, it's too late already... :lol:

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One thing I've learned about mirrors (Spitfire) is that if you see an enemy on you six, it's too late already... :lol:

What he said!

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If the mirror is directed as bad as in the Hs129, it is pretty useless, anyway. :(

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If the mirror is directed as bad as in the Hs129, it is pretty useless, anyway. :(

? the Hs 129s mirror is awesome, not sure what you're talking about

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very useful to refresh your make-up

young-woman-looking-rear-view-mirror-put

 

That was exactly what I thought - very useful for a female ferry pilot to freshen up before she dismounts in front of all the young airmen.  :)

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That was exactly what I thought - very useful for a female ferry pilot to freshen up before she dismounts in front of all the young airmen. :)

Hey what about my makeup as a beautiful metrosexual chap? You sexist! ;)

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Hey what about my makeup as a beautiful metrosexual chap? You sexist! ;)

Then I suppose when delivering to lonely pilots on remote pacific islands, you'll do.

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Then I suppose when delivering to lonely pilots on remote pacific islands, you'll do.

 

Ha! Indeed, nobody is perfect, but flesh will have its way.  I just hope that OrLoK looks nothing like his avatar.

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I believe when looking at this thread from start to finish, I can see the overarching themes of all humanity. Carry on...

? the Hs 129s mirror is awesome, not sure what you're talking about

Completely agreed.

Any kind of BYOD now as mod?

Just mirrors. I mean, you can’t reasonably model all the other things that were carried on the planes like sidearms.

I think the gunner's fat head would block most of what you'd be able to see. Could be useful if he gets killed though.

So cynical.

Well you'd be able to see on your 6, but you'd still have that massive red clown nose right between your eyes blocking your 12.

Have to take BMW up on that one, of course this isn’t a FW...

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Even the He111 has a mirror for pilot, I asked Han for adding it before, but w/o response.

Edited by III/JG2Gustav05

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Just out of courosity,if these mirrors were really helpfull,why didn't they become standard and were installed already in the factory?

Each pilot is picky on mirror configuration. See thread above for proof. 

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Just out of courosity,if these mirrors were really helpfull,why didn't they become standard and were installed already in the factory?

Because there was no real standard for such minor modification. It was up to the pilots or mechanics themselves. Aircraft on the German side were highly customizable, more like a toolbox to play around with, while Americans and soviets had perfected mass production, that wasn't the case for Germany, which had a more workshop approach instead of assembly line. Didn't serve them well, we may recognize. Anyway, hence this, we have all the confusion on other topics as well.

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Just out of courosity,if these mirrors were really helpfull,why didn't they become standard and were installed already in the factory?

 

IMO vibrations rendered most field-mod internal mirrors largely useless, while more solidly mounted external mirrors were in general not factory installed because:

1) aircraft designers are not combat pilots

2) external mirrors would limit aircraft speed, and speed is an important design specification

Edited by Nibbio

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The mirror would be a nice addition regardless of the practicality.

 

If the devs find time to slip a mirror modification in for E-series 110's, it would be a nice little treat. More modifications/options are a good thing.

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? the Hs 129s mirror is awesome, not sure what you're talking about

It points at the pilots head. I have bug reported it.

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It points at the pilots head. I have bug reported it.

again, no not really, it points right along the back of the plane towards the rudder if you're seated properly (aka, default position)

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again, no not really, it points right along the back of the plane towards the rudder if you're seated properly (aka, default position)

The ability to tweak the angle of the mirror would be nice for those who want to use non-default head positions, (ala Euro/American truck sim) but I figure that is an unlikely feature to be added. 

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again, no not really, it points right along the back of the plane towards the rudder if you're seated properly (aka, default position)

 

I have bugreport screenshots that show otherwise.

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well then i recommend you fix your head position first before you make bug reports.  ;)

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Why would the pilot of a 110 want a rear view mirror, when he has a gunner/radio operator behind him who can tell him everything he needs to know? It doesn't make any sense to me.

Edited by Wulf

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Why would the pilot of a 110 want a rear view mirror, when he has a gunner/radio operator behind him who can tell him everything he needs to know? It doesn't make any sense to me.

Maybe it is a matter of trust?

 

Maybe this 110 was also used as a tow plane.

 

Maybe the pilot wanted a better photo of himself.

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Why would the pilot of a 110 want a rear view mirror, when he has a gunner/radio operator behind him who can tell him everything he needs to know? It doesn't make any sense to me.

 

Because more options are good and, practically speaking, the gunner/RO doesn't do that in IL-2.

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