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Windows MR released the Steam VR patch today, so I gave my new headset a whirl.

 

It isn't going well.

 

The software is a little glitchy and I have had to restart my computer twice because windows would lose track of my headset when I closed Steam VR on occasion.  Probably not a surprise given the newness of it all.  Surely that will get better.  

 

I launched Onward to check the hand tracking and it worked well, which surprised me.  Still not Rift/Vive quality, but it'll do. 

 

Now..  IL2

 

So far I am quite discouraged.  

 

The game loaded just fine, but for some reason the game thinks I am tiny.  Everything is rendered oddly as if we are flying model airplanes.  I removed the Steam VR supersampling settings back to 1.0 but I am not sure why this game (and this game alone right now) is not rendering the HMD scale correctly.  I am going to keep fidgeting with some settings but so far its a bust.

 

I imagine everyone is wondering, Does it look better?  Honestly it is hard to really tell until the scale of the pilot is fixed.  It was quite funny to sit in the cockpit of a little model 109.

Edited by WISredcoat22

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Windows MR released the Steam VR patch today, so I gave my new headset a whirl.

 

It isn't going well.

 

The software is a little glitchy and I have had to restart my computer twice because windows would lose track of my headset when I closed Steam VR on occasion. Probably not a surprise given the newness of it all. Surely that will get better.

 

I launched Onward to check the hand tracking and it worked well, which surprised me. Still not Rift/Vive quality, but it'll do.

 

Now.. IL2

 

So far I am quite discouraged.

 

The game loaded just fine, but for some reason the game thinks I am a giant. Everything is rendered oddly as if we are flying model airplanes. I removed the Steam VR supersampling settings back to 1.0 but I am not sure why this game (and this game alone right now) is not rendering the HMD scale correctly. I am going to keep fidgeting with some settings but so far its a bust.

 

I imagine everyone is wondering, Does it look better? Honestly it is hard to really tell until the scale of the pilot is fixed. It was quite funny to sit in the cockpit of a little model 109.

Did you try to fidget around with the graphics settings in the startup.cry file? You might have to make the file a read-only once you've changed the settings.

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Did you try to fidget around with the graphics settings in the startup.cry file? You might have to make the file a read-only once you've changed the settings.

I wouldn't know how to even begin doing that.

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I wouldn't know how to even begin doing that.

Spell correct changed cfg to cry. Sorry. If you want I can try to post the internals of the file. And point to the possible lines that might be adjustable in your case. I would also recommend searching the forum for changing the display pixel count others have done for the puma and vive when they initially came out months back. There might be some useful info there. I'll try to as well to refresh my memory.

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Its actually really odd.  The landscape appears to be correct, but the plane and the player view is miniature.  The grass goes over the wings.  I was able to log into WOL and still it was like I was a two foot tall man in a tiny plane.  Even the main menu hanger looks the same.

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Its actually really odd. The landscape appears to be correct, but the plane and the player view is miniature. The grass goes over the wings. I was able to log into WOL and still it was like I was a two foot tall man in a tiny plane. Even the main menu hanger looks the same.

Would be interesting to see this.

You should see an identical view in the monitor viewport. And should be able to take screenshot as you are sitting in this tiny plane in the cockpit by pressing the "Printscreen" button, etc....

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The grass in the game reaches the wings in my rift as well. It’s just tall. Have you used other hmds? The bf109 does feel small. Maybe try the p40, this one is the opposite, it looks like my feet can’t reach the pedals

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The grass in the game reaches the wings in my rift as well. It’s just tall. Have you used other hmds? The bf109 does feel small. Maybe try the p40, this one is the opposite, it looks like my feet can’t reach the pedals

I have used an Oculus for many months and it works perfectly.  

 

I have some screenshots I will upload tonight, but this is literally like your head is tiny and the plane is tiny.  The gauges look like the size of quarters in front of you.  The stick looks like you could barely hold it with two fingers.  The FOV is somehow off and the plane is tiny compared to the landscape.  It's not as simple as "lean in closer to the cockpit"; the scale is bugged somehow.

 

I will add that the tracking does work fine and the screen door effect is reduced.  I can safely say that visually this is potentially better (aside from the MAJOR issue above) but it isn't "generation 2" better.

Edited by WISredcoat22

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How is the contrast? I found Oculus and Vive quite flat. I'm hoping the new Samsung screens will be quite bright.  Also, is 60fps supported? 

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How is the contrast? I found Oculus and Vive quite flat. I'm hoping the new Samsung screens will be quite bright.  Also, is 60fps supported? 

I thought it was quite bright and looked great.  I simply can't get the FOV / scale to work out.

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It seems a larger FOV, what values do you have in startup.cgf?

these are mine, with an OR and Steamvr SS at 2.0

 

or_enable = 1
    or_height = 2263
    or_hud_rad = 1.50000
    or_hud_size = 0.75000
    or_ipd = 0.06860
    or_width = 1901

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Wider FOV can be correct, if the device has a wider physical FOV. The two must match, or it looks wrong. What I notice is that the IPD is way off the mark, too big.

 

You can see it because on the Odissey, you can see both sides of the flight stick, and the position of the knob on the side window is far apart on the right and left pictures.

Something is wrong in the way SteamVR convoys the IPD, or the game gets it the wrong way. Weird.

 

Make sure the devs know about this (i.e. post a bug report in the section and/or contact support), it's probably trivial to fix, but we'll need a new build. Or maybe a hack in one of the OpenVR dlls (the source code is available, it's open after all) could do it.

Edited by coconut
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Probably an IPD bug, il2 or SteamVR don't seem to call the distance correctly.

 

 

Wider FOV can be correct, if the device has a wider physical FOV. The two must match, or it looks wrong. What I notice is that the IPD is way off the mark, too big.

 

You can see it because on the Odissey, you can see both sides of the flight stick, and the position of the knob on the side window is far apart on the right and left pictures.

Something is wrong in the way SteamVR convoys the IPD, or the game gets it the wrong way. Weird.

 

Make sure the devs know about this (i.e. post a bug report in the section and/or contact support), it's probably trivial to fix, but we'll need a new build. Or maybe a hack in one of the OpenVR dlls (the source code is available, it's open after all) could do it.

 

Precisely. I also noticed this when he posted the screenshots. As suspected, the IPD is way too large. That is why everything is so small to him.

Edited by 2./JG51_Fenris_Wolf

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So does it look like proper Odyssey support is long off?

I've been on the fence of buying into VR and IL2 hearing how awesome it apparently is. Then when I heard about the Odyssey I got even closer to doing it.

But now it looks like the Oculus is still the way to go. Would you all agree? My major remaning concern is low res flying. Does it really look that low res? I'm coming from a 1440p ultra wide...

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Fixing the Odyssey IPD bug (assuming that is the issue) is apparently easy to do; but no indication has been given that this is something they intend to do.  So for $350 I would buy a Rift.

 

As we have indicated before, you will lose resolution..  but the cockpit immersion and feeling of actually flying the aircraft far outweigh the former.  Early on, the effect is so real it will probably trick your brain (that's how good it is) though I find that you get used to it.

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I recently picked up the HP headset and have not encountered this problem. So far the game has been running pretty well and the VR experience is really something else. I have not used a Vive or Rift, so I cannot compare them.

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I can verify it is an IPD/FOV issue on Windows Mixed Reality devices.

 

I just got a Lenovo MR HMD and am seeing the same issue as the OP.  It is indeed an issue with the IPD/FOV being reported to, or most likely read wrong by BoX.  All other VR apps I tried work perfectly.

 

Setting IPD in Startup.cgf and making it read only does not make a difference.

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Hi everyone.  After spending a few more sessions in VR, I'm starting to wonder if I'm experiencing this as well, but to a lesser extent.  This may be due to the fact that my HP headset has a smaller FOV (95) compared to the Odyssey (110) and Lenovo (105), but that's just a guess.  What I find odd is the GUI appears to scale correctly, but some things in the cockpit are off ever so slightly when I close my left eye and look through the right lens.  At first, I was thinking it's the double-vision I have read about in VR so I found myself just focusing with my left eye when looking through the reticle and firing my guns, but now I'm not sure.  VR is new to me, so I'm going to have to try out some other games and then check back in IL2 to compare the experiences.  Anyway, just wanted to give you all an update.  

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Double vision is exactly what it is, the left eye and right eye are off due to IPD and when combined in stereoscopic it makes the cockpit view seem off slightly.  Slightly more distant details are not as bad because the eye offset is not as pronounced.

 

I have tested some more and can confirm the correct scaling and FOV is rendered perfectly fine in each eye.  The problem seems exclusively related to IPD because for me it looks like the left eye and right eye rendering are very far apart by default.

 

Setting correct IPD in startup.cfg has no effect.

 

I should also point out that the gunsight is invisible at default view with both eyes open unless you move your head significantly.  Close one or other eye and the gunsight is fine.  This is another surefire indicator that IPD is off.

Edited by ICDP

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Yes, exactly that. Your explanation sums up my experiences perfectly. At first, I thought that's just the way it was, but now I understand. Thank you for explaining this so clearly.

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Pixel grid is as good visible as on Oculus CV1, or is it much less visible??? :o: (on Samsung Odyssey)

Edited by huligan

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Pixel grid is as good visible as on Oculus CV1, or is it much less visible??? :o: (on Samsung Odyssey)

The clarity seemed a lot better and the SDE was reduced, I was very hopeful with this headset in IL2. 

 

I will say the focus "sweet spot" felt harder to retain as compared to the Rift.  I am not sure if this is because the Samsung headset hangs from the halo and moves easier or if I simply didn't fiddle with it enough to keep it tight to my face.

 

Alas, its hard to really give proper feedback since it currently doesn't work correctly in the sim.  

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Damn, I hope this issue can get sorted out soon for you guys.

 

Someone already offered to send the Samsung Oddyssey to 777 studios. Afaik that's the only way this can get fixed for now...

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The sweetspot on the Lenovo feels smaller than on the Rift but I believe it is a combination of two factors.

 

1. The sweetspot is indeed slightly smaller

2. It is exaggerated by the fact the Lenovo (and ovbiously any MR HMDs) have a more pronounced transition.

 

For example

 

Rift lense transition

< unreadable | unreadable | barely readable...... | barely readable | .....barely readable  | unreadable | unreadable >

< ..............................................suffers from god rays accross entire lense................................................... >

 

Lenovo lense transition

<Blurry mess | unreadable...... | barely readable | easily readable | barely readable | unreadable..... | blurry mess >

< .god rays......................... |............................NO GOD RAYS............................|...........................god rays. >

 

So I perceive the Lenovo to have a clearer, if slightly smaller sweet spot, yet it transitions to a worse state overall at the very edges.  With reduced SDE and increased resolution the Lenovo is a definite improvment in clarity and IQ for me.  Still not close to perfect but a definite step up over CV1.

 

The positives on Lenovo MR

  1. Lower SDE
  2. Better resolution
  3. Reduced God rays (only noticeable away from sweet spot)

Negatives are slightly smaller sweetspot.

Edited by ICDP

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thank you for the feedback, sounds interesting.

 

Quick question - are you able to set the SS higher than 1.0 in this headset and if it affects the clarity similar to cv1?

 

 

The sweetspot on the Lenovo feels smaller than on the Rift but I believe it is a combination of two factors.

 

1. The sweetspot is indeed slightly smaller

2. It is exaggerated by the fact the Lenovo (and ovbiously any MR HMDs) have a more pronounced transition.

 

For example

 

Rift lense transition

< unreadable | unreadable | barely readable...... | barely readable | .....barely readable  | unreadable | unreadable >

< ..............................................suffers from god rays accross entire lense................................................... >

 

Lenovo lense transition

<Blurry mess | unreadable...... | barely readable | easily readable | barely readable | unreadable..... | blurry mess >

< .god rays......................... |............................NO GOD RAYS............................|...........................god rays. >

 

So I perceive the Lenovo to have a clearer, if slightly smaller sweet spot, yet it transitions to a worse state overall at the very edges.  With reduced SDE and increased resolution the Lenovo is a definite improvment in clarity and IQ for me.  Still not close to perfect but a definite step up over CV1.

 

The positives on Lenovo MR

  1. Lower SDE
  2. Better resolution
  3. Reduced God rays (only noticeable away from sweet spot)

Negatives are slightly smaller sweetspot.

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thank you for the feedback, sounds interesting.

 

Quick question - are you able to set the SS higher than 1.0 in this headset and if it affects the clarity similar to cv1?

I never bothered trying as the FOV is so goofy it would be hard to really examine the effect.

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goofy as in the scale idp is off like in the odyssey? I guess if it's unplayable then what's the point .. yup..

 

I never bothered trying as the FOV is so goofy it would be hard to really examine the effect.

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I believe the Samsung Odyssey is making the IPD issue more pronounced because of the higher vertical resolution.  The problem does exist on the Lenovo but not the the same extent and it is playable.


thank you for the feedback, sounds interesting.

 

Quick question - are you able to set the SS higher than 1.0 in this headset and if it affects the clarity similar to cv1?

 

Yess, SS higher than 1.0 does work and makes things sharper and clearer.  Performance in an RC Vega 64 is very good and about on par with my CV1 on my 980Ti or Fury X.

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thank you, that's encouraging. I suppose now it's up to il2 devs to figure out the scaling issues...

 

I believe the Samsung Odyssey is making the IPD issue more pronounced because of the higher vertical resolution.  The problem does exist on the Lenovo but not the the same extent and it is playable.


 

Yess, SS higher than 1.0 does work and makes things sharper and clearer.  Performance in an RC Vega 64 is very good and about on par with my CV1 on my 980Ti or Fury X.

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Could it be possible for some of the owners of Windows MR devices to run this performance test:

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/29322-measuring-rig-performance-common-baseline/

 

I am curious to see how the increased resolution taxes the GPU and compare the performance vs. Rift/Vive.

In theory would be like running the Rift/Vive with a higher SS.

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S! To all.What a great community we have,all working together to fix these VR problems. I thank you all for when the day comes for myself and others to own a headset these problems will be in the past.Really Thank you.

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Just a feeback of problem I had with HDK2 OSVR and IL2 Bos.

HDK2 was working fine with DCS but not with IL2. The horizontal res. was 2 times more than it should be in game display and in SteamVR information. So I opened a ticket for this problem on IL2 Bos site. The devs answered me that it was a problem on OSVR/HDK2 side.

At first this answer pissed me off, because it was working on DCS, but they were right. There was a problem in OSVR/steamVR component. Hopefully, at is was opensource, I managed to fix it and so to prove the problem (because OSVR/SteamVR devs. sait that it was on IL2 Bos side...).

So, did anyone open a ticket for this odyssey FOV problem, either for IL2Bos or for SteamVR  ?

  • Upvote 2

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Could it be possible for some of the owners of Windows MR devices to run this performance test:

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/29322-measuring-rig-performance-common-baseline/

 

I am curious to see how the increased resolution taxes the GPU and compare the performance vs. Rift/Vive.

In theory would be like running the Rift/Vive with a higher SS.

done

 

 

Running Odyssey, I dont seem to have IPD/FOV issue, however the plane looks tiny when im in VR, I have a feeling like im squashed and my shoulder would be pushing on the canopy :D Im 183cm so it might be my historical tech ignorance.

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I dont seem to have IPD/FOV issue, however the plane looks tiny when im in VR

 

That's the IPD issue. How big things appear to you depends on whether the virtual eyes in the game are separated by the same distance as in reality. If they are further apart in the game than in reality then the virtual world will appear tiny to you.

Edited by coconut

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Guys, did you try dcs with it? Do you have the same problem? I’m starting to fear that my pimax, once it comes, will turn me into an ant on a cockpit...

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done

 

 

Running Odyssey, I dont seem to have IPD/FOV issue, however the plane looks tiny when im in VR, I have a feeling like im squashed and my shoulder would be pushing on the canopy :D Im 183cm so it might be my historical tech ignorance.

If your shoulder are hitting canopy then it would not be the height setting from the floor in your room being too high?

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Guys, did you try dcs with it? Do you have the same problem? I’m starting to fear that my pimax, once it comes, will turn me into an ant on a cockpit...

 

Just look over on their forums, there is a large Samsung Odyssey thread in the VR section.

 

Seems to be getting mixed results...

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