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VR Needs Some work - requests

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With Cockpit games being one of the main embraces of VR I believe games like IL2 will benefit greatly by a new influx of players. With the up coming hmds planned for release this and next year, samgsung lg pimax, bring high resolution I’m sure Sim enthusiasts will be grabbing them to compliment there overzealous cockpit setups.

 

So I thought I would throw my VR experience of IL2 to the devs.

 

The first thing that got my blood pumping in this game was the warehouse. Seeing the old bird setting there in all glory right in front of me was a site to behold. If you haven’t tried VR you just can’t imagine the images being relayed. It’s like going to an museum. So this brings me to my greatest request. Could we please please have some way to walk around the planes. I would be stuck for hours just looking at these magical wonders of the late.

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I've always thought that an interactive hangar would be awesome in this game and would love it even more so in VR. but i guess it would be something far from important in the to-do list.

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I'm happy as is. The quality of the work that has gone in to making IL-2 a VR experience is staggering. Just amazing.

Here's a suggestion: use whichever function key it is to cycle through other vehicles/targets and find a train. The train in VR is a fully realised, beautiful steam train ... all the parts whirring and moving, steam and smoke belching, manned gun carriages etc. You hardly ever SEE a train from the air except as vague shapes yet the developers have made an awesome thing. Go look at a train in VR, you'll thank me.

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I'm happy as is. The quality of the work that has gone in to making IL-2 a VR experience is staggering. Just amazing.

 

 

this.

 

 

truly a marvel top to bottom...

 

can't wait to check out this train now! 

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Yes you can zoom in and out on objects and they do look great. But it’s very hard to have scale. It would be nice to teleport around the planes extra, stick your head up under the fuselage to get a closer look.

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I love it and hardly can go back to flat after playing this on vr! But there’s two things that I could suggest:

 

1. This I’m not quite sure but it seems to me that the scaling is not 100% there, feels a big bigger than it should, and the central positioning also.

 

2. The aim, if I center the camera in my center position, the overlap is not there, I see two sights, so what I do to correct my centering is to stay a little bit to the right and forward and recenter so that way I get the right eye sight nice in place and shift me back a little to the plane seat, that way I fix the centering and aim with my main eye and also position myself better in the plane position that I imagine I should be in first place

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One very nice features in DCS is that you can jump out of cockpit and walk around your plane or anywhere actually. Unfortunately it's not possible to jump back in cockpit yet.

 

Anyway, this feature is really awesome in VR, something similar would be great in IL2 series too...

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The VR implementation has at least a few points open that would deny the label "fantastic" or "awesome work from top to bottom". For example, a lack of VR specific technologies come to mind, that let the game calculate geometry once instead of twice (or twice instead of 4 times if you use a mirror!), or allow more/tighter lense matched shading, or adjusting outer peripheral vision's resolution (allow a low res donut), as well as other things. Let's not dive into the lack of HT (improbably fixed or rewritten).

 

The game itself is beautiful. Would be great if that beauty was to be displayed in VR as well. There could be much more. Why aren't the devs pursuing this ?

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One very nice features in DCS is that you can jump out of cockpit and walk around your plane or anywhere actually. Unfortunately it's not possible to jump back in cockpit yet.

 

Anyway, this feature is really awesome in VR, something similar would be great in IL2 series too...

This time a million.

What better way to appreciate the aircraft then bring able to perform a walk around..

 

In DCS, left my p51 (knowing I couldn't get back in) and inspected my ordinance, fine writing on aircraft, it was awesome..

Especially once returning from mission and inspecting damage.

 

I believe the dream would be to start off in the barracks.. view the mission map, select your plane setup, and walk out to it.. a bit star citizen...

 

 

I just love this sim...

And I can't wait to get VR. ..

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The VR implementation has at least a few points open that would deny the label "fantastic" or "awesome work from top to bottom". For example, a lack of VR specific technologies come to mind, that let the game calculate geometry once instead of twice (or twice instead of 4 times if you use a mirror!), or allow more/tighter lense matched shading, or adjusting outer peripheral vision's resolution (allow a low res donut), as well as other things. Let's not dive into the lack of HT (improbably fixed or rewritten).

 

The game itself is beautiful. Would be great if that beauty was to be displayed in VR as well. There could be much more. Why aren't the devs pursuing this ?

Because to support more features, you need money and time.

Chances of bringing additional big bucks from investing in additional VR minor features would be less than investing in big theatre such as midway.

 

Does this answer ur question?

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The scroll wheel on your mouse will let you move all the way around your plane, at least when it's in the hanger. Not sure about in game....

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Because to support more features, you need money and time.

Chances of bringing additional big bucks from investing in additional VR minor features would be less than investing in big theatre such as midway.

 

Does this answer ur question?

 

Following that argument, devs should not work on triple-monitor support, should not improve AI, should not improve DServer, should not improve net code... Because none of these things by themselves is going to bring more money than a "big theatre such as midway".

 

Your argument falls on a number of points:

  1. There is no exclusive choice between theatre development and tech development. Tech development takes place as a part of theatre development. The reason why the specific kind of tech development requested by Fenris_Wolf is not taking place now is because the budget for VR development, as part of the budget for BOK development, has already been expanded (and maybe even went over what was planed). That's been said pretty clearly by Jason multiple times.
  2. Theatre development is not necessarily what drives people to the game. On reddit I see newcomers asking what theatre they should buy. The answer is never BOM, for the simple reason that the planeset is not as competitive and broad for MP as the one in BOS. I think the devs did a mistake when they picked BOM as the theatre after BOS. Some people fear that Midway will be a similar failure. Jason is obviously fond of it, not sure if customers will share that enthusiasm. Personally I can't wait for landing and taking off from carriers, but beside that the prospect of flying over vast uniform expanses of ocean and fighting over a tiny strip of land fails to excite me.
  3. Tech shortcomings definitely drive people away from the game. VR enthusiasts are typically not impressed by stutters and ASW/ATW kicking in, especially when it has very visible artifacts on the sights. Their expectations are set by comparatively simple tiny games like RoboRecall. They expect the same smoothness and VR controller support. Amazingly enough, BOx is almost there, an incredible feat in itself. But it's not quite there. You need to overclock your CPU, buy new fast memory, tweak your graphics settings, disable ASW using third-party tools... Too many hurdles.
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Good good. Much btter than what i wrote.

 

3 monitor support is alrdy off the table btw as confirmed by han and jason. I respect the decision. I dont ask "why not" in public as i can deduce unlike some individuals.

 

I wish you make a premium sp dynamic campaign because your mp server really kick butt. Thank you.

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The VR implementation has at least a few points open that would deny the label "fantastic" or "awesome work from top to bottom". For example, a lack of VR specific technologies come to mind, that let the game calculate geometry once instead of twice (or twice instead of 4 times if you use a mirror!), or allow more/tighter lense matched shading, or adjusting outer peripheral vision's resolution (allow a low res donut), as well as other things. Let's not dive into the lack of HT (improbably fixed or rewritten).

 

The game itself is beautiful. Would be great if that beauty was to be displayed in VR as well. There could be much more. Why aren't the devs pursuing this ?

You DEFINE hard to please!

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None of these issues affect me, since my computer is animal enough to run the game properly: i7 7700k overclocked, 16GB DDR4, GTX1080, et cetera, topping the performance comparison charts on these very forums.

 

 

So, did I define hard to please?

 

 

Most people do not have such fast systems. I speak with them in mind.

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The VR implementation has at least a few points open that would deny the label "fantastic" or "awesome work from top to bottom"

 

For me it's HUD that have a huge impact on fps when turned on and a forced "head movement limitation" on Expert settings. I would not mind if these limits are properly implemented but they are terrible at the moment. In bf109 you hit an invisible barrier 10-20cm before the actual physical object is like a canopy or Revi gunsight.

Edited by marklar

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For me it's GUI that have a huge impact on fps when turned on and a forced "head movement limitation" on Expert settings. I would not mind if these limits are properly implemented but they are terrible at the moment. In bf109 you hit an invisible barrier 10-20cm before the actual physical object is like a canopy or Revi gunsight.

 

 

They really should do away with the limited head movement in VR. It is annoying and really without having it is not an exploit either. VR is 1:1 tracking, whereas Track IR or Snap View users can unrealistically twist their head around to look anywhere and everywhere. I would love to fly on Expert settings but won't for this limitation in VR. 

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My guess is most of the limits come from using two cameras (one for each eye). Lean left against the glass as far as possible without rotating your head and close your right eye. Your left eye should be very close to the glass. Though it may not feel like it with both open. Not sure what kind of bounding box this cam setup uses (a line between cameras or proper head shape) but would be easy to test.

 

Any other limit would come from cockpit model optimization. Meaning they would not spend time or computing resources modeling/rendering parts your not likely to see.

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Two things that would be very welcome for me:

 

1: For VR users the "reset view" should reset you centered in the pilot's chair, which is generally in the center of the aircraft.  Many of the planes center you on the gunsight, which is often off to one side and I have to do this weird "recentering shuffle" to try to get back into the middle of the aircraft.

 

2: I don't mind being limited by the cockpit enclosure but I really dislike the huge clonking sound when my head touches the glass.  Sounds like you're getting hit, way overblown if necessary at all.  Either tone the volume WAAAAY down or just get rid of it altogether or at least just give a checkbox to enable/disable cockpit head-smashing sounds!

 

I want to reiterate that I really love the VR implementation in this game and they have done a great job on it.  Yes it is resource hungry, but is that surprising?  Look at all the other craptastic VR games out there that are little more than technology demos...  Anyway IMO this is the best game for VR by far.

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I want to reiterate that I really love the VR implementation in this game and they have done a great job on it.  Yes it is resource hungry, but is that surprising?  Look at all the other craptastic VR games out there that are little more than technology demos...  Anyway IMO this is the best game for VR by far.

 

Indeed it is, they did a fantastic job on this!

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Any other limit would come from cockpit model optimization. Meaning they would not spend time or computing resources modeling/rendering parts you're not likely to see.

 

 

When I fly on normal difficulty settings with limitation turned off I can move my virtual head however I want. I haven't noticed any unfinished parts of the cockpit so the above is not true. Just remove this option completely and everyone will be happy. It's like with an unlockable stuff in the offline campaign. Most people hated it, but devs were adamant about it. After some time finally they changed their mind. I hope the same will happen in this case. Someone is probably too proud of this idea and don't want to ditch it so easily.

 

 

 

For VR users the "reset view" should reset you centered in the pilot's chair, which is generally in the center of the aircraft.  Many of the planes center you on the gunsight, which is often off to one side and I have to do this weird "recentering shuffle" to try to get back into the middle of the aircraft.
 

 

You can move camera to the centre and save the view with F10 or F11, don't remember now. It can only be done in monitor mode as camera editing is disabled in VR. Once the new camera is saved go back to VR and you will be sitting right in the middle of the cockpit. I've done it for all German planes with Revi sight positioned off centre.

Edited by marklar

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VR totally sucks right now as I don't have it.

 

Well you certainly have a system to run it.. Just sayin...

;) 

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When I fly on normal difficulty settings with limitation turned off I can move my virtual head however I want. I haven't noticed any unfinished parts of the cockpit so the above is not true. Just remove this option completely and everyone will be happy. It's like with an unlockable stuff in the offline campaign. Most people hated it, but devs were adamant about it. After some time finally they changed their mind. I hope the same will happen in this case. Someone is probably too proud of this idea and don't want to ditch it so easily.

 

 

 

 

 

You can move camera to the centre and save the view with F10 or F11, don't remember now. It can only be done in monitor mode as camera editing is disabled in VR. Once the new camera is saved go back to VR and you will be sitting right in the middle of the cockpit. I've done it for all German planes with Revi sight positioned off centre.

 

That's interesting... are you saying that once the view is saved that way it will permanently go there when I hit "recenter"?

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When I fly on normal difficulty settings with limitation turned off I can move my virtual head however I want. I haven't noticed any unfinished parts of the cockpit so the above is not true. Just remove this option completely and everyone will be happy. It's like with an unlockable stuff in the offline campaign. Most people hated it, but devs were adamant about it. After some time finally they changed their mind. I hope the same will happen in this case. Someone is probably too proud of this idea and don't want to ditch it so easily.

 

 

 

I rarely fly on medium difficulty but the times I have I do notice backsides of things missing and very low texture resolution in the usually hard to see areas. Tese things not visible when you have to keep your head inside the canopy. I'm surprised you haven't.

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I rarely fly on medium difficulty but the times I have I do notice backsides of things missing and very low texture resolution in the usually hard to see areas. Tese things not visible when you have to keep your head inside the canopy. I'm surprised you haven't.

 

Maybe because I keep my head in a natural position and look around like a real pilot would do. I don't bend down to look through the surface of the fuselage or stick my head through the canopy. But I like to lean forward to have a better look through the gunsight. That's why I hate these artificial limitations. They only spoil the immersion. 

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Maybe because I keep my head in a natural position and look around like a real pilot would do. I don't bend down to look through the surface of the fuselage or stick my head through the canopy. But I like to lean forward to have a better look through the gunsight. That's why I hate these artificial limitations. They only spoil the immersion. 

 

I understand.

 

I was trying to find an explanation for them as I remember Jason posting about those same issues, stating that one of his first reactions to VR was why do I have these movement limits? And devs had to demonstrate why before he would accept that they are as free as can be. The stereoscopic camera rig would excuse some of it but does not explain forward limits.

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I'm new here. I bought BOM, and recently BOS (with discount), exclusively for playing in VR. I don't care flat monitor anymore since I bought my Rift.

 

I think BOx is very good in VR, the immersion is great, visuals are very good at current VR tech, but performance is not on par, so I think the VR implementation needs work on the performance department.

 

There is nothing I can do to get the golden 90 FPS required for smooth gameplay, so I settled at high visuals @45 FPS ASW. It's not unplayable, but It's not ideal.

 

So my wish about VR on BOx is better optimization, or new tech, in order to get better performance.

 

PS: I have a R7 1700 @3.9, DDR 2933, GTX 1070 G1. 

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Let's not dive into the lack of HT (improbably fixed or rewritten).

 

 

Hyper threading is of no use in games.

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Been flying VR for a bit over a month, on recommendation of my old flying squad friends, known these guys for nearly twenty years.  Got to say it's like going back to the good old days, the immersion is incredible, solid gold fun.  Honestly, had this sim for a while, but had nearly zero interest in it, just burnt out on what seemed "the same old game".  It's now a true flight simulator in my eyes, freaking awesome.

 

I'd like a more refined zoom system, the clarity ain't there yet, needs some sort of better ID ability, would help with navigation and ground attack.  Would agree with reducing the tone on the head bang, sometimes causes some confusion, is that flak or wondering if taking hits at some moments.  Maybe clean up the tint on some of the plexiglass, or a setting to turn it off, some planes seems like it doubles down on the screen door effects, degrading the outside views, makes some of the planes highly avoidable.  Perhaps increase the gamma setting amounts available for VR a bit, running a Vega 56, colors seem very washed out and dull with current gamma setting maxed.  There is no way to increase it for VR outside the game like you can for the desktop, if anyone knows how, sure would appreciate any tips. 

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I'm new here. I bought BOM, and recently BOS (with discount), exclusively for playing in VR. I don't care flat monitor anymore since I bought my Rift.

 

I think BOx is very good in VR, the immersion is great, visuals are very good at current VR tech, but performance is not on par, so I think the VR implementation needs work on the performance department.

 

There is nothing I can do to get the golden 90 FPS required for smooth gameplay, so I settled at high visuals @45 FPS ASW. It's not unplayable, but It's not ideal.

 

So my wish about VR on BOx is better optimization, or new tech, in order to get better performance.

 

PS: I have a R7 1700 @3.9, DDR 2933, GTX 1070 G1. 

 

It's not easy to reach constant 90 FPS. I have a 4790K at 4.7 GHZ and a GTX 1070 and I am using Balanced preset without AA and Sharpen. Landscape detail 2x. Low shadows, normal Grass.

Steam VR SS is set 1.9.

It's also important to turn off HUD to gain 15-20 FPS. I have it mapped on my HOTAS to be able to easily enable it.

 

With these settings I have 90 FPS most of the time but ASW still kicks in on a crowded airfield or in a heavy furball close to the ground.

 

It's a consensus that a good GPU alone does not add much in this game. CPU frequency and RAM frequency seems to be more important.

Been flying VR for a bit over a month, on recommendation of my old flying squad friends, known these guys for nearly twenty years.  Got to say it's like going back to the good old days, the immersion is incredible, solid gold fun.  Honestly, had this sim for a while, but had nearly zero interest in it, just burnt out on what seemed "the same old game".  It's now a true flight simulator in my eyes, freaking awesome.

 

I'd like a more refined zoom system, the clarity ain't there yet, needs some sort of better ID ability, would help with navigation and ground attack.  Would agree with reducing the tone on the head bang, sometimes causes some confusion, is that flak or wondering if taking hits at some moments.  Maybe clean up the tint on some of the plexiglass, or a setting to turn it off, some planes seems like it doubles down on the screen door effects, degrading the outside views, makes some of the planes highly avoidable.  Perhaps increase the gamma setting amounts available for VR a bit, running a Vega 56, colors seem very washed out and dull with current gamma setting maxed.  There is no way to increase it for VR outside the game like you can for the desktop, if anyone knows how, sure would appreciate any tips. 

 

Yes, a better implemented stronger zoom 3x-4x preferably on a slider would cure the only downside of VR vs Monitor - identification. 

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VR improvements wanted

 

1. Zebras in the sky: clouds look zagged and their coloration is distored to make them look like zebras.

 

2. Flat zoom: zoomed view looks like i am looking at inside of a painted cyclinder rather than a 3d world. Higher power of zoom wanted.

 

Thanks.

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On the subject of zoom: I'm sure the devs would have kept the regular zoom implementation if it worked directly in VR. But I guess it doesn't. You can notice it on the existing 2x zoom:perspective/parallax is wrong, and that's certainly due to the IRL FOV vs in-game FOV mismatch. Which is why you don't want it always on, head movement in that mode feels really weird.

 

Still, I would like a one-eyed flat stronger zoom, say 3-4x. If screen users have it, there is no reason VR users shouldn't have it. It obviously helps identifying planes at a distance, which helps make decisions early, which wins dogfights.

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There is nothing I can do to get the golden 90 FPS required for smooth gameplay, so I settled at high visuals @45 FPS ASW. It's not unplayable, but It's not ideal.   So my wish about VR on BOx is better optimization, or new tech, in order to get better performance.   PS: I have a R7 1700 @3.9, DDR 2933, GTX 1070 G1. 

 

 

Other people with Ryzen CPUs has been running the IL-2 performance test (procedure described here: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/29322-measuring-rig-performance-common-baseline/)and results reported here ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gJmnz_nVxI6_dG_UYNCCpZVK2-f8NBy-y1gia77Hu_k/ ) and we saw that although Ryzen are very good CPUs for Multithread, in the single-thread performance they are not as good. And IL-2 is very dependent of Single-Thread performance.

 

If you want solid 90fps you can do one of the following things:

 

- Change your CPU by a CPU with good single-thread performance (8700K, 7700K, 4790K, etc)

- Change your graphics settings to Low or Balanced

Edited by chiliwili69

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If there is one thing, one simple thing, I would like to see first off, it's the ability to reset your head position while in VR.

Edited by HagarTheHorrible

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If there is one thing, one simple thing, I would like to see first off, it's the ability to reset your head position while in VR.

 

Numpad-5 ? ? ? Or am i missing something?

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