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Let's talk about the Yak-7B


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#1 ShamrockOneFive

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:20

Thanks to today's update we now know the series number for the Yak-7B. Its a Yak-7B Series 36. I've spent some time trying to dig up Yak-7B series numbers to no avail. So I'm curious if anyone else has any resources out there on what specifically we're getting.

 

I'm assuming and hoping this variant has the VK-105PF engine in it. It's clearly the version with the original canopy and the heavier firepower with twin machine guns and cannon.

 

We also don't know yet what options will be available here. Rockets, bombs, 37mm cannon?


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#2 I./ZG1_Martijnvdm

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:23

It looks better then i think it would. The default arnement should be pretty nice with two 12,7's and one 20mm cannon. There is some info about the specs on this page.

 

http://wio.ru/tacftr/yak.htm

 

Looks like it does get the PF engine.

 

Grt M


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#3 ShamrockOneFive

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:30

That was definitely my assumption but I'd love to know exactly about this specific series number if possible. Always curious about those more minute changes on the Yak series and they are difficult to find out about.

 

And it definitely looks good. Glad to see this version of the Yak-7 showing up. Very likely fits the Stalingrad timeline so we'll see its use extend back several months in the campaign.


Edited by ShamrockOneFive, 20 April 2017 - 12:31.

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#4 Finkeren

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:36

For a plane that's almost 200kg heavier, it's really not much worse performance-wise than the Yak-1 s. 127.

It seems to be about on par with the Yak-1 s. 69 in the sim in pure numbers, which combined with the armament, slightly better FoV to the rear and (supposedly) slightly better dive performance should make it overall better.
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#5 Tag777

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 15:19

Thanks to today's update we now know the series number for the Yak-7B. Its a Yak-7B Series 36. I've spent some time trying to dig up Yak-7B series numbers to no avail. So I'm curious if anyone else has any resources out there on what specifically we're getting.

 

I'm assuming and hoping this variant has the VK-105PF engine in it. It's clearly the version with the original canopy and the heavier firepower with twin machine guns and cannon.

 

We also don't know yet what options will be available here. Rockets, bombs, 37mm cannon?

I do not think they will give us the 37 mm cannon, because in the original plane it was incorporated after some modifications, like moving the cockpit back and others, so the aspect of the plane is slightly different.

 

Bellow I copy an excerpt relative to the subject from http://www.airvector.../avyak1.html#m4

A small batch of Yak-7Bs was built in the spring and summer of 1942 for evaluation with the ShVAK 20-millimeter cannon replaced by the NS-37 37-millimeter cannon. These machines were designated "Yak-7-37". The rear cockpit was eliminated and the pilot's cockpit moved back to accommodate the cannon, and a number of other small changes were made. The cannon was reliable and effective, and the evaluation led to use of the weapon in the Yak-9, discussed below. 

 

But it will be great if they give us the 7-37 as well  :biggrin: 


Edited by Tag777, 20 April 2017 - 15:25.

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#6 bivalov

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 16:04

in according to table from best book about Yak-7 - https://eksmo.ru/boo...oyny-ITD453098/
 
Yak-7b №3625 with M-105PF (3018 kg) was produced somewhere in januar 1943 and during tests showed - 528/582 kph at SL/3670 meters, 5.1 min to 5000 meters and about 18 seconds at 1000 meters
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#7 BlitzPig_EL

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 16:48

The 7B was one of my favorite VVS planes in the original IL2.

 

Looking forward to it.


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#8 Yankee_

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 17:26

So how did the 7b compare to the 1b we now have?


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#9 Tag777

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 17:48

So how did the 7b compare to the 1b we now have?

You can go to the link Martijnvdm posted above. There is a nice comparison chart there  :)


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#10 Yankee_

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 18:42

You can go to the link Martijnvdm posted above. There is a nice comparison chart there  :)

 

Which Yan-1B do we have, based on that chart? The standard one or the Improved? And which Yak-7B are we getting?


Edited by Yankee_, 20 April 2017 - 18:43.

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#11 Finkeren

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 18:48

Which Yan-1B do we have, based on that chart? The standard one or the Improved? And which Yak-7B are we getting?


The improved Yak-1B and the Yak-7Bwith the M-105PF engine.
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#12 Yankee_

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 18:51

The improved Yak-1B and the Yak-7Bwith the M-105PF engine.

 

Hum... so would the 7B have any advantage over the 1B? Aside from not being a premium plane?

 

Of course, BoK's release will be great for MP, not only for the other planes, but because it will allow more maps with the Yak-1B as an option. :)


Edited by Yankee_, 20 April 2017 - 18:52.

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#13 AndyJWest

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 19:02

The Yak 7B has better firepower, and some sources suggest that it was a better gun platform, but otherwise there isn't much to choose between them really. 


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#14 Tag777

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 19:06

I think the improvement in weaponry is one of the points in favor of the 7B over the 1B. And, being heavier than 1B allows it a better dive speed (depended of course of what close to the real thing they will modeled it).


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#15 Finkeren

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 19:48

Also keep in mind, that the Yak-7B is also a relevant aircraft for the Battle of Stalingrad, and its qualities are much more apparent when compared to the Yak-1 s.69.
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#16 Yankee_

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 19:55

Also keep in mind, that the Yak-7B is also a relevant aircraft for the Battle of Stalingrad, and its qualities are much more apparent when compared to the Yak-1 s.69.

 

Well, I'm just wondering if there's a reason for me to pick a 7B over the 1B in Battle of Kuban, aside for novelty's sake.

 

Clearly there is that additional UB machine gun, but beyond that it seems like a step back (aside for the fact it's not a premium plane). Of course, historically I think the biggest advantage of the 7B is that it was built by another factory (and thus be produced in parrallel), but I'm wondering what made it so remarkable compared to the 1B.


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#17 Finkeren

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 20:00

The Yak-7B also had the redesigned wings that carried over into the Yak-9, presumably they improved handling somewhat.
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#18 BuzzU

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 21:21

I loved the Yak-3 in the original IL-2. I suppose we'll never see it here?

 

What map would we need?


Edited by BuzzU, 20 April 2017 - 21:21.

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#19 Yankee_

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 21:33

I loved the Yak-3 in the original IL-2. I suppose we'll never see it here?

 

What map would we need?

 

That'd be 1944... it'll be a while before we get there, as the next battle after Kuban is the Battle of Midway. :)


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#20 ShamrockOneFive

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 21:40

What will be most interesting to me is how the comparison between Yaks work out. The 7B was supposed to have slightly easier handling and be a better gun platform without being too much slower than the equivalent Yak-1. But we're probably going to feel the weight in maneuvering.

It may be easier to fly but less "tossable" during a rapidly changing dogfight.

I loved the Yak-3 in the original IL-2. I suppose we'll never see it here?

What map would we need?

The Yak-1B we have is a fairly direct member of the family leading up to the Yak-3 so that's as close as we get for now.

The earliest Yak-3s were available during the Battle of Kursk in 1943 but those were largely pre-production types. They came on into general use partly through 1944. The fighting near Lvov would be one battle. But ideally we'd be seeing it in a Battle of Berlin.
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#21 BuzzU

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 21:55

I figured as much. It's a great plane and sure gave the Germans a good fight.


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#22 Gambit21

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 22:42

I loved the Yak-3 in the original IL-2.


It was pretty much the biggest clown/dweeb plane in the entire sim.
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#23 BuzzU

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 22:52

It was pretty much the biggest clown/dweeb plane in the entire sim.

Why was that?


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#24 ShamrockOneFive

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 01:29

I figured as much. It's a great plane and sure gave the Germans a good fight.

 

I was more of a fan of the Yak-9U in that timeframe personally. Less agile to be sure (the Yak-3 was a sweet handler) but the Yak-9U was faster and better able to dive which I found useful chasing down FW190s :)


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#25 Gambit21

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 01:36

Why was that?

 

Way...WAY over-modeled...total UFO.


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#26 BuzzU

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 03:58

Well, it was a Russian sim. ;)


Edited by BuzzU, 21 April 2017 - 03:59.

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#27 LukeFF

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 07:38

Well, it was a Russian sim. ;)


And your point is...?
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#28 I./JG21-Radick

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 08:48

Why has the yak 1 and lagg 3 in bos the WK-105PF engine? Did yak 1 and the lagg 3 not the Klimow WK-105P?


Edited by I./JG21-Radick, 21 April 2017 - 08:48.

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#29 I./ZG1_Martijnvdm

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:10

Why has the yak 1 and lagg 3 in bos the WK-105PF engine? Did yak 1 and the lagg 3 not the Klimow WK-105P?

 

For the early models yes, but we have the later 1942 models. For a 1941 Yak-1 early the P engine would be appropriate. 

 

Grt M


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#30 I./JG21-Radick

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:24

Strange ... there was only a small number of yak 1 with WK-105PF engine, I think that is balancing. Thx for the answer


Edited by I./JG21-Radick, 21 April 2017 - 10:04.

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#31 Finkeren

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:45

Strange ... there was only a small number of lagg 3 with WK-105PF engine, I think that is balancing. Thx for the answer


Got a source for that? I have no data on the series 29, but every source I've seen on the series 35 and later show the LaGG-3 as having a VK-105PF. The PF was pretty much the standard Soviet fighter engine by the second half of 1942.
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#32 temujin

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:59

Strange ... there was only a small number of lagg 3 with WK-105PF engine, I think that is balancing. Thx for the answer


Interesting. Source please.
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#33 I./JG21-Radick

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:04

oh sorry i mean yak 1, not the lagg 3 *corrected*


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#34 Finkeren

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:10

The same goes for the Yak-1. An early series Yak-1 might have had a PA or some other engine, but a late 1942 series 69 would have had a PF.
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#35 I./JG21-Radick

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:18

Ok, I have believed the yak 1 had the P motor and the 1b the PF motor. Thank you for the clarification


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#36 Finkeren

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:59

The term "Yak-1B" is a convenience term invented after the war to distinguish the vastly improved Yak-1s from late '42/early '43 from their predecessors. Since all these improvements were introduced gradually from production batch to production batch (what we call "series") there is no clear line where a "late production Yak-1" becomes a "Yak-1B", that's why the planes in the sim are specified with a series number. So the Yak-1B we have is really more accurately described as a "Yak-1 from production batch no. 127". During the war it would simply have ben refered to in documents as a "Yak-1 with VK-105PF engine and improved cockpit." All the other changes were not significant enough to warrant special designation.

IIRC the VK-105PF was introduced into Yak production (Yak-1 and Yak-7) in mid-1942, so all versions of the Yak, we have in the sim (s.69, s. 127 and the upcoming Yak-7B) all have the PF engine.

Edited by Finkeren, 21 April 2017 - 11:07.

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#37 303_Kwiatek

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:26

Yak7B was about 100-200kg heavier then Yak-1B or Yak-1 with the same engine. So climb rate and turn rate should be worse then Yak-1B. So Yak7B was much more close to Yak-1 with PF engine and Yak1B was better plane for sure


Edited by 303_Kwiatek, 21 April 2017 - 11:39.

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#38 Finkeren

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:31

Yak7B was much heavier then Yak-1B or Yak-1 with the same engine. SO climb rate was much worse, also turn time should be worse.


It did have the improved wings though, and all things considered, it wasn't that much heavier, a bit less than 200kg, which is enough to be significant, but not to make it a complete dog.
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#39 303_Kwiatek

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:40

Im sure in Il2 Kuban it wouldn't be a dog at all. All Yaks in IL2 are faster at alt then should, better climbers and got wonderfull flaps so i dont expect 7B would be different ;)


Edited by 303_Kwiatek, 21 April 2017 - 11:43.

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#40 Tag777

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:06

If the turn radio and the turn speed is similar to the Yak-1-69 I will be satisfied. As for me, the additional 0.50 machine gun will give the plane the "punch" we need for knock down more easily the German bombers.


Of course, the additional 37 mm cannon would be superb, but I do not think we will be so lucky  :)


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