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Yak-1b- How do I operate the thing?


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So I got my self the lovely 1b as it is a very sound aircraft in both looks an performance plus I want to start flying a bit more for the VVS - but the small problem is I don't have a clue on how to use all the systems in the thing. I've flown plenty in the E-7 and He-111 to understand most of the MEC stuff but I'm still in the dark with fuel mixture and the cockpit layout of the Yak. So any tips or pointers will be welcome.

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You can find most of what you need to know in the manual: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/16752-il-2bos-user-manual-released-first-edition-english/

 

It doesn't cover the Yak-1b, but the CEM is exactly the same as for the Yak-1 s. 69 with the exception, that the water cooler (and to a lesser extent the oil cooler) is way more efficient on the Yak-1b. The water radiator also opens a lot further (hence causing drag), so be careful not to open it any more than absolutely necessary.

Edited by Finkeren
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You can find most of what you need to know in the manual: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/16752-il-2bos-user-manual-released-first-edition-english/

 

It doesn't cover the Yak-1b, but the CEM is exactly the same as for the Yak-1 s. 69 with the exception, that the water cooler (and to a lesser extent the oil cooler) is way more efficient on the Yak-1b. The water radiator also opens a lot further (hence causing drag, so be careful not to open it any more than absolutely necessary.

Cheers, I never realised there were manuals  

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To make it short: Managing the Klimov 105PF (the engine that powers the LaGG-3, the Yaks and the Pe-2 s. 87/110) is really, really simple. The engine is not designed to go above its safe rating, so you can run it at full throttle and max RPM all day long with no risk, as long as you make sure to keep oil and water temperatures down. For longer flights you of course want to cut back (I usually go for around 2550 rpm and 85% throttle and lean the mixture a bit)

 

Mixture is relatively simple. Below 2300m altitude you just keep it at full rich (100%), the supercharger will compress the air for you and negate any need to lean the mixture. Around 2300m you change to the 2nd gear on the supercharger (remember to do this, and change it back when you go below 2300 again, it's important) Then the supercharger has you covered right up to 3500-4000m above which you have to start leaning to get a proper combustion. The techno-chat will tell you to start leaning at much lower altitude, but there is really no need to, as long as you remember to change gears on the supercharger.

 

So really, all you need to worry about, are these controls:

 

1. Throttle. For combat and shorter flights, you can leave this at 100%. The downside is, that you burn a lot of fuel and your engine heats up, so throttle back for cruising.

 

2. RPM control. Same as throttle, you can leave it at 100% most of the time, but for cruising, setting it to a lower setting helps keep the engine cool.

 

3. Mixture. Keep at 100% until you reach 3500-4000m altitude, then lean as necessary (look at exhaust flames if in doubt, they should be a mixture of red and blue)

 

4. Supercharger gear. 1st gear below 2300m, 2nd above. Simple

 

5. Oil and water radiators. Watch your temp. gauges and open and close them accordingly. There is no harm in letting the engine run at the edge of overheating, just don't cross the line. When cruising, open radiators to cool water and oil down to a safe 75oC or thereabouts, then you can run the engine in combat with maybe 20% water radiator on the autumn map for a very long time in combat. Remember, that the faster your airspeed, the more effective the cooling is, If you run the engine at max in a protracted turnfight at very low speed, you'll need to open your radiators fully at some point. The same goes for long climbs at full power. Better keep the airspeed up if at all possible. 

 

That's really all there is to it.

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@Finkeren are you sure that is absolutely the best mixture setting for the yak? i always flew it at 85% mixture until i exceeded 4000m.

 

I've tried following the techno-chat and leaned below 4000, but I noticed absolutely no difference, but I'm honestly not 100% certain.

 

If the difference is there, it is small, and regardless if 85% is better, the point remains, that you really shouldn't concentrate on mixture too much below 4K.

Edited by Finkeren
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Just did a quick test:

 

Flying at 3000m, 100% throttle, max rpm, setting the mixture to 85% instead of 100% caused a tiny, almost unnoticeable, drop in manifold pressure with no real impact on either speed or cooling.


Spot on mate, Hopefully I can look at the sky now instead of the instruments 

 

You will need to look at the temperature gauges once in a while, and unfortunately the fuel gauges as well (which is an absolute pain in the ass even with Track IR)

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Re-reading Chuck's guide, I noticed a couple differences from my own flying:

 

1. He apparently thinks, it's beneficial to lean mixture progressively as you climb below 4000m. I find this to not be the case.

 

2. He shifts gears on the supercharger at 2500m (which is probably more correct)

 

3. He goes for significantly lower manifold pressure and rpm for cruising than I do - he's all the way down to 1850rpm/850mmhg, where I do something like 2200rpm/900mmhg. His settings are probably more fuel efficient, so you should use them, if you're flying a very long mission.

 

4. He sets the optimal climb speed at 250 km/h, I will very much advice against this. Climbing at 250 km/h in a combat environment is asking for trouble. Your radiators can't cool your engine properly and if you get jumped, you are in a very vulnerable position going that slow, because you will have almost no energy to perform any maneuvers. Climbing at 280 km/h or above is preferable.

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Also, about cockpit layout: The gauges are super simple and easy to read and very similar to the Yak-1 s. 69 covered in the guides (although a couple of them have switched places). Pretty much all you need is right in front of you, except for one thing: The fuel gauges.

 

The fuel gauges are placed out on the wings and are cleverly placed in such a way as to make it most awkward to get your head in a position to look at them. Furthermore, most of the time they don't really tell you, how much fuel you have left! The gauges only measure the emergency auxiliary tanks which contain 80 liters each (which is why the gauge goes up to 80, it's not percentages) Until you're down to your last 160 liters (which equates to a little more than half an hour at cruise power, less than 20 mins at combat power) you pretty much have no way of telling, how much fuel you have left, unless you're constantly making calculations in your head. Whoever designed this should have gone before a military tribunal.

Edited by Finkeren
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Just 100% engine all the time and if you spot a 109 time to use the flaps. The plane will do the rest.

Nah, you don't wanna do that. If the German pilot has any sense at all, he immediately takes advantage of you burning your energy like that and gets on top of you.

 

Don't deploy flaps in combat, just don't. Speed is far more important than being able to hold a tight turn just a bit longer.

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The manual might be useful: Yak Manual.pdf Generally it's numbers are close to Fink's suggestions. 

 

Lean below 4000m only if engine is smoking, switch supercharger at 2000m. 

 

If you do not use the techno thingie you need to memorize the water/oil temperature limits.  Also do not over-rev in a dive - 2800 is suggested limit. This is close to the 2600-2700 you will be running at level flight in a fight, so be careful. Having said that, I have not tested in game to see if this causes engine failure: over heating certainly does. 

 

The only part of Finkeren's advice I disagree with (strongly!) is climbing at 280 kph.   Up to 4000m 260 kph is the manual's recommended best climb speed and this is what you should generally use.  Lower at greater heights - see table in manual for the person who ever does get higher ;) Why? because, contra Fink, it will put your aircraft at it's optimum energy position.  Energy = speed (kinetic) + height (potential),  and regaining 20 kph in a hurry is a lot easier than regaining a few hundred meters of height that you have sacrificed by climbing at a sub-optimal rate for several minutes. 

 

 

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I guess it's a matter of preference, there is no question, that the optimal climb speed is around 250-260km/h.

 

Unreasonable is absolutely right, that climbing at optimal climb speed increases your energy state most in the shortest amount of time (obviously). But even that won't guarantee you from getting attacked by an opponent with higher energy during the climb. I personally would rather climb to altitude a bit slower and retain full maneuver potential at all time, in case I get bounced, than first having to gain a little speed, before I can start to maneuver.

Edited by Finkeren
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Climbing at best climb speed will not guarantee not getting attacked by an opponent with higher energy - but it will reduce the probability. The longer the climb continues, the greater the advantage becomes - since the speed energy is constant but the potential energy accumulates over time. In a case where you do not know where the enemy will be encountered, not climbing at your best climb rate is irrational, whether you prefer it or not.    :)  

 

If you think of the relative height differences at the start of a fight as being random then it makes sense to have more speed, especially to deal with the situations where you start at a disadvantage. But they are not random, they are a function of how much each plane has climbed. Essentially you are choosing to be lower at the start of the engagement - by an unknown amount since you do not know when it will happen - in return for 20kph of initial speed. So you have increased the probability of being bounced.

 

There may be circumstances where you want to intercept a specific enemy with a known position in a limited time window where a faster climb speed might be better - essentially if it is below the "slope" of your best climb. Then the quickest way to get to that point would be a faster, flatter climb. You are increasing the risk of an unknown enemy meeting you with the enemy having an energy advantage, but you might have to suck it up to make the interception. 

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In the end it comes down to a choice between maximizing probability of starting the fight with energy advantage or making sure you always have enough energy to immediately initiate defensive maneuvers.

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No - if you climb at best climb speed you will always have more energy than if you do not, at the point you meet a given opponent.  You think you have more energy because you are faster, but it is an illusion.  If you had climbed at best climb speed you would be slower - but have more total energy. If you have been climbing for a while the height loss could be substantial.  You can turn height into speed much faster than you can add height. You can initiate defensive maneuvers just as immediately in both cases - that is about how quickly you spot the opponent, not your speed.

 

But of course everyone is free to fly - and die - as they wish. :)

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I have flown the Yak very little, but the rule of thumb in the LaGG is that when you see "oxygen on" message, switch supercharger.

 

Also, depending on the situation, it can be advantageous to climb at a higher than normal speed. This is useful if you're actually under attack:

 

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I feel like a god when I fly the 1b.  It's a truly excellent fighter.

 

As for supercharger, it should be obvious:  Switch it as soon as your manifold pressure drops.  That's what it's for, after all.

 

I do not think this is right. For instance, the manifold pressure starts to drop perceptibly at about 1200-1300m on the autumn map. The manual and Stepanet's guide both say switch at 2,000m. 

 

Google to English and it is just about comprehensible.  http://www.airpages.ru/dc/doc111.shtml

 

I am not an engine expert, but from seeing it discussed before and reading Stepanet's guide the reason is that the manifold pressure =/= available engine power at the prop/crankshaft. The second stage uses more of the power of the engine to run than the first stage , so although your manifold pressure will rise if you switch as soon as it starts to drop, you will have reduced your available power until you have reached the height where the extra MP pays back the extra power needed to run the second stage - which is 2000m.

Edited by unreasonable
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I have flown the Yak very little, but the rule of thumb in the LaGG is that when you see "oxygen on" message, switch supercharger.

 

Also, depending on the situation, it can be advantageous to climb at a higher than normal speed. This is useful if you're actually under attack:

 

Solid video. Very clear and good for any newer pilot.

 

Basic tactics for any aircraft flying against a 109 who maintains energy well.

 

Of course, 1v1s, usually...eventually, end up in an outnumbered situation when they last as long as that video.

 

Good stuff regardless.

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I do not think this is right. For instance, the manifold pressure starts to drop perceptibly at about 1200-1300m on the autumn map. The manual and Stepanet's guide both say switch at 2,000m. 

 

Google to English and it is just about comprehensible.  http://www.airpages.ru/dc/doc111.shtml

 

I am not an engine expert, but from seeing it discussed before and reading Stepanet's guide the reason is that the manifold pressure =/= available engine power at the prop/crankshaft. The second stage uses more of the power of the engine to run than the first stage , so although your manifold pressure will rise if you switch as soon as it starts to drop, you will have reduced your available power until you have reached the height where the extra MP pays back the extra power needed to run the second stage - which is 2000m.

 

hmm, maybe I'm mixing it up with something else but I thought it didn't start to drop until almost 1800 metres.

 

edit:  oops, yeah, you're right, it's the VK-107 that has first gear FTH at 1800m or so.

Edited by JG13_opcode
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Also, depending on the situation, it can be advantageous to climb at a higher than normal speed. This is useful if you're actually under attack:

 

 

I have no issue with that at all - once you have spotted an enemy and a fight looks likely then the trade off of height and speed may be different, depending on where you want to go. My comments (insistence :)) on best climb speed relate to climbing before contact is made.

 

 

hmm, maybe I'm mixing it up with something else but I thought it didn't start to drop until almost 1800 metres.

 

Well I was not sure either so I opened up the game and took off - and that is what I observed climbing in a Yak 1b.  The point about needing to regain the power loss from running the second stage will hold whatever. I recall in the Fw190 argument about the supercharger automatic gear switch the same issue came up - the switch is set at an altitude well above the point at which the MP starts to drop for the same reason. 

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-after take-off i set mixture to 85-90% (also depends of alt),

-behind the stick there is engine temp indicator, water and oil temp so i set radiators according to temp (radiators water/oil induce drag=reduce speed).

-rpm and throttle usually at 100% (during travel reduced to 90% for saving fuel)

-under>2000m supercharger 1, above>2000m supercharger 2

-for me perfect climbing at 280-300km/h

-find limits when diving to keep your flight control surfaces on the plane

-turn fighter

 

maybe not perfect but all i know!

Edited by redribbon
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Hello all,

 

Intersting discussion regarding climb speeds. Generally speaking, if you are climbing at your best rate/optimal climb speed, your kite is producing maximum, or close to maximum lift. In modern parlance, this speed is also sometimes referred to as corner speed. If you climb at this speed you will gain potential energy (altitude) more quickly, but if you start a hard maneuver you might bleed energy and no longer generate your maximum lift. Carrying a little extra speed will cost you in terms of altitude gained, but you will have some energy reserve for unanticipated maneuvering.

 

Good hunting,

Conky 

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@Conky "but you will have some energy reserve for unanticipated maneuvering."  Strictly speaking this is an illusion, you are making a false comparison which you can see when you calculate the energies. As I said before, if you are already in a fight or know you are about to get into one you may well want to keep your speed up - 260 kph is a little close to the speed at which the responsiveness becomes rather sluggish.  But this is nothing to do with the energy reserve.

 

Energy = kinetic energy + potential energy.  For a 3000kg plane, 280kph vs 260 kph is a 14% energy advantage - at the same height. But if you had been climbing at the best climb speed you would be higher.  This kinetic energy difference is the same as the potential energy of a mere 43 meters of height -  just over 4 Yak wingspans.  Any time the slower plane is more than 43 meters above the faster one, it is in a higher total energy state.

 

How long would the planes climbing at these speeds take to open up this height difference? I cannot see this on the Yak climb rate charts because they are, with good reason, done at best climb speed! 

 

If you make the heroic assumption that the fall off in climb rate is roughly a straight line function of the speed difference between best climb speed and top speed, then climbing 20 kph faster loses nearly 1 m/s climb rate, assuming we are somewhere in the low-medium height range and so a roughly 15 m/s climb rate.  Ie your kinetic energy of 20 kph speed is "worth" about 43 seconds of climbing.  

 

There is a good reason all the military manuals give a recommended speed to achieve best climb rate.

Edited by unreasonable
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Best climb rate was optimal solution (maximum function of 2 variables) for height over distance ?

 

Not really - energy does not "care" about horizontal distance, it is a measure at a particular moment in time.  E = 1/2mv^2 + mgh           m=mass, g = acceleration due to gravity, h = height, v = velocity.  Do it all in SI units and you get Joules. 

 

The problem is that people easily fall into the trap of making the wrong comparison - ie between being at 280 kph and being at 260 kph at the same height. The true comparison should be between the two speeds with the difference in heights due to the climb rate and duration of climb. Without a clear idea of these two variables it is easy to underestimate how much total energy has been sacrificed by climbing at the sub-optimal speed.

 

Working out the best height/distance trade-off is more complex - fuel, time limits, how high you plan to get etc. All I am going on about here is the scenario where you are climbing in an area where there is a risk of meeting an enemy but you do not know at what height (or you know he is likely to be high!).

 

edit for post 32 above - For a 3000kg plane, 280kph vs 260 kph is a 14% energy advantage - at SL. Ie a 14% KE advantage when PE is = 0. As you go higher the advantage in KE and Joules is the same but proportionately to total energy drops as PE rises.

 

Said it could be tricky. ;)  

 

Edited by unreasonable
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@Tomcat optimal climb is the best climb per time, best climb over distance would mean climbing slower and innefective.

EDIT: someone was faster^^

@ the argument between climbing at optimal speed or a bit above:

I think both sides are right here and are just talking around each other.
There is no definitive answer as to what speed you want for climbing, since there is different situations in which you want to climb.

For example we are in a FW190 and are low in a combat area. Optimal climb speed is telling me to climb with 280km/h (more or less I dont know the optimal climb speed)
but if I know one thing in life its that I will NEVER climb at optimal climbspeed in a combat area, just never. 
I will climb at 350km/h at least, since I dont just want altitude, i also want to get out of the combat area and be able to defend myself should someone dive on me.

On the other hand if I just took off from my airfield and know that there are no enemys nearby, then the right thing to do is to climb at optimal climb speed.

The optimal climb speed for your plane is a constant, the optimal climbspeed for your situation is a variable.


 

Edited by =ARTOA=Bombenleger
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The optimal climb speed for your plane is a constant, the optimal climbspeed for your situation is a variable.

 

I think that is a good formulation even if I might not agree with your choice for a given situation - that will obviously depend on your goals as well as the objective facts. 

 

Just add that best/climb distance is best ie steepest climb slope which is always at a lower climb rate, so completely agree with you there. What happens when you climb at highest possible AoA.

 

So I will leave it at that. 

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@unreasonable,

 

Depends on the situation, I suppose. If you are at optimum climb speed, (i.e. max lift), at climb power, and you have to make a sudden maneuver, if you increase power, you might have enough leftover to maintain that max lift speed, depending on your altitude. It's a bit easier with after burning jets.

 

Energy is energy, whether in the form of altitude (potential), or speed (kinetic). While it is usually desirable to start a fight with an altitude advantage, having energy in the form of higher speed, albeit at a lower altitude, does not necessarily translate into a huge disadvantage. If you want to get to or maintain your best speed to get the tightest turn radius, you'll have to expend some energy either by descending/climbing, increasing/reducing thrust/power, or bleeding speed through maneuver. 

 

In the end it's what you do with the energy that matters.

 

Good hunting,

Conky

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So what is the equation. I read about that in books from WW1 era. I suppose there is simplified version to.

 

Not sure what equation you mean. Your total energy = kinetic energy + potential energy, ie    E = 1/2mv^2 + mgh           m=mass, g = acceleration due to gravity, h = height, v = velocity.  Do it all in SI units and you get Joules.  You can calculate your total energy exactly using this formula.  

 

@Conky  While of course it is what you do with your energy that counts in any given situation, the same is true of your guns, but that does not mean that you should only use two guns when your plane has four.  Statistically you will maximize your chances of success in a series of fights - or avoid fights if you wish (ie stay alive longest) if you always have the highest total E you can generate before contact  (consistent with your mission goals of course - no  point climbing to max ceiling when you are tasked to intercept low flying intruders :)) .  

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Hi guys,

 

I'm not the proud owner of a Yak-1 (127) at this moment, although I'm a lover of my good lady Yak-1 (63)...

 

From what I can read on the official store page, it's not obvious that it features :

 

1. The M-105 PF engine.

2. Electrical and pneumatic firing of the weapons instead of the mechanical system. (-> more reliable firing ?)

3. New gunsight.

4. Retractable tailwheel.

 

Could the happy owners of this lovely beast could shed some lights here ?  :) 

Edited by Solmyr
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