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How do I use the Stabilizer?


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#1 hrafnkolbrandr

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 19:50

Can anybody please explain to me the best way to use the stabilizer in the Fw190 and 109?

What is its purpose, and how best do you make use of it?

Why do some people recommend tying the 109 stabilizer to the pitch axis? What is accomplished by this, and how does it work?

Thank you.
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#2 AndyJWest

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 19:59

You use it like the pitch trim control in any other aircraft - by adjusting it to maintain level flight. As for 'tying it to the pitch', that isn't how the real aircraft worked. Possibly it reduces the minimum turn radius (I'd like to see actual evidence for this) or gives faster immediate response, but if you do that, how do you trim it? A silly hack, for marginal benefit at most, since sustained turns are rarely restricted by control restraints. 


Edited by AndyJWest, 04 January 2017 - 20:00.

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#3 BOO

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 20:37

You use it like the pitch trim control in any other aircraft - by adjusting it to maintain level flight. As for 'tying it to the pitch', that isn't how the real aircraft worked. Possibly it reduces the minimum turn radius (I'd like to see actual evidence for this) or gives faster immediate response, but if you do that, how do you trim it? A silly hack, for marginal benefit at most, since sustained turns are rarely restricted by control restraints. 

For the 109 you trim out when using the pitch "hack" by also assigning a primary sliding axis (spare throttle slider for instance) or (i guess) a standard set of trim up and down buttons (not sure if you can do that in a 109) - The primary sets the center point from which the movement assigned to the stick axis moves to and from. 

 

Benefits i dunno - i think it helps a little if you really wind in the linearity curve so its only moving a bit as you are not having to use a lever with a small amount of travel to fine tune in boom and zooms. If you dont its possibly giving you an unrealistic vectored thrust type effect in slower evasion moves i guess. Not good for others and not good for improving you own skills really. If you have a long travel second throttle lever than would perhaps be the best option. 

 

Where a little axis linked may help is getting you out of trouble in power dives - a little deflection here may make wing loading (or whatever forces there are) smaller allowing you keep hold of your wings a little longer and get out of the dive. Perhaps useful if you dont have the presence of mind to reach for the trim primary.

 

But its subjective - my own test of using trim on both BOS and CLOD is that it does allow you to retain a little more speed and fine control in the same turn radius but that could simply be a placebo as im not an expert or fully conversant with the theory of flight.. There's somey contemporary accounts out there that refer to RAF pilots trimming for turns (as well as for cruise and climb) but probably even more that dont.  At least one report of a captured 190 refers to using the trim almost as a necessity when turning (this is an electric trim button on the throttle i beleive) but - hey - these are test pilots finding the limits so perhaps not a good general day to day reference. I believe Marseille also referred to using his trim wheel in combat. 

 

Regardless of if you use it on the axis or not, trimming on the 109 in general can, dependent upon your set up and personal style, allow for increased accuracy in certain circumstances as it takes away the need to move the stick far from centre (where you may have less wrist control). 

 

As for unrealistic - yes it it  as it stands i guess- so its a personal choice and may or may not be useful but its there until its taken away - but then so is using your headtracker set up to lean 16ft out of the cockpit at 300mph or sit on your instrument panel when checking your six. 

 

Regards

 

BOO


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#4 LukeFF

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 20:39

but then so is using your headtracker set up to lean 16ft out of the cockpit at 300mph

 

That's been programmed out of the game for some time now. 


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#5 AndyJWest

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 20:41

'Trimming for turns' may possibly be of benefit in real life, since it may reduce stick forces. Not relevant in a sim.


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#6 BOO

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 20:51

That's been programmed out of the game for some time now. 

 

I stand corrected - thank you

 

'Trimming for turns' may possibly be of benefit in real life, since it may reduce stick forces. Not relevant in a sim.

 

I find it helps me is all i can say.

 

Kind Regards

 

BOO


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#7 Dakpilot

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 14:05

It certainly can help in pulling out of a dive

 

and is pulling out of a dive not just a turn in a vertical dimension?  :)

 

Tying the trim to pitch axis, I cannot say whether it works or not but it is an 'exploit' regardless, I have never tried it because it sounds a bit 'gamey' and probably comes with some disadvantages

 

If it is there people will use it...just a fact, no judgement

 

Trim is used to keep control forces in a state that you are using your "effort" to purely give control inputs to direct the aircraft, and not 'fighting' external forces, although this does not always relate to a flight sim, however if you are correctly trimmed you will have better control in all aspects even in a sim, and in turns as well, whether you will always have time and if it is worth it is up to personal experience and individual situations

 

like many of my comments/advice it can be picked apart but generally the principle is more or less correct overall without going into minute detail  :biggrin:

 

Cheers Dakpilot


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#8 hrafnkolbrandr

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:29

Okay, so it is basically another form of trim is what I'm getting here.
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#9 19//curiousGamblerr

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 03:57

It's another form of trim, but there's more to it than that, at least in my experience. 

 

I adjust pitch trim often in most aircraft that have it, but when I fly he 109 I adjust the stabilizer much more often. Every dive, every pull up, I've got my right hand on the stick and my left adjusting my stabilizer wheel on my throttle. When booming and zooming it doesn't just help you pull out of dives, sometimes it's all that makes it possible when you're really diving fast, as opposed to smacking into the ground. And when you pull up, negative stab helps negate the float at high speed so you can climb steadily instead of flying straight up. I also use it very often on the 190, via buttons, but it's not quite as essential for me.

 

I don't bind it to my pitch axis, however, not only because is it completely ahistorical, but keeping it separate allows me to control the aircraft more precisely, trimming, holding the nose down and what not. 

 

On the other hand, it also makes it easy to black out, or worse, rip your wing off, so use it with care! 


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