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Junkers 52 "Tante Ju" /Lisunov Li2/C47 ❤️Fan Club & Help

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From what I remember reading, below the clouds in bad weather and an operational altitude of 2000 feet / 610 m in clear? Not 100% sure though as I can't find any sources at the moment - I might have imagined it! :blink:

Cheers.

It is something like that. Generally low level flight.

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On that topic, what's the ceiling for this airframe guys?

 

According to in game specs it has a service ceiling of 6800M

 

Some sites give service ceiling of 5900M, but this is for an earlier model which i believe has slightly less powerful engines

 

(service ceiling is generally a theoretical number with many factors that can influence it)

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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From what I remember reading, below the clouds in bad weather and an operational altitude of 2000 feet / 610 m in clear? Not 100% sure though as I can't find any sources at the moment - I might have imagined it! :blink:

Cheers.

Depended on time, weather and threat, VERY low often. Especially in the Mediterranean over the sea Ju-52 went down below 10 m, avoiding to be visible against the horizon. Until they discovered the RAF used the large triangles the prop-wash produced on calm waters to detect them from above. They went up to 50 - 100 m over water after that. In general without a threat something like 500 m above ground level, it was mostly done following the pilots or the formation leaders personal preference. Over the large forest and tundra areas in northern Europe some went up to 1500 m just to have more time choosing one of the rare places for an emergency landing. With fighter threat present I found two procedures: stay near the cloud base and climb into the clouds, usually they had a good training in instrument flying. Or fly VERY low, hedge hopping.

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Thanks Guys! When looking at a replay , I can confirm:

Brought you by the Junkers 52 Dc3 Fan Club :)

 

 

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Edited by Nil

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Depended on time, weather and threat, VERY low often. Especially in the Mediterranean over the sea Ju-52 went down below 10 m, avoiding to be visible against the horizon. Until they discovered the RAF used the large triangles the prop-wash produced on calm waters to detect them from above. They went up to 50 - 100 m over water after that. In general without a threat something like 500 m above ground level, it was mostly done following the pilots or the formation leaders personal preference. Over the large forest and tundra areas in northern Europe some went up to 1500 m just to have more time choosing one of the rare places for an emergency landing. With fighter threat present I found two procedures: stay near the cloud base and climb into the clouds, usually they had a good training in instrument flying. Or fly VERY low, hedge hopping.

 

Agree with all of above, there are a number of photo's around showing Ju-52's in formation more than likely on real operations either over water on Med flights and over Russia taken from other Ju-52's, 

 

post-6177-0-52530200-1483711276_thumb.jpg

 

Ju-52 Flying into Demyansk Pocket 1942

 

All of these generally show very low level altitude, while certainly no actual evidence it does give that impression.

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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Just copy my post from the "History" subforum to a similar topic:

 

I've read in a chronicle of a Ju-52 pilot who flew eight air lift sorties to Stalingrad, that they flew at an altitude of 3.000 respectivelly 3.500m until they approached the "Kessel", then subsequently descent to a few hundred meters when they were close to the airstrip (Pitomnik or Gumrak); his last sortie was a supply drop mission where the "drop altitude" was mentioned with 150m for drop-containers and 50m for boxes/crates and bags.

Edited by Geleitzug
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Just copy my post from the "History" subforum to a similar topic:

 

I've read in a chronicle of a Ju-52 pilot who flew eight air lift sorties to Stalingrad, that they flew at an altitude of 3.000 respectivelly 3.500m until they approached the "Kessel", then subsequently descent to a few hundred meters when they were close to the airstrip (Pitomnik or Gumrak); his last sortie was a supply drop mission where the "drop altitude" was mentioned with 150m for drop-containers and 50m for boxes/crates and bags.

Thanks for this.

I had the flight in the first mission of the campaign up at 2000 meters, and things look really nice from up there. The problem is that the player is #4 in the flight, thus flying formation with the AI - and the hard-coded AI behavior for descending to lower waypoints is awful right now. Basically after reaching a waypoint they will immediately dive to the altitude of the next waypoint - even though the actual waypoint is some distance away.

The net effect is an unrealistic 'stair step' behavior.

 

So until this behavior is fixed I'll keep all AI led flights lower to reduce this problem. Just glad to hear that it's supported historically, even if higher altitudes were reached at times.

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Gents,

 

I wouldn't say I'm a fan of any of the aircraft here as to be honest and without sounding lame, I actually enjoy them all.  However, I do enjoy what the JU52 brings to this sim and hope that more servers will allow JU52 operations and allow more re-supply type scenarios.  That said, if any of you chaps/ladies are in a server that allows JU52 and you see me, I would be more than willing to join up and do a JU52 sortie with you. 

 

Regards

 

Haza

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From Operation Weserübung, the German invasion of Denmark and Norway.

Low level flying!

 

german_planes_over_denmark_1940.jpg

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the famous Pamir mountain crossing enroute from Berlin to China was done at 7000m by the D-ANOY.. but civilian airline ops where usually between 1000m and 3000m

 

 

According to in game specs it has a service ceiling of 6800M

 

Some sites give service ceiling of 5900M, but this is for an earlier model which i believe has slightly less powerful engines

 

(service ceiling is generally a theoretical number with many factors that can influence it)

 

Cheers Dakpilot

Edited by Monostripezebra
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I like flying at tree top level and lower. When you do that the AI fighters leave you alone. They just chase you for a while

and then give up. Multiplay would be different I'm sure. Really like the Para part of this one. I fly low and then popup 

at the drop site and unload, then back down for a return to base. 

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Naa. Really not. By the time Hitler flew around in a Ju-52, the Ju-52 was "old iron" and Junkers said so himself.

 

"Hitler was the first politician to campaign by air travel, deciding that travel by plane was more efficient than travel by railway. Baur first piloted him during the 1932 General Election.

 

Hitler obtained his first private aeroplane, a Junkers Ju 52/3m with registration number D-2600 (Werk Nr. 4021), in February 1933, on becoming German Chancellor. Powered by BMW 132 licence-built Pratt and Whitney radial engines, it was named Immelmann II after the First World War pilot Max Immelmann.[5] The Fuehrermaschine had a small folding table in Hitler's favourite seat on the right, with a clock, altimeter and airspeed indicator on the bulkhead just in front."

 

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Baur)

 

Travelling in the Ju-52/3m less than a year after its first flight can hardly be called flying in an "old iron"...

Edited by Freycinet
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Well this bird have made me start a dialog with a simulator hardware manufacturer to fit a yoke to my small spaced cramped pit kind of thing together with my stick.

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Thank You for your contributions! They help me a lot to improve and update the initial post. :clapping:

+1 for your research , informations which help me to better know Tante Ju

 

Thank you

Haza, 

HarryM

B0SS

 

For following this topic! ;)

 

First mission in Friday Night Bomber with a MASSIVE Junkers 52 formation.

Very exciting to fly, more than I expected.

 

I love so much this new gameplay addition.

 

 

 

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Edited by Nil
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^^ Irrelevant to the 'game' but i saw an unofficial Luftwaffe 'field mod' on a photo where a "filler plate" was put between the centre engine and windscreen base/fuselage to deflect/prevent contamination of oil on the windscreen, this was on an aircraft used in Demyansk airlift

 

Have only ever seen a single example of this type of 'field mod' but your screen shots reminded me of it  :)

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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New section: "History" in the initial post.

Thank you for your help!

 

Screen: "getting the job done!"

I love to drop Paras and Canisters!

What about you Guys??

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Edited by Nil

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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

 

 

I see some promising books about it covering its development and history from 1930 to 1945 on Amazon , but I am not so sure it contain paint schemes and markings. It should cover technical details though 

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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

 

Not sure about paint schemes but here is some info on a book that seems to have had good reviews as an overview

 

http://falkeeins.blogspot.co.za/2016/09/luftwaffe-book-review-junkers-ju-52.html

 

I have not read it or have any affiliation

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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[Edited] son, great pic there!

And just to think that exact scene would now be possible in the sim!

We have to get a few of these airframes together for a drop lads.

 

7. Comments containing profanity, personal insults, accusations of cheating, excessive rudeness, vulgarity, drug propaganda, political and religious discussion and propaganda, all manifestations of Nazism and racist statements, calls to overthrow governments by force, inciting ethnic hatred, humiliation of persons of a particular gender, sexual orientation or religion are not allowed and will result in a ban.
Violations of this rule will result in the following:
 
First offense - 3 days ban on entry

 

Last warning. Watch your lenguage

Edited by SYN_Haashashin
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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

 

I am working my way through this book by Robert Forsyth  https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Junkers-Ju52-Robert-Forsyth/1906537461/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1484219771&sr=1-1&keywords=ju52

Everything you need to know about the design and development of the Tante Ju from Professor Hugo Junkers life story through to the Ju252 and 352. There are chapters devoted to each of its incarnations: Bomber - Fallschirmtruppen - Transporter - Air Ambulance - Ju52/3m See - Ju52/3m MS 'Mausi' - Test Beds and Flying Classrooms - Courier and Staffel Transports, with a wealth of technical and operational details. There is no day-by-day record of which unit did what, but there are a good few profile paint schemes throughout the book.

As with other books in the this series, well worth the price tag - if you buy from Amazon or similar. Don't pay the full price of £60.00.

Cheers.

 

51XTXqwxujL._SX373_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

Edited by 216th_Cat
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Great idea for the Transportgeschwader

 

I've amended my name to join the new squad.

 

Currently overseas but look forward to representing the tante group in due course! I fly all airframes in this sim, VVS and Luftwaffe, but I feel this 52 is rather special.

 

Look forward to doing a drop together soon, lads!

Edited by 1./TG1_B0SS
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Not sure about paint schemes but here is some info on a book that seems to have had good reviews as an overview

 

http://falkeeins.blogspot.co.za/2016/09/luftwaffe-book-review-junkers-ju-52.html

Hmm, looks like it's more focused on history. But thx anyway!

 

 

I am working my way through this book by Robert Forsyth  https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Junkers-Ju52-Robert-Forsyth/1906537461/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1484219771&sr=1-1&keywords=ju52

Everything you need to know about the design and development of the Tante Ju from Professor Hugo Junkers life story through to the Ju252 and 352. There are chapters devoted to each of its incarnations: Bomber - Fallschirmtruppen - Transporter - Air Ambulance - Ju52/3m See - Ju52/3m MS 'Mausi' - Test Beds and Flying Classrooms - Courier and Staffel Transports, with a wealth of technical and operational details. There is no day-by-day record of which unit did what, but there are a good few profile paint schemes throughout the book.

As with other books in the this series, well worth the price tag - if you buy from Amazon or similar. Don't pay the full price of £60.00.

Cheers.

 

51XTXqwxujL._SX373_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

This looks really good but it's way over my budget (50€ on amazon de, cheaper than used ones from ebay). Too bad because I'm also very interested in the 252 and 352 development :(

I was looking at "Die Alte Tante und der Storch" from Janusz Piekalkiewicz which supposedly has a ton of photo material on both aircraft across 376 pages but I'm not quite sure yet.

Die-Alte-Tante_m.jpg

Edited by 6./ZG26_5tuka
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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

 

S! 5tuka.

 

At Axis and Allies Paintworks you can find a large amount of Ju-52 skins for the Il-2 '46 made by cheruskerarmin. They can be used as reference.

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Seeing as there are no campaigns available yet for the Junkers I decided to fire up the games Stalingrad one again and after flying the obligatory opening mission as a 109 pilot there was only really one aircraft I was going to fly in the next one, yes Auntie Ju. ;)

 

Took twelve passengers and dropped them behind Soviet lines near an airfield and returned, seemed to take forever but loved it.

 

I have trouble flying these days due to ill health so only manage a few short missions usually but once in the air was able to take advantage of the auto stabilizer to do the work while I sat back and admired the scenery, only needed to do some real hands on near the drop zone when two Laggs showed up to try and spoil the party, thankfully some mad manuvering and the Macchi top cover restored the earlier calm and I trundled back to base watching the night sky decend before making a rather nice touch down in the dark, we all made it back leaving the troopers to whatever mischief they had in mind before their rather long walk home. :salute:

 

Made a lovely change from the usual mad fighter sweeps and such, would certainly recommend the experience and look forward to the next outing.

 

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete. :biggrin:

Edited by Missionbug
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Gents,

 

I'm not one for organising stuff, therefore hopefully somebody might be able to organise this suggestion.  Owing to the fact that there appears to be little interest in the popular server for having the JU52 in game, I think it would be great if as many players as possible got together on a server that does allow JU52 Ops to at least try and get all those interested parties together to form up and do one big Para drop.  Therefore, perhaps "Nil" might be the best placed person to organise!?

 

Owing to the different time zones it will be interesting to see what happens.  However, with the lack of apparent interest in allowing the JU52 onto servers, I think that I would be reluctant to purchase any more aircraft of this type (Supply/observation etc) as without the support of the servers, the Ju52 is basically the new "Duck"! 

 

HOWEVER, hopefully the new TAW campaign will do us all justice and get together!?

 

Regards

 

Haza

 

 

PS  

 

MISSIONBUG,

 

Nice report mate!


Hmm, looks like it's more focused on history. But thx anyway!

 

 

This looks really good but it's way over my budget (50€ on amazon de, cheaper than used ones from ebay). Too bad because I'm also very interested in the 252 and 352 development :(

I was looking at "Die Alte Tante und der Storch" from Janusz Piekalkiewicz which supposedly has a ton of photo material on both aircraft across 376 pages but I'm not quite sure yet.

Die-Alte-Tante_m.jpg

 

 

Not sure if this site might help for books!?

 

 

http://www.bookdepository.com/The-Junkers-Ju-52-Story-Jan-Forsgren/9781781555156?ref=pd_detail_1_sims_b_p2p_1

Edited by Haza

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I see JU 52 all over the place myself, but I am no longer a fan about having the JU 52 on russian side, after people take advantage of German Skin. And I do not fly LW since they are always outnumbering Red. 

But Random Expert do allow, Finnish allow on LW side . I fly it offline and enjoy it

Edited by 216th_LuseKofte
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Slightly offtopic, but does sby. know a good book on the Ju 52 (including technical details, paint schemes, markings)?

Get a copy of " Ju52 in action" by Squadron/Signal Publications They are in Carrollton, Texas in the USA. (I suppose one could order from them "Online"). I find their reference material absolutely superb, and the Ju52 issue is no exception. They cover developmental history, variants, technical highlights, combat history, etc., as well as including a selection of colour-profiles and illustrations. The many dozens of high-quality black-and-white photo's include, for example, at least ten different "Tante Ju's" sporting the oil-protector cover between the mid-engine and cockpit. The differences between variants are also described and illustrated in detail.

I have about thirty of their various reference publications on WWII aircraft, and they are all excellent.

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For all your contribution, 

For making this post better!

 

Please welcome our new follower:

1./TG1_Don_Quijote :dance:  :dance:  :dance: 

Please follow this topic for whose are not following yet, it helps a lot, more than you think!

 

Gents,

 

I'm not one for organising stuff, therefore hopefully somebody might be able to organise this suggestion.  Owing to the fact that there appears to be little interest in the popular server for having the JU52 in game, I think it would be great if as many players as possible got together on a server that does allow JU52 Ops to at least try and get all those interested parties together to form up and do one big Para drop.  Therefore, perhaps "Nil" might be the best placed person to organise!?

 

Owing to the different time zones it will be interesting to see what happens.  However, with the lack of apparent interest in allowing the JU52 onto servers, I think that I would be reluctant to purchase any more aircraft of this type (Supply/observation etc) as without the support of the servers, the Ju52 is basically the new "Duck"! 

Hi Haza

Little interest in popular server is due to 2 factors in my opinion:

NO points for pilot when they do transport missions

NO C47/Li2 which makes building missions tricky for server host. (see bellow)

However, So far we had 2 coops Friday Night Bombing (which are popular) with Tante Ju, and believe me the pilot involved LOVED to fly it! :good:  

 

For the matter of organise this fantastic idea about Ju52 Ops, I am the worse person to do that yet. 

I whish to make a server "tante ju" only with misisons involved and rewards for the the pilots who are doing the most transport missions...with a leaderboard but that is just an idea which has to be tuned up.

 

 

I see JU 52 all over the place myself, but I am no longer a fan about having the JU 52 on russian side, after people take advantage of German Skin. And I do not fly LW since they are always outnumbering Red. 

But Random Expert do allow, Finnish allow on LW side . I fly it offline and enjoy it

That is what I was talking about.

 

Haza,

I kike the idea of the "big drop"! :biggrin:  We could try to make it a weekly thing!

Yes! maybe you Don Quijote , you are the best for organise that. Count me in of COurse!

 

Get a copy of " Ju52 in action" by Squadron/Signal Publications They are in Carrollton, Texas in the USA. (I suppose one could order from them "Online"). I find their reference material absolutely superb, and the Ju52 issue is no exception. They cover developmental history, variants, technical highlights, combat history, etc., as well as including a selection of colour-profiles and illustrations. The many dozens of high-quality black-and-white photo's include, for example, at least ten different "Tante Ju's" sporting the oil-protector cover between the mid-engine and cockpit. The differences between variants are also described and illustrated in detail.

I have about thirty of their various reference publications on WWII aircraft, and they are all excellent.

Nice find!

 

As usual, some screen, 

this time about the Friday night bomber!  Dropping supplies and MEDIVAC flight where we have to do a landing and a take off in a field. With 30% fuel, it was possible. Thank you Tx Tip for this mission!

 

And remember! fly low and slow! ;)

 

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1./TG1_Don_Quijote, on 16 Jan 2017 - 16:07, said: Haza, I kike the idea of the "big drop"!  We could try to make it a weekly thing! Yes! maybe you Don Quijote , you are the best for organise that. Count me in of COurse

 

1./TG_Don_Quijote,

 

Are you able to perhaps try and organise this for a time that will allow as many players as possible to join? 

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I'm wondering if 19.GIAP would excommunicate me if I fly German again next TAW just to get some time in Tante Ju... I guess I'll see what the TAW folks decide to do with her first ;)

 

(kidding of course about the excommunication, p3z wouldn't do that hehe)

Edited by 19.GIAP//curiousGamblerr
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If someone could set up a server for Ju52 ops, with preferably not too hard settings(no navigation aid, no aim assist, automatic engine control, allows mouse), I think I can presuade a few Ju52 fans who are friends of mine to try this game(their main grip is that they play WT and say that this sim will be too hard to get into). Perhaps it should be a massive paradrop somewhere on the other bank of the Volga, with tons of AA, AT and artilery guns all over the place. Also, apparently you can set the AA to go after paratroopers, so you will have to drop hundreds to ensure many get to the ground safely. The missions success or failure will be determinded by the number of paratroops alive at the end of the mission. For maximum effect, have the drop and subsequent resupply drops occur in the wee hours of the morning and watch the fireworks. What do you guys think?

 

Just try and immagine a large flight of a hundred Ju52s flying in a loose formation over the Volga, as dozens of searchlights turn on and hundreds of machine guns and AA guns start firing, first at the planes, then at the desending paratroopers. If it is possible, have the guns destroyed if a centain amount of paras reach the ground. Now immagine supporting them against an armoured counterattack in Stukas, while a second, smaller wave of Ju52s drop supplies.

Edited by hames123
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Here an interesting story of german build Ju-52's operated by an Australian aviation company after the war: http://www.goodall.com.au/australian-aviation/junkers%20ju52/junkersju52.html

 

It has some very interesting quotes about the Ju 52's capebilities:

 

Ivan Bennett: "You didn't need a pilot's licence to fly the old JU, you needed a plumber's certificate. But it was a bloody good aeroplane. The corrugated metal construction made them very strong and gave them a much greater wing area than was apparent. They had great ability on short fields.  I did a lot of air drops in the JU. You could get back to 65 knots which made the job easier. One of the worst I did was at Simbai, to drop a roller to Jim McKinnon who was building a strip there. We landed at Aiome to get the metal roller. Jim gave us a detailed plan to fly up the Simbai valley and drop the roller. All well in theory, but the Simbai valley did not have enough room to complete a 360 degree turn in the old JU. Coming around in the turn I could see we were in deep trouble, so just as we missed a ridge I gave the signal to drop the roller because I had to climb out of there. The roller went into the next valley and took 3 weeks to get it out."

 

 

Adrian Nisbet: "Those JUs were terrible things, heavy as a brick, but magnificent aircraft for the job. Imagine getting into the old Maprik strip, only 1,600 feet long, with a trimotor carrying 7,500 pounds - as much as a DC-3.  They were an extraordinary aircraft for their time. Qantas were stripping down their DC-3s to try to get a bit more payload out of them to compete with the Ju 52s."

Edited by 6./ZG26_5tuka
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