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109 cockpit gauges

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After seeing the the cockpit and gauges in this new 109 my respect level for team fusion has grown even more. I hope the gauges and shadowing effects are still work in progress, look cartoony to me.  I was hoping that it was just the way the dashboard in the LaGG was made that gave it a dull look. I do realize it is work in progress and trust the devs will take some time to highlight the eyecandy that could be the inside of these planes.

The 109 was truly easy to take off and land, seems to stall easily in inverted turns. Seems fast enough though. Good work guys, just do not forget the detail in the cockpit please, the outside view is gorgeous the way the sun shines and the shadows roll around, very good detail with the ripples in the sheet metal, us full switch pilots need that kind of detail in the cockpit too.

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Hmm to me this cockpit is much better than team fusions 109 f-4. ;p. But honestly i compared screenshots, and both look great, they just look "different". I am also a full switch player. Please cease commenting for the lot of "us" pretty sure there are a varying set of opinions throughout the community.

 

I love the way it looks and am pretty sure its going to stay pretty close to how it looks now.

 

Im more looking forward to getting a yak1 to give a slightly higher chance against the 109.

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Still alpha. Most effects are placeholders or aren't present. It's been in public hands for a total of 5 days, and only 32% complete. Why don't we pump the brakes a bit and wait a few months to start worrying about graphics.

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I fully agree with Zombie.

 

Cockpit eye candy is more important than external plane rendering as 99% of time is spent inside the plane! (at least for me)

But having both is the "must" of course :biggrin: 

 

Main thing missing in BOS cockpits is gauges reflection in my opinion..

Maybe nowadays we have anti-reflection glasses, but back in 1942?...

Adding some more reflection to gauges glasses would greatly improve the realistic touch to me.

Actually it's only alpha, ok, but on my rig with 2560x1440 reso, they look really flat and not natural. Even at the edge of the "cartoonish"! (i'm sorry, but...).

Reflections would add some more relief to the whole stuff.

Maybe we have been spoiled with better eye candy elsewhere? Probably.

 

Simulation names appart, would be cool to see this kind of reflection:

 

778590Gaugereflection.jpg

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I've got to admit I'm not keen on the random weathering effects.

 

If I see damaged cockpit textures textures then I want to be able to have some logical reason for that damage happening. Scratched footpads, OK, scratches on the instrument panel were a faulty instrument has been removed, nice. Random flaky paint just looks wrong imo, these planes were quite new, at most months put of the factory. The BOS 109F cockpit almost looks like its been at the bottom of a Russian lake for 70 years.

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 To me it just needs a little livening up, which im sure is coming, though if it doesn't and that's it for the cockpit, then i can live with it.

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I fully agree with Zombie.

 

Cockpit eye candy is more important than external plane rendering as 99% of time is spent inside the plane! (at least for me)

But having both is the "must" of course :biggrin:

 

Main thing missing in BOS cockpits is gauges reflection in my opinion..

Maybe nowadays we have anti-reflection glasses, but back in 1942?...

Adding some more reflection to gauges glasses would greatly improve the realistic touch to me.

Actually it's only alpha, ok, but on my rig with 2560x1440 reso, they look really flat and not natural. Even at the edge of the "cartoonish"! (i'm sorry, but...).

Reflections would add some more relief to the whole stuff.

Maybe we have been spoiled with better eye candy elsewhere? Probably.

 

Simulation names appart, would be cool to see this kind of reflection:

 

778590Gaugereflection.jpg

 

 

I'd rather see an example of a real cockpit showing that reflection, and not from another game.

 

Couple real life cockpits:

 

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3868139/Re_109_is_here#Post3868139

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I'm also very underwhelmed by the 109 pit in general. I have some comparison photos to Il2 with mods and it looks almost exactely alike. (I posted the pics but Jason deleted my posts so I guess I'm not alowed to repost them again... So my gut says that 777 knows that the 109 pit isnt that great).

 

And for a 2013 game its just no enough imho - even more so because the externial model looks absolutely awesome.

I wonder which parts of the 109 and LaGG they took from Cliffs "battle from moscow" and if that has anything to do with it.

 

Its just strange how far appart the cockpit and the externial model are in terms of poly count and texturing.

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Something similar about flat gauges etc. has been mentioned in another topic and I'm quite sure a lot will be improved considering the screenshots posted in some Dev Diaries

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/2469-post-109-picks-here/?p=57505 (post # 30)

 

The game is just at 32% and still 6 months to go before final release. ;)

 

Another thing: this fixed number 32% as mentioned by the team that pops up all the time is something quite funny.

It is just an estimation. During the process you never know what is going to be changed/ added and so on.

Nobody knows what is going to happen in future. Unless they have a crystal ball in their office. :biggrin:

Besides that, assuming the development ís at 32% what they present to you founders might be less.

To have a better control over the input from Tuesday till Thursday.

 

Or am I a bit to suspicious. :ph34r:

 

giphy.gif

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I have to agree with Zombie and I strongly hope cockpits are still heavily work in progress. There's no comparison with CLoD stuff at any level so far, no matter if modded with teamfusion or not. That was insane state of the art, but let's wait and see, hopefully there are still many things this engine /and this team) may have in store for us.

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When I look at real cockpits, I see a lot of artistic freedom taken with the "state of the art" title's cockpits. I haven't seen the reflections in real cockpit gauges that are so admired in the "state of the art" cockpits.

 

Like this...post-9266-0-65257400-1385506854_thumb.jpgpost-9266-0-89936900-1385506904_thumb.jpg

 

You'll see gloss, and blocked light, maybe lines here or there - but not defineable reflections like in a mirror.

Edited by FuriousMeow

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I agree when you compare what TF has done to what you see currently, there's a big visual difference.  But it's silly at this point to say or think what you see in IL2 is the finished product, common guys we know it's not.   I would think it's more about getting the flight models and core game running, then lets go back and make it pretty.  While I think it's OK to express that you have a concern about a certain area lets not harp on why A is better than B while B is still in it's infancy.  

 

Also think the appropriate response to these types of concerns are for the devs or mods to address them instead of locking them to keep the rumor mill in check.

 

1) Make it work

2) Then make it pretty

Edited by AcesHigh

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The game looks great. At the moment, I am just keeping the setting on low. I don't have to, but I have to really tweak everything so it looks great and allows for really good framerates. Anyway, at the moment I am keeping things on low, and this is what the cockpit looks like. I think it looks great, especially since I am not taking advantage of any of the in game or in Nvidia graphics settings that would make the cockpit look much better.  :salute: MJ

 

 

2013_11_25__20_16_46_zps0e47204b.png

Edited by =69.GIAP=MIKHA
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This is BOS 109 cockpit from devs blog:

 

927392Sanstitre.jpg

 

Don't know what happened to those nice reflections...and why they didn't include it.

Hopping they change it for future update. They were done!

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When I look at real cockpits, I see a lot of artistic freedom taken with the "state of the art" title's cockpits. I haven't seen the reflections in real cockpit gauges that are so admired in the "state of the art" cockpits.

 

Like this...attachicon.gifDVIII_Cockpit.jpgattachicon.gifN17_cockpit.jpg

 

You'll see gloss, and blocked light, maybe lines here or there - but not defineable reflections like in a mirror.

 

I know what you mean.

But every every every game is artistic freedom. Developers have to consider its limitations and how to deal with it.

For several reasons.

A: We are all infuenced by low rez German/Russian/US propaganda footages on YouTube.

B: Our limited computer resources.

C: the time consuming programs to create computer games.

 

I think it will take about 10 more years before a small team can create a realistic 3D 100% real life immersive flight sim and then we will laugh about 2012 CLOD or 2014 BoS.

Just like we smile when we see screenies of CFS I right now.

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I've got to admit I'm not keen on the random weathering effects.

 

If I see damaged cockpit textures textures then I want to be able to have some logical reason for that damage happening. Scratched footpads, OK, scratches on the instrument panel were a faulty instrument has been removed, nice. Random flaky paint just looks wrong imo, these planes were quite new, at most months put of the factory. The BOS 109F cockpit almost looks like its been at the bottom of a Russian lake for 70 years.

 

Agreed. Flaking / scratched paint should really only be evident in those areas where the pilot would have his hands and feet most of the time (canopy frame, floorboards, flight stick, throttle, rudder pedals). The LaGG-3 cockpit right now is a good example of believable paint "damage." 

Edited by LukeFF

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This is BOS 109 cockpit from devs blog:

 

927392Sanstitre.jpg

 

Don't know what happened to those nice reflections...and why they didn't include it.

Hopping they change it for future update. They were done!

that's better, almost state of the art :lol:

 

And about reflections in real life, even this old, terrible pic shows it

 

bf109b-cockpit.jpg

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When I look at real cockpits, I see a lot of artistic freedom taken with the "state of the art" title's cockpits. I haven't seen the reflections in real cockpit gauges that are so admired in the "state of the art" cockpits.

 

Like this...attachicon.gifDVIII_Cockpit.jpgattachicon.gifN17_cockpit.jpg

 

You'll see gloss, and blocked light, maybe lines here or there - but not defineable reflections like in a mirror.

 

Don't try to compare photos taken indoors. The lighting conditions are quite different from the outside.

 

Another issue to consider is if the camera that took the picture had a polarizer filter fitted. If it did then no reflections would be apparent in the photo even if they are obvious in person. Its very common for aircraft photographers to use polarizers.

 

EDIT: here is a pic that shows reflections in the 109 pit.

 

 

source;http://avocado360.com/en/

post-850-0-31812500-1385537091_thumb.png

Edited by LizLemon

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Tbh and imo those refelctions are useless, if they appear just static. And this is what p**** me throughout the time I played Clod.

If you intend to create reflections - fine. But then do it the proper way by using dynamic refelctions, a simple alpha texture with less opacity doesnt do the trick, and looks a bit cheap to me. So I am very grateful, static refelctions didnt make it into the sims` cockpit up to now. However I am a fan of dynamic shadows anywhere I can get em.

 

When I am right BoS cockpits use just a part of Clod cockpit lods, what leads to the performance aspect and playability for even weak systems. At the end of the day we received top notch cockpits which fit very well into the complete appearence of the sim, and so already now, the product looks honest and reasonable

 

I would really appreciate interaction with the cockpit, like changing the default compass direction or using the timer, well stuff like that, which mustnt end in a clickable cockpit.

 

I didnt had the impression Clodo cockpit fitted into the remaining status of the game, but this shall not lead into a useless clodo vs bos cockpit discussion (apples and pears) and just want to state I really liked Clodo as my sys was decent enough to handle it.

 

Really like the 32% product throughout and gives me the feeling my investment in july was justified and will be warrantable at release day 1.

Edited by 1./JG42Nephris

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I'm completely happy with the level of 3D detail it's the textures that could be better. I suspect this is it though...

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So far(3.008)
We can see the"reflections" in He-111 H6&H16 "only".

1440022362_Il-22018-12-0710-57-17.thumb.jpg.69e866f8b10e274da8aa0f097b356ce4.jpg

They looking so good!!

Shall we see this in others planes?

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4 hours ago, Takuya_liang said:

So far(3.008)
We can see the"reflections" in He-111 H6&H16 "only".

1440022362_Il-22018-12-0710-57-17.thumb.jpg.69e866f8b10e274da8aa0f097b356ce4.jpg

They looking so good!!

Shall we see this in others planes?

If I'm brutally honest I think the reflections look much too matt. 

 

What I'd also really like to see would be reflections on exposed metal parts in the cockpits, we have this amazing reflection on the externals of the aircraft (eg: P-47), could than not be applied to the inside too? Not to the same extent of course, it's way to shiny for most components save for things like switches in US aircraft, but with the right amount of reflectivity, plus the gauge lenses, it would really push the cockpits to the next level. 

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6 hours ago, LizLemon said:

gauges.thumb.png.7abb57a72bae3995afc357d8b9227ff2.png

Both these pictures are a poor example.

Left shot has the entire cockpit in shade.

 

right pic has the sun too high in relation to the canopy. IAS is interesting though, notice how the line of sunlight is refracting through the glass of the instrument onto the base behind. Really well done. 

Try setting up a mission at a time where the sun is low in the sky and get it behind you at your 4 - 5 o clock position or 7 - 8 and repost

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I saw cockpits which in "Chuck's Guides" was beautful ↓ There are glass reflections on the instruments.

this guides update dates : 09/04/2016

dsgdsgdec.thumb.jpg.afd761779f45483dda5c9c8c333ef20e.jpgfdfggh.jpg.134d553241d563c7fe5c6b2f2b14e09b.jpgrggdgdg.jpg.6c6677fad9db95544e1f89c96bb64bb6.jpg

Even it was somehow a little matt, but IMO it's better than now Version.

Besides He-111 H6&H16, glass all taken out.:cray:

Edited by Takuya_liang

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Honestly it looks great in VR. Surprised anyone even notices the guages since most of the people online use the stupid technochat. Maybe one day we will be gifted with the removal of technochat server side.

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7 hours ago, =11=Herne said:

Both these pictures are a poor example.

Left shot has the entire cockpit in shade.

 

right pic has the sun too high in relation to the canopy. IAS is interesting though, notice how the line of sunlight is refracting through the glass of the instrument onto the base behind. Really well done. 

Try setting up a mission at a time where the sun is low in the sky and get it behind you at your 4 - 5 o clock position or 7 - 8 and repost

 

Its just something I've been messing with on an off for a while. Trying to get the color about right for most situations, including when its in shade and at night. The best thing that can be done is to give the glass a slight tint like that. Trying to bake a reflection into it ala Clod doesnt work as all instruments are pulling the glass from the exact same location.

2018_10_28__7_17_23.thumb.jpg.7a13a602f1bf13965de488ac1d1db6ce.jpg

 

6 hours ago, Takuya_liang said:

I saw cockpits which in "Chuck's Guides" was beautful ↓ There are glass reflections on the instruments.

this guides update dates : 09/04/2016

dsgdsgdec.thumb.jpg.afd761779f45483dda5c9c8c333ef20e.jpgfdfggh.jpg.134d553241d563c7fe5c6b2f2b14e09b.jpgrggdgdg.jpg.6c6677fad9db95544e1f89c96bb64bb6.jpg

Even it was somehow a little matt, but IMO it's better than now Version.

Besides He-111 H6&H16, glass all taken out.:cray:

 

Those are not reflections, they are specular highlights. Same as every other surface in this game.

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24 minutes ago, LizLemon said:

 

Its just something I've been messing with on an off for a while. Trying to get the color about right for most situations, including when its in shade and at night. The best thing that can be done is to give the glass a slight tint like that. Trying to bake a reflection into it ala Clod doesnt work as all instruments are pulling the glass from the exact same location.

2018_10_28__7_17_23.thumb.jpg.7a13a602f1bf13965de488ac1d1db6ce.jpg

 

 

Those are not reflections, they are specular highlights. Same as every other surface in this game.

Sorry, I'm not good at English, I can't narrative well.

At least, give us the specular highlights, like He-111s.

This is an old technic which used before, right?

Edited by Takuya_liang

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10 hours ago, Soilworker said:

Not to the same extent of course, it's way to shiny for most components save for things like switches in US aircraft, but with the right amount of reflectivity, plus the gauge lenses, it would really push the cockpits to the next level

 

The switches in American cockpits were not shiny either, in reality. I have a recognition light control panel from a P-47 sitting on my desk, and all of the switches are made of a very dull material. 

 

DSCN9601_1024x1024.JPG?v=1513475313

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3 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

The switches in American cockpits were not shiny either, in reality. I have a recognition light control panel from a P-47 sitting on my desk, and all of the switches are made of a very dull material. 

 

DSCN9601_1024x1024.JPG?v=1513475313

Ok sure (although I'm guessing a lot of that is due to corrosion), but regardless some form of reflection maps would go a long way, currently everything metal is basically matt grey. 

 

BTW Luke, that's super cool! 😄

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35 minutes ago, Soilworker said:

BTW Luke, that's super cool! 😄

 

Thanks! I'd love to get it wired up somehow. All of the switches work properly, and the keying switch is still spring-loaded. 

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look into DD202, the pics of dora...

Fw190D_1.jpg

It's rarely they made glass on the gauges, and we can see reflections on it.

Maybe Devs are plannig to deliver on something new!!

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On 12/7/2018 at 11:10 AM, Takuya_liang said:

Sorry, I'm not good at English, I can't narrative well.

At least, give us the specular highlights, like He-111s.

This is an old technic which used before, right?

 

Every cockpit in game already has specular highlights.

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12 hours ago, LizLemon said:

 

Every cockpit in game already has specular highlights.

No.....I only see it in He-111, should I reinstall the game!?

Edited by Takuya_liang
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3 hours ago, Takuya_liang said:

No.....I only see it in He-111, should I reinstall the game!?

 

No, that would be a waste of time. @LizLemon has it right.

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On 12/7/2018 at 11:33 PM, LukeFF said:

 

Thanks! I'd love to get it wired up somehow. All of the switches work properly, and the keying switch is still spring-loaded. 

Shouldn't be too hard if you know a little about (or know someone who can help with) micro controllers, it's all buttons so it'd be pretty straightforward.

 

I'm actually planning on building an axes quadrant and brake lever using Hall sensors and an a Teensy board for my simpit so I'm going to be learning a bit about that myself. 😊

 

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