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[ASOR]Pharoah

Question - why is taxiing so difficult?

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Really? I always feel like an idiot when I take it. If memory serves me right I've managed one or two take-offs with it against four to five ground accidents online. Getting used to it might be a factor - I can even land and take-off from a random grass patch in the middle of nowhere in the LaGG-3.

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Really? I always feel like an idiot when I take it. If memory serves me right I've managed one or two take-offs with it against four to five ground accidents online. Getting used to it might be a factor - I can even land and take-off from a random grass patch in the middle of nowhere in the LaGG-3.

 

Yep. 190 is very easy to taxi, just keep the tailwheel locked, turn with the differential brakes. Only unlock tailwheel when you need to do 90 degree turns. Taking off with it is even easier: deploy combat/take-off flaps, lock tailwheel pulling the stick, then add throttle and keep her straight with gentle taps on the brakes, when you reach 150 kph, release the pressure on the stick, the tail should come up off the ground, lift off at 200kph, gear up as soon as possible, flaps up at around 220-250 and off you go.  :)

 

Sometimes I even overtake other planes while taxing by driving outside the taxiway.

 

The Lagg/La5 on the other hand.... half of the landings result in a ground loop at the ending of the rolling. The 110 is another PITA to taxi, not to mention if you let any of the gear of the 110 hit the snow outside the taxiway you get sucked to it like a black hole.

 

All in all... Every plane has its perks and I think the ground handling is pretty believable, sure some planes could use some tweaks (110 I'm looking at you!), but once you learn how to taxi it just becomes something you do without much thinking.

Edited by Herr_Istruba
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All in all... Every plane has its perks and I think the ground handling is pretty believable, sure some planes could use some tweaks (110 I'm looking at you!), but once you learn how to taxi it just becomes something you do without much thinking.

 

Yep  :salute:

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Good to see both sides of the story.

 

I've practised quite a lot with taxiing and I usually taxi (where applicable) with 100% pitch/full mixture/tail wheel unlocked but I still struggle with the JU88. The a/c goes into a circle way too quick it seems, even when countering the swing with opposite rudder and throttle. Hell I've gone into a right circle with just the left throttle on full and full left brake. I guess prevention is better than cure.

 

I noticed too that on takeoff if I slammed both throttles forward to 100%, the a/c will basically go straight and true....try doing it slowly with the power levers not being exactly equal and the bird will go into circles. That's a bit excessive - I've been in a/c that have taken off with differential power settings (esp with xwinds) and its easily counteracted with rudder. Anyway, this is a game.

 

Am loving the a/c though.

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Hell I've gone into a right circle with just the left throttle on full and full left brake.

 

A little off topic, but if you apply left throttle only, the aircraft should turn to the right, nothing wrong with that. The same with right throttle only resulting in a turn to the left.

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The only Aircraft I have a tiny bit of trouble with is the 110. When taxiing out and the guy infront brakes, the crash is inevitable. It feel a bit like the Slow Motion of a Crashtest. 

But everything else is simple if you are patient. 

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A little off topic, but if you apply left throttle only, the aircraft should turn to the right, nothing wrong with that. The same with right throttle only resulting in a turn to the left.

 

lol sorry got my wires crossed. I've tried taking off by slowly advancing the throttles (as against jamming them at 100%) but ended up in a spin to the right. To counteract, I gave it full right throttle (reduced left throttle to nil) and applied right brake...but kept spinning. I just didn't think the impact of power differential from unsynchronized engines would be that pronounced. Ever see RL pilots inc throttles on larger piston engine a/c (eg. DC3)? they do it slowly advancing it left/right/left/right/left/right etc...which is what I was trying to do.

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I can rally drive most of the aircraft especially the pe-2. I'm not saying its accurate but with the correct know-how, some practice and a good set up it is easy for me.

 

The only problems I have are going to fast in the la/Lagg and getting in a mess. Also the problem with some aircraft when I get a leg stuck in the snow

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I remember when I went from EAW to IL2-1946. I could not taxi at all. Same happened when I went to Cliffs of Dover and to BoS.

And if I have been playing BoS for a good while and take a step into War Thunder I find it difficult to taxi there.

 

I think it was easier for the real pilots in the real planes. But they had plenty of experience before they got into a real fighter plane.

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lol sorry got my wires crossed. I've tried taking off by slowly advancing the throttles (as against jamming them at 100%) but ended up in a spin to the right. To counteract, I gave it full right throttle (reduced left throttle to nil) and applied right brake...but kept spinning. I just didn't think the impact of power differential from unsynchronized engines would be that pronounced. Ever see RL pilots inc throttles on larger piston engine a/c (eg. DC3)? they do it slowly advancing it left/right/left/right/left/right etc...which is what I was trying to do.

There's a passage in the P-51D manual (DCS) that's really informative. You want to be a full power before reaching a certain speed. Not continually adding it. Don't slam the throttle forward but do be quick about it.

"It is recommended that 61 in.Hg and 3000 RPM be used for takeoffs and that this power setting is reached as quickly as possible after the takeoff run is started. However, advance the throttle smoothly and never jam it forward."

Key words "as quickly as possible". Bring the engines to full power quickly before you raise the tail and steer only with the rudder, not the brakes.

Edited by SharpeXB

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interest and I take your point. I guess, esp with playing online (and flying a Russian bomber online when we're normally outnumbered), there's already enough problems to worry about just trying to get to/from the target! lol

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Yep. 190 is very easy to taxi, just keep the tailwheel locked, turn with the differential brakes. Only unlock tailwheel when you need to do 90 degree turns.

That's not how it should be done though. The manual is pretty clear on that matter as it can both damage the tail wheel mechanism as well as the wheel brakes (brake pressure was to be applied in short bursts only to not damage them).

 

Hence why I reported the tailwheel being impractical when unlocked a while back (and got seriously attacked by some posters seen in this thread for it btw.), which now is more manageable on Stalingrad and actually quite fine on Moscow map.

 

Overall, and without noteworthy taildragger expirience in reality to compare to, my opinion is that the basic mechanics are okish. Theres still some issues like furusiously jumpy tailwheels and very questionable rudder authorities on some aircraft, but that's possibly being looked at in future (mind you DD120).

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I have experience with IRL taildraggers and I think that it is very quite well in the sim and have no problem taxi any aircraft. What makes it a bit more difficult is the feeling of inertia, which you have to substitute with visual ques only. You need to be taxiing slowly, use short bursts of power with mostly the engine at idle and after you initiate a turn you have to counter it before you reach your desired course as in real life. I think that BOS has the best ground model of all sims I have flown. At our local airport landing anywhere besides the prepared part of grass strip will end with injury, plane damage or both. There could be some tweaks, but only minor. 

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You've haven't tried the I-16 and MiG yet I guess. They taxi themselves.

Edited by 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann
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The P-40 is also very easy.

 

But some planes can be real nightmares, the Yak-1 with unlocked tail wheel probably being the worst single seater.

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Tornado, have you tried it since the last patch? It's been night and day to me ever since.

 

 

Taking off with the LA-5 is much easier now.

 

Landing with it though it is very difficult to keep the tail end from doing a 180 degrees

tried brakes,rudder etc it still swirls around like a carnival ride.

 

You use power on take-off to get rudder control and stability but on landing you can't

you have to power down.In the winter it is very hard to keep the LA-5 straight on

landing.

 

Maybe Russian pilots were not suppose to land they had plenty of aircraft you flew until

you were shot down or bailed out due to mechanical failure. :biggrin:

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short answer so people dont take off crazyly as they spawn and those they crash with whine on the forums

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Just look here how much rudder work does a taildragger need to keep in straight line - and see how Mr. Borsuk applies counter rudder immediately after initiating a turn in the Mig-3, this is perfectly modeled in the sim and it is difficult as it should be, also see how much does the aicraft bump:

https://youtu.be/_wTZjYGyl-4?t=1m44s

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I find if I taxi at realistic speeds (as opposed to a video game rush) the taxiing is fine.

 

correct - look online: you sometimes don´t know, wether they taxi or take off - and then they ground loop ;)

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I have experience with IRL taildraggers and I think that it is very quite well in the sim and have no problem taxi any aircraft. What makes it a bit more difficult is the feeling of inertia, which you have to substitute with visual ques only. You need to be taxiing slowly, use short bursts of power with mostly the engine at idle and after you initiate a turn you have to counter it before you reach your desired course as in real life. I think that BOS has the best ground model of all sims I have flown. At our local airport landing anywhere besides the prepared part of grass strip will end with injury, plane damage or both. There could be some tweaks, but only minor. 

 

+1

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Taking off with the LA-5 is much easier now.

 

Landing with it though it is very difficult to keep the tail end from doing a 180 degrees

tried brakes,rudder etc it still swirls around like a carnival ride.

 

You use power on take-off to get rudder control and stability but on landing you can't

you have to power down.In the winter it is very hard to keep the LA-5 straight on

landing.

 

Maybe Russian pilots were not suppose to land they had plenty of aircraft you flew until

you were shot down or bailed out due to mechanical failure. :biggrin:

I keep my Throttel at about 10-15% after touchdown which helps a lot. Not using brakes helps too. (planes decellerate fine with enough runway).

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2.  It almost seems like the CG is too far aft when taxiing.  Typically you want the main gear as close to the CG (Center of Gravity),  as possible,especially on a tail dragger so you can pitch up or down while rolling on the gear.

 

This is not true. Allthough every WW2 plane had the CG at a different point of course, they were designed to operate on short strips. Therefore the CG was so far back, that you could apply full brakes, as soon as the tail was down.

I have no idea, where you found the facts for your statement. 

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I keep my Throttel at about 10-15% after touchdown which helps a lot. Not using brakes helps too. (planes decellerate fine with enough runway).

I will try not touching the brakes on landing with the LA-5 and see what happens. :o:

 

No trouble with the other planes on landing.

Just look here how much rudder work does a taildragger need to keep in straight line - and see how Mr. Borsuk applies counter rudder immediately after initiating a turn in the Mig-3, this is perfectly modeled in the sim and it is difficult as it should be, also see how much does the aicraft bump:

https://youtu.be/_wTZjYGyl-4?t=1m44s

Ya he is slapping that rudder around to keep the plane steady even on the landing too.

 

Nice video

Edited by WTornado

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It almost feels like the old "slip on a banana peel" canned stalls in original IL2.  Best example is landing a 109, start to see a slight move to the right after rolling out so apply FULL left rudder and FULL left brake, and the plane still ground loops right at the end of the landing roll out.

 

That's not been my experience with the 109s whatsoever. :huh:  

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It's odd how we all have such differing experiences with ground handling, is it not?

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It's odd how we all have such differing experiences with ground handling, is it not?

 

Once you put the 109 down pull your stick right back, apply brakes to both wheels and a little rudder thrown in and you will never loop.

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It's odd how we all have such differing experiences with ground handling, is it not?

Considering that every player has varying levels of experience and different hardware. No. Edited by SharpeXB
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The Ground Handling is silly in this sim period.  It's overly difficult for whatever reason.  Brakes are anemic at best.  Yes I have RL experience.  You shouldn't have to lock the tail wheel in the FW to taxi.  The locked tail wheel was meant for take off.  Simple differential braking should be all that is required especially in the FW given is wide wheel base.  If you use say 20-30 percent power you can easily groundloop it multiple times even when applying brakes.  You should be able to overcome the torque and  P-Factor without any problems especially if you're at very low speeds. 

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The thing with this thread is op asks why is it so difficult to taxi and I would say its not at all(apart from the snow monster that sucks u in).

 

But some things like the over sensitivity with tail wheel unlocked are questionable.

 

 

Fwi I can taxi and take off in the 190 without tail lock but it ain't pretty

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How many people who have trouble taxiing are using actual brake pedals? Real aircraft don't use keyboards for their brakes.

For the record I actually use HOTAS buttons since the zoom view is mapped to my toe axis and is way more useful.

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I had a hard time with ground handling at first. It was very frustrating to say the least. However with some practice and some advice I became competent at taxing soon enough. I think blaming the Dev's for perceived failings in game design are a fallacy in my opinion. If I cant do something well enough in the game I try harder or accept my own personal limitations

 

Hard work and practice are necessary to get good at something. Plus when you consider that maybe some people will never be that good no matter how hard they try...

 

We all cant be Aces, some will always be fodder for the cannon.

Edited by JG27_Targ
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When it was just the snow maps in BOS, I pretty much thought I'd lose my mind from the endless ground loops and the mile-high bounces landing the Me109. But things have vastly improved for me with the Summer and Autumn maps as well as the coming of BOM. Currently, I'm trying to master the Fw190 and have found that after the initial burst of power to get it rolling, it works for me if I take the throttle back to 15% and am very liberal with the brakes. The bounces at touch down have reduced but just by a tad, except that it's kinda funny when I match the recommended landing speeds and still bounce. Perhaps that's for not settling down at the correct landing angle or flaring a bit too high off the ground than I should.

 

One thing's for sure, I'm improving by the day even though my main hardware is a battle-worn Logitech 3D Extreme Pro joystick and I rely on the twist rudder rather than pedals. I only wish it was as easy as it is in those war movies where the pilots are jabbering away on the intercom, fiddling absently around in the cockpit but still taxiing with prim and proper precision to the runway almost as though there was nothing to it. Even with my improvements I'm still feeling a little sweaty around the armpits and usually am huffing and puffing by the time I finally line up. Maybe it's the effort that makes it feel so rewarding.

 

Pirabee.

Edited by Eagle-OnePirabee

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How many people who have trouble taxiing are using actual brake pedals?

 

That would make diference for those aircraft that has diferential brakes, as you can control each brake with a very nice degree of accuracy with the pedals. It shouldnt make so much diference for those a/c's that have the brakes on the joystick, like the russian ones. With that said, rudder pedals make a very big diference while flying though. 

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It's odd how we all have such differing experiences with ground handling, is it not?

This could be caused by the different sensitivities we place on our pedals in game. I have mine at 60. Perfect for small aiming adjustments but takes getting used to when taxing. Huge rudder throws are needed to reach the outer limits with my setup.

 

You can master anything with enough practice. Is is right? Even real life pilots in this thread can't agree. Lol

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How many people who have trouble taxiing are using actual brake pedals? Real aircraft don't use keyboards for their brakes.

For the record I actually use HOTAS buttons since the zoom view is mapped to my toe axis and is way more useful.

I use the Saitek Combat Rudders with Brakes.

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<snip>

Ever see RL pilots inc throttles on larger piston engine a/c (eg. DC3)? they do it slowly advancing it left/right/left/right/left/right etc...which is what I was trying to do.

 

Interesting. I saw this in an LW Me262 training video and wondered if were a quirk of the plane that he advanced the throttles alternating quickly between left and right.

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SharpeXB, I saw your reply to me before you edited it.

 

Troll much?

 

Seriously, people talk a lot about simulation, but then when genuine issues are pointed out, the response is to attack those raising the issue, and throw simulation out the window in a rush of sycophantic fanboyism.

 

You yourself say you have no idea how the aircraft flew, but are totally willing to accept that what we currently have is correct.

 

Unbelievable.

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Seriously, people talk a lot about simulation, but then when genuine issues are pointed out, the response is to attack those raising the issue, and throw simulation out the window in a rush of sycophantic fanboyism.

 

 

There are plenty of RL pilots who have stated that the ground handling seems realistic.  So it seems unlikely that fanboyism has anything to do with the differences here. Personally, I find it much easier to taxi/takeoff in BoS than in any of the WWII DCS aircraft.  Does that make me a DCS or BoS fanboy?  Instead of spending your time complaining and insulting people who disagree with you, maybe you should just practice.

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Really? You're going to use the "learn to fly n00b" argument? Oh yes, well played BSR!

;)

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