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smink1701

64bit ... what would be the benefits for BOS?

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I see a lot of interest from the community wishing that BOS would go to 64bit.  Was wondering what the effect would be?

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64 bit and DX11 / 12 would certainly make it a lot more performant, and optimize the use of modern hardware and OS.

 

Most users are already running 64 bit Win7, 8 or 10, and have DX11/12 capable graphic cards....

 

Limitations imposed by the 32 bit model can go from the flightdynamics modeling to scenery / objects / weather / AI / # of online players at a server or # of AI elements on an SP mission, Map complexity and extension, and so on...

 

I can only see advantages, and since IL-2 is closed for 3rd parties for development of add-on aircraft and Maps, it would be just an internal task converting the code to 64 bit and linking with the proper libraries...

 

I really hope it happens somewhere along the course of evolution of this sim :-)

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You would be able to use more then 3.5gb of RAM for one.

 

This would probably solve the skin pop-in when you look at an aircraft and it has the low quality default skin, then the actual skin pops in, especially jarring when aircraft has a winter skin.

 

Also 64bit can handle more computations at once, so would also increase performance if its taken advantage of.

Edited by RoflSeal
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You would be able to use more then 3.5gb of RAM for one.

 

This would probably solve the skin pop-in when you look at an aircraft and it has the low quality default skin, then the actual skin pops in, especially jarring when aircraft has a winter skin.

 

Also 64bit can handle more computations at once, so would also increase performance.

 

 

^ this.

 

I remember asking the devs about skin pop, and the Devs said that it was due to the small amount of cache available. 64 bit would solve that, or at least make it much more tolerable.

 

I'm also looking forward to potentially have more AI and simultaneous players on the maps.

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If they upgrade engine to 64bit and dx11/12 will this change ivolve bos/bom or it will be only for the new game on upgraded engine?

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If they upgrade engine to 64bit and dx11/12 will this change ivolve bos/bom or it will be only for the new game on upgraded engine?

 

Purely speculation but the idea is that we've bought into the BoS/BoM world and from the sounds of it they are intent on adding more content and features to that world as we go along. IF, and thats a big IF, they decide to make some upgrades to the core technologies I would see them wanting to ensure that everything came along with it.

 

I gather from the very limited comments on this that an upgrade wouldn't be a wholly new engine but rather an upgrade to the current one. Anytime a game dev has talked about core technology updates that add new features or upgrades to DX11/12 and/or 64bit, its involved a massive amount of work... So make no mistake that an update like this would be something small. And it'd probably bring with it new bugs that would need to be ironed out.

 

That said... BoS has some serious limits to performance that I would hope that new technology would help smooth out.

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While you can't have one without the other (probably) I am much more interested in DX12 than anything else. If the reported increase in performance and function is even remotely true it is an impressive piece of software. I'm willing to chip in if they want to crowdsource the engine upgrade. Or I can just gift a bunch of strangers premium aircraft as usual :)


If they upgrade engine to 64bit and dx11/12 will this change ivolve bos/bom or it will be only for the new game on upgraded engine?

It would be political suicide to dump all of that work and leave thousands of customers out in the cold. I'm sure they would be ported over.

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The biggest benefit would be in texture quality and possibly smoother FPS because there would be less of a need to move things out of/into RAM. Don't build up your expectations too much, I don't think it's a game changer, performance-wise.

 

So in other words: Better looks, more stability. Better performance is hard work, compared to moving to 64 bits (it's also work, but it's conceptually not difficult).

Edited by coconut
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It is funny how we upgrade get 64 bit and all the hardware and the gaming industry does not follow.

 

Star Citizen is 64 bit.

 

Oups did I say that?

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It is funny how we upgrade get 64 bit and all the hardware and the gaming industry does not follow.

 

Star Citizen is 64 bit.

 

Oups did I say that?

 

It takes time. The chips went first but the OS and basic driver and software support took several more years... Now finally things are starting to catch up. Thing is the DN engine that this runs on was built a few years ago before 64bit/DX10 had stabilized... It's great to see movement towards updated technology, especially where there are performance gains to be found, but it does take time for all of the stars to align. 1CGS is not DICE which seem to be able to rebuild their Frostbite engine every few years (to mixed results at that).

 

Star Citizen has the advantage (and disadvantage) of building their tech on the very well developed CryEngine.

Edited by ShamrockOneFive

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Star Citizen has the advantage (and disadvantage) of building their tech on the very well developed CryEngine.

 

 

 

:cool: excuse me; I been with SC from the beginning and Farcry engine isn't even anything like it used to be; once the code monkey's at SC fixed it! yes all the fixes that SC has done since the farcry engine license to them, they have to upgrade their engine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CryEngine modified version, so I guess they dont have to force update there original engine.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Lumberyard

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunia_Engine

Edited by 71st_Mastiff

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I don't think 64bit would give us any other benefit than using more RAM, as stated above. Porting the code base to 64bit is also a huge amount of work and introduces a lot of potential for regressions. I believe the BoS/BoM/RoF engine is written in C/C++; there's a good summary of the difficulties of porting C++ code from 32 to 64bit at: http://northstar-www.dartmouth.edu/doc/ibmcxx/en_US/doc/complink/ref/rucl64mg.htm.

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I don't think 64bit would give us any other benefit than using more RAM, as stated above. Porting the code base to 64bit is also a huge amount of work and introduces a lot of potential for regressions. I believe the BoS/BoM/RoF engine is written in C/C++; there's a good summary of the difficulties of porting C++ code from 32 to 64bit at: http://northstar-www.dartmouth.edu/doc/ibmcxx/en_US/doc/complink/ref/rucl64mg.htm.

 

Laminar Research had a huge headache with it.... X-Plane was C++ 32bit, but they did it, and the many 3rp party, including freeware devs, rapidly adapted...

 

It's complex, but doable...

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Lets not forget we could have VR implementation if they  implement 64 bit and dx/11 LOL

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I'm not a techguy at all but considering how the 64bit upgrade for DCS basicly catapulted their engine from stone age to top notch performence I have high hopes for BoS/BoM. Hopefully this will finally make the gane as flurent and enjoyable as it is meant to be and allows for better graphics (grass beyond 15m, increased terrain visibility, higher texture resolution for aircrafts, ect.).

Edited by Stab/JG26_5tuka

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I'm not a techguy at all but considering how the 64bit upgrade for DCS basicly catapulted their engine from stone age to top notch performence I have high hopes for BoS/BoM.

 

Also the upgrade to DX11 played a large part in that as well.

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hoping for DX12, which will need 64bit anyway history may show it was worth skipping DX11?

 

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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64 bit and DX11 should have been from the start implemented

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Should and possible are two very different things though... ;)

 

Cheers Dakpilot

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64 bit and DX11 should have been from the start implemented

Would you have been willing to wait another year or two for porting the engine over. All this with the probability of multiple bugs in the re-write and the possibility of bankrupting the company before it even got to market? As Dak said, should and could are two different things.

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And yet you bought both titles? You are in a tough position to defend Duke.

 

The game is among the best in the genre. Some would argue the best in the genre. It can improve within the current engine and will likely take an exponential leap forward when it is upgraded. I'm not sure what the complaints are at this point in a functioning game other than the hypothetical.

 

Sure, we all want more but this is what could be brought to market in the timeframe and within budget..................and it's pretty darn good too.

Edited by [LBS]HerrMurf
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And yet you bought both titles? You are in a tough position to defend Duke.

 

The game is among the best in the genre. Some would argue the best in the genre. It can improve within the current engine and will likely take an exponential leap forward when it is upgraded. I'm not sure what the complaints are at this point in a functioning game other than the hypothetical.

 

Sure, we all want more but this is what could be brought to market in the timeframe and within budget..................and it's pretty darn good too.

He did buy both and I bought BOS.

 

What else is out there to buy anyways with WWII planes.

 

There is not much worth mentioning.

Edited by WTornado

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WT, DCS, '46. Perhaps if you only bought BOS you'd have a valid argument but to buy the second title and then disparage them both is a bit odd.

 

Doesn't change the original argument, however, that this engine and company brought to the genre an excellent game, which is continuously being updated, in a relatively short period of time, that functions for most, is nice to look at and fun to play.............on time and on budget. All this while the DEV's have voiced an interest in upgrading when the time and money is right - possibly sooner than later but that remains to be seen.

Edited by [LBS]HerrMurf

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Also 64bit can handle more computations at once, so would also increase performance if its taken advantage of.

 

What do you mean by that? 64bit app versus 32bit app or 32bit cpu vs. 64bit cpu? If the latter you're right, but 32bit cpu's have been long phased out for desktop pc's.

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Please implement all the above and Nvidia Gameworks VR SLI for my preordered Vive, thanks

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I'm not questioning if is a good sim from immersion point of view, art , etc. but only from a technical view. We invest lot of money to get hardware only to see a minimal benefit or not at all.

For ex. i spent on a GTX970 340 euros  + 20% taxes, in my country the minimum monthly wage is 240 euros so u can see it's quite an investment and i tend to get frustrated to see in some modern engines to have very good performance and in all dx9 , 32 bits softw. to lurk around 30-40 fps with spikes on medium - low settings. 

I'm holding off in getting BOM to see if we get some improvements is this department and this is the only reason i don't have it yet. 

Edited by duko
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this is my only reason I don't have it yet too

this is also my only reason I'm not upgrading my pc yet too

and probably VR compatibility will be the only reason I will be getting a rift or vive too

 

come on guys break our chains!! :))

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