Jump to content
=LG=Kathon

Tactical Air War

Recommended Posts

Cold Starts are not realistic! Any Osprey book, pictures and other sources and even real life operations show that machanincs haves the aircraft ready to go by the time the pilots shows up on the flight line. Not sure why we are still having that conversation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Carl_infar I know it's hard to not get combative or resort to ridicule to make your point.  Let's try bro!

 

Everyone has to agree that with the current format, the side that has the better ground attack aircraft will always win the campaign (...not bomber not transport and not even fighter). It has nothing to do with the better pilots either.

 

However, if the BLUE side were to change tactics and focus on putting airfield out of commission with our He 111s. We might have a fighting chance - someone else has suggested this tactic in the not so distant past. Issue there is that this requires coordination and that is lacking on the BLUE side. Certain squads have there TS channels locked for their use only - so we (BLUE) will never have a full strength to strategist such a feat. Also, the automatic prop pitch and other technological advances modeled in the German aircraft means new pilots will gravitate towards the blue side then slow stick to Russian aircraft as they get more comfortable (...just a hypotheses).

 

BLUE will always loose if something doesn't change and at this rate - why bother even playing? When RED runs out of BLUE players because no one what's to play for a team that looses all the time, what then?

 

Take a look at Coconut's Server - it's more balanced to both ground and air attack.

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@7.GShAP/Silas - LOL! That sounds about right. There are a few German fighters down below too getting mauled as well.

 

As long as there is a penalty for losing an aircraft, that behavior will not change. Which is why VEF, VOW, Brllum War, Czeh War were so good. There were no penalty for getting shot down.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shall we start with the subject of chute killing:hunter:......................just kidding:rofl:

giphy.gif

Edited by ATAG_dB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, JG7_X_Man said:

(...) Everyone has to agree that with the current format, the side that has the better ground attack aircraft will always win the campaign (...)

 

Nope.avi
If I remember correctly Machine Killers guys gave a proof that LW bombers can easily end whole 7 map campaign in very short time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, JG7_X_Man said:

@Carl_infar I know it's hard to not get combative or resort to ridicule to make your point.  Let's try bro!

 

Everyone has to agree that with the current format, the side that has the better ground attack aircraft will always win the campaign (...not bomber not transport and not even fighter). It has nothing to do with the better pilots either.

 

However, if the BLUE side were to change tactics and focus on putting airfield out of commission with our He 111s. We might have a fighting chance - someone else has suggested this tactic in the not so distant past. Issue there is that this requires coordination and that is lacking on the BLUE side. Certain squads have there TS channels locked for their use only - so we (BLUE) will never have a full strength to strategist such a feat. Also, the automatic prop pitch and other technological advances modeled in the German aircraft means new pilots will gravitate towards the blue side then slow stick to Russian aircraft as they get more comfortable (...just a hypotheses).

 

BLUE will always loose if something doesn't change and at this rate - why bother even playing? When RED runs out of BLUE players because no one what's to play for a team that looses all the time, what then?

 

Take a look at Coconut's Server - it's more balanced to both ground and air attack.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I most certainly do not have to agree that the better ground attack aircraft will carry the day. They can carry the day, certainly. But if you kill them even the best ground attack plane won't do anything. All this would take is for the 109 jocks to take on a bit of risk. I know this may sound absurd, but war is a risky prospect and the enemy won't just polity roll over and let you kill them, most of the time. If Blue wants to stop the Red ground attack menace all they need do is fly in range of them and shoot them down. An IL2 is tough, this is true, but it has it's vulnerabilities. Study these vulnerabilities and hammer on them and that plane will fold like a thing that folds real good. (I'll give you one for free: The elevator controls are prone to jamming if you shoot bullets at it.) The PE 2 is a notoriously tough nut to crack, but even I can do it and I'm a middling 109 pilot on most days; but I'm not sharing my 'secret' PE2 killing techniques. You'll have to figure that one out yourself.

 

Now, doing this is going will expose the 109 to enemy fire but that is the nature of the business. Get some friends on comms, you don't need many 1 or 2 will do, and do your best to minimize casualties among your group. This is what Red does and it seems to be working for them. It is tactics, more than equipment that is carrying the day, I think you will find. You are right though, Blue will lose if something doesn't change. But as the phrase goes, "Hate the player, hommie, not the game." You can try emulating success and maybe fail or I guess you could continue circling at 7 km and complaining about losing, that plan seems to be working for you.

 

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

 

I flew a campaign as Axis on TAW something like 4 campaigns ago, and I've flown Axis previously on Random Expert.  This is a problem that has existed ever since I started flying BOS online in early access. 

 

EDIT: There was a great comic someone(Silky maybe) drew on the forums something like three years ago with all the 109s up with the rainbows and clouds and one burning, raging stuka down around the houses with a swarm of yaks.  I wish I could find it.  Some things never change.

 

You can post all you want.

 

Время виража предельного по тяге у земли: 19.2 с, на скорости 270 км/ч по прибору

Время виража предельного по тяге у земли: 20.3 с, на скорости 270 км/ч по прибору

 

If you cannot understand that different..there is nothing to discuss.

Edited by Norz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Norz said:

 

You can post all you want.

 

Время виража предельного по тяге у земли: 19.2 с, на скорости 270 км/ч по прибору

Время виража предельного по тяге у земли: 20.3 с, на скорости 270 км/ч по прибору 

 

If you cannot understand that different..there are nothing to discuss.

 

I've forgotten my Cyrillic.  Feel free to show me I'm wrong next campaign.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

I've forgotten my Cyrillic.  Feel free to show me I'm wrong next campaign.

 

Can you clarify what you mean? Will you fly AXIS and low? R.I.P.

Edited by Norz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Norz said:

 

Can you clarify what you mean? You will fly AXIS and low? R.I.P.

 

 

If more Axis fly with the attitude in Disarray's post, Axis have no more need to fear than VVS.

Edited by 7.GShAP/Silas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Disarray said:

 

But if you kill them even the best ground attack plane won't do anything. All this would take is for the 109 jocks to take on a bit of risk. I know this may sound absurd, but war is a risky prospect and the enemy won't just polity roll over and let you kill them, most of the time. If Blue wants to stop the Red ground attack menace all they need do is fly in range of them and shoot them down. An IL2 is tough, this is true, but it has it's vulnerabilities. Study these vulnerabilities and hammer on them and that plane will fold like a thing that folds real good. (I'll give you one for free: The elevator controls are prone to jamming if you shoot bullets at it.) The PE 2 is a notoriously tough nut to crack, but even I can do it and I'm a middling 109 pilot on most days; but I'm not sharing my 'secret' PE2 killing techniques. You'll have to figure that one out yourself.

 

Now, doing this is going will expose the 109 to enemy fire but that is the nature of the business. Get some friends on comms, you don't need many 1 or 2 will do, and do your best to minimize casualties among your group. This is what Red does and it seems to be working for them. It is tactics, more than equipment that is carrying the day, I think you will find. You are right though, Blue will lose if something doesn't change. But as the phrase goes, "Hate the player, hommie, not the game." You can try emulating success and maybe fail or I guess you could continue circling at 7 km and complaining about losing, that plan seems to be working for you.

 

 

Totally wrong.

 

Stay high, kill all red fighters. The ground attackers will turn home immediately. DO NOT ATTACK any low IL2, PE2 if the red fighters are around. DO NOT attack the first plane you see. Take a short pause.... look around. These rules are simple and usually work fine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Norz said:

 

Totally wrong.

 

Stay high, kill all red fighters. The ground attackers will turn home immediately. DO NOT ATTACK any low IL2, PE2 if the red fighters are around. DO NOT attack the first plane you see. Take a short pause.... look around. These rules are simple and usually work fine.

 

 

Why would I turn home when my friendly fighters are doing their job so I can do mine?  I don't turn home until I am shot at directly, and sometimes not even then.  Flying in this cowardly way is a recipe for losing the campaign.  Luftwaffe fighters do not melt under 2K, where does this bizarre attitude come from? 

Edited by 7.GShAP/Silas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

 

Why would I turn home when my friendly fighters are doing their job so I can do mine?  I don't turn home until I am shot at directly, and sometimes not even then.  Flying in this cowardly way is a recipe for losing the campaign.  Luftwaffe fighters do not melt under 2K, where does this bizarre attitude come from? 

 

That explains how you lost your 50 planes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Norz said:

 

That explains how you lost your 50 planes.

 

 

And you explained how Axis lose every campaign.  I'd rather lose 50 planes.

Edited by 7.GShAP/Silas
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

 

And you explained how Axis lose every campaign.  I'd rather lose 50 planes.

 

EVERY?

 

Are you sure?

 

A round before was a draw. Please be not so pathetic...

Edited by Norz
  • Confused 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Norz said:

 

EVERY?

 

Are you sure?

 

 

55 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

Feel free to show me I'm wrong next campaign.

 

 

P.S. I think I was only shot down by enemy fighters something like 10 times or less during the latest campaign.  The rest was from AA and my own foolishness.

 

P.P.S. It was a draw, yes, but it tasted like defeat for the Axis team given the reactions I saw.

 

P.P.P.S.  You lost 106 planes.

Edited by 7.GShAP/Silas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

P.P.S. It was a draw, yes, but it tasted like defeat for the Axis team given the reactions I saw.

 

LOL. The axis team almost won. I played the red side and everyone who said that it was not like that just kidding.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course you can fly low as axis. You just need high cover then its all fine.  But the axis flying low would end in a massacre. It needs skill to fly the axis aircraft low since you need a lot of situational awareness and knowlege how to dogfight in them. Just turn turn turn doesnt work.
It need drag and bag tactics and some aggressive turning without being to slow after that.

"just fly low and all is fine" is utter bs. You can fly at 4k and you are able to dive. But just diving through all enemy fighters wont work. And dying as a measure to win is not how I understand the server to be played. You are out of fighters in no time

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, DerSheriff said:

Of course you can fly low as axis. You just need high cover then its all fine.  But the axis flying low would end in a massacre. It needs skill to fly the axis aircraft low since you need a lot of situational awareness and knowlege how to dogfight in them. Just turn turn turn doesnt work.
It need drag and bag tactics and some aggressive turning without being to slow after that.

"just fly low and all is fine" is utter bs. You can fly at 4k and you are able to dive. But just diving through all enemy fighters wont work. And dying as a measure to win is not how I understand the server to be played. You are out of fighters in no time

 

 

And what about the VVS fighters?  Do they not need skills to fly low?  It's not like turn turn turn is a panacea in a LaGG.  In this circumstance is it really so superior to a 109 F series?

 

I don't know what you want.  Say I'm in a 110 and I need you to protect me while I attack a convoy or defensive position.  What do you need from me for you to do that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

 

And what about the VVS fighters?  Do they not need skills to fly low?  It's not like turn turn turn is a panacea in a LaGG.  In this circumstance is it really so superior to a 109 F series?

 

I don't know what you want.  Say I'm in a 110 and I need you to protect me while I attack a convoy or defensive position.  What do you need from me for you to do that?


A focke wulf on 3k. Then I stomp your lagg in the dust, and can protect you in your 110 very effectively. With the help of others of course since there will be more than just one.

You don't have to tell me that the russian aircraft need skill, but they perform the best on the deck. So its the first logical step that you don't stay around where the enemy performs best. you ever fly fighters? For that you are flying ground attack aircraft, you have a lot of good ideas what blue fighters are doing wrong.

Edited by DerSheriff
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, DerSheriff said:


A focke wulf on 3k. Then I stomp your lagg in the dust, and can protect you in your 110 very effectively. With the help of others of course since there will be more than just one.
 

 

Ok, fair enough.  I meant what *I* need to do to enable you, but I understand.

 

3 minutes ago, DerSheriff said:

You don't have to tell me that the russian aircraft need skill, but they perform the best on the deck. So its the first logical step that you don't stay around where the enemy performs best. you ever fly fighters? For that you are flying ground attack aircraft, you have a lot of good ideas what blue fighters are doing wrong.

 

The Axis guys who are attacking ground forces don't have that luxury is the only problem.  I fly fighters sometimes, but only rarely on TAW(~10 sorties this campaign) .  I can only tell you what I see from my perspective, and it often seems like madness. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

and it often seems like madness. 


and I agree. I am often that dude below the clouds. But its not solved like you proposed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the K/D ratio has gone in to Sheriffs head.

 

109's are generally better than any VVS mounts. Regardless of altitude, they are lighter, have better power/weight and can handle higher speeds. Only in the late stage of war, does VVS bring anything that is comparable. In very rare cases LA-5 can actually surpass some aspects of axis stuff. 

But in general, when you hear someone saying  "But the axis flying low would end in a massacre", what he really means is "i might actually get killed doing my JOB and lose muh streeks".

 

German tech is superior. German pilots just want to to stay in situation where the superiority of the mounts are maximized (and in general that is ok but...), IE, high alt and avoid any risk what so ever when no plane from VVS can follow you in a shallow 750km/h dive to your airfield from low earth orbit.... 

 

(...but when you have JOB to do, protect your shit, staying at Low earth orbit just accomplishes nothing... but hey, at least you got your streak, amairight? 😄  b b but muh " Russian aircraft need skill, but they perform the best on the deck"..... yeah and German mounts STILL OUTPERFORM THEM ON THE DECK, just not by ridiculous margin you are so used to enjoy at the low earth orbit)

 

 

Edited by CptSiddy
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does seem like the Germans need a more 'mission first' attitude when it comes to their fighters. At the end of the day surviving the flight just won't get it done if you get your target killed underneath you. I also don't know where this notion of flying at 5-6 km or tree top are the only options. Flying at high speed at 2.5-3 km still leaves the German planes in a great position to attack Soviet bombers, attackers, and fighters. Conditions may dictate that effective cover of a target means flying under the cloud level. So be it. The case seems to be take the risk, get stuck into the fight and stand a chance of winning or stay out of harm's way a bitch on the forums that Blue never wins.

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

u guys talking over the FM of the Panes(i see here a Problem too) but this is still a Dev. Problem and this is the wrong Forum for that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/25/2018 at 4:19 PM, Ala13_Antiguo said:

Hi ... Shvak ... with your theory, with the attack planes, ... what about the medals that were given to the dead in action? Without people flying on the ground and without bombers, that boring would be the TAW ...

 

if you do not risk it, nothing is achieved   👍

 

Trying to survive is my premise   👍 but sooner or later I run into someone who knocks me down (I usually fly bombers and I usually loose at a level of 5000 m more

regards    :drinks:

Yeah. you have point

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, CptSiddy said:

I think the K/D ratio has gone in to Sheriffs head.

 

109's are generally better than any VVS mounts. Regardless of altitude, they are lighter, have better power/weight and can handle higher speeds. Only in the late stage of war, does VVS bring anything that is comparable. In very rare cases LA-5 can actually surpass some aspects of axis stuff. 

But in general, when you hear someone saying  "But the axis flying low would end in a massacre", what he really means is "i might actually get killed doing my JOB and lose muh streeks".

 

German tech is superior. German pilots just want to to stay in situation where the superiority of the mounts are maximized (and in general that is ok but...), IE, high alt and avoid any risk what so ever when no plane from VVS can follow you in a shallow 750km/h dive to your airfield from low earth orbit.... 

 

(...but when you have JOB to do, protect your shit, staying at Low earth orbit just accomplishes nothing... but hey, at least you got your streak, amairight? 😄  b b but muh " Russian aircraft need skill, but they perform the best on the deck"..... yeah and German mounts STILL OUTPERFORM THEM ON THE DECK, just not by ridiculous margin you are so used to enjoy at the low earth orbit)

 

 


Yes, sure k/D got to my head. Sure. Maybe think about the fact that the red groundattackers aren't even winning the map for the reds very often? Often its just lost planes/pilots. You as a team better start thinking about minimizing losses/getting more kills.

And pilots actually want to survive their sorties in a simulator. Oh how unrealistic is that. 

edit:
"German mounts STILL OUTPERFORM THEM ON THE DECK" 
Actually no. The Yak 1b, the La-5 are both faster than Bf 109s on the deck. Yes 109s are better. But not on the deck. 
Nobody talks orbit. But a little bit of alt is needed.

Edited by DerSheriff
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DerSheriff said:

 

edit:
"German mounts STILL OUTPERFORM THEM ON THE DECK" 
Actually no. The Yak 1b, the La-5 are both faster than Bf 109s on the deck. Yes 109s are better. But not on the deck. 
 Nobody talks orbit. But a little bit of alt is needed.

 

La-5 with all models, yes, yak-1b only if the 109 uses auto rads. But even then i wont say that reds have superiority sub 1000m, more like parity.  109 can still out sustain slow turns and are plenty nimble with 2-3 minutes worth of rocket time power. 109 can pull off some sick slow speed stunts on pure hate and raw engine power.... i know, i have spent considerable amount of time on 109's six. And if you miss your first pass in most VVS planes from the first 3 maps, there wont be second chance. It gets easier once VVS gets La's and Spits and 1b's. But even then, only La-5FN can be said to really outperform Luftwaffe's hardware, at least in the same sense that 109 totally outperforms VVS stuff at height.

Now that spit 9 is out, things start to get interesting.   

 

 

>pilot want to survive

 

Yes, and high command want to get things done, and will insist that pilots will go where there are things in need to get done. 

I bet many pilots would rather stay in comfy barracks instead of sortie, too. Should you just enjoy hot cocoa and spectate from the field? 

Edited by CptSiddy
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I fly both sides and its a lot harder for axis fighters to fly low, first it requires a good wingman and crazy situational awarness. Second axis fighters are a lot more fragile, so getting bounced is not ideal. And I am in no way saying its easy for red fighters, but it is simpler and it is where your plane performs best in comparison to ennemy fighters. Also red planes are though and can take severe punishement and make it back. Its factors like these that make people fly at higher altitude as germans, and since more germans fly high, the ones still flying low are getting wrecked. Its not that hard to analyse.

VVS favorite at low alts -> Germans fly higher to use their advantage better and not lose planes -> the LW still flying low gets demolished -> they fly higher -> most russians on deck and most germans at high alts -> TAW objectives requires you to get low -> VVS victory. Its a simple observation and yes there are more factors but I beleive this is an important one. It requires a bit more skill to fly deck as a blue fighter.

  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, CptSiddy said:

I think the K/D ratio has gone in to Sheriffs head.

 

109's are generally better than any VVS mounts. Regardless of altitude, they are lighter, have better power/weight and can handle higher speeds. Only in the late stage of war, does VVS bring anything that is comparable. In very rare cases LA-5 can actually surpass some aspects of axis stuff. 

But in general, when you hear someone saying  "But the axis flying low would end in a massacre", what he really means is "i might actually get killed doing my JOB and lose muh streeks".

 

German tech is superior. German pilots just want to to stay in situation where the superiority of the mounts are maximized (and in general that is ok but...), IE, high alt and avoid any risk what so ever when no plane from VVS can follow you in a shallow 750km/h dive to your airfield from low earth orbit.... 

 

(...but when you have JOB to do, protect your shit, staying at Low earth orbit just accomplishes nothing... but hey, at least you got your streak, amairight? 😄  b b but muh " Russian aircraft need skill, but they perform the best on the deck"..... yeah and German mounts STILL OUTPERFORM THEM ON THE DECK, just not by ridiculous margin you are so used to enjoy at the low earth orbit)

 

 

 

LOL Siddy.


Cannot wait to see your performance on the axis side on the low altitude.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎5‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 5:20 PM, JG7_X_Man said:

@Carl_infar I know it's hard to not get combative or resort to ridicule to make your point.  Let's try bro!

 

Everyone has to agree that with the current format, the side that has the better ground attack aircraft will always win the campaign (...not bomber not transport and not even fighter). It has nothing to do with the better pilots either.

 

However, if the BLUE side were to change tactics and focus on putting airfield out of commission with our He 111s. We might have a fighting chance - someone else has suggested this tactic in the not so distant past. Issue there is that this requires coordination and that is lacking on the BLUE side. Certain squads have there TS channels locked for their use only - so we (BLUE) will never have a full strength to strategist such a feat. Also, the automatic prop pitch and other technological advances modeled in the German aircraft means new pilots will gravitate towards the blue side then slow stick to Russian aircraft as they get more comfortable (...just a hypotheses).

 

BLUE will always loose if something doesn't change and at this rate - why bother even playing? When RED runs out of BLUE players because no one what's to play for a team that looses all the time, what then?

 

Take a look at Coconut's Server - it's more balanced to both ground and air attack.

 

 

 

 

 

I'll try it.

 

Anyway I think I'm getting old and don't understand the new generation ( cause i hope theses are not grown man who are consntantly making excuses), cause I was tought to find  ways to solve problems instead of making excuses.

 

So reading constant excuses, whining etc  always makes me lough and then its hard to resist not to do some "mocking", which main point is to make people to do some thinking and action instead of hiding behind the wall of excuses. 

 

As for blue side,  I played the whole previous campaign (not the one which just ended) as a german bomber and attacker plane pilot (also played previous Random expert exclusivly as blue fighter) and found it much easier to inflict damage with blue bombers (than red ones) even when very rarely I received cover by blue fighters. That campaign ended in a draw but could be easly won, if only there would be little more cover and more blue players could be persuaded to attack airfields. (generally more coordination, which somehow on red side is each time happening)

 

As for durability of red planes. I'm not entirely convinced. On random expert thers exact info which your shells (cannon mg etc) hit and I needed 2 to max 5 cannon rounds each time to down red fighter.

 

Also I have same view as Siddy above regarding the german fighters performance.

 

And the last thing that comes to my mind, playing as red fighter (except meybe la5FN) once you commit to a fight you have no chance of escape, but as a german fighter You always have at least slight speed or climb rate advantage so You have at least a chance to run...

 

 

 

Edited by Carl_infar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, minus the insults, Siddy was right imo. I flew LW this campaign and VVS before, and it was my observation as well. 

 

P. S. You can fly 109 at 3k and still outclimb anyone you see. 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

P. S. You can fly 109 at 3k and still outclimb anyone you see. 

 

Was it not like that last 15 years? 

 

P.S:  Everyone who said that the AXIS side played wrong last 2 rounds are totally wrong. They played efficient enough.

But the last round there were less AXIS players at EU prime time as usual. 

 

Again, if you play AXIS

 

1. stay high enough, kill fighters. If it is not enough for you, find some level bombers and cover them at 6..7k. 

2. Do not attack Pe2 if it is already without bombs at 0 m.

3. do not fly Hs129. If you want to kill 2..3..4 tanks... just try to use 109 with 4x50 or 110 with 2 x500.

4. do not fly Ju87 (check #3)

5. do not use a diving attack on the airfields with 109, 110, 190, 87. Use level bombers for that.

6. Buy Ju52 for TAW.

 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Norz said:

 

Was it not like that last 15 years? 

 

P.S:  Everyone who said that the AXIS side played wrong last 2 rounds are totally wrong. They played efficient enough.

But the last round there were less AXIS players at EU prime time as usual. 

 

Again, if you play AXIS

 

1. stay high enough, kill fighters. If it is not enough for you, find some level bombers and cover them at 6..7k. 

2. Do not attack Pe2 if it is already without bombs at 0 m.

3. do not fly Hs129. If you want to kill 2..3..4 tanks... just try to use 109 with 4x50 or 110 with 2 x500.

4. do not fly Ju87 (check #3)

5. do not use a diving attack on the airfields with 109, 110, 190, 87. Use level bombers for that.

6. Buy Ju52 for TAW.

 

 

Yup numbers were pretty uneven. To be competitive, the LW need 60 (axis - all flying at 7k) x 20 (vvs) so please let's all switch to the blue side .... Maybe if we all do that together we can have a campaign with 84x0. That would at least give the LW a chance.

 

Don't get me wrong Norz, I do agree with all the points you listed above and they are the main reason LW keeps losing not the numbers. VVS has shown the LW many times in previous campaigns that one can be effective with lower numbers if they employ the tactics and strong points better and do it so coordinated. The LW in TAW always makes the same mistakes. No one clears the flaks form the tanks with high level bombing first and people go straight to the tanks with 110s and Stukas flying low. It is just dumb ... if you know the strongest factor we have in favor of the LW is the level bombers out them in use and level bomb targets ... use them high where the VVS fighters suck. We all know that but no one does it ... 

Edited by SCG_Riksen
  • Haha 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, SCG_Riksen said:

 

Yup numbers were pretty uneven. To be competitive, the LW need 60 (axis - all flying at 7k) x 20 (vvs) so please let's all switch to the blue side ....

 

Don't worry. We will switch this new round :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually agree with Dersheriff in as much as the K/D ratio should matter,

The people who moan the most about DiD seem to be the players who throw their virtual pilots lives away without care..

Of the top 50 pilots with the most deaths 31 were LW.

I think more emphasis  needs to be placed on staying alive,

and if that means the LW need to have a serious rethink of their strategy, then that's what they need to do.

As has been pointed out the LW lost most maps through plane and pilot attrition. (again!)

 

And to back up the theory are stats:

The top scoring fighter pilots was killed 0 times for 68 kills!

And top bomber pilot was killed (only) 8 times for an incredible 1013 ground kills.

Even the top tank killer was only killed once.

If you died 40+ times your'e doing something wrong irrespective of what you flew or for which side.....

Now staying alive may not help your side to win (with TAW in its current form) but really it should have a greater impact.

After all dead pilots shouldn't win the campaign, people need to fly more sav'vy, and be rewarded for doing so.

 

All in all, i enjoyed this TAW, but i always do! 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So it is Memorial Day in the United States. . . My uncle (and namesake) was a B-26 Marauder pilot killed during a night mission over France by a radar-guided 88 mm Flak at about 10,000 feet (3K or so meters).  Hit the pilot compartment; pilot, copilot and navigator/bombardier all killed instantly but the gunners all bailed out with light shrapnel wounds.  The point of this bearing in mind that "balance" is ultimately an arcade game thing:  Would it be historically accurate to beef up AAA/Flak around German targets to make things a bit more challenging for the Sturmoviks and particularly the Peshkas?  I honestly don't know whether it would be "accurate" and have no strong opinion as to how important that is.  Other ideas:

  1. Make only a few incremental changes.  From experience working in information technology (and watching the arcade games "balance"), the more changes you make and the more drastic the changes the more unpredictable the result.
  2. Weight "air kills" by type of plane.  Don't know whether the on-line manual is still accurate (lot to do for volunteer map developers), but it says +50 for an air kill.  Make it +100 (or something) for an attack plane (single-engine plus Duck, maybe), +150 for a bomber.  "Assists" could be beefed up similarly.  (Bravo to the developers for scoring "assists".)  This might encourage fighter pilots to protect targets.  
  3. Much more difficult for developers - score events that do not result in kills.  Example if an enemy fighter forces me off the target, or to ditch my bombs, he has won the engagement even if he does not shoot me down.  If I have the scoring correctly, the enemy fighter pilot has benefited his/her team prevented target damage) but has not scored personal points.  (Seems like this would be, at best, extremely difficult to implement for a map/campaign developer.)

There are historical precedents - the Allied Fighter-Bombers over France did not kill that many German tanks.  But they made the tankers keep their heads down and move at night, etc.  Again, this is very difficult to actually score, both in real life and in a simulator-like game such as this one.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/27/2018 at 11:46 AM, SCG_Riksen said:

The LW in TAW always makes the same mistakes. No one clears the flaks form the tanks with high level bombing first and people go straight to the tanks with 110s and Stukas flying low. It is just dumb ... if you know the strongest factor we have in favor of the LW is the level bombers out them in use and level bomb targets ... use them high where the VVS fighters suck. We all know that but no one does it ... 

 

 

I look forward to seeing you just fly bombers at 5k day after day after day, etc etc. 😁 Even in the best case scenario where LW focuses solely on bombing AFs from high altitude, in the end it is still a race between knocking those out and VVS doing the same to tank columns/defensive positions. For one, a mission could last ~40 minutes. The other, 15 minutes. Pretty simple math who the winner would be. 

I have to agree with @DerSheriff on how this server needs to be flown (if anything to preserve one's sanity as a LW player). Just accept you will lose most if not all maps. And just fly TAW to stay alive. 

 

  • Thanks 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's almost as if the Germans lost the war for some reason?

 

Joking aside, the only thing that I would like to see is a reduction in the effectiveness of flak on TAW. I honestly never enjoy going near any flak because, too many times I've lost a good streak to the AAA on both side. BOTH sides have AAA that is too strong in my opinion. I would prefer more ground targets that need to be hit.

 

Additionally, the inclusion of some wearhouse type target further back from the front would be a nice change of target that might also help 5he LW some. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...