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Tactical Air War

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Posted (edited)

just drop a certain topic in here, and people start tearing each other apart about it. discussions on teh interwebs..  it's just ridiculous :lol:
"TECHNOCHAT!!" looks like we found ourselves a worthy successor to all those legendary topics like chute killing, peshka snipers or overpowered AA. keep it going guys, it just never gets boring.

Edited by [I./JG62]Knipser

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I rather fly TAW without technochat and getting chutekilled than flying on goddamn WOL.

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Would be nice if the devs made a “limited” technochat option. There’s a few planes that don’t have indicators for where things are set.

 

Next TAW campaign, is there plans to go back to warmed up starts? Cold starts only seemed to keep bombers on the ground longer, fighters could still pretty much take right off. Is there really need to make bombing more tedious on TAW?

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22 minutes ago, HenHawk said:

 

 

Next TAW campaign, is there plans to go back to warmed up starts? Cold starts only seemed to keep bombers on the ground longer, fighters could still pretty much take right off. Is there really need to make bombing more tedious on TAW?

Operationally I don't really have a problem with waiting, but the spawn issue was pretty bad a few times for me last campaign.  I was unable to spawn due to sitting planes, to the point I had to scrap a mission and take off from another location.  

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I liked the cold starts. I don't know if it was related but I didn't see many if any people neglecting to taxi to runway. For me that in itself was very good to see.

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Posted (edited)

The cold start are wrong i am sorry to say. Cold start proceedure and different then the normal engine start procedure IRL. Because of the way the autostart is in BoX we can’t manually start, prime, crank, delay the mixture, ETC. let alone the fake power up to quick heat that people where simply doing.  I am in the rank of the guys that if you do something do it right, you want to have it closer then the real thing. ALL front line fighters where kept warmed buy the crew chef. The cold engine really kill the immersion and it is bugged.

Edited by ATAG_dB
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44 minutes ago, =FEW=Herne said:

I liked the cold starts. I don't know if it was related but I didn't see many if any people neglecting to taxi to runway. For me that in itself was very good to see.

 

Could just start enforcing the rule that says you’re supposed to use runways/taxiways properly.

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Reply to a slightly older post, sorry:

 

On 21.3.2018 at 1:48 PM, 56RAF_Roblex said:

 

What we certainly don't need in a 'realistic' server is things like 'Adjust your Mixture' & 'Slow down to 200kts and lower your flaps' :-)           On a related note,  I noticed that with the P-39 there is a very definite audible change in engine note when you  change from Continuous Mode to Combat Mode.  I cannot say I have noticed that on any other aircraft.

 

 

That's not Technochat, that's a separate Help thing that can be toggled independently.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann said:

 

 

And what you whant to tell us with this?

I dont need to look all the time on the instruments as in the video it is about 20% +- 5% maby less and still can fly all fu... planes i have without techchat.

Of course the plane you fly most, you can take into battle. And that can do allother pilots that can fly without techchat. Looks more like you cant do it and want to avoid it. Or you dont have the time to learn it or the will to do it. Also the argument dont have the hardware i don take, as i and many others also start in the beginning with smal hardware for flying. But this is also the difference between a simmer and a germer. Normlay the simmer has everything he need to fly a flightsim as realistic as possible and for this you need Throttle, stick, pedals, Track IR, etc. Of course is a expensive hardware better than a cheap one, but still even with a cheap hardware you dont need techchat. Also fo the sence you are missing because you dont feel how many time you sturn a weel ( trim ) in the plane. For this you can count the second or the clicks you need to get the right settings. Again a simmer will find a way, a gamer use techchat. If you dont have the time to do this, because of real life is it absolutly ok, but than maby is a full real server or a server that trys to make it as realistic as possible not the playground for you or others. Sorry when it sounds hard, but this thrue, this starts with 1946, over CoD to BoX, as flightsimming is a time-consuming hobby.

 

Our old standart in JG2 was or better to say it still is if you cant spend up to 8 hours or more in a week with the flight sim you cant learn all you need to fly and fight in full real.

 

Regards

 

Little_D

 

Edited by 1./JG2_Little_D

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On 3/21/2018 at 4:37 PM, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

If you removed technochat, even less people would fly the VVS.

 

Those people who don't want nor use the technochat and like to use the instruments - those can do that already. For example: I am flying without HUD, I am using solely the cockpit instruments, even when flying VVS (I am one of the few West-Germans who can read kyrillic).

 

 

Nah, man, its is easy to fly VVS planes without techno when u get used to watch your temps. 

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Posted (edited)

On TC subject, since some over here believe that removing then is the real thing.

 

Ask yourself this

How did a Spitfire pilot knew how much is radiator where open? 

How about on the P40?

Bf109?

 

Pilots and I kinda know what I am talking about, we're also using their ears, our butt or fingers. We ear sound, vibration and feel. 1 crank up, one pull knee height, 1 finger length from the bottom ETC. 

Do you think a pilot with someone on it's 6 was really putting it's head down to know if he closed it's cowl flap enough?

 

You want to remove the TC, it's ok. It's different but PLEASE spare me with the it's how it was IRL

 

This is only a game

 

 

Edited by ATAG_dB
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Just now, ATAG_dB said:

On TC subject, since some over here believe that removing then is the real thing.

 

Ask yourself this

How did a Spitfire pilot knew how much is radiator where open? 

How about on the P40?

Bf109?

 

Pilots and I kinda know what I am talking about, we're also using their ears, our butt or fingers. We ear sound, vibration and feel. 1 crank up, one pull knee height, 1 finger length from the bottom ETC. 

Do you think a pilot with someone on it's 6 was really putting it's head down to know if he closed it's cowl flap enough?

 

You want to remove the TC, it's ok. It's different but PLEASE spare me with the it's how it was IRL

 

This is only a game

 

 

 

"This is only a game"

 

Is this the same guy that was complaining about cold starts and how things are IRL?

Come on dB, you can't have it both ways when it suits you!

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, Haza said:

 

"This is only a game"

 

Is this the same guy that was complaining about cold starts and how things are IRL?

Come on dB, you can't have it both ways when it suits you!

I get what dB is saying. And I get his point about a sim (without a fully built RL sim pit) failing to provide the tactile elements of RW situations. Any argument that calls for removing TC does fail to take this into consideration when taking the "in real life" stance. Just as it fails to take in the ability of the eye to flick quickly to a point of focus (say a temp gauge) without moving your whole damn head and adding zoom. 

 

TC isn't perfect and is, to a large degree it is a safety blanket in the manner in which it offers overheating warnings and mode info but removing it in order to make things more realistic in some situations actually makes it more difficult than in RL. The problem isn't with TC (or rather positional data about flaps, shutters and throttle)as a whole but its inflexible data presentation in that you get no help or too much or it. 

 

Edited by BOO

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Posted (edited)
Just now, BOO said:

I get what dB is saying. And I get his point about a sim (without a fully built RL sim pit) failing to provide the tactile elements of RW situations. Any argument that calls for removing TC does fail to take this into consideration when taking the "in real life" stance. Just as it fails to take in the ability of the eye to flick quickly to a point of focus (say a temp gauge) without moving your whole damn head and adding zoom. 

 

TC isn't perfect and is, to a large degree it is a safety blanket in the manner in which it offers overheating warnings and mode info but removing it in order to make things more realistic in some situations actually makes it more difficult than in RL. The problem isn't with TC (or rather positional data about flaps, shutters and throttle)as a whole but its inflexible data presentation in that you get no help or too much or it. 

 

 

I was teasing!

However, it appeared to work without TC in CLoD!

Hey, at least there is no Bit**** Betty, YET!!!

Edited by Haza

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27 minutes ago, Haza said:

 

I was teasing!

However, it appeared to work without TC in CLoD!

Hey, at least there is no Bit**** Betty, YET!!!

I was more agreeing dBs post than virtually squaring up to you mate ;) (you're an Aussie - squaring up to aussies is something I know better than to do!!)

 

The Clod window for engine settings I think is very good. Flexible, not to intrusive and offering the right level of information that still means a player has to do some thinking for themselves. 

 

S!

 

BOO

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

 

 

Nah, man, its is easy to fly VVS planes without techno when u get used to watch your temps. 

For me, yes. For you, yes. For others as well, I am sure of that. My goal is to get more people to play VVS, so we all have a better time.

 

I am referring to a lot of people I have tried to talk into flying VVS during the last TAW campaign.

 

Probably 4 in 5 said: "There's too much hassle involved in controlling VVS planes, I don't want to have to learn 4 new planes to get flying with them, I cannot read Rawsian! I may try next campaign."

 

Hence, if you further lower accessibility of the VVS' aircrafts, you'll probably get less VVS players. Unless you further soft-balance the setups by locking up some of Luftwaffe's equipment options, and giving Russian players more +1 spawns of good aircrafts each mission.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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41 minutes ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

For me, yes. For you, yes. For others as well, I am sure of that. My goal is to get more people to play VVS, so we all have a better time.

 

I am referring to a lot of people I have tried to talk into flying VVS during the last TAW campaign.

 

Probably 4 in 5 said: "There's too much hassle involved in controlling VVS planes, I don't want to have to learn 4 new planes to get flying with them, I cannot read Rawsian! I may try next campaign."

 

Hence, if you further lower accessibility of the VVS' aircrafts, you'll probably get less VVS players. Unless you further soft-balance the setups by locking up some of Luftwaffe's equipment options, and giving Russian players more +1 spawns of good aircrafts each mission.

 

This. But I do also wonder if too much is made of the management of RPM, Mixture and Manifold Pressure too. It sounds daunting to a new player especially after the relative comfort of a  190 or 109F/G but it actually isn't so hard in most VVS aircraft.. Coming from Clod I was used to the "complex" EM but reading around the forum when I first started I was put off by how complicated it was made to sound in this game. It isn't and much of the fine theoretical (or even hypothetical) detail on settings is not relevant to the average transient situation in game played by the average player.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Haza said:

 

"This is only a game"

 

Is this the same guy that was complaining about cold starts and how things are IRL?

Come on dB, you can't have it both ways when it suits you!

You missed the point Hazza. I am all for the improvements that make it close to reality. Less so for those that are doing the opposite. The cold engine start is bugged and wrong, why should we simulate something like that? Surely not because that is the way they did it, right?

   

Edited by ATAG_dB

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, ATAG_dB said:

On TC subject, since some over here believe that removing then is the real thing.

 

Ask yourself this

How did a Spitfire pilot knew how much is radiator where open? 

How about on the P40?

Bf109?

 

I would say as he used his hand to move the cooler lever and knows the possition for each setup he need and remamber it. take off, climb, combat climb, fight, emergancy and landing.

Same would be for flaps, oilcooler, rpm, mix, etc.. This for all planes the same, you have standart settings for different situations of flight. No need at all to look all the time into the cockpit to know what settings you are at only for qick checks when there is time for. Or do you think in the battle of fight when it is like loose sighn losse fight they where looking on there insrtuments all the time or even in the fight?

 

Yes i have no fu.. sense of my hand in this sim, only hardware or good hardware and buttons/tastatur. But i still can know my settings and what i have to do to come do a different setting. As i do it and many others since 2009  or even longer and it works in Cliffs of Dover and even in DCS with P-5, it will easely work in BoX. How?

 

1. I know how many klicks it takes to come from a cloes water/oil cooler to an open one.

2. Also i know how many sec. it takes to come from flaps in position to combat flaps, to start pflaps, etc.

3. This works fo all systems you need to control in even more complex vvs fighters or other planes.

4. Sound (rpm settings you can heare also in all planes ) windnoise, etc.. As in real life

5. View as in real life ( you look around to estimate your position in the 3d room + g-force we dont have ) and look at the instuments to check all systems and this is mutch easyer

    than in real life, as in this game in wideview i dont even need to move my had to see all system settings or other information like speed, temps, etc. when i

    have a enemy in my sighn. ( So fly as long as possible in wideview and only for ID or fire zoom in as youn need it )

6. for the missing g-fores i combinate  point 4 and 5. and the position of my stick ( zero position to max. ) and at witch point i am in the moment.

    this all is enough information to fly the planes.

 

Of course you need to know the klicks you need or the seconds, also you should know if you have to move or push the button up or down and you need the settings you had before you

changed your settings. Also you need to know the you stick position in different speeds and fligh manovers and what it does with the plane. And mutch more, you need Experience

for this.

 

So with this klicks or seconds you simulate youre sense of your hand, as you remamber as the pilot in real life the position you set before changing them, you need only to

count the klicks or seconds to get into a different setting. So the real life pilot has his hand sense i have my klick/second cound sense. Works perfectly.

 

The whole thing brings a little more stress into play and the likelihood and that is the most important thing for me the human error factor in such a stressful situation as a dogfight comes to it. (Misjudgment, incorrect operation, etc.). As it was then. And that is missing completely with technical aids. Since 1946, they all want more and more complex flight simulations, but if they get them then they would be flying with support wheels on a server trying to simulate ww2, lol.

 

And agin for all i fly also both sides with no techchat, but i would never say that i could go with vvs planes into a battle like on TAW or an other server thats whant to be "full real" as this would be to mutch time i need to invest to flly tham in a fight. So this is way some people only fly one side online and the other side ofline only to know at least what this plane can do with a bad pilot in it and how it flys in th eall over view.

 

I have the utmost respect for the people flying the aircraft with more work for the pilot online on a "full real" server

 

As little info  "full real" server in 1946 with no techchat where 24/7 full with 60 - 80 people. from europen 18:00 to 03:00 in the morning. And there where more than one server like this. I would bet that even when TAW lost in the beginning with a "full real" server some pilots, there are other that will come in because off this as it is the next stepp and gives a complet different world to mp flying as you not only have the different between the pilots with flyingtime ( because no knowleg is needed to fly a plane with techchat to his limits ), no also there is the difference between the opreationg pilots. Who can better opperate there planes under stress and has less fear to make some settings wrong and kill his own plane.

 

Hope this makes sense as it is hard for me to finde the right words in english and sorry for the long post.

 

regards

 

Little_D

 

Edited by 1./JG2_Little_D
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It's not "Full Real", it's "Hardcore", the two are different. You basically want a more Gamey Server that Suits your "Elite" Needs. Also: Unlike you most here have active Lives besides Il-2 and can't spend 8 hours on learning how many Seconds are what and how many Clicks do What. 

 

And as someone who flies somewhat competitively in Real Life and 2Gs at a time, not a single Word you said is True. Pilots in WWII weren't Autistic OCD Patients for the most Part, and neither am I, so no, that Counting/Clicking doesn't work for me and wouldn't for anyone in his right mind, at least not at Realistic Levels. 

 

And we don't want more Complex, but more Realistic Sims, we aren't Gamers, we are Simmers.

 

We also don't have the Possibility to modify our Cockpits, as is usual for most Pilots if Markers aren't Factory Items.

 

In any Case, a Pilot going to War would have flown his own Type before Battle and Mapped the Controls in his Muscle Memory. A purely Visualied Technochat without Numbers, Percentages or Warnings is the Closest Thing to Reality

Or in other Words, look at RoF Technochat in "Full Real" and that is what is the Closest to Real as you will get. 

 

Il-2 does Oversimplify it's Technochat a little, but removing it fully is just Unrealistic. 

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The way you talk to people is wildly insulting - grow up.

 

If you really can't handle the removal of technochat (which at this point is just an idea), clearly this server isn't the right fit for you.

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Posted (edited)

Klaus is right. When you release the winch you pull the jack 2 times to make sure, flaps you push/pull a lever, airbrake is another jack - you pull or push those with your muscle memory after a short while. If you check you just put the hand above it, and feel where it is without looking.

 

That feedback is missing when you have buttons instead of half a dozen levers! You can't feel a button or a lever ingame. Except for throttle, only a few people have more levers, most even don't have RPM levers! Some map RPM+Throttle on one for that reason! And most don't have analogue cranks they could feel instead of buttons. We got Technochat for that.

 

Klaus' reasoning is perfectly right.

 

If you Tuesday feels that he came a cross a dick, well, welcome to German culture. We dont talkwalk around the bush. He's just being straightforward. Ignore that, and better concentrate on the facts, not feelings.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
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Posted (edited)

Calling people "Autistic OCD Patients" is not being "straightforward," it's being a dick.

 

Trying to put himself on a pedestal because he flies a plane and everyone else is just a "gamer" is being a dick.

 

That's not German culture, that's being a jackass.

 

Edit: so faux-German culture is fine, but US/Canadian is not?  Well, can't fight with stupid.

Edited by 19//Tuesday
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Posted (edited)

It doesn't matter. Stop being offended, stop ignoring his points, and please leave that US/Canadian SJW culture out of this community.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, 19//Tuesday said:

Calling people "Autistic OCD Patients" is not being "straightforward," it's being a dick.

 

Trying to put himself on a pedestal because he flies a plane and everyone else is just a "gamer" is being a dick.

 

That's not German culture, that's being a jackass.

 

Edit: so faux-German culture is fine, but US/Canadian is not?  Well, can't fight with stupid.

I didn't call anybody anything. I just pointed out that Autism and OCD would disqualify someone from becoming a Pilot for the Luftwaffe or VVS. Nowadays it's possible for People with Autism to fly, and they are exceptional at Operating their Machines, yet they must always be accompanied by a Safety Pilot. 

 

And I was simply pointing out that I, and most normal Pilots don't think like Autists, as they have a completely different Method of Approaching the Problem of Flight, based on that kind of Counting and Clicking. 

I, when I'm flying visualize Problems 3D, I think and turn them differently, I Function more "Monkey-ish" while Autists go about stuff like Calculators. We are all Monkeys, with Monkey Brains and we are Monkey Flyers with all the accompanying Problems. And for Monkey like me the Technochat is the closest to Realtitty.

Edited by 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann
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@1./JG2_Little_D I tried your suggestion about counting the neccesary clicks and even timing the secs you need to hold down the key... it isn't possible in a practical way. Because of the way the control input works in BoX if you use single clicks they not always count, and sometimes they give more or less input, about the time from 0% to 45% it advances so fast I couldn't even measure the time it took reliably... already the error in pulling out the finger from the key was too big to make a possible measurement (sometimes at 40- sometimes at 60, I couldn't nail it at 45).

 

The only way I can see it possible is if with a cockpit texture mod you could "paint" markings in these controls so you know the important positions, the two examples with Yak-7's neutral radiator and mixture control:

l2sPVDQ.png

 

z6ro6Iy.png

 

I am in favor of removing the engine status messages, like combat/emergency and overheating, but I don't agree with removing the inputs.

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On 3/24/2018 at 10:40 AM, 1./JG2_Little_D said:
1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann said:

I just love being Lectured by Gamers on what Real Flying feels like. 

Klaus, you've piqued my interest.  When you say fly competitively, what do you mean?  I've always wanted to take my certificate further and either race or do aerobatics.

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, =BES=Coyote-66 said:

Klaus, you've piqued my interest.  When you say fly competitively, what do you mean?  I've always wanted to take my certificate further and either race or do aerobatics.

Just not too much. I partake in Local  Gliding Competitions, don't have the Hours or Money for Aerobatics License yet. Normally DG-500-18 elan, I like having a Second Pair of Eyes and the Company of Pilots with more Competition Experience than me. I'm still quite Fresh. 

 

Euregiocup is up soon, and that means 50 Planes up at the same time in the same Thermal. It's extremely stressy. 

Edited by 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann

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Posted (edited)

The problem with techno chat, as it is now, is that it displays warnings about engine states that did not exist at the time. 

 

There were no buzzers that started to buzz when the needle on temps went to the red. 

 

However, technochat is somewhat needed to display the leaver positions, because you have no physical feeling for them and the markings on them are poorly displayed. 

The information that is available on the readouts on measurement instruments vs the positions of leavers and stuff like that. This is the issue here. 

Too much technochat makes instrumentation panel redundant. Too little makes the plane operation too hard. 

 

I doubt that anyone in here disagree with this position. However, if you do, i would want to hear why. 

 

 

1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann said:

Just not too much. I partake in Local  Gliding Competitions, don't have the Hours or Money for Aerobatics License yet. Normally DG-500-18 elan, I like having a Second Pair of Eyes and the Company of Pilots with more Competition Experience than me. I'm still quite Fresh. 

 

Euregiocup is up soon, and that means 50 Planes up at the same time in the same Thermal. It's extremely stressy. 

 

 

As a fellow man who flown gliders, do you feel that the wing in ground effect in BoX is little off when landing? 

I always felt that the flaring part on most planes makes them drop too fast, and thus having too much velocity on touchdown. 

Edited by Cpt_Siddy

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Not sure. Not sure how much of a Difference it would make with most Aircraft, except the 52 maybe. 

 

If you try the 202, it feels extremely floaty, others like the 111 never seem to be able to do that Ground Effect Take-Off I love the DC-4 for. I honestly don't really know and every time I try I come to a different conclusion. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann said:

It's not "Full Real", it's "Hardcore", the two are different. You basically want a more Gamey Server that Suits your "Elite" Needs. Also: Unlike you most here have active Lives besides Il-2 and can't spend 8 hours on learning how many Seconds are what and how many Clicks do What. 

 

And as someone who flies somewhat competitively in Real Life and 2Gs at a time, not a single Word you said is True. Pilots in WWII weren't Autistic OCD Patients for the most Part, and neither am I, so no, that Counting/Clicking doesn't work for me and wouldn't for anyone in his right mind, at least not at Realistic Levels. 

 

And we don't want more Complex, but more Realistic Sims, we aren't Gamers, we are Simmers.

 

We also don't have the Possibility to modify our Cockpits, as is usual for most Pilots if Markers aren't Factory Items.

 

In any Case, a Pilot going to War would have flown his own Type before Battle and Mapped the Controls in his Muscle Memory. A purely Visualied Technochat without Numbers, Percentages or Warnings is the Closest Thing to Reality

Or in other Words, look at RoF Technochat in "Full Real" and that is what is the Closest to Real as you will get. 

 

Il-2 does Oversimplify it's Technochat a little, but removing it fully is just Unrealistic. 

 

This is what I as a "sim pilot" with only a few hours in a real Cessna Skyhawk and 172 have been saying all along! The harder developers make an aircraft to start/taxi/takeoff/fly/fight and land doesn't make it more real. It just make the sim harder to fly - that's all!

 

I hear these people ask for complex start procedures - OMG! Why would someone want to spend 30 mins to get an aircraft in the air? This is a simulator, true - but a game none the less!

 

 

Edited by JG7_X_Man
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19 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann said:

Not sure. Not sure how much of a Difference it would make with most Aircraft, except the 52 maybe. 

 

If you try the 202, it feels extremely floaty, others like the 111 never seem to be able to do that Ground Effect Take-Off I love the DC-4 for. I honestly don't really know and every time I try I come to a different conclusion. 

 

 

 

Thats my conclusion too. most, but not all, of the planes lack the floatiness when near the ground. Even with flaps at full, it feels like only the half of what it should be. 

 

Generally it is not issue but.. when landing on unprepared fields, you want to do the soft, glide landing and avoid powered landing because unprepared strips are really rough on your air frame. Perhaps we are just spoiled by the hyper light composites available now. The 3000kg air frame might feel different.

7 minutes ago, JG7_X_Man said:

 

 

I hear these people ask for complex start procedures - OMG! Why would someone want to spend 30 mins to get an aircraft in the air? This is a simulator, true - but a game none the less!

 

 

 

 

WW2 aircraft, from hangar to air, involves 99% of ground crew work and 1% of pilot anyways. Even more so in the winter. 

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Posted (edited)
On 23/03/2018 at 12:58 PM, wellenbrecher said:

That's not Technochat, that's a separate Help thing that can be toggled independently.

 

 

Where please? I was flying without having all those advices (like slow down to... don't run on combat power during nav, etc etc), and one day, without changing anything, those annoying messages started to appear. 

It's possible to desactivate that, while keeping % power, pitch, mixture, flaps, etc?

 

 

EDIT: I've found it...

Edited by F/JG300_Faucon

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On 23.03.2018 at 7:00 PM, =CAF=xThrottle_Geek said:

Is there a timeframe for an update for next campaign to include 3.001?

It's really hard to say. New issue with durability of the buildings has been revealed lately so we have to devote some time to this problem: 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

If the simple goal of leaving technochat in is to have more VVS players - why not just lock down majority of the LW configurations and nerf their planesets? It already happened with the aircraft too - because VVS outright declined to fly against "superior" F4 when they didn't have anything to show for it (one of the older TAW campaigns).

 

And all the people claiming that we get our own "technochat" by the "feels" - well setup yourself a joystick and you can see the axis. You can use headtracking to get a quick glance at the temp gauges as well.

 

If people argue that the lack of hardware should be compensated for by technochat - why no allow mouseflying for those who do not have the joystick then?

 

 

Edit: On the topic of cold starts - I have noticed some people spending time to sit on the ramp waiting for their engine to warm up only to boost off in the air straight from the ramp. I quickly discovered that you did not need to wait for pe2 engines to get warm to be able to take off from the ramp either - its fairly easy and engines get warm very quickly running at 100%. On the exceptionally rare occasions when the engine stalls due to cold start you just get a ditched aircraft that is back in 2 missions, no big deal.

Edited by JaffaCake

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The Cold Starts are a bit stupid for a Couple of Reasons. 

First of all, the Game's Thermodynamics on the Ground Suck, they simply don't warm up as they should, too slow and almost impossible to Overheat on the Ground.

 

The JuMo and DB Engines had 1 to 5 Minutes Maximum before Shutoff or Take-Off, no matter the Temperature. 1 Minute in Summer, 3 in Spring and Autumn, 5 in Winter.

 

That's mostly it.

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