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Battle of Berlin

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I'm willing to wager folding money that we will not be getting any 1945 scenario as the next instalment. :salute:

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Not a chance. And certainly not a Berlin you can fly over if Moscow is any indication.

Smart money is on the Crimea with the Pacific as an outside favourite.

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Bob is a theater that is one sided! Not the Best for a team v team game

 

Side thought lets get a theater that was pretty much equal!!!!

 

I'm thinking 1942 Europe

Edited by [TBC]AeroACE

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Pacific ?!?! LMAO

 

Pacific would be smarter than another Yaks vs. 109s release.  More of the same...same maps, different cities, marginal new content for a AAA sim Title.  I think customers would LTAO more if they were presented with marginally improved and different aircraft and some new maps.

 

Not smart.

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Pacific would be smarter than another Yaks vs. 109s release.  More of the same...same maps, different cities, marginal new content for a AAA sim Title.  I think customers would LTAO more if they were presented with marginally improved and different aircraft and some new maps.

 

Not smart.

 

 

You never miss a chance to grind your axe and lobby for your agenda, do you?

 

Smart money is on the Crimea

 

 

This is most likely the correct answer.  Regardless of what you wish.

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No more this thing of "city battles, Battle of Caucasus for the next.  :)

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You never miss a chance to grind your axe and lobby for your agenda, do you?

 

 

 

This is most likely the correct answer.  Regardless of what you wish.

 

 

If only you could truly understand my agenda, you'd probably agree with me.  But by the bolded post above clearly you don't.  I may be wrong, but if you find fault with anything I say about the future of this franchise, that would put you firmly in the category of Eastern Front-Only's that selfishly want more Yaks and 109s, MORE versions of the SAME aircraft we already have, before we see anything new or fresh for the engine.  And you likely would hold to this mentality regardless of how closed minded it is.  And before you retort with some remark that I am anti East Front, consider this.  I love this game, and the Eastern Front and all it offers is absolutely fascinating to me.  I have over $500 of books, games, and references for the War in the East and the Battle of Stalingrad.  I am about as cosmopolitan as a customer comes to this community.

 

See this post to get another perspective of my agenda...specifically my reply to Bivalov.

 

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/20108-what-planes-should-be-added-after-bom/page-2

 

Really what it comes down to is my "agenda" as you call it is simply to see this sim to succeed and for it to make lots of money for the Devs, so we can see a lot more from them.  Do you disagree with that too?

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If only you could truly understand my agenda, you'd probably agree with me. But by the bolded post above clearly you don't. I may be wrong, but if you find fault with anything I say about the future of this franchise, that would put you firmly in the category of Eastern Front-Only's that selfishly want more Yaks and 109s, MORE versions of the SAME aircraft we already have, before we see anything new or fresh for the engine. And you likely would hold to this mentality regardless of how closed minded it is. And before you retort with some remark that I am anti East Front, consider this. I love this game, and the Eastern Front and all it offers is absolutely fascinating to me. I have over $500 of books, games, and references for the War in the East and the Battle of Stalingrad. I am about as cosmopolitan as a customer comes to this community.

 

See this post to get another perspective of my agenda...specifically my reply to Bivalov.

 

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/20108-what-planes-should-be-added-after-bom/page-2

 

Really what it comes down to is my "agenda" as you call it is simply to see this sim to succeed and for it to make lots of money for the Devs, so we can see a lot more from them. Do you disagree with that too?

Haters gonna hate man...haters gonna hate.

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Pacific Eastern Front IMO is bland but I c why Americans Russians would like it

 

 

Funny, if anyone wrote that here, there would be outrage. 

 

(For the record, I enjoy the Eastern Front  :) )

 

 

Pacific IMO is bland but I c see why Americans people other than me would like it

 

 

There, I fixed that for you.

 

If you're wondering why my political-correctness skillz are so strong, it's because it's been so strongly reinforced in this country for decades  ;)

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Haters gonna hate man...haters gonna hate.

 

 

yeah, no kidding.  You suggest anything that doesn't fall in line with the Eastern Front-Only mentality and you have an "Agenda" and "an axe to grind..."

 

So much for openness and freedom of speech and ideas...

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Let's be civil, gentlemans. 

The reason I say Battle of Berlin is because, what planes will we be missing after BoM? Just the later ones. Maybe I'm wishing out loud : )

Now, logically, the Mediterranean would be next if anything. Since we already have the Macchi. And, come on, I'm a big fan of the Macchi, but its addition is COMPLETELY random lol (just like the P40). However, where would the P40 and Macchi have seen each other in combat, and make it an easy transition for the devs to open up the Med. theatre?

Nothing is accidental, my friends : )

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Let's be civil, gentlemans. 

 

The reason I say Battle of Berlin is because, what planes will we be missing after BoM? Just the later ones. Maybe I'm wishing out loud : )

 

Now, logically, the Mediterranean would be next if anything. Since we already have the Macchi. And, come on, I'm a big fan of the Macchi, but its addition is COMPLETELY random lol (just like the P40). However, where would the P40 and Macchi have seen each other in combat, and make it an easy transition for the devs to open up the Med. theatre?

 

Nothing is accidental, my friends : )

 

 

Not to mention the desert skins we've had since BOS :)

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Doubt it.

 

Unless you limit the teams so there are like 3 262's available, and germans can only queue for half the number of allies.

+1 And that won't happen.

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Let's be civil, gentlemans. 

 

The reason I say Battle of Berlin is because, what planes will we be missing after BoM? Just the later ones. Maybe I'm wishing out loud : )

 

Now, logically, the Mediterranean would be next if anything. Since we already have the Macchi. And, come on, I'm a big fan of the Macchi, but its addition is COMPLETELY random lol (just like the P40). However, where would the P40 and Macchi have seen each other in combat, and make it an easy transition for the devs to open up the Med. theatre?

 

Nothing is accidental, my friends : )

 

 

I think the biggest detractor to any future Battle of Berlin is that there really wasn't one.  By the time the Allies (any of them) were flying and fighting over Berlin the Luftwaffe had for all intents and purposes ceased to exist as a cohesive fighting force.  Not very fun from a gameplay / game balance standpoint.  That is not to say that the idea of flying the Me-262, Ta-152, La-7, or some such thing wouldn't be great, it would be.  But you have to build a package that sells as a single unit as well as fits into the mold of previous installments such as BoS and BoM.

 

As far as what is left after BoM and BoS?  Plenty.  On the Eastern Front alone, there are many variants of the planes we already have, as well as entirely new ones we need to fill out the BoS / BoM titles.  here's a short list

 

Bf-109G-4/G-6/G-10/G-14/K-4

FW-190A-4/A-5/A-6/A-8/D-9

Yak-7b//1M/9/9D/9U/ & Yak-3

La-5F/FN

Ju-87G

He-111 H11

Ju88G

Hs-123

Hs-129

Fw-189

Bf-110F/G

Me-210/410

Il-2M

I-15/152/153

Hurricane

Spit V

B-25

DB-7

IL-4

DB-3

P-400/ P-39Q/P-63

MBR-2

Su-2/ Su-4

 

Just to name a few...These should all come before the Me-262, Ta-152, La-7 etc...

Edited by TheElf
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Pacific IMO is bland but I c why Americans would like it

It is bland (to some extent). We had it in IL2:1946. I think what makes everyone so angry about mentioning the Pacific is just the amount of coverage it gets in games both now and in the past. It's kind of like when another Call of Duty game comes out, everyone goes, "Holy cow, more lasers? Can't someone just make a Red Orchestra?"

 

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It is bland (to some extent). We had it in IL2:1946. I think what makes everyone so angry about mentioning the Pacific is just the amount of coverage it gets in games both now and in the past. It's kind of like when another Call of Duty game comes out, everyone goes, "Holy cow, more lasers? Can't someone just make a Red Orchestra?"

 

 

 

Sorry this is wholly untrue.  The Pacific has had exactly the same coverage as the Eastern Front in terms of AAA Combat flight sims.  The overdone Sim de Jour has always been Western Europe, P-51, B-17, Bf-109G-6 ad nauseum...blah, blah, blah.  Talk about bland!

 

 The only treatment of the Pacific theater of any import in the last 15 years was IL-2 Pacific fighters.  Its been just as long for Pacific fans as it has for Eastern Front fans.  And take it from someone who cares about all theaters, there isn't ANYTHING on the market right now that does any of these theaters any justice as a combat sim, or could, except IL-2 Sturmovik...

 

I do however agree with your CoD / Red Orchestra sentiment!   :good:  :good:  :good:

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I would love to see a pacific theater, but that's mostly because I'm an American who's about to graduate as an ESL teacher who knows Japanese.  :P

 

I would love to see some Zeros and N1Ks fighting P-38s, P 40s, Hellcats, etc. in this engine.  :)

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Spain ?

 

I don't know if it would make sense....

 

Britain / Channel ?

 

But, what I would really really be happy to have would be a "Reno Air Races" or "Red Bull" scenario to fly, even with the fighters we have, in Civil colors, or, even better, with modern aerobatic aircraft to play with...

Edited by JCOMM

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I think the biggest detractor to any future Battle of Berlin is that there really wasn't one.  By the time the Allies (any of them) were flying and fighting over Berlin the Luftwaffe had for all intents and purposes ceased to exist as a cohesive fighting force.  Not very fun from a gameplay / game balance standpoint.  That is not to say that the idea of flying the Me-262, Ta-152, La-7, or some such thing wouldn't be great, it would be.  But you have to build a package that sells as a single unit as well as fits into the mold of previous installments such as BoS and BoM.

 

As far as what is left after BoM and BoS?  Plenty.  On the Eastern Front alone, there are many variants of the planes we already have, as well as entirely new ones we need to fill out the BoS / BoM titles.  here's a short list

 

Bf-109G-4/G-6/G-10/G-14/K-4

FW-190A-4/A-5/A-6/A-8/D-9

Yak-7b//1M/9/9D/9U/ & Yak-3

La-5F/FN

Ju-87G

He-111 H11

Ju88G

Hs-123

Hs-129

Fw-189

Bf-110F/G

Me-210/410

Il-2M

I-15/152/153

Hurricane

Spit V

B-25

DB-7

IL-4

DB-3

P-400/ P-39Q/P-63

MBR-2

Su-2/ Su-4

 

Just to name a few...These should all come before the Me-262, Ta-152, La-7 etc...

 

 

Actually, there was a 'Battle of Berlin'.  It took place over a 5 month period in late '43 and early '44.  It was waged between RAF Bomber Command, on one side, and the Luftwaffe's night fighter force and the civilian and military defenses of the City on the other. During the course of the battle, the RAF lost about a 1000 bombers shot down and about 7000 aircrew killed.  Another 1000 or so bombers were badly damaged.  Tens of thousands of Berliners were either killed or made homeless. 

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Let's go do Battle of Britain with a hypothetical operation Sea Lion campaign so we can kill CoD and move the community forward lol.... I bought that PoS but could never play it - so I'd welcome the opportunity to buy a working re-release!

Aside from that, I'd be really happy to fly some commercial and sport aircraft in a pre-war/post-war Europe - no other civil aviation sim has the flight dynamics BoS offers along with the graphical and cost/performance fidelity. Bu-181, Me-209, Fi-97/99, Tigermoth, Hughes-H1, FW-200 Condor, DC-3... along with other airliners and 'Blitz' mail-planes...

Spanish Civil War anyone?

Edited by Lippisch

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Medmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmedmed

 

;)

 

+10000000000, etc, etc. :salute:

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Actually, there was a 'Battle of Berlin'.  It took place over a 5 month period in late '43 and early '44.  It was waged between RAF Bomber Command, on one side, and the Luftwaffe's night fighter force and the civilian and military defenses of the City on the other. During the course of the battle, the RAF lost about a 1000 bombers shot down and about 7000 aircrew killed.  Another 1000 or so bombers were badly damaged.  Tens of thousands of Berliners were either killed or made homeless. 

 

 

The Battle of Berlin that the OP was suggesting never occurred.  Bomber Commands assault on Germany was referred to as the Battle of Berlin, but they are not the same thing and the night fighter campaign would be difficult to sell.

Edited by TheElf

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My suggestion where Italy 1943 to introduce US planes increase the player count, think they don't wish to fly UDSSR planes all the day long.

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Med is a bad idea.... Dev would have to sell twice the same AC (almost all the German line which is already here... )....

 

Worst marketing idea ever, even if the battle itself looks awesome, .... And I like very much this theater!

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The Battle of Berlin that the OP was suggesting never occurred.  Bomber Commands assault on Germany was referred to as the Battle of Berlin, but they are not the same thing and the night fighter campaign would be difficult to sell

 

Okay, this is 'nit picky' I know but just in case there are young people around it should be noted that "Bomber Command's assault on Germany" wasn't  referred to as the 'Battle of Berlin".  The title: 'Battle of Berlin' refers to the specific Bomber Command campaign that was mounted against the German Capital from Nov '43 to March '44.  .  Hamberg was another example of a 'Battle City' that came in for special attention from Bomber Command.  The RAF launched numerous other raids on Berlin during the war but the 'Battle of Berlin' refers to a specific air campaign comprising 16 particularly heavy raids launched between Nov. '43 and March '44.  These raids were intended to bring the City to its knees or "to wreak Berlin from end-to-end".  The City wasn't brought to it's knees but it was comprehensively wreaked.

Edited by Wulf
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I know everyone has their favorite aircraft and it's fun to speculate but battles like Berlin and Western Front 44-45 would not be a good idea and I don't think they would be very fun either. I'm not saying they aren't interesting, I just don't think they would work well. Personally I'm hoping we get Kursk next before departing the eastern front and moving on to North Africa/Med or the Pacific. It's important to focus on the pivotal battles where one air force didn't completely dominate the other.

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I know everyone has their favorite aircraft and it's fun to speculate

 

To be honest, I've been at this long enough now that another map and another bunch of planes really isn't going to move anything forward for me.  It's just the same old gameplay with slightly different pieces.

What I most want is the experience of being there.  A game that works hard to capture the mood of the times gives you a real sense of being a part of those events.  The Battle of France, with an emphasis on the chaos, the paranoia, disorganisation, apathy and wasted heroism.  The Battle of Britain with the uncertainty, overwhelming odds, hectic squadron life and international cast.  The uncompromising pressure from Command during the Battle of Stalingrad, or the hopeless shambles in defence of the Far East.  I want to feel something of what it was to be young and at war and embedded in those times.  Surely I can't be alone in this?

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You're not alone, Feathered, not alone :) To be honest this is why I am excited about Battle of Moscow - it was by all means a struggle to survive, where a massive state was pushed to its last line of defence, its last free-standing major city in the west since Leningrad was surrounded while Kiev and Minsk had fallen. To be a Soviet pilot there and then meant having to fight to the last bullet where every failure brings the enemy's bullets closer to not you but your family and friends, if they were not dead already. Scary stuff, and the prospect caused a sense of panic so wide in the city it took Zhukov and Beria to calm down the animosities and mobilise Moscow.

 

It's about how each person sees the game, of course. To me the experience is closely tied in with historical re-enactment, and more often than not a good campaign or SP mission can take you much further than many multiplayer experiences even though the AI has its shortcomings (speaking of which, I'm still using that 2000-and-something Soviet female pilot pack you did for 1946, the voices and particularly the radio static file are a total game changer there :))

 

On a side-note, doesn't it make more sense to just create a thread called "Future expansions discussion" and keep everything there instead of having someone create a new discussion on the same subject every other day? A new person comes in, drops their idea and then the next 20 who posted on the previous thread come and write the same thing they did last time (I've done it myself :biggrin: ). Is there a need for it?

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To be honest, I've been at this long enough now that another map and another bunch of planes really isn't going to move anything forward for me.  It's just the same old gameplay with slightly different pieces.

What I most want is the experience of being there.  A game that works hard to capture the mood of the times gives you a real sense of being a part of those events.  The Battle of France, with an emphasis on the chaos, the paranoia, disorganisation, apathy and wasted heroism.  The Battle of Britain with the uncertainty, overwhelming odds, hectic squadron life and international cast.  The uncompromising pressure from Command during the Battle of Stalingrad, or the hopeless shambles in defence of the Far East.  I want to feel something of what it was to be young and at war and embedded in those times.  Surely I can't be alone in this?

+ open canopy animation + land deformation for craters +

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Is it possible to go a week without one of these threads?

 

They are like mines or booby traps... before you know it you have stepped into one and you become a casualty!

 

Reading the usual shrapnel that always follows the blast, all I can do is cry for help and implore for an evacuation to warmer climes to convalesce... someone told me the nurses are prettier in North Africa.

 

 

In short... the developers need to be brave, be bold, take a risk and move away from the eastern front. They can always return to it for yet more vodka and snow!

Let's go to Libya, or Tunisia... or even the Battle of France in 1940. Just something totally different.

 

There you see... I'm a casualty now, delirious, the pain is getting to me... must... have..............

 

C'mon you dev's...  help me... please!

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To be honest, I've been at this long enough now that another map and another bunch of planes really isn't going to move anything forward for me.  It's just the same old gameplay with slightly different pieces.

What I most want is the experience of being there.  A game that works hard to capture the mood of the times gives you a real sense of being a part of those events.  The Battle of France, with an emphasis on the chaos, the paranoia, disorganisation, apathy and wasted heroism.  The Battle of Britain with the uncertainty, overwhelming odds, hectic squadron life and international cast.  The uncompromising pressure from Command during the Battle of Stalingrad, or the hopeless shambles in defence of the Far East.  I want to feel something of what it was to be young and at war and embedded in those times.  Surely I can't be alone in this?

 

How could you possibly ever get "the experience of being there", or anything like it for that matter? It's simply not possible.  And why would you want to anyway?

 

Maybe, just maybe, if before you next fire up the 'puter, you don't eat for a few days, are informed by your doctor that you're terminally ill and won't see out the rest of the year, before also being told that your best friend had just died in a car crash.   Then yeah, that might be a start.

 

It's like those people (who, as it happens, have never been shot at in their lives) who play the game and then announce that they'd likely do far better at the air fighting business than the guys who were actually there, because they have so much more experience .   Sheesh, talk about being divorced from reality.

Edited by Wulf

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Med is a bad idea.... Dev would have to sell twice the same AC (almost all the German line which is already here... )....

 

Worst marketing idea ever, even if the battle itself looks awesome, .... And I like very much this theater!

 

Eh?  Why would the devs have to sell aircraft twice?  One of the advantages of a med scenario is that the correct LW aircraft already mostly exist.  They'd need to create the map and the appropriate allied aircraft.

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How could you possibly ever get "the experience of being there", or anything like it for that matter? It's simply not possible.  And why would you want to anyway?

 

Maybe, just maybe, if before you next fire up the 'puter, you don't eat for a few days, are informed by your doctor that you're terminally ill and won't see out the rest of the year, before also being told that your best friend had just died in a car crash.   Then yeah, that might be a start.

 

It's like those people (who, as it happens, have never been shot at in their lives) who play the game and then announce that they'd likely do far better at the air fighting business than the guys who were actually there, because they have so much more experience .   Sheesh, talk about being divorced from reality.

I think he's talking about the evolution of simulation. It's called dreaming Wulf. 

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