Jump to content
Jubles

IL2 Sturmovik: Battle of Guadacanal/Midway

Recommended Posts

I know some of you don't like Pacific Theater of Operations. But I think we should consider it, the starting planes can be F4F Wildcats and A6M2-21 Zeroes. Starting bases can be Land and or Carrier. Also, carrier operations are more sketchy but bring more excitement to the battlefield. I proposed a mission: Americans start on the USS Saratoga, Japanese start on the islands and have to destroy the carrier and supporting battleships or it could be strictly a main battle group of 3 carriers, SBDs, TBFs, and F4Fs. For me, the Pacific Theater is important to me because my father was in the Navy, and so were my great grandparents which were pilots. The Pacific Theater may be just water and sand with palm trees, but has the best memorable legacy of the war in 1942-1945 

 

Also-- Add in D3A1 "Val", B5N "Kate", and also the A6M2 "Zero" 

 

post-20290-0-60474500-1430944300_thumb.jpg

post-20290-0-12504600-1430944435_thumb.png

post-20290-0-05098300-1430944459_thumb.jpg

  • Upvote 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sure a pacific map and pacific planes would look great, but whenever that pacific map loaded up in Il2 1946, it cleared the server faster than yelling cops at a underage drinking party.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 "it cleared the server faster than yelling cops at a underage drinking party" That was a sensible chuckle but it made me frown because it's true, the pacific theater is so undermined, yes I know carrier landings are difficult, and dangerous, but I loved them, Hellcat anyone? 


What's with the disdain of the Pacific Theater? People just don't like water?  :lol:  :wacko:  :(

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would love to see it too. If it will ever happen though. 

 

Brings back good memories from Battlehawks 1942 on the Amiga back in 1988.  :cool:

 

Landing on a carrier is something. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Picture this: Your plane is rattled with bullet holes strewn in your tail section and fuselage, you have to return to base, but surprise surprise, you have to lower your landing gear and flaps, and oh crap, you forgot to pull down your tailhook because you're a naval aviator! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would love PTO.  I know from a post long, long ago that the PTO lurks in the back of Jason's mind.  This however doesn't mean we will see it though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lets try with a smaller pond first :

 

Mediterranean or Channel ;)

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love PTO. Of course during 1947 times most servers were western front and also eastern front mostly and when a pacific map turned up they left because they came in for ETO. However the zeke vs wildcat server was always full and it was one of my favorite servers.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the idea, and find the PTO very interesting. A Midway map would a piece of cake.

 

Casual online gamers would not enjoy the long transit times from Rabaul to Henderson or even Buin to/from Henderson. Trying to get online gamers to wait and assemble an attacking force is like trying to herd cats (except for established virtual squadrons one night a weekend). So you would at least compromise on the scale of the Solomons, otherwise the map would be HUGE! 

 

Adding naval targets would be interesting (if you make the IJN fight during daylight hours rather than retreating out of range from Henderson's bombers), otherwise bombing targets will be airfields (like it is now) and ports. 

 

Make it SP...I'm all in. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pacific is more than neat, and my personal preference above anything else. However your choice as obvious is not really best. Guadalcanal is extremely hardcore option, in fact I dont believe anyone would have cojones to play it in pure realistic way as there is more than 1000 kilometers from the Rabaul to Henderson Field - that means (and thats what those who survived campaign said) about 3 hours of flight to the target, 30+ minutes of combat and another 3 hours of flight back. It's also a huge navigational problem. 

 

Midway as cool as sounds is very ... limited. I mean you cant play more scenarios than that, you're excluded mostly from land units and after all navigation over ocean is super hard.

 

And last point - this choice excludes Japanese Army which has quite a few fans here and there. 

 

I proposed and from time to time advertise the option of New Guinea :

oTpOiE.jpg

 

That is open scenario for more or less two periods, the most interesting would be March 1942 till September 1943. Area gives a greater variety of participants, as includes RAAF, RNZAF, KNIL (they had some pilots in the area) and Japanese Army.

 

Between Lae and Port Moresby there is "only" 300 kilometers which is about  the length of new BoM map, so its completely flyable. And the closest Japanese base is actually Buna, from which there is only 150 kilometers to Port Moresby and roughly 220 to Goodenough Island (which was a base of RAAF Spitfires since mid 1943).

 

It's also area full of action (Kokoda trail campaign, Milne bay landing or even aircraft carrier action, as US Navy on March 1942 carried an attack against Lea using their carrier based aircraft - F4F-3, TBD and SBD).

 

The fun aircraft set I considered was something like :

A6M2 - P-39 D
A6M3 - Spitfire Vc/trop

D4Y1- A-24 Banshee

G4M1 - B-26

And premiums would be even greater :

Ki-61 - P-38 F or G

 

 

So yeah, Pacific any time. I would buy it not two but three times just because I like it. And New Guinea is technically easiest to scenario to give a huge variety and diversity, as you got almost everything there. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Man, Id love to be back in the Pacific … I think if we do see it like many have said it will be way down the road … but most of us have been very supportive and patient overall since 2001.

 

Speaking of supportive, why reply "What's with the disdain of the Pacific Theater? People just don't like water?   :lol:   :wacko:   :("? The replies prior and after had and have been positive. 

 

Wait, missed one "I know some of you don't like Pacific Theater of Operations".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I forgot to say i loved PTO from original IL2, especially carrier operations  ;) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My first real flight sim was 1942: The Pacific Air War. I loved it and still play it sometimes. Reading the manuals was just as interesting as flying for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't do New Guinea without the Ki 43 or the P 40.

 

It's also good to remember that New Guinea was mostly an Army show, both for the Imperial Japanese and the Allies.

The majority of experienced Japanese Army pilots that were lost during the war were lost in New Guinea.

 

It was a brutal campaign for both sides, because not only did they have to contend with one another, they had a common "enemy", New Guinea itself.

Bad weather, terrain that made bailing or a forced landing a virtual death sentence, and disease, not to mention the abysmal conditions of many of the airfields.

Interestingly, the Japanese Army had fewer non combat losses than the Allies did.  From the reading I have done it seems that the IJN's more lightly wing loaded aircraft were easier to get in and out of

typically poor airfields with than the heavier, faster Allied aircraft.

 

It also saw the combat introduction of Japan's first "modern" fighter, the Ki 61, always one of my favorites.

 

Bring it and I will buy it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't do New Guinea without the Ki 43 or the P 40.

Ki-43 can also be cool, and P-40 E-1 ... there is one coming in BoM, right ? :)

 

 

 

It's also good to remember that New Guinea was mostly an Army show, both for the Imperial Japanese and the Allies.

Not exactly, initially it was a main operation area for Japanese Navy. Starting from March 1942 and until December 1942 it was only and exclusively area of Japanese Navy Air Service - its NG where Saburo Sakai, Jun'ichi Sasai or Hiroyoshi Nishizawa got their greatest achievements.  But later due to commitment in Solomon Islands they couldn't keep up the numbers to fight both Guadalcanal and New Guinea. So on November an Army–navy central agreement on operations in the South Pacific Area was signed, and the 6th Air Division was committed to the New Guinea front. In accordance with the agreement, 60 Nakajima Type 1 “Oscar” fighters of the 11th Sentai reached Rabaul via Truk on 18 December, and almost immediately became involved in air defense operations.

Edited by =LD=Hiromachi

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 'The best memorable legacy of the War in those years 42-45'

 

Of all memorable legacies of the War in those years it's definitely the best one. All that water. All that death. How could that be bettered?

 

Sorry for the sarcasm BC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Perfect suggestion Hiromachi.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This topic seems to come up about once a quarter. It’s not a problem but I also think it is mostly talked out. As stated, Jason has been quoted fairly often as having a special place in his heart for the PTO. And the aircraft set for PTO could be a bit more varied than those listed in the OP. Similarly, however, someone always comes along and says the PTO kills server populations.

 

I remember either SOF or SOV server had a couple of really beautiful New Guinea maps. Also, I think, AAA had a really fun Pearl Harbor map. I enjoyed both fairly often. And one must not forget one of the best and often VERY populated Zekes vs Wildcats. Really awesome carrier ops. Midway and Wake would be OK if the carriers were moved closer than is historically correct. Guadalcanal is a tough nut anyway you look at it. If the focus is sufficiently narrowed you could do a December 41 - September 43 and do several diverse small and medium sized maps with a really interesting plane set and lots of room for DLC planes later.

 

The Pacific can be handled if done right. The aircraft are excellent subjects, the scenery – when not overflying vast expanses of ocean – is beautiful and would showcase the water effects quite nicely. The water background would be similar to the snow as a background for dogfighting as well. I anticipate BOM’s greenery with a bit of trepidation as it’s gonna be a PITA to spot and or track a fast mover down there.

 

Realistically, I would be stunned if we aren’t going to the Med next. The aircraft set there and the scenery will be quite varied. But, I’d pay double secret EA funding to get to the PTO after that. 

Edited by HerrMurf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Butch_O_Hare_1.jpg

 

Come on men, you don't want to be a Butch O'Hare? Also I would love a MTO, also adding on to the New Guinea, yeah that'll be interesting, I know it's cliche but what about a Pearl Harbor map or would that not work? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rabaul would be perfectly achievable and accessible if the later period of its encirclement was depicted, rather than the ultra long distance Guadalcanal campaign.

 

I made this mod for il-2 a while back. Transit time from the allied base at Green Island to Simpson Harbor is only 15-20 minutes on a 1:1 scale map.

 

http://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,39938.0.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the same as the Midway map, you'd have to move the carrier force closer than is historically accurate to keep it fun. The ALT history opportunities at Pearl are endless. What if the carriers were in port? What if they were in the vicinity and available to counter the second wave or attack the Japanese? And there are more islands than Oahu. What if the Japanese decided to mount an invasion after the proposed third wave? Yes, Pearl Harbor is do-able but probably not as a stand alone release.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Battle of the Philippines (44-45). Navy, army, marines, ships, landings, tanks.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tricky bit with Midway is the campaign lasted eight or nine days tops. Having to re-fight it over and over again for years would get old fast.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Come on men, you don't want to be a Butch O'Hare? Also I would love a MTO, also adding on to the New Guinea, yeah that'll be interesting, I know it's cliche but what about a Pearl Harbor map or would that not work? 

I want Jun'ichi Sasai :

Ens_Junichi_Sasai_May1941.jpg

 

or Shogo Takeuchi :

Takeuchi3.jpg

 

 

 

Rabaul would be perfectly achievable and accessible if the later period of its encirclement was depicted, rather than the ultra long distance Guadalcanal campaign.

Yeah, but that is 1944 when practically front moved to the Mariana islands. But still, I tried that Rabaul 1944. It was so so so cool map.

 

 

Tricky bit with Midway is the campaign lasted eight or nine days tops. Having to re-fight it over and over again for years would get old fast.

Exactly, problem with scenarios like Midway or Pearl Harbor is that they are extremely limited in area and possible combinations of aircraft. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cannot wait to see some action on the Pacific theater: the aircraft are so nice and landscapes so different! If modelled as well as what we have in BOS i cannot wait see the ocean and the weather (storm in the pacific)!

 

And there's this little light thing called Ki43!! :blush:

 

+1 for PTO :salute:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

whilst I enjoyed Pacific fighters very much PTO has already been done. I think what is rather interesting though is the next plane set in BoM, because several of those aircraft were in the Mediterranean theatre. I would love to see a Med map created maybe by Zeus with some P40's BF 110's 109's Ju 88's and of course MC.202's.  Hopefully Hurries will be added to this sim at some point in the future  then we can really have a Med mix up.      

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The PTO? Sure...

 

As soon as the devs are done with Moscow, Smolensk, Crimea, Kuban, Kharkov, Kursk, Leningrad, Bagration, Kurland, Berlin, the Winter War and the Mediterrainean, then they should get right on making a PTO campaign.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

As soon as the devs are done with Moscow, Smolensk, Crimea, Kuban, Kharkov, Kursk, Leningrad, Bagration, Kurland, Berlin, the Winter War

 

God forbid, I can fly BoS and BoM and really enjoy it but 3 times in a row eastern front ? Nope. Something fresh has to come after BoM to attract people :)

 

Anyway, I knew I somewhere had a good animations of PTO. This was done by Futabasha with great detail, the first is a Guadalcanal campaign :

 

Second is Battle of Coral Sea :

 

And third is Battle in Bungo Strait in 1945 :

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very nice =LD=Hiromachi  but I think this is what we need.

 

Part 1

 

 

Part 2

 

 

 

Part 3

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not saying no Custard, Med is a neat place too. Pacific is just my personal preference, especially that Med would be still 109s vs Mc.202, Spitfires (something new, and I like Spitty), P-40s and P-38s eventually. But some of those aircraft are already available or will be with BoM. 

 

PTO is something completely fresh and different :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not saying no Custard, Med is a neat place too. Pacific is just my personal preference, especially that Med would be still 109s vs Mc.202, Spitfires (something new, and I like Spitty), P-40s and P-38s eventually. But some of those aircraft are already available or will be with BoM. 

 

PTO is something completely fresh and different :)

I too am very interested in PTO but it's already been done whereas the MTO would be fresh IMHO. I wish we could have it all to be honest  :)

 

Regards

 

Custard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly. I don't understand how the PTO is 'fresh and different'. It's litterally the theatre of WW2 that has been covered by most flight sims over the years. I compiled a list some months back and discovered, that the PTO has been the focus of I think 9 major flight sims that I'm aware of since 1989, more than any other theatre.

 

The Eastern Front, on the other hand, has been covered by exactly 1 flight sim before BoS (well 2 if you count the original IL2 and Forgotten Battles as seperate entities) and the mediterrainean has been covered by none.

 

I'm not against the PTO as such, it does offer some interesting and unique variation, but to say that it's 'fresh' or in any way overlooked is ridiculous.

  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

but to say that it's 'fresh' or in any way overlooked is ridiculous.

And when was last time it was done ?

 

Because the last title I can recall was developed 10 years ago. Some also fly Aces High 2 but its not a real simulation. I bet some of the people were not even playing when the titles you refer to were launched. Most of the combat/flight simulators related to Pacific were developed in between 1990 and 2004, so it is actually fresh. Or would be "fresh". 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It was last done (and quite well) in Pacific Fighters, yes. But how many proper WW2 flight sims have there been since then? By those criteria just about anything would be 'fresh'.

 

If we, Odin forbid, are forced to leave the Eastern Front after BoM, I'd vote Mediterrainean, simply because it has never been done properly.

 

But please: Not just Malta, it'll get old real fast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

It was last done (and quite well) in Pacific Fighters, yes.

Not really, it was done decently. But amount of mistakes, starting from graphical and 3d models up to flight models ... was just huge. 

 

 

 

But how many proper WW2 flight sims have there been since then?

That is true.

And as I said, I have nothing against Med. Its a cool area too, I bet I'd spent a lot of time flying  SM.79 Sparviero and dropping torpedoes on the British fleet :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

But please: Not just Malta, it'll get old real fast.

I agree because there is plenty to be interested about across the whole MTO and north Africa etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's with the disdain of the Pacific Theater? People just don't like water?  :lol:  :wacko:  :(

 

In MP, wouldn't Pacific Theater involve either flying for hours by dead reconing just to find the targets (cries of boooooring and lost!) or having career fleets at spitting range from one another to avoid boring (cries of arcaaaaade!). With SP campaign in new IL2 rudimentary as it is, it would make PTO useful mostly in user made scripted missions?

 

(A big plus for PTO is that we have well-modelled sea already in RoF, with ship and  seplane physics). But yes, I'd prefer mideterrain sea first.

Edited by Trupobaw

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pacific would be cool lots of sweet options there if done correctly to avoid three hour flight times over the blue abyss....

 

I would personly rather north Africa,set around the siege of one of the towns or many battles. Think of huge tank formations kicking up dust for miles to see. Also would be easiest to transition to in terms of dev time.

 

Ps I was a little offended by people saying PTO was the most memorable in ww2. That really depends on where ur from

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...