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Feathered_IV

Flying the BoS Dream campaign - SP inspiration, Singleplayers only

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That'd be interesting. Giving some sense of consequences, impending doom but doing it anyway.

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Ten years or more of creating singleplayer content, thinking about singleplayer content and dreaming about the future possibilities of singleplayer content can make you something of an authority on the subject.  I 've no doubt that there are a great many here with a tremendous amount of applied knowledge regarding what can make or break an engaging and addictive SP experience.   They know the tricks, the fine details and the artistry that can suspend player belief and deliver them into the game-world and make them feel a part of it. 

 

Back when Early Access first started, I began thinking of what a single player campaign in BoS could be like.  How it might function and what improvements it would bring over the Rise of Flight career mode.  Having rewritten nearly a thousand lines of RoF career files and briefing texts for the GNM mod, I was pretty familiar with the way the system worked and its potential for development (it's a fantastic piece of programming, it just needed more activity in missions). 

 

So, here was me dreaming about a BoS campaign system and how it would look.  Flight sim fans love to make lists.  New planes, new features, new complaints. 

Just for fun I thought I'd make pictures instead...

 

Okay, here's a few snippets from my hypothetical BOS campaign.  I'll add to them as I go. 

 

...

 

 

Yes mate, thats exactly what BoS - and we too ofcourse   :P - need. Excellent idea.  :salute:

Edited by II./JG1_Baron

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Would be enough for me...

 

 

 

For guys talking about dynamic campaign, look at good ol' Falcon 4. I don't think it was beaten since. For those, who didn't play it, it was not a series of dynamically generated missions. It was really a continous battle, where every single vehicle in ground units was persistent for the entire durantion of war (or until destroyed). If you destroyed runway, every single squadron based on that airfield was grounded and would not fight until the runway was repaired. Destroy a half of AAA batalion guns? Those guns would be missing next time you flew over them or maybe all of them would be gone, because somebody else bombed them again. Your side had to occupy enemy capital, which meant, that your tanks had to roll through that city. Air command would create meaningful missions for all squads in battle. Eg. mission to cover friendly teritory or attack on enemy tank column, which is actually blocking advance of our own tanks ( = not a random tank column), strike on enemy airbase, or protection of tanker/AWACS. Some mission needs another missions - escort and SEAD escort. All (ok, most) of these missions were generated so they actually had a meaning on the grand scale. All of this was done by the game and was going on while you were in flight or in campaign ui on the ground in real time (you could time accelerate in campaign UI). You would just pick a mission, that you like, from missions assigned to you squad and fly it.

 

Of course with campaign like this, you can't have historical accurancy, you can only historically accurate starting conditions.

 

The main thing is, that each mission you flew, each small action you made had a real meaning and consequences for the rest of the campaignThat was in 1998. 16 years later and it wasn't matched, let alone beaten...

 

Well, maybe this one mission in czech Il-1946 comunity matched it. It was 48 hour long nonstop special mission. There was sizeable human command structure on both sides with historicaly accurate radar, so they knew what was going on in the air and could actually command their forces and acomplish their objectives. Command would give ordes to squads which would have to follow those orders. No individuality whatsoever. There were high time penalties for dying (4 hours I think) and lost planes were gone forever, so fly carefuly a survive at all costs. Did I mentioned, that it was nonstop action? So apart from figuring out which squad is aviable now, they also had to account for sleep time of their pilots, and their own also. Best part about all of that? That sweet woman voice on radar control, when you were returning home from tough action and requesting landing clearance . :)

Fido. I took two weeks off work to fly the Falcon4 Campaign. I had Pizzas and coke (no women) ! I blew up bridges to trap the enemy and help my side defend. I Flew SEAD flights to knock out the air defences first(Harms+Mavericks) and then Refly with LGB/mavericks/Dumb 500s to finish them off.

Remember that Video when you WON the Campaign ?... Somethin like "North korea" has asked for urgent Peace Talks !

For anybody reading this who hasn't Flown it.It was like,you spawn into the Map/Briefing and every thing on the Map is Moving and Alive. Air and Ground units Fighting it out.You could look at the Map and pick from Missions(Cap,Sead,GA etc).If you wanted to,you could Load up and fly to try and change the outcome of the Campaign. You could save your Campaign.

And tomorrow,you can continue where you left off.

IMHO that was the best Campaign ever created within a Flight Sim . Thanks for Reminding me how Great it was ! ~S~

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Heres a little more. 

Must admit I'm not playing Dead is Dead.  Managed to get myself killed, captured or wounded several times.  Each time I exit there is a different message.  Not some PC game promt to tell me to go back to the main menu (what kind of death is that?).  Instread there are what appear to be a diverse number of death-notes that the campaign program chooses at random.

 

This one struck me as being particularly poignant.

 

iYkCCJr.jpg

Edited by Feathered_IV
  • Upvote 5

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Missing also, some backgroud sounds (like in ROF), or some background musics and so on... :rolleyes:

 

Nice work, like more and more! :salute:

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Having a few beers after work, so forgive the philosophising.

 

Perhaps immersion is not always the right word for what singleplayers are after in a great campaign.  Perhaps the real trick is making them feel invested as well.  Employing little details to give them pause to reflect for a bit.  The Nationality screen back in the first post for example:  The bit where it says, Please Select.  What if instead it said, Choose Carefully.  The outcome will still be the same of course, you will go red or you will go blue, no worries.  But for a second you will hesitate.  A moment of uncertainty...   Is this a trick question?  What awaits me?  I'll go Blue.  No, Red.  Or Blue.  Aw f*ck it, Blue...  Okay, I'm in.  Did I do the right thing??? 

 

Also I wonder how Dead is Dead players would feel if a window popped up, saying that a special mission of exceptional risk had been planned.  Volunteers are required.

Accept/Decline?

 

Those are very cool ideas!

 

It's usually the little things that make or break immersion/investment. I remember in old IL2, I once got a message that we were running out op planes and had to borrow some from a training unit. Just a smattering of things like that helps a lot in tying you into your virtual self.

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Great stuff!

 

A perfect GUI front end... love it

 

Maybe add a button for war news? and transfer request?

 

Are you looking at a plane set up page changes - ie load/ammo options and skins? or option that you can't change them until you are the squadron leader?

 

Cheers,

 

Simon

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I hadn't thought of that too much yet.  I liked the way RoF did the equipment screens and hoped we'd see a version of that.

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Haven't got any RoF screens handy at the moment unfortunately FF. Definitely worth the free download if you haven' tried it yet.

 

Regarding briefings, it would be good if briefings worked with changing keywords like the pilot bios in RoF, and with a file structure like the nation specific mission briefings.  (Rise of Flight\Data\SCG\2\blocks_career\misc\desc and Rise of Flight\Data\SWF\career\2\data\bio folders)

 

This would allow a mission briefing template to be read and insert the correct aircraft, character names and time/weather etc. from the pilot roster and mission file.

Below is a quick picture example with a plain text version below.  RoF seems to choose the briefing randomly from 3 available for each target type. Creating even more, or allowing users to add their own would give some great variety to mission briefings and stop the missions feeling so damned robotic.

 

 

H1uL7Fa.jpg

 

 

The briefing template for this one would look something like:

 

Four $[bombername] set out at first light to bomb the railhead at $[target]. 

They never returned.  Another raid was sent out but has not been seen or

heard from since. 

 

We will take off at $[time] as the $[bombername] arrive over our airfield.

$[1stpilotname] will lead with $[3rdpilotname] and $[5thpilotname]. 

$[player] will lead the second flight accompanied by $[8thpilotname] and

$[11thpilotname]

 

The $[bombername] will bomb at an altitude of $[altWaypointattack]. 

The weather remains $[weather].

 

$[1stpilotname] looks worried as he briefs us.  The others try to look unconcerned

but they too are nervous. 

 

$[5thpilotname] as always, is $[5thpilotname]...

 

 

Hope that makes sense to somebody  :salute:

Edited by Feathered_IV
  • Upvote 5

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Four $[bombername] set out at first light to bomb the railhead at $[target]. 

They never returned.  Another raid was sent out but has not been seen or

heard from since. 

 

I suppose this whole section is $[intro]? Others could include:

 

Army group $[army unit] reports new $[enemy] reinforcement is pouring in via $[train/lorries/transport columns] at $[place]. Our front line won't hold much longer. The $[transport junction] need to be taken out, and the task has fallen to $[our squadron].

 

or

 

To support our boys at the ground at $[place], the high command has ordered us to attack $[tanks/artillery/positions] at $[place]. We need to stop the enemy from utilizing their equipment. Knowing the situation at $[place], I am sure I need not stress to you the importance of success in this mission.

 

or something.

 

The possibilities are legio! 

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Very interesting to see your thoughts on how a campaign should be. I'll keep watching.

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Great stuff, now THIS is a campaign!

 

I believe in due time BoS will get fleshed out with stuff like this from the community.

 

But some stuff, just the "wording" of the current campaign could benefit from these immersive ideas. For example don't call stuff unlocks, or action points, ect. What terms would be used back in the 1940s? We know the current campaign is more gamelike, but come on you could as least try to snazz it up by making it FEEL more like we are back in the day during this war.

 

I'll post some ideas I have for this kinda stuff in that new briefings subforum later. :)

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Not dynamic. I'm basing it on what RoF career mode can do already.

 

This is all just fantastic, Feathered :good:  And starting your ideas based on the RoF career mode will hopefully make it all the more feasible for 1CGS to do.  Keep the creative juices flowing, or the juice that makes you creative flowing, however it works for you...lol 

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Nice!  I used that one many times :salute:

 

 

This is all just fantastic, Feathered :good: And starting your ideas based on the RoF career mode will hopefully make it all the more feasible for 1CGS to do. Keep the creative juices flowing, or the juice that makes you creative flowing, however it works for you...lol

 

Juice might be good.  Still a bit chafed from Sallee's rhubarb crumble

Edited by Feathered_IV

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Another quick one before it gets too late here.

 

Looks like I just unlocked the bombs.  :salute:

 

 

VfWan9e.jpg

 

 

I really didn't like the present campaign's method of displaying unlocks.  Apart from being seemingly optimised for deaf people, the big trophies and waggling padlock animations really take

you away from the playable world and put you back into a jarringly modern pc game interface.

 

The picture above shows the newly available loadout expressed within the mission briefing instead of a seperate arcade-style presentation.  The idea is it reinforces the narrative within the playable world and brings the menus into the game.  These landmark events also allow the campaign designers to create special missions here that have a tutorial use, to teach the player how to use the newly won item.  This mission for example is a bombing attack on a railyard.

 

The method of bringing character names into the briefing from the pilot roster (described above in post #90) would also apply here.  Putting words into their mouths, or in this case, the illusion of it can influence the player and have them identify with the characters much more strongly than with just a simple stat screen.  Hope you like it!

 

PS:  I must admit, I'm getting quite fond of that Azarov fellow...

Edited by Feathered_IV
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I must admit, disguising the present unlock system to a representative action, actually within your campaign briefings would be a great way to receive them :)

Weaving a plausible story into the present grind would go a whole way to giving the process some life!

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^^ great idea. I really like it.  Would be great to get the "unlocks" unlocked in such  a unassuming and logical way.

 

SD 

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Here's an idea. Instead of a little XP bar advancing across the screen, have something a little more fun:

 

"The train carrying X upgrade for your squadron is being attacked! Scramble to defend it!"

If you defend it, you get the upgrade. If you don't, you wait for another supply train. 

 

You could time these occurences to coincide with "levelling up", in-keeping with the format of the XP system.

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lol... I never, ever thought I'd hear the term 'levelling up' in a historical and accurate flight sim.

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Looks like I just unlocked the bombs.   :salute:

 

Yessss!

 

This is how I always imagined a good implementation of the unlocks should look like.

 

Unlocks of planes could come in the form of letters from the high command, asking for volunteers for transfer to other squadrons or another squadron sharing your airfield offering to you a chance on flying with them or similar.

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Superb stuff, if the devs are at all interested I'd love to help write down piles of briefings for them... There'd have to be otherwise they'd get rather repetitive.

 

Anyway, Feathered, this campaign you're creating is a dream. Truly Excellent.

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Love it. This is what I envisaged when people spoke of a "Campaign Mode". Experience and career development instead of juvenile "unlocks". This would actually make me _want_ to play SP. 

 

Big fan of "dead is dead" too. The knowledge transforms your behaviour.

 

Bonus if the narrative can be made historically "consistent" as I am also a fan of education as a by product of entertainment. In fact this kind of thing sometimes attracts grant funding.

Edited by Dave
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I think this type of campaign and unlocks is in line with what the Dev's envisioned when they started the process. I think they implied this type of stuff was going to be more community driven, they just didn't relate that very well in their posts. Feathered, I hope you and some of your co-conspirators can pull this off as it looks really excellent.

 

I also have to commend Sallee for inserting RHUBARB at every opportunity. :)

 

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/6657-good-luck-777-team/page-2?hl=%2Brhubarb&do=findComment&comment=148949

Edited by HerrMurf

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Guys can somone explain it to me?
Is this a sample of what the game could be or it's alrerady running somewhere?
I really would like to have a Carrer mode like this! :o:

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Guys can somone explain it to me?

Is this a sample of what the game could be or it's alrerady running somewhere?

I really would like to have a Carrer mode like this! :o:

 

No, it's just Feathered thinking about how he want a campaign to look, and making some graphics of how it could look. The signals from the developers are positive, so this is your chance to ad your ideas about a dream campaign and how it can be constructed.

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Thanks again FF.  :salute:

 

Thinking a bit more about this D-campaign.  Sometimes things happen that are outside your control.  As squadron commander, you shepherd your flock.  You blood the new pilots early to

get them up to veteran status and increase their chances of survival.  A higher level of experience within the unit means you achieve the increasingly difficult mission goals with ease.

Headquarters is pleased, they get their steady diet of mission points and you get some added perks for your unit in turn.  Morale goes up.  Fatigue is kept at a manageable level.

 

And then something like this happens.  Aces drop back to veteran.  Veterans are making rookie mistakes.  The days work has got that much harder.  You might loose some of your best pilots today, all for the want of some sleep.   You have some hard choices to make.  Headquarters still wants their pound of flesh.

 

But what if they come back again tonight?

 

r53vfJG.jpg

 

PS: I added a new entry in the briefing section called, A Chance Meeting.  Hope you like it.

Edited by Feathered_IV
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So, when can we expect to see this implemented? ;)

 

Great work Feathered

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So, when can we expect to see this implemented? ;)

 

Great work Feathered

Thanks. Though that ball is in the developers court I'd say. I'm no coder unfortunately. :(

I would love it if the kind of event decscribed above was punctuated by a brief interlude track or pre-rendered movie.

Fantastic idea! The intros for the campaign chapter already show the game engine able to handle video. I never thought of that. :)

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You've got the same problem, playing on german side, if some air transports were shoot down, or some trains were destroyed. We also could imagine, for a MP Campaign, a "supply points" system. For example, you have 3000 supply points each "turn", but if some trains, or transports were destroyed, it will reduce the total of your supply points, then with this points you must make a choice, fuel or ammo? New pilots or spare parts? And so on....

 

But it could be very hard to manage in BoS...

Edited by GCN_Obelix

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Nice!  I used that one many times :salute:

 

 

 

Juice might be good.  Still a bit chafed from Sallee's rhubarb crumble

Are you criticising my cooking or my skills in the bedroom?

 

Some really brilliant ideas here. This is the stuff that makes you live and breathe a campaign. I was remembering the Jedermann campaigns in original Il2 a while back. They were amazingly immersive.

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You've got the same problem, playing on german side, if some air transports were shoot down, or some trains were destroyed

 

For a SP campaign, you could probably get away with very limited actual results of your flying. The battle went to Hades for the Wehrmacht despite the effort of the Luftwaffe. I think pseudo-interactions with the game in the form of written acknowledgements will go a long way towards creating the feeling of an actual contribution.

 

Imagine you're a Luftwaffe pilot and have successfully landed a He 111 in Stalingrad, and the next section calls for a collaps of a front to the South. The text of the next briefing could read:

 

- Thanks to the supplies flown in last night, we have managed to hold the North front, however, the situation to the South is grim ...

 

If you bugged the delivery, it would read

 

- The supply situation is now dire. The South front is collapsing, the situation is grim ...

 

If you fail to take out a e.g. an artillery position, you could perhaps be asked to hit it again. With the desperation of the fighting around Stalingrad however, the whole thing can simply be solved by flying a different type of mission next time. I guess with the type of fighting over Stalingrad, both air forces would constantly be called up to put of fires. 

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