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NZTyphoon

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  1. I included the Griffon 64/69 data more for interest than anything else, because, as you rightly point out, neither of them were used in the Spitfire XIV/XVIII/XIX family during wartime operations: they were, in effect modified and strengthened variants of the Griffon 61.
  2. Definitely; the +21 lbs boost was considered 'interim' http://www.spitfireperformance.com/125wing-replacement-aircraft.jpg but AFAIK +25 lbs was never used operationally. Interestingly, manuals for the both the Griffon 64 and 69 referred to +25 lbs being cleared for service use. 42 Maintenance Group, which was responsible for supplying fuel and ordnance to 2 TAF, confirmed that the changeover from 100/130 grade to 100/150 grade fuel would start from 15 December 1944.
  3. The memo dated 18 September 1944 was written by A.D.G.B, and referred to the operational requirements of A.D.G.B aircraft - it did not apply to 2 TAF operations or aircraft. The memo clearly states: meaning that the V-1 threat had subsided and Luftwaffe fighters were as rare as hen's teeth over A.D.G.B's operational area: why bother using the fuel, when it could be better used by 2 TAF aircraft? By November 1944, the ADGB Spitfire XIV squadrons had been transferred to 2 TAF and 150 grade fuel had been cleared for operational use by all 2 TAF Spitfires, as noted in a November 1944 memo from SHAEF: http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/150grade/150_Grade_20-11-44.jpg also note the final sentence: Couldn't be any clearer, really.
  4. Of course, what these numbers don't reflect is that most of the Spitfire Vs used by the ADGB & 2 TAF were on squadrons that were resting on rear-echelon airfields and transitioning from earlier Spitfire IXs onto L.F Mk IXs, or were being used as trainers. The Mk VIIIs were all based overseas. As of 5 June 1944, 2 TAF had an Air Spotting Pool made up of 26 & 63 Sqns plus 4 FAA Sqns and VCS-7, a U.S Navy unit, all of which were equipped with Spitfire Vs or Seafire IIIs, but no front-line Spitfire V squadrons. ADGB had 5 fighter squadrons equipped with Spitfire Vs, of which 350 (Belgian) Sqn was transitioning to the XIV, plus 2 ASR units.
  5. In line with the OP, a NACA report on the P-47D-30's longitudinal stability, control and stall characteristics can be downloaded from this link
  6. Er..., did you read the attachment which, BTW is from Shores and Thomas' 2nd Tactical Air Force; Volume Three? No one is saying that the XIV "flew in hordes" or in hundreds, but nor were they as insignificant as some people like to think: as it was, there wasn't much need for large formations of Spitfire XIVs, because the Luftwaffe fighters were hardly ever seen. Then there was the weather, which, in January '45 for example, didn't allow for a lot of operational flying (eg. 610 Sqn Summary of Events, Jan '41):
  7. While this sort of crude number crunching is kind of interesting and all that, it's hardly relevant to the OP "Spitfire XIV should be included in BOBP", unless badatflyski is trying to say that the Spitfire XIV is irrelevant to Bodenplatte because many of them were built and/or delivered post war, or that (apparently) deliveries to front-line squadrons were slow? That it took an "average" of 20 days for Spitfire XIVs to filter into squadron service is nothing new or sensational - all it means is that the Spitfire XIVs on front-line squadrons weren't suffering from a punishing attrition rate, while those that were being delivered as replacements had been fully serviced, inspected and - if necessary - modified updated/upgraded in GSUs and the like, prior to front-line service. (see attached) None of this changes the fact that the Spitfire XIV was operational in 2 TAF service before, during and after Bodenplatte...
  8. NZTyphoon

    Spit XIV

    So much for my comment that Spitfire XIVs didn't carry bombs! Just rediscovered 402(Canadian) Sqn's ORB (Operational Record Book) for February 1945..see pages 5 & 7, starting on Feb 22 (also note close escort for medium bombers on Feb 28) 402 Sqn ORB Feb 45.pdf
  9. NZTyphoon

    Spit XIV

    Of course, it is well documented that the German fighter pilots were constantly sniggering at the thought of confronting old, very rare, over-hyped hotrods with a badly designed cockpit and stiffer, heavier fuselage: conversely, there are many, many combat reports showing that Spitfire XIV pilots were thoroughly demoralized, knowing that they would inevitably encounter hoards of rapacious 109K-4s using 1.98 ata, while also having to worry about all those mysterious, loose objects rattling around beneath their feet. The few Spitfire XIV pilots who survived the numerous 109K-4s, plus all the carelessly dropped spanners and other miscellaneous objects being flung around around their cockpits, were mostly gibbering wrecks after a few weeks of combat service.
  10. NZTyphoon

    Spit XIV

    This is a complete misunderstanding of the actual roles of the Tempest V and Spitfire XIV in 2 TAF service: neither aircraft were used - nor were they needed - in a so-called "tactical role" (ie; fighter-bomber) because that role was fulfilled by the Typhoon (arguably the "British Wurger" ) and Spitfire L.F Mk IX/XVIs respectively. Neither the Tempest or Spitfire XIV carried bombs or rockets (with the exception of a few Tempest sorties right at the end of the European war), because their primary role was to act as air-superiority fighters, with ground attack being secondary. (There were also Spitfire F.R Mk XIV equipped tactical reconnaissance squadrons; while their primary role was tac recon, they also engaged in air-air combat and should not be separated from the pure fighter squadrons.) As Thomas and Shores explained (see below), the Tempest and XIV's performance characteristics complemented each other, and both proved to be very useful and successful in 2 TAF service: that there were fewer and fewer encounters with Luftwaffe fighters, particularly after the debacle of Bodenplatte, had nothing to do with the merits of either the Tempest or Spitfire XIV. The simple fact is the Spitfire XIV was still a world-class piston engine fighter in 1945, badatflyski's reservations notwithstanding. BTW: The 3 pages posted are from Christopher Shores and Chris Thomas' 2nd Tactical Air Force Volume 2: Breakout to Bodenplatte: July 1944 to January 1945 hopefully, they provide a more balanced perspective than one or two comments posted in this thread.
  11. The full reference to the development of spring tabs can be found here: unfortunately, the section on beveled edge control surfaces is limited to page 66
  12. Here are three pages from Christopher Shores' and Chris Thomas' 2nd Tactical Air Force: Volume Four describing the Tempest's operations: note that the drop tanks were hardly ever dropped (2nd paragraph, page 2), which helped reduce turn-around times between sorties, and because they had "little effect on performance" when carried. Also note that the drop tank pylons were made out of clear perspex.
  13. Nobody, including me, is saying that the R-2800 "...should be able to pull insane stunts...". If you read my post properly I wrote "Just for interest" to indicate that I was not commenting on the game, but was citing a source confirming that the R-2800 was run at such extreme boost pressures and horsepower ratings.
  14. Just for interest, from page 218 of R-2800: Pratt & Whitney's Dependable masterpeice: On another note, it was possible to have "Turbo Collapse" or "Pulsation" through incorrect operation of the engine controls: ,
  15. Your source for the maximum number of " +/- 145 Spitfire XIVs" assigned to operational service is..? Spitfire XIV production RBxxx - RNxxx : RB140 - RB189 = 50 airframes = 47 operational on ADGB & 2 TAF squadrons http://www.airhistory.org.uk/spitfire/p095.html RM615 - RM625 = 11 airframes = 11 operational ADGB/2TAF RM648 - RM887 = 239 airframes = 162 operational ADGB mostly 2 TAF http://www.airhistory.org.uk/spitfire/p096.html thus, between RB140 & RM887 there were 220 Spitfire XIVs "assigned" to operational, frontline units of the ADGB & 2 TAF... I could continue counting, but can't be bothered, because your guesstimate of "assigned" Spitfire XIVs is already way too low: see also http://www.airhistory.org.uk/spitfire/p097.html NH653 - NH720 series = http://www.airhistory.org.uk/spitfire/p080.html Discounting the Es, and F.Rs plus the so-called "FRE" is dishonest, because the F.R variants in 2 TAF service engaged in air-air combat and scored several kills, while the F Mk XIVEs also saw combat in the time they were in operational service. The majority of F & F.R Mk XIVs lost on operations were due to causes other than fighter combat.
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