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SCG_judgedeath3

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  1. Have ran several quick missions and single player missions and some online multiplayer sessions with the free to play tanks: Panzer III L and T-34-42 models and have the following issues with their damage models and AI and also questionable gun behaviour: 1: The T-34s damage model is still severly lacking and players who know about this bugg and flaw use it on the multiplayer servers to get a big advantage: If you turn around and reverse towards the enemy tank, you in most cases cant be killed, only the engine gets destroyed but the crew and gun and inside of the tank is fully alright and operational, ran 10 missions and no time did the enemy tank manage to kill me. In reality the engine wont protect one like this and the shot from the panther would gone through it and killed the crew. This is also a issue on the multiplayer server as many prefer to play this T-34 version as it gives them a big advantage, instead of the T-34 43 model where you do die if you try this trick. More details is in this thread: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/68528-are-the-free-tanks-representative-of-tank-crew/ The damage model is correct when enemy tanks hit the front or the sides of the tank and its turret, so the issue seem to be only in the back of the tank. 2: The AI gunner when one play as driver or other position than gunner will automaticly aim towards the enemy tank in quick mission. 3: This version of the T-34 can easily knock out panther frontally, I managed each time to knock it out with a shot, just aim for between the gun mantlet and the hull, in the center and it will explode, it dont happen with the other tanks in the tank crew game. T-34 shouldnt be able to take out panthers like this in reality. 4: I noticed this during my recording session: IF you do a ingame recording, the gunsight will behave strangely in the replay. Either its graphic card related or its something with the programing in the game, as it havent happened before I guess its game related but Im not 100% sure. 5: the game counts one as killed when the engine was destroyed and the enemy tanks ignore one and drive forwards without caring anymore, not even if I shot at them do they react, my tank is just immobile due to the engine is blown but Im not killed or knocked out. Here are two videos, one I made when playing a single player mission and the other a quick mission and can see here the bad damage model of the tank, I havent had the time to make a recording of the Panzer III L but it too has its damage model issues and can be exploited, hence I never want to play these tanks: Here on a multiplayer server where I found a panther and tried this, he couldnt kill me even with 2 hits in the rear of my tank and my crew and tank was fully operational, but sadly the enemy tank got taken out by a pilot so couldnt get to shot him or wait for him to shot me some more but doubting it would had done anything: As some can guess: this gives players who uses these tanks on online multiplayer a big advantage if they know this bug and also against the panther or against kv-1 as panzer III L have also this advantage and bad damage model.
  2. From the front and sides its like you say, most shots will kill one, besides a few times when the damage model acts up, but try reversing and you wont be as easily killed in quick missions
  3. Here you go: Or just google up tiger or panther tank manual, have a section there showing how the gunner can range in the range to the target
  4. Can only hope as the damage model of them is as I said very poorly and gives those who play these tanks a big advantage. Okay well at least its better now than 2 years ago when the free to play tanks had HP gauge style where a Panzer III L could take more hits than a tiger for example. But to this day these tanks can be exploited and unrealistic in how much damage they can take and behave. Okay what advantages and what is so bad with those tanks? 1: The interior is lacking, darkened out to hide details, cant see the radio operators or the crew members inside, nor can play those stations. 2: Cant close the commander vision ports and cant use them, can only either go inside the gunner sight or button up. 2 1/2: In the past and maybe to this day as I see some videos where people manage to do this but not sure how: can from commander position traverse the turret and aim and shot without having to go inside the gunner station, which is a big advantage compared to TC tanks that you have to go inside the gunner sight to do this. 3: As the tanks arent as modelled they cant be as damaged or behave damaged when they get hit, no fuel burning if you damage the fuel tanks or damage the commander visors or commander cupola and all the small details that you have in the TC tanks. 4: Persicope and alternative stations and hatches cant be used or opened in these tanks. 5: The tanks can take strange amount of damage which would had destroyed the TC tanks but these can still function and work on. 6: They have also weird penetration ability, with the free to play T-34 you can knock out panther tanks frontally with ease if you know where to aim while the TC T-34-43 model cant. (this isnt historical to any degree and is unfair advantage). 7: I maybe shouldnt tell this as its ruining the fun for many but there are ways to become unkillable or near unkillable in the Panzer III L and T-34 41 models: Turn your tank around and show the enemy tanks or AI the back of your tank, and the best they can do is to destroy your engine, but your crew and the rest of the tank are fine and can keep fighting and cant be killed in certain cases, in singple player missions the AI will think after the engine is destroyed that you are dead and starts to drive forwards as you dont exist anymore, but you can kill all the enemy AI tanks as they come closer, and they wont do anything if you shot them either. Played a single player mission where one shall defend against an attack of panthers and tigers and by using this trick I found a spot and got immobilised and then I killed them as they drove past my tank. In multiplayer this is a even bigger advantage, although its not happening as often as in the past but it do happen time to time.(Some people claim this tro be historically accurate and correct for the T-34 and the engine is able to protect one from tank shells....Which its not unless you use HEAT ammo or modern frag shells. Ask any tank instructor if you are in the tank corps like myself and they will laugh, no tank unit will ever use such tactic nor in ww2. The engine is made of aluminimum or soft metal, its not armour nor face hardened armour, so AP rounds will go through the engine like butter as steel metal dont really stop much besides small arms fire, I can buy that from certain angles and luck the AP round might explode inside the engine bay but then big pieces of the engine will be blown up and the next AP round wont be stopped and go inside the crew compartment and kill them.) Engines dont stop AP rounds or can make one unkillable. the normal TC tanks you get killed in if you try this trick. 8: The free to play tanks with all the mentioned above makes those tanks a bit better in some ways than the TC tanks and is why I see some players after 2 years still sticking to these tanks and not buying TC, if unemployed people manage to buy Tank crew after 5 months of saving and some dont buy it for over 2 years then there is a problem, here is an example of the reaction when the TC t-34 came out: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/51875-the-new-t34/. Here are two videos, one I made when playing a single player mission and the other a quick mission and can see here the bad damage model of the tank, I havent had the time to make a recording of the Panzer III L but it too has its damage model issues and can be exploited, hence I never want to play these tanks: Here on a multiplayer server where I found a panther and tried this, he couldnt kill me even with 2 hits in the rear of my tank and my crew and tank was fully operational, but sadly the enemy tank got taken out by a pilot so couldnt get to shot him or wait for him to shot me some more but doubting it would had done anything: So thats the sum up on the free to play tanks and to me they give a bad impression of the game and is very unealistic and they are nowhere near the realism of tC tanks are and needs major work to be as good and fair to play as the TC tanks.
  5. How can you from commander position traverse the turret and aim and fire at the same time without going into gunner mode? All other tanks need one to go into gunner sight/position to move the turret let alone shot it.
  6. A better option would be to replace them with Panzer III M and the SU 122 as demo tanks.
  7. they are very poor compared to the tanks you have in the game, much more realistic and fully modelled and simulated and each place in the tank is manned, much better damage model and details etc.
  8. Same like the myths of many american documentaries of modern time spews out: French tank were worse than german tanks, germany had more tanks, french soldiers didnt stand and fight, german army was 100% mechanised etc. While in reality: France and UK combined had almost 1000 more tanks than the germans and of better quality: armour and guns, germans at the time had around 70% of their armored force consisting of Panzer I and IIs and light tanks. In the air the allieds had also more airplanes than the luftwaffe had. The weakness of the allieds plans were: 1: They were still thinking in ww1 terms and immobile warfare where the infantery is the king of the battlefield, hence they were always thinking in infantery speed, every time the french and british tried to set up a new frontline they found out the germans already was there or past it and then needed to fall back further, or in the attack the counterattack would come too late. The french which was considered the best army in the world prior to ww2 was surten that they can defeate all attacks and their infantery could stop any tank attacks as shown in the war excercises hence they let infantery division to hold big lines and didnt expect tanks to break through, and expected the germans to play ball and use ww1 tactics, but instead used rapid advance and combined warfare which showed rapid movement was its own for of defence. 2: Doctrin and tactics where the allieds expected ww1 v2 and used tanks as ifnantery support and spread them out along the line, the generals and officer made sure they were as far away from the front as possible and by doing so let the morale down with the soldiers, and making combined warfare impossible and slow communication, their tanks didnt have radios, besides the command tanks and the ideas from the french tank generals to create tank dicisions like the germans did was denied. 3: the allied plan consisted of: IF´s, if the germans attack or if the germans get here, or if the belgians are neutral, or if etc, their plans were only reactive and no iniative. 4: Old fashioned tactics and no combined arms warfare which enabled the german panzer divisions to penetrate the front and advance deep enabling those panzer I and IIs to be effective as they could advance rapidly and against infantery they are still effective. Germans won due to their more modern tactics and use of tanks correctly and that all tanks had radios and trained deep penetration tactics and iniative, having the leaders close by and make decisions on the spot, unlike the french who waited long times to get new orders from the command what to do, germans on the other hand didnt wait and keept advancing. By using tanks in panzer division they could overrun the few tanks they faced and break through and that sealed france defeate, they had better morale too as they seeked payback for the defeate in ww1 and the versailes treaty, while the french was still hurt by the losses in ww1. Luftwaffe helped the ground when they encountered stiff resistance and overrun the allied airfleets as they in the air worked better together while the french and british airplanes were split along the frontline like their tanks. As the battle of arras and the tank historian david fletcher etc said: if the allied had used their armour in the same way as germans or russians did and created their own tank division and used flexible tactics and conentrate their forces and better communications, their counter attacks would easily stopped the germans. Defeating france wasnt a sure way win, but due to the state of the allieds and the germans more modern use of their forces they managed to bring the french a knock out blow. I strongly suggest watching the documentaries: battlefield battle of france and, tanks fall of france that goes much deeper into this and how the germans could win. Well in reality it wasnt as much fun as it can be in a game: The commander is overworked, he has to: load the gun, aim and shot it, fix and load the machine gun, give orders to the tank soldiers in his tank, and have radio contact with the command, and if he is a squad leader: also keep an eye on the other tanks. The driver besides driving the tank, is also the gunner and aimer of the hull mounted gun. As David fletcher said: the vision out of the tank was poor and in battle the german tank crews said they often got very close to these tanks before they were spotted, could also be due to the crew as mentioned are quite busy handling their tank. But when it do work and in a game then its fun as no german tank can knock it out frontally Same for matilda 2
  9. No, only requirement is one crewmember has his hatch open and it will repair, commander, radio operator, gunner or driver can do it. And that the engine is off, repairing a engine that is on can be...quite dangerous. xD
  10. David fletcher not working with archives nor bovington tank museum, worlds biggest tank museum with one of the biggest archives of ww2 and being considered the worlds expert on tanks? and blamed for anti soviet opinions whne showing good documentaries which are very researched in archives? Ok I give up here.
  11. Where did I mention any anti soviet opinions?
  12. I dont mind if we get a barbarossa expansion or battle of france one, nor care for balance as myself as a simulator and ww2 loving person I want to experience fighting against the oddsa nd live and experience what the tankers did during these battles. And panzer III with short 50mm gn isnt much of a match against kv-1s but that makes it exciting to me, short barrelled panzer IV is a infantery support tank, near useless against other tanks, but I dont see any more use for more russian expansions besides later war ones like: bagration or battle of berlin. What will sell a lot of tank crew and I have 15 friends waiting: is when they add king tiger and late war tanks and hellcats etc, those are the tanks that sell games, world of tanks and warthunder have made big pushes in the past to add as many late war tanks due to: they sell. I would love to get africa korp expansion, fighting the british desert rats in nort africa Red storm documentary you link above is good but incorrect at places and the intro where the germans are talking is taken from battlefield game xD I can strongly suggest watching these documentaries: Tanks: Battlefield: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAfcOYKMPP4&t=3073s german war files panzer III: scorched earth: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAaEotkZBJE Most documentaries by david fletcher from bovington tank museum are top notch and best on the market :D
  13. Warthunder compared to tank crew is like world of tanks vs warthunder: il-2 is way more realistic and harder and more correct and no holding hands and being arcadish, inw arthunder you spawn 3-5 tanks and attack and attack until youre dead or won in 15 minutes time. IL-2 when playing on finnish server or in SCG missions then expect to be playing 2-4 hours and like in real life its a lot of driving and mundane tasks and then a few stressfull and nerv wrecking action and with dead is dead rules very immersive and hard. Some servers are more arcadish but if you play on finnish server or the ones that offer a battlefield and moving frontline then you have to defend military objects and attack enemy bases and defences, no capture the flag silly stuff and if you get killed you wont see what killed you, no hand holding here. After I got tank crew which is a simulator, warthunder isnt, heck they have the commander in the wrong place in the ferdinand... I never look back and play IL-2 80% of my time.
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